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View Full Version : I've been offered this trade....



Red Leader
06-03-2004, 04:20 PM
My team:

C: Posada
1B: Helton
2B: B. Roberts
3B: Blalock
SS: Jeter
CI: M.Mora
MI: O.Cabrera
OF: Sheffield
OF: M. Cabrera
OF: J. Burnitz
OF: B.Giles
UTIL: M.Bradley
UTIL: V.Martinez
DL: M. Giles

SP: M.Mussina
SP: F.Garcia
SP: J.Moyer
SP: J. Lieber
SP: J.Pineiro
SP: A.Burnett
RP: A.Benitez
RP: O.Dotel
RP: J. Affeldt

I've been offered the following trade:

OF/1B/3B A.Huff and SP J. Vazquez for OF G.Sheffield and SP J.Lieber

What do you think? He originally asked for J.Pineiro. I thought Pineiro, even though he's 1-7 was better than Lieber, so I told him I'd switch those two in the trade. He thought Lieber was better anyway. I'm primarily trying to increase my K's for my pitchers. Vazquez is typically a 2nd half pitcher. He's struggled lately, but I feel he'll come on in the 2nd half. Giving up Sheffield hurts, but Huff's bat might be able to make up for that loss. He's really coming on lately, hitting another homer today. Sheffield has also started to heat up lately, but not the player I thought he'd be so far. Thoughts?

jmcclain19
06-03-2004, 04:52 PM
Huff started off the year in a slump - but he's a big bat.

I'd be hesitant to give up Sheffield however - he's always a fantasy monster.

I always look at past performances when I'm thinking about a trade.

Huff had similiar numbers the past two years.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?statsId=6545

So you can easily think that he'll be back up at .300 w/ 30 hr 80-100RBI

Sheffield has the same - similiar stats for the last 6 seasons.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?statsId=4268

I hate to say its a wash, because Sheff's going to net you quite a few more runs, but they are closer than you would think.

Vazquez will get you wins as well.

Its up to you, The numbers do look in your favor though.

IowaRed
06-03-2004, 05:13 PM
Looking at your roster I would say that SP is your weakest area and Vazquez would help with that. Obviously you lose a little trading Sheffield but you have a lot of offense and Jeter and O. Cabrera haven't done much yet. I think I would do the deal.

IowaRed
06-03-2004, 05:19 PM
Having said that, I've never had a worse start to a fantasy baseball season and not just 1 team (I know it's still reasonably early) so you may want to do the opposite of my opinion

westofyou
06-03-2004, 07:39 PM
Do Wins count in this league?

You're losing a lot in offensive across the board with that trade.

Look at it this way, if wins count Leiber should pile them up as a Bomber, across the board Huff will drop your offense. So what you'd be gaining is an increased K rate and "maybe" a few more wins.

I'd ask for another outfielder, Huff won't get the counting stats (runs, rbi's) like GS will in the Yankee lineup, and then you'll be dropping the % stats, all to increase 1 category.... K's.

Remember that a guy like Sheff on a team that can score 900 runs pushes a guy like Huff on a team that scores 720 aside very easily.

Vasquez is one of my pitchers too, and he had late season tired arm last year and incidents of his arm slot moving, thus causing him a few rough spots.

He has thrown a TON of innings at an early age and is considered to be somewhat of a risk simply because he has yet to ever experience arm trouble (and they all do)

Either he gives you a better OF or you give him Bradley (who is a wildcard in a pitchers park)

Red Leader
06-03-2004, 07:52 PM
Thanks to everyone for their advice.

westofyou, categories are as follows:

HITTERS: R, HR, RBI, SB, K, AVG, OBP%, SLG%

PITCHERS: W, L, CG, SV, HR, K, ERA, WHIP.

I'm getting killed in the K dept. Mussina, Garcia, and Pineiro usually get 5-7 per start. Lieber and Moyer usually get 2-5 K's per start. Benitez usually gets a K or 2 per outing, same with Dotel. I just added Affeldt. Getting Burnett back will help as he's a solid K guy that I can put in the 5-7 group.


Another team in my league has Carlos Lee in the OF, who I figured would be a good target to get back for Sheff. His pitchers: Pedro, Wood, Colon, Mulder, Maddox, Dontrelle.

I could offer OF Gary Sheffield + one of my pitchers for OF Carlos Lee + one of his pitchers. See any pretty even matches there where I come out ahead in the K dept?

Red Leader
06-08-2004, 05:13 PM
Ok. Big deal thrown at me.

I would give: 1B Todd Helton, 3B/OF Melvin Mora and SP A.J. Burnett

I would get: 1B Jason Giambi, 3B/OF Aubrey Huff, SP Javier Vazquez



That leaves me with:

C: Posada
1B: J. Giambi
2B: B. Roberts
3B: Blalock
SS: Jeter
MI: O.Cabrera (might drop for J. Hairston, Jr)
CI: A. Huff
OF: G.Sheffield
OF: B. Giles
OF: M. Cabrera
OF: J. Burnitz
UTIL: V.Martinez
UTIL: M. Bradley

SP: F. Garcia
SP: M. Mussina
SP: J. Vazquez
SP: J. Moyer
SP: J. Pineiro
SP: J. Lieber
RP: A. Benitez
RP: O. Dotel
RP: J. Affeldt


Is that too much to give up for those guys? I'm worried that Helton's bad back will hurt his power numbers, and numbers overall. Also worried that Burnett won't help much because of pitch count restrictions. What do you think?

westofyou
06-08-2004, 06:48 PM
Here's their EQA's



Name Team Pos Out PA EQA EQR RAR RAP RARP
Helton, Todd COL 1B 119. 223. 0.332 37.7 22.6 12.3 19.1
Giambi, Jason NYY 1B 96. 159. 0.321 28.0 15.8 7.6 13.0
Mora, Melvin BAL 3B 137. 245. 0.359 53.0 35.6 26.7 33.7
Huff, Aubrey TBY 3B 151. 223. 0.263 26.7 7.5 -3.5 4.6


Vasquez has a 17.7 VORP about 25th in MLB for pitchers.

At this point it looks like you're overpaying for Vasquez and taking a hit with the position players.

I have Miguel Cabrera too on my team, fyi (if you didn't note yet) he's having major problems with LH's (facing one tonight)

Red Leader
06-08-2004, 06:59 PM
At this point it looks like you're overpaying for Vasquez and taking a hit with the position players.

I have Miguel Cabrera too on my team, fyi (if you didn't note yet) he's having major problems with LH's (facing one tonight)


That's kind of the way I felt as well. Considering Vazquez is still throwing an insane amount of pitches per start, it might be wise for me to look elsewhere for my K's...Schilling maybe?

Its funny you mentioned that about Cabrera. I was just looking at my hitter's splits the other day and I saw how awful he was hitting LHP's. Somewhere south of .150. Being a RH power hitter I figured his numbers against LHP would be good. I was surprised as I hadn't noticed this until then. We don't have a bench in our league, so I can't take him out of there vs. LHP's. He also has 9K in 34 AB vs LHP and 43K in 182 AB vs RHP's. So he's not striking out as much against LHP by a slight percentage, yet he's not getting hits either. WEIRD. BTW, I also noticed that Melvin Mora is hitting an even .400 vs RHP's. I thought that was strange as well.

I really appreciate your input on this. You seem to make hard decision easier for me for some reason.

Red Leader
06-09-2004, 02:05 PM
Oh, God. This guy is killing me. I told him know on the above trade: Helton, Mora, Burnett for Vazquez, Giambi, Huff.

He counters with Scott Rolen and Javy Vazquez for Mora and Benitez.

If I give up Benitez, I'm left with Affeldt and Dotel as closers, with Rhodes, Biddle, Borowski, Frasor, Mantei, and Wickman available in free agency. I really like Rolen, but I also really like Mora (power / SB / avg / OBP). Advice?

westofyou
06-09-2004, 02:14 PM
Oh, God. This guy is killing me. I told him know on the above trade: Helton, Mora, Burnett for Vazquez, Giambi, Huff.

He counters with Scott Rolen and Javy Vazquez for Mora and Benitez.

If I give up Benitez, I'm left with Affeldt and Dotel as closers, with Rhodes, Biddle, Borowski, Frasor, Mantei, and Wickman available in free agency. I really like Rolen, but I also really like Mora (power / SB / avg / OBP). Advice?

I'd do that one in a heartbeat, then I'd try and trade other surplus for a Hawkins/Nathan type reliever.

Red Leader
06-09-2004, 03:16 PM
Ok. Here's what I got going so far.

Another team in our league has 4 closers (Smoltz, Graves, Kolb, Hoffman) and a bunch of pitchers on the DL (Padilla, Wolf) and Nomo.

I've offered SP Jon Lieber and SP A.J. Burnett for Wolf and Hoffman, figuring Hoffman would help replace Benitez and Wolf (when healthy) will be an upgrade over Burnett or Lieber anyway.

I told the other owner that I want to wait until I hear on another offer before I get back to him on the Mora/Benitez for Vazquez/Rolen trade.

If both deals go down, I think I'll be in REAL good shape. My lineup would be:

C: J. Posada
1B: T. Helton
2B: B. Roberts
3B: S. Rolen
SS: D. Jeter
MI: J. Hairston, Jr. ( I dropped O.Cabrera)
CI: H. Blalock
OF: G.Sheffield
OF: B. Giles
OF: J. Burnitz
OF: M. Cabrera
UTIL: V. Martinez
UTIL: M. Bradley
DL: M. Giles

SP: M. Mussina
SP: F. Garcia
SP: J. Vazquez
SP: J. Moyer
SP: J. Pineiro
SP: K. Wells, B. Webb, M.Redman (free agent pickup for Wolf on DL)
RP: O.Dotel
RP: T. Hoffman
RP: J. Affeldt
DL: R. Wolf


Does that team look significantly better that what I started with?

Red Leader
06-10-2004, 03:21 PM
The team with Wolf/Hoffman never got back to me. While I was waiting for them to respond, I received an email from the other owner that he had a deal in place and he had already agreed to it. Here is the deal he took:
Scott Rolen / Kevin Millwood for Pedro Feliz / Matt Clement. Ouch. So now, I'm looking at other teams to make a trade. One owner in my league wants me to give him Mike Mussina and Melvin Mora for Jason Scmidt and Junior Spivey. Eeeek. I don't know about that. What do you think?

Also, do you think I should drop Jon Lieber and pick up Kip Wells, Jeff Weaver or John Thomson? I'm thinking Kip will rebound in the near future and bring his ERA/WHIP down.

Red Leader
06-10-2004, 04:53 PM
Owner won't budge. He wants Mussina and Mora for Schmidt and Spivey. I could drop Spivey and pick up Chone Figgins off waivers to offset the loss. Is is worth it?