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View Full Version : Reds pick up Casey's option for '06



BrooklynRedz
10-29-2004, 01:29 PM
just announced.

Reds1
10-29-2004, 01:48 PM
cool. How much was it again!

MWM
10-29-2004, 01:55 PM
Not a bad move considering he was going to reach his incentives anyway.

jmcclain19
10-29-2004, 01:58 PM
I think this quashes just about every "Trade Casey" idea, at least in the interim.

Chip R
10-29-2004, 01:59 PM
Those cheap &^##%$. Oh, wait. Those generous $%&^#@$. ;)

Red in Chicago
10-29-2004, 02:04 PM
captain casey :gac:

zombie-a-go-go
10-29-2004, 02:04 PM
Rawk. :gac:

RedFanAlways1966
10-29-2004, 02:10 PM
Add me to the positive list... :gac:

deltachi8
10-29-2004, 02:14 PM
It may be another sign that the Keras thing is truthfully in the plans. I always felt that if they dumped the plan (for wahtever reason), plan B was to move Casey and have Jr or Dunn at 1b.

iammrred
10-29-2004, 02:23 PM
I just hated to picture this team without Casey on it.

A great move that makes quite a statement! :gac:

BrooklynRedz
10-29-2004, 02:23 PM
It may be another sign that the Keras thing is truthfully in the plans. I always felt that if they dumped the plan (for wahtever reason), plan B was to move Casey and have Jr or Dunn at 1b.

Wait, what's the "Keras thing" again?

here's a link to the story: http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cin/news/cin_news.jsp?ymd=20041029&content_id=907965&vkey=news_cin&fext=.jsp

Red Leader
10-29-2004, 02:27 PM
Wait, what's the "Keras thing" again?



You know, John Keras, the guy running for president. They're trying him out to see if he can play the hot corner next year until EE comes up. Then after Keras has a good year next year, they're going to trade him because they won't be able to afford him. Damn taxes on the wealthy.

BCubb2003
10-29-2004, 02:32 PM
I think he means Eric Keras as a backup first baseman.

BrooklynRedz
10-29-2004, 02:33 PM
You know, John Keras, the guy running for president. They're trying him out to see if he can play the hot corner next year until EE comes up. Then after Keras has a good year next year, they're going to trade him because they won't be able to afford him. Damn taxes on the wealthy.

Booya!

MWM
10-29-2004, 02:44 PM
I don't think this has anything to do with being a "sign" of anything. Let's not read too much into it. Casey was going to reach the incentives that automatically kicked in the extra year. Doing this is good PR in the sense tha it makes it look like they WANTED him bak. I'm not saying they don't, just that they really had no choice, so doing this is the best way to handle it.

M2
10-29-2004, 02:54 PM
I don't think this has anything to do with being a "sign" of anything. Let's not read too much into it. Casey was going to reach the incentives that automatically kicked in the extra year. Doing this is good PR in the sense tha it makes it look like they WANTED him bak. I'm not saying they don't, just that they really had no choice, so doing this is the best way to handle it.

Bingo, take an inevitable and spin it into a positive.

Smart business by the Reds on this one. Now market the guy for cripes sake. The Reds have to get over this stress-the-team-instead-of-the-players mentality and start taking greater advantage of guys like Casey.

guernsey
10-29-2004, 03:04 PM
$8.5m option for 2006, guaranteed w/ 2 AS or 1500 AB from 2003-2005

macro
10-29-2004, 03:10 PM
$8,500,000 is too much to pay Sean Casey.

westofyou
10-29-2004, 03:17 PM
Smart business by the Reds on this one. Now market the guy for cripes sake.

Casey markets himself, the Reds just have to learn to play it that way.

He's a big smiling, pumping fist, lamp black and bat on the ball baseball player.

That stuff is heartland gold, it's a baseball brand.

Now with Barry gone Casey becomes the face of the organization, why I bet he is already more famous than Long John O'Reilly.

RFS62
10-29-2004, 03:22 PM
Casey markets himself, the Reds just have to learn to play it that way.

He's a big smiling, pumping fist, lamp black and bat on the ball baseball player.

That stuff is heartland gold, it's a baseball brand.

Now with Barry gone Casey becomes the face of the organization, why I bet he is already more famous than Long John O'Reilly.



I couldn't possibly agree more, as I'm sure you know.


:thumbup:

bucksfan
10-29-2004, 03:25 PM
I think it is great news as well.

pedro
10-29-2004, 03:29 PM
this is good too in helping clubhouse moral, especially after letting larkin go.

Matt700wlw
10-29-2004, 03:31 PM
Dammit! They did the right thing....how am I supposed to complain now? :p:

M2
10-29-2004, 03:31 PM
Casey markets himself, the Reds just have to learn to play it that way.

He's a big smiling, pumping fist, lamp black and bat on the ball baseball player.

That stuff is heartland gold, it's a baseball brand.

Now with Barry gone Casey becomes the face of the organization, why I bet he is already more famous than Long John O'Reilly.

Making Casey a central figure in team ad campaigns, rather than say burglars who'll give you a pass if you have Reds memorabilia lying around, might help too.

westofyou
10-29-2004, 03:33 PM
Making Casey a central figure in team ad campaigns, rather than say burglars who'll give you a pass if you have Reds memorabilia lying around, might help too.

That ad campaign was fox driven, they had one for every city, same shot sans the note and the eyeing of the material.

Look for a Giant Casey and Dunn pairing, two towering guys with bats.

M2
10-29-2004, 03:40 PM
That ad campaign was fox driven, they had one for every city, same shot sans the note and the eyeing of the material.

Look for a Giant Casey and Dunn pairing, two towering guys with bats.

That's what they should do, but when's the last time the Reds took advantage of their own players on the marketing end of things?

I still say they should run spots where Casey chats up random folks at 1st base like it was his own talk show. You can make the interviewees as far flung as you want (a mock Queen Elizabeth trying to work a lead remains my personal favorite).

Chip R
10-29-2004, 03:45 PM
That ad campaign was fox driven, they had one for every city, same shot sans the note and the eyeing of the material.
God forbid the Reds come up with something on their own instead of using Fox' "fill in the blank with the team name" advertisements. :rolleyes: It reminds me of the old gag on Late Night with David Letterman where they would welcome a new affiliate with the same narration over a generic montage of footage and the only thing that would change would be when they said the city's name, a lake or river and what they produce. The voice that said those things was totally different than Letterman's voice which they used for the narration.

I just think it's a shame the Reds are so lacking in creativity that they choose to use generic ads. :(

RFS62
10-29-2004, 03:47 PM
Uh, the Reds aren't running those ads. They're being run by FOX.

iammrred
10-29-2004, 03:51 PM
God forbid the Reds come up with something on their own instead of using Fox' "fill in the blank with the team name" advertisements. :rolleyes:

I just think it's a shame the Reds are so lacking in creativity that they choose to use generic ads. :(

The Reds can't tell Fox which ads to run during their games, much like they can't tell Skyline or Chevy or DHL which ads to run during their games.

RFS62
10-29-2004, 04:02 PM
I think it's just that Fox has a big ad department and they build a nationwide campaign every year with a series of generic commercials, as described above.

These are Fox promotions, just like a commercial for 24 or OC. They bear the cost, not the Reds.

And they aren't asking you to go to the ballpark, they're asking you to watch on TV.

15fan
10-29-2004, 04:32 PM
Casey gets $7.8 M in 2005, and $8.5 M in 2006.

$16.3 M over two years would go a really long way towards buying some better pitchers.

iammrred
10-29-2004, 04:34 PM
And if we get rid of everyone else, that'll give us $50 million to put toward some pitching!

Chip R
10-29-2004, 04:35 PM
The Reds can't tell Fox which ads to run during their games, much like they can't tell Skyline or Chevy or DHL which ads to run during their games.
No, but they can sell those ads to local stations and the local cable company which would put them on their local ads on ESPN and other stations where they put local ads on.

Red Heeler
10-29-2004, 04:49 PM
And if we get rid of everyone else, that'll give us $50 million to put toward some pitching!

Not such a bad idea. ;)

Really, if the Reds took what they are paying for position players and used it to pay pitchers and vice versa, they would win more ballgames. I'd bet on it.

Falls City Beer
10-29-2004, 04:58 PM
Not such a bad idea. ;)

Really, if the Reds took what they are paying for position players and used it to pay pitchers and vice versa, they would win more ballgames. I'd bet on it.

Of course they would.

iammrred
10-29-2004, 04:59 PM
No, but they can sell those ads to local stations and the local cable company which would put them on their local ads on ESPN and other stations where they put local ads on.

I am so totally confused right now...

Matt700wlw
10-29-2004, 05:03 PM
This also gives the Reds a better opportunity to trade him...his FA value would have been higher than what the Reds are paying him, so a team would take the smaller contract and the Reds could get something in return

Don't rule it out

Falls City Beer
10-29-2004, 05:04 PM
This also gives the Reds a better opportunity to trade him...his FA value would have been higher than what the Reds are paying him, so a team would take the smaller contract and the Reds could get something in return

Don't rule it out

I certainly hope you're right.

CougarQuest
10-29-2004, 05:24 PM
Matt, your radio station is playing this to mean that Casey won't be traded.

Chip R
10-29-2004, 05:52 PM
I am so totally confused right now...
Let me see if I can enlighten you. The Reds decide to make some commercials advertising themselves. They go to the local TV stations or the TV stations come to them and the Reds agree to buy time for their commercials. They then make the commercials and the TV stations show them when they and the Reds think fans are going to watch. Not during "Oprah" or "Wheel of Fortune" but during the news or other shows like during UC basketball. Now, you know when you are watching ESPN and a commercial for some local used car company comes on? Those commercials are only being shown in the area that cable company serves. There might be a totally different commercial on in Covington as there would be in Cincinnati because two seperate cable companies serve the area. So what the Reds do is buy that time and have the cable company(ies) show those commercials. You don't need them on the actual telecast of the game. The game should be enough of a commercial.

Krusty
10-29-2004, 06:22 PM
Well, we know Casey will be the first baseman. And it is no secret the Reds are shopping for a third baseman. If the Reds do get a third baseman, what will our outfield look like next season?

RANDY IN INDY
10-29-2004, 06:43 PM
God forbid the Reds come up with something on their own instead of using Fox' "fill in the blank with the team name" advertisements. :rolleyes: It reminds me of the old gag on Late Night with David Letterman where they would welcome a new affiliate with the same narration over a generic montage of footage and the only thing that would change would be when they said the city's name, a lake or river and what they produce. The voice that said those things was totally different than Letterman's voice which they used for the narration.

I just think it's a shame the Reds are so lacking in creativity that they choose to use generic ads. :(

Generic front office. Generic GM. Just staying consistent. What's not to like?

FlyingPig
10-29-2004, 07:46 PM
yesssss! :gac:

In a perfect world, every baseball fan gets to see his or her favorite player stay on their team. Salaries, cost cutting, trading for "prospects", and other nasty things shouldn't be a part of this "perfect world."

Today..my baseball world got a little bit perfect! Captain Casey stays!

Tomorrow..of course I'll be sent back to reality... :(


But at this moment......2 more years of sticking the bat under his arm, tugging at the gloves...sticking one leg in...holding the hand up...sticking the other legs in...grinding the feet into the dirt...

yessssss!

iammrred
10-29-2004, 08:27 PM
Let me see if I can enlighten you. The Reds decide to make some commercials advertising themselves. They go to the local TV stations or the TV stations come to them and the Reds agree to buy time for their commercials. They then make the commercials and the TV stations show them when they and the Reds think fans are going to watch. Not during "Oprah" or "Wheel of Fortune" but during the news or other shows like during UC basketball. Now, you know when you are watching ESPN and a commercial for some local used car company comes on? Those commercials are only being shown in the area that cable company serves. There might be a totally different commercial on in Covington as there would be in Cincinnati because two seperate cable companies serve the area. So what the Reds do is buy that time and have the cable company(ies) show those commercials. You don't need them on the actual telecast of the game. The game should be enough of a commercial.

I understand the concept of regional advertising, but what does that have to do with commercials for Fox?

The Reds do, in fact, do some TV advertising during the season on a variety of channels, from what I've seen. However, they're definitely more informational then entertaining (plugging a promotion, a big series, opening of the Hall, etc.). Of course, I don't see TV advertising as an effective way to spend money when you have what is probably a small marketing budget. Most people aren't going to decide to go to a game simply because of a TV commercial (unless it's in one of the "informational" ones). That's not to say it doesn't work. I remember Seattle having some really popular TV commercials a few years ago (Bret Boone, Jamie Moyer, Edgar and a bunch of players got involved), but I heard it ended up costing a fortune. For a team that was on the verge of something big, though, it was probably money well spent.

Chip R
10-29-2004, 09:15 PM
I understand the concept of regional advertising, but what does that have to do with commercials for Fox?

The Reds do, in fact, do some TV advertising during the season on a variety of channels, from what I've seen. However, they're definitely more informational then entertaining (plugging a promotion, a big series, opening of the Hall, etc.). Of course, I don't see TV advertising as an effective way to spend money when you have what is probably a small marketing budget. Most people aren't going to decide to go to a game simply because of a TV commercial (unless it's in one of the "informational" ones). That's not to say it doesn't work. I remember Seattle having some really popular TV commercials a few years ago (Bret Boone, Jamie Moyer, Edgar and a bunch of players got involved), but I heard it ended up costing a fortune. For a team that was on the verge of something big, though, it was probably money well spent.
I didn't say it had anything to do with Fox commercials. RFS62 said it best when he said that those commercials are trying to get you to watch the games on TV. What the Reds need is for people to come out to the ballpark if they want to increase revenue enough to have a higher payroll. Even if they increased TV revenue to the level of St. Louis, if there was a corresponding increase in payroll it might be enough to offset annual arbitration increases but they still would be sorely lacking behind St. Louis in revenue from butts in the seats. I'm not saying having the Reds make their own commercials would be a panacea but it would be better than they have now which isn't much. As for cost, that could be a problem. But it's like having a big payroll. It's not what you spend but how you spend it. Have you seen anything creative come out of the Reds marketing department? They pretty much follow the lead of the other teams. Bobbleheads are popular so let's give away 3 or 4 bobbleheads a year. 3 or 4 easy sellouts. Celebriducks, nesting dolls, beanie babies? Sure, everyone else does it so it's safe. I'd like to see them come up with something on their own that other teams would ape instead of the other way around.

You want to create a demand for the product. You want people begging to buy tickets at any cost. It's entertainment. People want to be entertained and have fun. M2 is right when he says the Reds need to market the individual players more. That's true of any business. You market your assets. Why does Wal-Mart do such good business? It certainly isn't because of the customer service or the displays blocking the aisles. They do great business because they have low prices and they advertise it ad nauseum. The Reds need to do the same thing. They need to market their assets instead of hiding them under a bushel. You have one of the nicest, most fan-friendly guys around in Sean Casey. People love him here. Use that to your advantage. But I don't see any commercials with him in them unless they are for some charity he works with. They obviously believe he can do some good for their charity so why can't the Reds see that he can do some good for them? Use Dunn, use Kearns, use Jr. - which they have done in the past to the eclusion of others. Heck, use Wily Mo if he has any kind of charisma in him. maybe he's not the next Sammy Sosa just because of the way he hits. Maybe he has a bit of ham in him.

I don't have all the answers. But what has been going on lo these many years certainly hasn't been working. They certainly don't have to pay for RedsFest this year or the next. Use that money to make some ads and buy some commercial time. It won't be as easy as make a commercial and draw 3 million. But it may be a good first step.

MWM
10-29-2004, 09:27 PM
How often do you see a Reds commercial during regular programming on one of the local networks?

M2
10-29-2004, 09:43 PM
Of course, I don't see TV advertising as an effective way to spend money when you have what is probably a small marketing budget. Most people aren't going to decide to go to a game simply because of a TV commercial (unless it's in one of the "informational" ones). That's not to say it doesn't work. I remember Seattle having some really popular TV commercials a few years ago (Bret Boone, Jamie Moyer, Edgar and a bunch of players got involved), but I heard it ended up costing a fortune. For a team that was on the verge of something big, though, it was probably money well spent.

Seattle started the commercials in the early '90s when the franchise was bottom of the barrel in terms of its budget. The ad campaign was the shot across the bow in terms of getting the local market to pay attention to the product. Now Seattle's one of the highest grossing revenue teams in baseball. Seattle didn't pay a fortune, it made a fortune.

Chip, great post.

iammrred
10-29-2004, 10:13 PM
Seattle started the commercials in the early '90s when the franchise was bottom of the barrel in terms of its budget. The ad campaign was the shot across the bow in terms of getting the local market to pay attention to the product. Now Seattle's one of the highest grossing revenue teams in baseball. Seattle didn't pay a fortune, it made a fortune.

Chip, great post.

Here are the commercials I were talking about -- they're just two years old. http://seattle.mariners.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/sea/news/sea_news_story.jsp?article_id=sea_20020314_comm_ne ws&team_id=sea#

It's hard to compare the effectiveness of advertising in each market, though. Seattle has a much bigger pool of potential fans in the Seattle area (about twice the size of Cincinnati's), many of which were or are totally foreign to the Mariners. So TV ads (especially clever ones) could do a lot to pique the interest of those fans. Most people in Cincinnati already have a strong feeling one way or the other, and a TV commercial isn't likely to do much to sway opinion.

You're right, though. Seattle at least made an attempt, and it worked (116 wins didn't hurt).

Chip - nice post. The Reds definitely need to find a way to better market the players. Concepts? Adam Dunn and Austin Kearns as Bo and Luke Duke in a General Lee-esque bullpen cart. Sean Casey sitting at the mayor's desk while Charlie Luken tries to explain he's not really "the Mayor." Ryan Freel springing full steam (and running over the occassional pedestrian) through downtown to drop off his dry cleaning, to hail a cab and grab some lunch. There's definitely some fun to be had with this team.

Chip R
10-29-2004, 10:45 PM
Here are the commercials I were talking about -- they're just two years old. http://seattle.mariners.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/sea/news/sea_news_story.jsp?article_id=sea_20020314_comm_ne ws&team_id=sea#

It's hard to compare the effectiveness of advertising in each market, though. Seattle has a much bigger pool of potential fans in the Seattle area (about twice the size of Cincinnati's), many of which were or are totally foreign to the Mariners. So TV ads (especially clever ones) could do a lot to pique the interest of those fans. Most people in Cincinnati already have a strong feeling one way or the other, and a TV commercial isn't likely to do much to sway opinion.

You're right, though. Seattle at least made an attempt, and it worked (116 wins didn't hurt).

Chip - nice post. The Reds definitely need to find a way to better market the players. Concepts? Adam Dunn and Austin Kearns as Bo and Luke Duke in a General Lee-esque bullpen cart. Sean Casey sitting at the mayor's desk while Charlie Luken tries to explain he's not really "the Mayor." Ryan Freel springing full steam (and running over the occassional pedestrian) through downtown to drop off his dry cleaning, to hail a cab and grab some lunch. There's definitely some fun to be had with this team.
:lol: Good stuff. :) I especially like the Freel one. :) A couple of years ago, some of us on the board came up with various ideas for commercials with Reds players in them. I wish we still had those cause they were a hoot and some were very good too. Say what you will about their talent level but there are a lot of likeable players on this team.

Actually Seattle started advertising creatively back in the late 80s when Jeff Smulyan owned the team. They did a couple of commercials where they showe scenes from an old Russian silent movie - Potemkin I believe it was - but they dubbed dialouge over it. They would show them all sad when the peasant leader told them, "Let's go to the Mariners game". Then he'd talk up the new players and the spruced up Kingdome and they all marched happily off to the ballpark. They drew pretty well after that 2.1M in 91. He did have to sell out eventually but he did start somewhat of a buzz there.

I'd just like to see the Reds give the fans more reason to come out there besides the new ballpark or Jr. or bobbleheads. It's easy to sell out for Opening Day or when you're giving away a bobblehead. It's tougher to get a good crowd on a Tuesday night in mid April when it's 50 degrees out and you're playing the Brewers. That's when you earn your money if you are are in marketing.

M2
10-29-2004, 10:46 PM
iammrred, seems to me the Reds are in an even better position than the Mariners were. Seattle residents were familiar with the Mariners when the team started its first major ad campaign, the club had sucked big time for more than a decade up to that point. The city had a well-formed negative opinion of the franchise.

The Reds have fans who've just sort of wandered away. Put yourself front and center in their line of sight, remind them how much fun baseball can be and you're likely to find a receptive audience. Going into satellite media markets (something the Mariners also did with gusto) is another area where the Reds would be well-served. We've got fans from West Virginia, Indiana, Kentucky and Tennessee all over this board (not to mention the fine city of Columbus). That's not by happenstance. It's the result of the team's massive reach during the BRM's heyday. What Seattle did was find fans, make its market work. It's exactly what the Reds don't do and should.

BTW, nice ideas for the commercials. And I ask, if we can come up with this stuff, why can't the Reds?

REDREAD
10-29-2004, 10:57 PM
. We've got fans from West Virginia, Indiana, Kentucky and Tennessee all over this board (not to mention the fine city of Columbus).

Good points on the advertising/marketing. IMO, when this Fox deal expires, they should really make an effort to get some free TV deals back. That is free advertising. Actually, it's advertising the local stations pay for :)
Instead of trying to marginally increase the TV deal by giving Fox complete rights, the Reds should be trying to increase their audience.

IIRC, the Fox deal expired after this season, unless I missed them extending/renewing.

CougarQuest
10-29-2004, 11:03 PM
I would've never guessed that the Reds picking up the option on Casey would have attracted this much posting about the economic advantages of advertising and the Mariners.

flyer85
10-29-2004, 11:11 PM
From Rotoworld -

"Apparently, the Reds thought they had to do something to restore goodwill with their fans after dumping Barry Larkin. Viewed strictly as a baseball move, this is terribly stupid. Casey has had one good year out of the last three, and he's been nothing more than an average regular over the course of his career. This was a transaction made to keep season-ticket holders."

Big Klu
10-30-2004, 12:45 AM
You know, John Keras, the guy running for president. They're trying him out to see if he can play the hot corner next year until EE comes up. Then after Keras has a good year next year, they're going to trade him because they won't be able to afford him. Damn taxes on the wealthy.

I thought he meant Alex Keras, who would give the Bengals an All-Pro defensive lineman. :gac:

MWM
10-30-2004, 12:51 AM
From Rotoworld -

"Apparently, the Reds thought they had to do something to restore goodwill with their fans after dumping Barry Larkin. Viewed strictly as a baseball move, this is terribly stupid. Casey has had one good year out of the last three, and he's been nothing more than an average regular over the course of his career. This was a transaction made to keep season-ticket holders."

They completely missed the point. He needs only 360 ABs next year or to make the AS team to meet his incentive that would automatically kick in the 2006 option.