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View Full Version : 5/14 GAME THREAD vs Philly (Randa batting...gulp...3rd)



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KronoRed
05-14-2005, 10:21 PM
I'd like about 5 more runs before we go to the pen

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:22 PM
Griffey K's. 2 outs.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:22 PM
Dunn Int. BB. 1s and 2nd, 2 outs.

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 10:23 PM
Instant Manager Poll: Let Harang go back out next inning? (Yea or Nay)

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:23 PM
Kearns singles. 10-4 Reds. 1st and 2nd, 2 outs.

M2
05-14-2005, 10:24 PM
Harang still hitting 92 on the gun.

The guy is a warrior.

Credit where it's due. He didn't have his stuff tonight and he gave the team seven innings. Been a long time since I've seen a Reds pitcher do that.

Chip R
05-14-2005, 10:25 PM
Instant Manager Poll: Let Harang go back out next inning? (Yea or Nay)Yea. I'd rather have him out there than anyone else in the bullpen.

OnBaseMachine
05-14-2005, 10:25 PM
Great night for Kearns! 3 hits and has walked.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:25 PM
Jimenez walks, bases loaded, 2 outs.

TRF
05-14-2005, 10:26 PM
Agreed. let him go, but keep the leash short.

Kearns now hitting .250. Starting to see him come out of the funk.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:26 PM
LaRue singles. 12-4 Reds!!

37red
05-14-2005, 10:26 PM
If he feels like he can go back out..................... of course let him.

KronoRed
05-14-2005, 10:26 PM
Hey Dave..Austin might wanna be hit higher then 7th more often ;)

TRF
05-14-2005, 10:27 PM
Man... LaRue! doubles!

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:27 PM
Harang batting for the third time in two innings, LOL!

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 10:27 PM
Harang batting for the third time in two innings, LOL!

Too bad he looks SOOOOOOOooo awful at it. :laugh:

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:28 PM
Harang K's. 12-4 Reds, Mid. 8th.

KronoRed
05-14-2005, 10:28 PM
Poor Harang, his BA is gonna take a big hit tonight ;)

RedlegJake
05-14-2005, 10:28 PM
Harang is easily our best starter though that isn't much to say inre the rest of the staff...

flyer85
05-14-2005, 10:30 PM
Lets see, Jr has a a run scoring double and a 3 run HR but he also has 3 Ks, really not a very good because of the Ks.

Please turn your sarcasm detector on

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:30 PM
Despite tonigh'ts "off night", Harang has a 3.68 ERA. Not bad at all. Might get better if he can get through hte 8th here.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:30 PM
Poor Harang, his BA is gonna take a big hit tonight ;)

Harang now 1 for 22. Easily our worst-hitting pitcher. (not necessarily worst BA...just the worst hitter).

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:31 PM
Burrell lines out to Randa...NICE play! 1 out.

Reds Fanatic
05-14-2005, 10:31 PM
Good catch by Randa

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:32 PM
Utley flies out. 2 outs.

RedlegJake
05-14-2005, 10:33 PM
Put Randa down as one of the season's few positives - he's earning his pay and its nice to see a real third baseman out there.

Reds Nd2
05-14-2005, 10:34 PM
Did Chris just say that Harang would be the first Reds pitcher since '01 to go 8 innings in back to back starts?

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:36 PM
Michaels K's. 12-4 Reds after 8.

4 ER in 8 IP for Harang. What a gutsy effort! :thumbup:

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 10:37 PM
Did Chris just say that Harang would be the first Reds pitcher since '01 to go 8 innings in back to back starts?

I complain about Don Gullett with the best of them, but the work he has done turning Aaron Harang into a quality major-legue starter has been second to none.

This guy was figured as a back-of-the rotation kinda guy, he's pitching like a solid #2-#3 starter.

TRF
05-14-2005, 10:38 PM
M2 called it. Harang was the most likely pitcher to take a big step forward.

Event though he gave up the three run tater, he hung tough and is leading by example. Milton, Wilson and the others should take notes.

M2
05-14-2005, 10:38 PM
Did Chris just say that Harang would be the first Reds pitcher since '01 to go 8 innings in back to back starts?

Reitsma was the last to do it, IIRC.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:38 PM
Adams in for the Phillies.

Freel with the dirty uni. singles.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:39 PM
If you ask me, Harang pitched one inning too many. You have an 8 run lead.
The only reason Harang hit in the eigthth was to justify Miley's decision to have him hit twice in the seventh.

stubborn...just stubborn.

Reds Fanatic
05-14-2005, 10:40 PM
3 straight good starts for Harang.

Tonight 8 IP 4 ER
May 9th 8 IP 1 ER
May 3rd 7 IP 2 ER

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:40 PM
Weathers in the Reds pen... will be on for the 9th.

Lopez grounds into FC, Lopez on 1B, 1 out.

flyer85
05-14-2005, 10:41 PM
kudos to harang

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:41 PM
Felipe has hit the ball HARD..every AB.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:41 PM
Randa flies out. 2 outs.

flyer85
05-14-2005, 10:42 PM
BTW, Weathers started the 9th in the STL meltdown

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:42 PM
Griffey grounds out. 12-4 Reds, Mid. 9th.

Eric_Davis
05-14-2005, 10:44 PM
Good win, but if we don't win tomorrow, Miley should be fired.

Reds Nd2
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
Reitsma was the last to do it, IIRC.

I'm not sure I even heard that correctly. If thats true, it's just unreal.

To Emperor: Yea' Harang has looked good so far this season. Hope he keeps it up and others take notes.

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
If you ask me, Harang pitched one inning too many. You have an 8 run lead.
The only reason Harang hit in the eigthth was to justify Miley's decision to have him hit twice in the seventh.

stubborn...just stubborn.

This is the kind of an outing that can send a message to the entire staff. Harang has been up and down today, but he's battling and he's made it through 8 innings. He'll pick up a win (which he should've gotten the last time he pitched), and carry the confidence of being able to go deep into two ballgames in a row.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
Weathers on to try to close it out.

Bell flies out. 1 out.

Chip R
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
I think we should segregate the pitching staff. Keep Harang and Wagner away from all the others. I am afraid the stink is gonna rub off on them.

traderumor
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
If you ask me, Harang pitched one inning too many. You have an 8 run lead.
The only reason Harang hit in the eigthth was to justify Miley's decision to have him hit twice in the seventh.

stubborn...just stubborn.I'd call it watching his bullpen all year. Stretch the starters out when possible. Now, we only have an eight run lead, Yogi had this bullpen in mind when he said the immortal "it aint over til its over"

TRF
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
If you ask me, Harang pitched one inning too many. You have an 8 run lead.
The only reason Harang hit in the eigthth was to justify Miley's decision to have him hit twice in the seventh.

stubborn...just stubborn.

It couldn't possibly have been because he was cruising, and the 'pen has stunk.

Nah that couldn't have been it. hey, I'll bash miley with the best of them but keeping Harang in was the right move.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:45 PM
Good win, but if we don't win tomorrow, Miley should be fired.

He should be fired...regardless.

Eric_Davis
05-14-2005, 10:46 PM
13 pitchers on the roster and you let your best young pitcher go 119 pitches. Absolutely ridiculous.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:46 PM
Pratt lines out. 2 outs.

Reds Fanatic
05-14-2005, 10:47 PM
Reds win 12-4! :beerme:

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:47 PM
Offerman grounds out...And this one belongs to the Reds!!!! 12-4 final!

traderumor
05-14-2005, 10:48 PM
I tell ya, if Felipe hasn't sent a strong enough signal that we can concentrate on other areas of this team, then there is nothing he can do.

The streak ends, held the Phils to nine hits. Baby steps, baby steps.

RosieRed
05-14-2005, 10:48 PM
Now that the game is over, can I just say ...

12

Run

Plan.

;)

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:49 PM
Harang didn't even look like he was out of gas before he came out in the 8th, and that was after HITTING a few times in a couple of innings.(Although doesn't mean much for him ;) )

I think leaving him in for the 8th was a good move. Our pen needed a rest after being worked so much to start this season, and it gave Harang the endurance/confidence to hopefully do something like that again in the future.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:50 PM
It couldn't possibly have been because he was cruising, and the 'pen has stunk.

Nah that couldn't have been it. hey, I'll bash miley with the best of them but keeping Harang in was the right move.

Whatever. But the last thing I wan't to do is strain the only starter who's been pitching well. If I can't trust the bullpen up 8 with 2 to go against this lineup (not the Cardinals)... :bang:

Reds Nd2
05-14-2005, 10:50 PM
Ok, be honest. When the Reds made it 8-4, did anyone else breathe a sigh of relief that Graves had lost a save opp?

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 10:51 PM
Well folks, I will be AT Citizens Bank(can't wait to look all around the place) for the game tomorrow, so no play-by-play from me. I know you're all upset ;)

Anyway, I will have a full report after the game about observations on various facets of the team/the park.

If anyone has anything they want me to scream into the Reds dugout since I will be right next to it, just tell me :)

KronoRed
05-14-2005, 10:52 PM
Nice win, at least we can't lose this series :)

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 10:52 PM
13 pitchers on the roster and you let your best young pitcher go 119 pitches. Absolutely ridiculous.

Harang's last three games prior to this one: 94, 111, 115 pitches.

Over the course of his career, Harang has averaged 93.5 pitches per start. The only thing that has been holding him back from pitching deeper into ballgames like this has been propensity to throw too many pitches early in the games. He's a big dude who should be able to handle the increased workload that he's been getting lately.

Plus, he seems to maintain velocity over the course of the game, still throwing his 92 fastball for strikes as late as the 7th inning.

I say, as long as he feels good, let him throw. It's nice to see starters throw like this once every five games.

KronoRed
05-14-2005, 10:53 PM
Now that the game is over, can I just say ...

12

Run

Plan.

;)

Finally! how long has it taken them to get on board? ;)

oneupper
05-14-2005, 10:53 PM
REDS manage to stay out of the cellar. Houston won 4-1 (Clemens).

Winning Pct inching its way back to .400 (.389)

traderumor
05-14-2005, 10:59 PM
Whatever. But the last thing I wan't to do is strain the only starter who's been pitching well. If I can't trust the bullpen up 8 with 2 to go against this lineup (not the Cardinals)... :bang:Don't buy that 90-100 pitch count stuff that has been bought into hook line and sinker by so many. Harang is showing the ability to stretch it out, plus you are talking 115 pitches over 8 innings. There are more factors than the number of pitches. For instance, he was not in trouble much tonight, in fact other than the Abreu cheapy in that bandbox of a park, Aaron was in control the entire night. I am impressed that he has been able to get that number of innings out of a relatively low number of pitches. That is a sign of effectiveness. Milton and Wilson are hitting the 100 pitch mark in the fifth as they get knocked around the field.

CincyRedsFan30
05-14-2005, 11:03 PM
Oh, BTW, I liked this lineup fairly well tonight. :) (Even though Dunn should certainly be higher)

M2
05-14-2005, 11:04 PM
Harang's in the crucible right now. He's gone 110+ pitches three games in a row. It's probably the first time he's had this kind of workload. I'm sure fatigue is one of the reasons he was a bit flat tonight.

For a guy his size and age it's a workload he theoretically can handle, but it's still new territory for him.

Caveat Emperor
05-14-2005, 11:04 PM
Oh, BTW, I liked this lineup fairly well tonight. :) (Even though Dunn should certainly be higher)

Yeah, this leaves no doubt in my mind that the correct strategy is to trade Casey for whatever can be had. Get out from under the $8 million next year, get some prospects in return.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 11:06 PM
Don't buy that 90-100 pitch count stuff that has been bought into hook line and sinker by so many. Harang is showing the ability to stretch it out, plus you are talking 115 pitches over 8 innings. There are more factors than the number of pitches. For instance, he was not in trouble much tonight, in fact other than the Abreu cheapy in that bandbox of a park, Aaron was in control the entire night. I am impressed that he has been able to get that number of innings out of a relatively low number of pitches. That is a sign of effectiveness. Milton and Wilson are hitting the 100 pitch mark in the fifth as they get knocked around the field.

No, I agree with you on that. If we had been up 1, 2, 3, 4. I'd say...let him pitch. But with an 8 run lead (yes, BP and all), the need wasn't really there.

There's a lot of baseball from here to October.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 11:07 PM
Yeah, this leaves no doubt in my mind that the correct strategy is to trade Casey for whatever can be had. Get out from under the $8 million next year, get some prospects in return.

I agree, but Dunn will need A LOT of work at 1B.

KronoRed
05-14-2005, 11:15 PM
Harang's in the crucible right now. He's gone 110+ pitches three games in a row. It's probably the first time he's had this kind of workload. I'm sure fatigue is one of the reasons he was a bit flat tonight.

For a guy his size and age it's a workload he theoretically can handle, but it's still new territory for him.

I hate to see him go so many pitches, but really with this pen it's hard not to ask him to :(

ochre
05-14-2005, 11:18 PM
Grande called tonight a "great" pitching performance. Have the baseball standards of greatness plummeted so far? It was definitely a good outing by Harang, but the use of the word "great" so freely drives me nuts. Not quit as bad as Marty claiming the offense is equally responsible to the pitching for the Reds suckage so far this year, but bad enough.

Chip R
05-14-2005, 11:26 PM
Grande called tonight a "great" pitching performance. Have the baseball standards of greatness plummeted so far?You have to remember that Grande announces games for the Reds, not the Braves. Compared to the others on this staff, he looked like Cy Young tonight.

oneupper
05-14-2005, 11:28 PM
For those who liked the WPA analysis (both of you)...here's a summary of the "turnaround" seventh, in which the REDS Win probability went from 15.1% to 94.5%.



WE WE
Event Before After WPA

Freel Singles 0.151 0.190 0.039
Freel Steals 0.190 0.207 0.017
Flo IFH 0.207 0.276 0.069
Randa Singles 0.276 0.380 0.104
Griffey HR 0.380 0.799 0.419
Dunn HR 0.799 0.883 0.084
Kearns 2B 0.883 0.901 0.018
Jimenez 2B 0.901 0.945 0.044

Hoosier Red
05-14-2005, 11:59 PM
This is the kind of an outing that can send a message to the entire staff. Harang has been up and down today, but he's battling and he's made it through 8 innings. He'll pick up a win (which he should've gotten the last time he pitched), and carry the confidence of being able to go deep into two ballgames in a row.

That's the big thing to me especially because he has struggled historically in his last inning of work. There have been a lot of times where he hasn't had the endurance to go past the 5th or 6th inning, so to gut his way through 8 innings has to be a big confidence booster.

Hoosier Red
05-15-2005, 12:08 AM
Another thing to keep in mind. The Reds have an off day on Thursday, so he'll have a whole 5 days to rest as opposed to coming out on 4 days rest.

Mutaman
05-15-2005, 12:29 AM
13 pitchers on the roster and you let your best young pitcher go 119 pitches. Absolutely ridiculous.

Who are the 13 pitchers on the roster. I count 2, maybe 2 1/2.

SirFelixCat
05-15-2005, 06:53 AM
Great win today. Gutsy effort by Harang and the offense stepped it up. Good team win today. Love to see it catapult this team to a few wins now. Hopefully the rest of the rotation took notes tonight :thumbup:



And does this mean I'm hired for the pbp? ;)

PuffyPig
05-15-2005, 10:59 AM
13 pitchers on the roster and you let your best young pitcher go 119 pitches. Absolutely ridiculous.

It's called stretching him out.

A starter in the majors ought to be able to go 115-120 pitches per night routinely.

But you got to get there gradually. Harang's pitch count has been slowly going up. He was pitching to accomplish this.

And anytime a pitcher hits twice in an inning, you gotta love it.