PDA

View Full Version : Adam Dunn Trade Rumor!



Matt700wlw
05-15-2005, 05:25 PM
Adam Dunn to Marlins for 2 top pitching prospects, and infielder, and Luis Castillo.

Tracy said it on the air, and says it's from a reliable source he knows in Florida (I believe him...he usually doesn't make stuff up for the sake of making stuff up)

Again, only a rumor

smith288
05-15-2005, 05:32 PM
Any idea of the prospects?

My gut says its a dumb move. We need prospects but this teams needs results now. I want us to sign AD longterm and chuck aither Kearns or Pena. Kearns stock is down right now but I imagine Pena can fetch something.

KEEP DUNN! Sign him longterm darnit.

Matt700wlw
05-15-2005, 05:33 PM
Any idea of the prospects?

My gut says its a dumb move. We need prospects but this teams needs results now. I want us to sign AD longterm and chuck aither Kearns or Pena. Kearns stock is down right now but I imagine Pena can fetch something.

KEEP DUNN! Sign him longterm darnit.

Tracy wasn't sure the prospect's names, but one is THE top pitching prospect...

westofyou
05-15-2005, 05:34 PM
And Luis Castillo?

A Speed guy with bad wheels and the Reds have a glut at the position.

Sounds like hooey.

top6
05-15-2005, 05:37 PM
This trade would make absolutely no sense and would make the Reds much worse in the long run. Therefore, I'm virtually certain that Dan O'brien is considering it.

butlerbulldogs
05-15-2005, 05:39 PM
i like Luis Castillo, never strikes out and walks a ton, great leadoff hitter
(17 walks/4 k's)

westofyou
05-15-2005, 05:45 PM
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=4018

It's pretty clear, at least from this seat, that Luis Castillo is having a cascade problem running up and down his leg. It's been his hip flexor, hamstring and quad in quick succession. Castillo's had some structural problems in the past and I'm getting conflicting messages on whether the latest problems could be related to them. In any case, he seems to be taxed by explosive, quick movements, even in straight lines. A rest or even a DL stint could help heal it, but this is reaching the chronic stage quickly. That would leave Castillo as a speedy player without the ability to play speedy.

Red in Chicago
05-15-2005, 05:45 PM
i'm fine with trading dunn if it makes the team better...in my opinion, this does not accomplish that...let's hope this goes nowhere...

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 05:47 PM
The trade is tough to ctritique without knowing the prospects. But, if the prospects are Yorman Bazardo and Scott Olsen, the trade could be very enticing. I don't really like the idea of getting castillo becasue we already have two capable major league 2nd basemen on the roster plus we have Bergolla. If Castillo was say replaced by Jason Stokes or Josh Willingham, then I might have to pull the trigger.

RosieRed
05-15-2005, 05:50 PM
Yuck. :thumbdown

creek14
05-15-2005, 05:56 PM
I might have to call in a missile strike on the greater Miami area.

smith288
05-15-2005, 05:57 PM
I might have to call in a missile strike on the greater Miami area. I was waiting for your input. :thumbup:

RFS62
05-15-2005, 05:57 PM
I might have to call in a missile strike on the greater Miami area.


I would have thought DanO's street would be the target.

Petitt33
05-15-2005, 06:04 PM
Dunn is the only guy of the three OF's that I would NOT trade. But, if it's for either Burnett or Beckett, then I wouldn't mind for it. Castillo just isn't needed when you have two up and coming 2nd baseman in Bergolla and Freel.

M2
05-15-2005, 06:09 PM
Olsen's a mighty interesting prospect. Bazardo's got a 5.82 K/9 in the minors, which doesn't exactly float my boat. I'd rather have Jason Vargas. AA SS Robert Andino might be the anonymous IF.

Honestly, unless Jeremy Hermida's in the offer then it's way too cheap to sell off Dunn.

pedro
05-15-2005, 06:10 PM
no thanks on castillo. 30 year with no pop and bad legs.

he's not playing today BTW.

The Marlins remain hopeful that 2B Luis Castillo can avoid the disabled list and return to action next week. Castillo strained his left quadriceps muscle on Monday while running to first base.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:10 PM
Dunn is the only guy of the three OF's that I would NOT trade. But, if it's for either Burnett or Beckett, then I wouldn't mind for it. Castillo just isn't needed when you have two up and coming 2nd baseman in Bergolla and Freel.

Trading for Burnett doesn'y make much sense since he will be a FA after the year. If we really want him and can afford him (which we can't) then we should just wait until the off-season to shell ot the big bucks for him without wasting Dunn.

It would be different if we were in the middle of a penant chase, but getting Burnett only helps us for this year which doesn't make much sense.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:11 PM
Honestly, unless Jeremy Hermida's in the offer then it's way too cheap to sell off Dunn.

I think you are right on with that one.

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 06:17 PM
We're considering trading the best young hitter in the game for two unproven players and an alright leadoff man? Wow, if DO's stock with the fans wasn't low enough, this surely would put it there.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:20 PM
We're considering trading the best young hitter in the game for two unproven players and an alright leadoff man? Wow, if DO's stock with the fans wasn't low enough, this surely would put it there.

Dunn is pretty far off from being the best young player in the game.

OnBaseMachine
05-15-2005, 06:21 PM
Dunn is pretty far off from being the best young player in the game.

Behind Pujols, he's the best.

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 06:28 PM
Dunn is pretty far off from being the best young player in the game.

As OBM said, only Pujols is a better young hitter. The only other young hitters I would possibly consider in the same league as Dunn would be Cabrera, Crawford, Teixeira, and maybe Blalock.

NCRed
05-15-2005, 06:29 PM
Beckett or Burnett only please.

Was at all 4 games in Philly. Team needs a lot of help. If you keep Dunn and do not build anything around him, we will never get better.

Cant imagine why we would want Castillo unless D'Lo going too ??


Would you trade Dunn and FeLo for Gavin Floyd and Jimmy Rollins ?

RedsBaron
05-15-2005, 06:29 PM
I would have thought DanO's street would be the target.
Good point. Wipe out Miami and DanO will just make a bad trade with someone else. Know thy enemy.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 06:30 PM
WHY? unless 2 of the prospects become studs, it makes no sense. castillo is good, but he plays a position where we actually have prospects. how in the world can you trade dunn. you better get 2 no.1 starters if dunn goes. you cannot, CANNOT, trade a guy of his skill at his age.

pedro
05-15-2005, 06:30 PM
Dunn is pretty far off from being the best young player in the game.

Can you name a better young hitter (25 & under)? Now remember, he said "hitter" not "player" so fielding doesn't come into play.

I'd imagine that it should be pretty easy since Dunn is so far off IYO.

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 06:32 PM
Would you trade Dunn and FeLo for Gavin Floyd and Jimmy Rollins ?

No. Not trying to sound mean, but not only is Dunn for Floyd a coupe for the Phillies, but so would Lopez for Rollins. Rollins is Cesar Izturis circa 2003. Pass.

OnBaseMachine
05-15-2005, 06:35 PM
Did he say when the trade will be announced?

I will hate this deal unless the Reds receive Jason Vargas, Scott Olsen, and Jeremy Hermida, and even another top prospect.

It would be hard to be a Reds fan if they trade Dunn. He's the only thing that's keeps me interested when the team is losing.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:36 PM
WHY? unless 2 of the prospects become studs, it makes no sense. castillo is good, but he plays a position where we actually have prospects. how in the world can you trade dunn. you better get 2 no.1 starters if dunn goes. you cannot, CANNOT, trade a guy of his skill at his age.

what makes you think that we need to get two number one starters for Dunn. We would be incredibly lucky to get one for Dunn.

Teams simply don't trade good young pitchers like hitters since they have more trade value.

ochre
05-15-2005, 06:36 PM
Wasn't Tracy Jones about to get fired a couple of weeks ago?

(hint: its about the ratings...)

WVPacman
05-15-2005, 06:37 PM
No thanks!!!!! That would be just stupid to trade away our best power hitter for two prospects and a 2nd baseman that has bad wheels.If anybody is to get traded it should be Kearns,,nothing againist Kearns but Miley simply does'nt want to play him.When Willy comes back Willy will get to play thats why Kearns should be the one traded not Dunn.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:37 PM
Did he say when the trade will be announced?

I will hate this deal unless the Reds receive Jason Vargas, Scott Olsen, and Jeremy Hermida.

It's only being discussed. I don't think it's even close to being immenent.

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 06:39 PM
Did he say when the trade will be announced?

I will hate this deal unless the Reds receive Jason Vargas, Scott Olsen, and Jeremy Hermida.

I thought this was just a rumor.

And I'll hate this deal regardless. We get a gift in Dunn (cornerstone for the franchise, Top hitter, fan favorite) and the Reds are going to toss him to the corner of the street.

It was obvious the Reds needed to rebuild, so I'm not shocked they'd be selling off current players (though it still is early), but I'm shocked, and angry, they'd be shopping their best player (who happens to be young), especially for nothing guaranteed (and great) in return.

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:39 PM
Behind Pujols, he's the best.

That wasn't the message though. He said Dunn was the best young hitter in baseball.

Pujols is way better than Dunn which is why I said he is a far ways off from being the best since Pujols is in his own league.

westofyou
05-15-2005, 06:40 PM
Wasn't Tracy Jones about to get fired a couple of weeks ago?

(hint: its about the ratings...)

Kinda like leaving the lid off the trash can to catch a racoon.

Except the trash is easier to swallow.

WVPacman
05-15-2005, 06:41 PM
That wasn't the message though. He said Dunn was the best young hitter in baseball.

Pujols is way better than Dunn which is why I said he is a far ways off from being the best since Pujols is in his own league.

Pujols-Steroids!! :thumbup:

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:41 PM
Pujols-Steroids!! :thumbup:

We can only hope.

Redmachine2003
05-15-2005, 06:41 PM
Then if the Reds flipped Castillo for a couple of top prospects. It could be interesting to see who the Reds would get. But like he said it is only a rumor right now and they are a dime a dozen

SandyD
05-15-2005, 06:48 PM
I'm going to just keep reminding myself that this is just a rumor unless/until we learn otherwise.

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 06:49 PM
That wasn't the message though. He said Dunn was the best young hitter in baseball.

Pujols is way better than Dunn which is why I said he is a far ways off from being the best since Pujols is in his own league.

Pujols isn't "way better" than Dunn. Pujols is better than Dunn. But not by nearly the margin you think he is.

You're looking at: HR/BB/AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS

Pujols:
169 322 .333 .413 .622 1.035

Dunn:
129 380 .250 .386 .521 .907

Col_ IN Reds fan
05-15-2005, 06:52 PM
I would not be interested in Castillo. If Dunn is traded he better be traded for a top line pitcher. Having said all of that. The Reds need to keep Dunn and hope they can get Baltimore or then Yankees in somewhat of a bidding war for Griffey. Then just take the best possible trade for him.

CrackerJack
05-15-2005, 06:55 PM
Maybe the Reds know they can't or are not willing to re-sign Dunn with Jr. on the roster...? A sad, sad thought.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 06:56 PM
hey i got an idea, lets trade the fans fav player, the best player on your team, one of the best in the league, who is young, for prospects. SMART. IDIOTS. get oboring out of here before he ruins us for good. hes setting our development back a year about every month he stays on board. you trade griffey, then case, then MAYBE kearns or pena. in that order. you DO NOT trade dunn for prospects

Patrick Bateman
05-15-2005, 06:57 PM
Pujols is way better than Dunn. It isn't particularily close. I don't believe in K's being too indicative in a player' performance, but when you K as little as Pujols does, it puts you in your own league. Dunn will always K a lot and Pujols wont which is the biggest difference between the two.

KearnsyEars
05-15-2005, 06:58 PM
just dont trade kearnsy

WVPacman
05-15-2005, 06:59 PM
Maybe the Reds know they can't or are not willing to re-sign Dunn with Jr. on the roster...? A sad, sad thought.

Thats the problem we need to find a taker for Griffey so we could have Dunn in left,Willy Mo in center,Kearns in RIGHT.I garrentee if Jr was'nt a Red then we would have already signed those three to contracts extentions.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 07:01 PM
castillo is 29, makes almost 5 mill and is hurt right now

MattyHo4Life
05-15-2005, 07:11 PM
Any deal for Dunn should ONLY include pitchers. The Reds need to get as much good pitching as they can if they trade Dunn.

WVPacman
05-15-2005, 07:13 PM
Ok ok,whos the guy deleteing my reputation points?? :angry: I was 104 two days ago and now im 92.I hav'nt said nothing wrong so I would really like to know why you are are taking points away from me.

Send me a PM and tell me what im doing wrong.

Gainesville Red
05-15-2005, 07:15 PM
Aw Christ!!!!! My computer breaks, so I can't come hang out for like a week, and I come back to Dunn trade rumors. Not good.

Redmachine2003
05-15-2005, 07:16 PM
One thing is for sure, if Dunn is traded the Reds will be cleaning house. You won't know very many players on the field for the Reds.

Maldez
05-15-2005, 07:20 PM
This trade would make absolutely no sense and would make the Reds much worse in the long run. Therefore, I'm virtually certain that Dan O'brien is considering it.

True enough. Big Adam's the kind of guy you build a team around. Fans love watching strapping HR hitters launch majestic shots into the stands. Granted, our starting pitching is abysmal, but you don't just "fix" it by trading away one of the crown jewels.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 07:26 PM
? - how do we score without dunn. hes our only consistent off player. you could argue against trading kearns and pena, and i dont want to. but they havent proven what dunn has. you know what you are gonna get from dunn and you like it :)

OnBaseMachine
05-15-2005, 07:28 PM
Where's BigDonkey44?

I think he has inside information. Maybe he can tell us if this is true.

RedsBaron
05-15-2005, 07:28 PM
Pujols isn't "way better" than Dunn. Pujols is better than Dunn. But not by nearly the margin you think he is.

You're looking at: HR/BB/AVG/OBP/SLG/OPS

Pujols:
169 322 .333 .413 .622 1.035

Dunn:
129 380 .250 .386 .521 .907
Pujols is a better young hitter than Dunn, assuming that the rumors about Pujols's age are untrue. If they both really are 25 years old, then yeah Pujols is better "young" hitter than Dunn.

Marc D
05-15-2005, 07:34 PM
Fans love watching strapping HR hitters launch majestic shots into the stands.

With our pitching, we will still get to see that Dunn or no Dunn.

deltachi8
05-15-2005, 07:38 PM
i doubt this rumor has much validity. However, if Dunn has to go, send him to Florida, they have become my official second favorite team over the past 10 years - this may make them almost even with the Reds.

I have no doubt Dan O is talking about things every day and maybee even put a feeler out with FL for Kearns or Pena and they came back asking for Dunn. Its how many of these things get started (rumors). It probably has little to do with who the Reds are actually looking to trade.

Just my $0.02.

The_jbh
05-15-2005, 07:43 PM
If we trade one of the top 10 hitters in the game and don't get an ESTABLISHED top notch pitcher then i may become a cubs fan or something. That would be redicuous. This is a rediculous deal i don't care who the prospects are. No prospects are sure bets. Olson is good but no where near the Beckett Willis or Burnett league of pitchers. Hermedia is solid. Stokes strikes out a lot.

Personally i think Ryan Freel is better than Castillo. I think if Freel played 2B full time he'd get a lot better at it defensively. He wouldn't be a gold glover or anything but hed be adequate. Lopez has looked sharp at SS. There is really no need for Castillo.

We'd be getting hosed if this deal went down, no doubt.

KronoRed
05-15-2005, 07:46 PM
Terrible trade, but considering the source I'm not worried it's for real

Oxilon
05-15-2005, 08:05 PM
Pujols is a better young hitter than Dunn, assuming that the rumors about Pujols's age are untrue. If they both really are 25 years old, then yeah Pujols is better "young" hitter than Dunn.

I'm not denying that Pujols is a better hitter than Dunn. I've admitted it. I'm just saying the margin between the two isn't nearly as far as some think it is.

Petitt33
05-15-2005, 09:00 PM
Trading for Burnett doesn'y make much sense since he will be a FA after the year. If we really want him and can afford him (which we can't) then we should just wait until the off-season to shell ot the big bucks for him without wasting Dunn.

It would be different if we were in the middle of a penant chase, but getting Burnett only helps us for this year which doesn't make much sense.
Well, if we did do this trade, I'd wait until mid June-July to see where this club sits with the rest of the team in the NL central. If we're out of the race for sure, then I'd probably clean house. We could then trade for either Burnett or Beckett, then sign either one long-term. But, i'd just much rather trade Griffey or Kearns. If Griffey continues to stay healthy and hit like he is, then we could get some real good stuff for him. The Braves have a ton of major league prospects that we could aim for, or even the Marlins could be a suitor.

We'll just have to wait and see how everything pans out.

RedsBaron
05-15-2005, 09:13 PM
I have several concerns about any proposed trade of Adam Dunn.
1. I regard Dunn as a close to sure thing to hit another 300 to 500 HRs in his career. That kind of power isn't found just anywhere.
2. That said, the Reds do need pitching, but I lack confidence in Dan O'Brien and the rest of the Reds front office to correctly judge among available young pitchers and select the right pitchers to receive in a trade.
3. If the Reds somehow did somehow select the right pitchers (even a blind squirrel finds an acorn every now and then), I lack confidence in Don Gullett and the other pitching coaches ability to develop that talent, and in the Reds ability to keep the pitchers healthy.
In short, if the Marlins offered the Reds Beckett AND Willis for Dunn, I have a feeling that in a year or two Beckett would blow out his arm and Willis would lose 10 mph off his fastball while trying to learn to throw a sinker; meanwhile Dunn would have several 50+ HR seasons for the Marlins.
Trading Dunn could make good sense-I wish I had confidence in the people running the Reds to make the right decisions in that regard.

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:13 PM
I wouldsay the Marlins would love that, it would be a disaster for the Reds. Castillo is finished as a slap and speed guy. His legs are gone, he can't keep them healthy, without the speed he has little value.

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:15 PM
Beckett or Burnett only please.
they aren't prospects.

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:16 PM
Then if the Reds flipped Castillo for a couple of top prospects. Castillo is expensive and has no value. He can't keep his legs healthy and thus can't run.

penantboundreds
05-15-2005, 09:24 PM
I'd need Beckett for sure, maybe even Beckett and a high prospect. I don't have much input because I don't know FL's prospects or anything about their farm system, but I want someone with a high K/per 9 and low walks, basically I need a stud and a guy that would be better than anyone in our minor leagues. Hopefully the Castillo part of the deal is hogwash, but a nice groundball/strikeout pitcher would be nice. Then we can let him tell the front office to get Gullett out of here.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 09:25 PM
what makes you think that we need to get two number one starters for Dunn. We would be incredibly lucky to get one for Dunn.

Teams simply don't trade good young pitchers like hitters since they have more trade value.

i meant guys seen like that. since its PROSPECTS, they both better be seen as STUDS. if its a proven guy, then only 1.

i just dont understand this. you trade your best player for prospects and an aging,oft hurt 2b. you lose your best offensive weapon, most consistent, no one really to replace him(pena hasnt proven he can stay healthy) yet and you gain a guy at a position you have 2 or 3 ml guys at and 2 of your best prospects at. yea makes a lot of sense.

i would never trade him but it would take at least floridas top 2 pitching prospects and top 2 position prospects

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:26 PM
I'd need Beckett for sure, maybe even Beckett and a high prospect. The Marlins need Beckett, they won't be trading him.

penantboundreds
05-15-2005, 09:28 PM
I agree with you Driesen, if you can't get two basic #1's, or Beckett/Burnett, then the deal is off. This isn't Jim Bowden the video game, we hold the cards on who to deal where (as a FO). If they won't give us what we want, then tell them they need to find another stud who will hit 500+ HR's in his career.

penantboundreds
05-15-2005, 09:30 PM
Flyer, then why trade him? My question is why do we HAVE to trade him, if we don't get what we want, then don't trade him. I wasn't trying to say that they would do that, I'm saying what I would trade Dunn for.

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:30 PM
I have said all along that the Reds would get nothing near value for Dunn and that fans would be extremely unhappy with the return.

My guess on the 2 prospects would be Bazardo and Olsen.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 09:30 PM
someone brought up the point i fear and the main reason i want the entire fo fired. judge of talent and handling talent. i have no faith in them picking the right guys and developing them and making them better. something needs to change or we will never get better. even if you get the right guys, if you cant develop them, then it doesnt matter

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:31 PM
Flyer, then why trade him? Don't. However, I am quite convinced that DanO is going to bury this franchise for years to come and trading Dunn would just be another step.

penantboundreds
05-15-2005, 09:35 PM
Okay, I see where you are going with that. I tend to agree, but we see eye to eye on not trading him because he is so rare and will continue to get better and demolish major league pitching for a loooong time.

reds44
05-15-2005, 09:45 PM
I'd do it. Why not, we are sucking with Dunn and we can suck without him. People we need pitching, and we need a everyday second baseman. TWO! top pitching prospects, look what that organiztion has pumped out. WILLIS,BECKETT,BURNETT they pump out pitching. You guys WE HAVE FREEL,DUNN,GRIFFEY,PENA, AND KEARNS THEY CAN ALL PLAY THE OUTFIELD. There is no reason why we have 0 pitching and we are carrying 4-5 everyday outfielders. This team needs change, I am for almost anything.

RosieRed
05-15-2005, 09:50 PM
Has ramp101 chimed in yet? Maybe he's heard something.

reds44
05-15-2005, 09:51 PM
I checked the Marlins fan site, nothing on it there.

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:52 PM
I'd do it. Why not, we are sucking with Dunn and we can suck without him. People we need pitching, and we need a everyday second baseman. TWO! top pitching prospects, look what that organiztion has pumped out. WILLIS,BECKETT,BURNETT they pump out pitching. You guys WE HAVE FREEL,DUNN,GRIFFEY,PENA, AND KEARNS THEY CAN ALL PLAY THE OUTFIELD. There is no reason why we have 0 pitching and we are carrying 4-5 everyday outfielders. This team needs change, I am for almost anything.These guys aren't ML ready and young pitching prospects are extremely high risk. Neither is a potential Beckett or Burnett. The Reds have a number of good young arms, they just need time. No shortcuts, have to develop your own.

reds44
05-15-2005, 09:54 PM
These guys aren't ML ready and young pitching prospects are extremely high risk. Neither is a potential Beckett or Burnett. The Reds have a number of good young arms, they just need time. No shortcuts, have to develop your own.

Do you know who we would get? How do you know they arent MLB ready and how do you know they arent a potential Beckett or Burnett?

Gainesville Red
05-15-2005, 09:55 PM
If this is true, I don't like it. 1.) I don't like it for selfish reasons. I love Dunn in a Reds Uni. 2.) The Marlins are not only better than us, they're smarter than us. If they want to do it, they've got good reason for it. It WILL come back to bite us.

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 09:55 PM
the thing that scares me is castillo is even mentioned. high priced guy at a position that isnt of need. and hes getting hurt.

i bet oboring looked at his baseball card and said, hey, this guy was good 2 years ago, lets get him

im really scared of what oboring is gonna do to cincinnati

RDriesen16
05-15-2005, 09:58 PM
Do you know who we would get? How do you know they arent MLB ready and how do you know they arent a potential Beckett or Burnett?

so you trade a proven star for some potential guys who may never be crap

flyer85
05-15-2005, 09:58 PM
Do you know who we would get? How do you know they arent MLB ready and how do you know they arent a potential Beckett or Burnett?Trading someting proven for Minor league pitchers is nothing but a chance to step up to the craps table and take your roll. Be patient and wait on Gardner, Ramirez, Kelly, Kozlowski, Pauly, Dumatrait, Bailey, Pelland, etc.

reds44
05-15-2005, 10:00 PM
Ok guys how long to you want us to hold on to our 4 outfielders? What good is that doing us?

flyer85
05-15-2005, 10:02 PM
Ok guys how long to you want us to hold on to our 4 outfielders? What good is that doing us?No reason to trade one of the young guys during the season, now if somebody wanted Casey or Jr that would be different.

Buckeye33
05-15-2005, 10:02 PM
I'm going to start off by saying that I believe Adam Dunn should not be traded unless a team just offered something no team could refuse.

Now, I will also say that I believe Adam Dunn does not want to stay in Cincinnati longterm. I believe he'll run out his arbirtration time if he has to and make 7-9 million/year for those years remaining and then hit the open market and cash in bigtime. Therefore, I believe the Reds will at some point have to move him or get nothing, which good teams and GMs (see As/Billy Beane) don't allow to happen.

The Reds just aren't going to be able to move Griffey unless George believes he's the last piece to a playoff run this year, in which case the Reds would get garbage prospects and $$ relief.

So, my theory on Dunn would be to wait until around the All-Star break and see how things are going, and if the Reds are playing the same then you have to discuss moving him because at that point the Reds would be no closer to the playoffs with him or without him, and you could probably count out 2006 as well.

So, as many other posters have mentioned, you build towards 2007.

The Marlins have the pieces that could get a deal done. I'd rather Dunn be shipped to an AL team but.....

If the Marlins offered Scott Olsen, Jeremy Hermida, Josh Johnson, Josh Willingham, and Luis Castillo for Adam Dunn, Jiminez, and some minor league fodder I think I'd have to pull the trigger.

Olsen, Hermida and Johnson are all 21 right now and would be 23-24 going into 2007. Willingham gives you a catcher who can actually hit and is still only 26, and Castillo gives you something you can flip into more youth, or plug in at 2B.

Olsen 6'4" Lefty at AA:

4-1 2.88 ERA 40IP 50/12 K/W .219 AVG against

Josh Johnson 6'7" Right at AA:

4-1 1.84 ERA 34 IP 36/14 K/W .194 AVG against

Jeremy Hermida at AA:

.300/.447/.633 10 HR 30/31 K/W 6 SB in 35 G

Josh Willingham at AAA:

.305/.446/.684 10 HR 21/20 K/W 4 SB in 29 G

If this offer was put on the table after the All-Star break, I'd have to do it myself.

I'll end this lengthy post by stating I believe the "rumor" is exactly that, and this whole post was pointless :)

reds44
05-15-2005, 10:03 PM
No reason to trade one of the young guys during the season, now if somebody wanted Casey or Jr that would be different.

But nobody does. Not trying to be sarcastic but dont you think having 4 outfielders is pointless when we have no pitching?

flyer85
05-15-2005, 10:05 PM
But nobody does. Not trying to be sarcastic but dont you think having 4 outfielders is pointless when we have no pitching?and how often have all 4 been healthy over the last 3 years? Making a trade for the sake of making a trade is exactly the wrong thing to do.

reds44
05-15-2005, 10:08 PM
and how often have all 4 been healthy over the last 3 years? Making a trade for the sake of making a trade is exactly the wrong thing to do.

It's not making a trade for the heck of making a trade, its making a trade for pitching, which by the way we dont have!

pedro
05-15-2005, 10:21 PM
I actually think Florida might be a good destination for Griffey.

Gainesville Red
05-15-2005, 10:24 PM
I actually think Florida might be a good destination for Griffey.

No kidding, switch Griffey for Dunn and I love the deal. Too bad they don't want Griff. :bang:

flyer85
05-15-2005, 10:25 PM
I actually think Florida might be a good destination for Griffey.baltimore is the only destination that makes much sense

2001MUgrad
05-15-2005, 10:27 PM
If the Reds make any trades with major league players for minor league prospects I think they are asking for fans to start showing up and buying tickets. All 10,000 that will show up.

The_jbh
05-15-2005, 10:28 PM
It's not making a trade for the heck of making a trade, its making a trade for pitching, which by the way we dont have!

But it has to be the right type of pitching. Right now, i still don't think there is a major problem with the rotation we have. There is no reason to deal dunn unless we get EXACTLY what we want. Dunn is the last of the 5 players (Griffey, Kearns, Dunn, Pena, Casey) that should be dealt. If we are going to deal him we need to get an extreme premium price which would include a top of the rotation starter (not a prospect, a for real). If the fact of the matter is that no one is willing to give that up then Dunn stays in a Reds uniform.

If this was any other organization, Adam Dunn would be one of the most untouchable players around.

:bang:

flyer85
05-15-2005, 10:29 PM
If the Reds make any trades with major league players for minor league prospects I think they are asking for fans to start showing up and buying tickets. All 10,000 that will show up.If it is a player like Randa or DJ I don't think it would be a problem.

Cedric
05-15-2005, 10:31 PM
But it has to be the right type of pitching. Right now, i still don't think there is a major problem with the rotation we have. There is no reason to deal dunn unless we get EXACTLY what we want. Dunn is the last of the 5 players (Griffey, Kearns, Dunn, Pena, Casey) that should be dealt. If we are going to deal him we need to get an extreme premium price which would include a top of the rotation starter (not a prospect, a for real). If the fact of the matter is that no one is willing to give that up then Dunn stays in a Reds uniform.

If this was any other organization, Adam Dunn would be one of the most untouchable players around.

:bang:

I understand the sentiment JBH, but how do you expect great value when you act like you can't trade the player with the best value? I don't think Dan O'brien is smart enough to get the most value for Adam Dunn, but if you don't think you can bag him long term I'm not against moving him. For the perfect on paper haul I'd do it. But we'd need a new gm first.

WMR
05-15-2005, 10:53 PM
That wasn't the message though. He said Dunn was the best young hitter in baseball.

Pujols is way better than Dunn which is why I said he is a far ways off from being the best since Pujols is in his own league.


LOL, that's like saying, "A Ferrari is WAYYYYY better than a Lamborghini"

They're both luxury cars.
They're both awesome at what they do.
Dunn is not as far removed from Pujols as you are claiming. You've got to look at his surrounding cast, which affects, in a HUGE way, the quantity and quality of pitches that he sees!

Not to mention that he's got a Manager who is bright enough to bat him in the 3-slot which is where you're supposed to put your best hitter!

DOH


OH yeah, and you don't trade Dunn. Not for ANYBODY. He's the only thing that makes the Reds half-way entertaining when they're twenty games out of contention. You try to build around Dunn, but you don't trade your Lamborghini for some Porsche mufflers and a set of rims.

kyred14
05-15-2005, 11:11 PM
You try to build around Dunn, but you don't trade your Lamborghini for some Porsche mufflers and a set of rims.

:laugh: i see new a signature :thumbup:

Col_ IN Reds fan
05-15-2005, 11:12 PM
baltimore is the only destination that makes much sense

Which is exactly why i hope the Yankees would get involved to keep Baltimore from getting him. Not sure what kind of prospects the Yanks have , but it could come down to who would be willing to foot more of the contract.

Hobo
05-15-2005, 11:14 PM
No truth to this, If Dunn goes to the Marlins where does he play?
1st is Delgado, Left is M. Cabrera, Center is Pierre, Right is Encarnacion/Conine.
One of the above would have to be coming back. I don't see it.

Cedric
05-15-2005, 11:16 PM
I agree the trade isn't likely, but I doubt Encarnacion or Conine would make the Marlins not trade for Dunn.

CincyRedsFan30
05-15-2005, 11:20 PM
These Dunn rumors make this board light up like a Christmas Tree. ;)

Hobo
05-15-2005, 11:21 PM
I agree the trade isn't likely, but I doubt Encarnacion or Conine would make the Marlins not trade for Dunn.

I just wonder why would they deplete their farm system for an area which isn't a need.

cincinnati chili
05-15-2005, 11:30 PM
No truth to this, If Dunn goes to the Marlins where does he play?
1st is Delgado, Left is M. Cabrera, Center is Pierre, Right is Encarnacion/Conine.
One of the above would have to be coming back. I don't see it.

What Cedric said.

It's simple. You'd put Encarnacion on the bench, and push Conine in front of an oncoming Amtrak.

It is a need. Conine/Encarnacion are subpar players.

M2
05-15-2005, 11:31 PM
I just wonder why would they deplete their farm system for an area which isn't a need.

IMO, anyone playing Juan Encarnacion as a regular has a corner OF need.

Don't know that the Fish would be willing to deplete their system, but no way should the Reds move Dunn for less. He's one of the top bats in baseball and dearly is the only way he should be sold.

TeamBoone
05-15-2005, 11:34 PM
Adam Dunn for PROSPECTS???? You've got to be kidding me?

Actually, I wouldn't trade him for anyone, but prospects? I surely hope this truly is only a rumor.

WVPacman
05-15-2005, 11:37 PM
I don't see Dunn going nowhere he is going to stay a Red for along time.If he stays healthy he will easily hit over 600 homers IMO you just don't trade a player like that b/c of all the potential that he has.If a trade does happen it will be Kearns or Willy Mo going to Florida.I would like to see JR traded just so we can keep our 3 great outfielders.Trading JR will be hard to do unless the Yanks or some other high priced team comes calling.

Team Clark
05-15-2005, 11:46 PM
This very well may be ploy by the Reds to get Adam to work harder. Of course it could backfire too. His work ethic is suspect and has caused a great deal of concern the past two seasons. Unfortuantely it has rubbed off on other players as well. (i.e Kearns, and former Red Brandon Larson) It takes a lot to light a fire under Adam. It takes even more to get him to do anyhting extra. Been there and witnessed it. Maybe this will do the trick.

Going to bed before 4 AM, quit hosting Playstation Tournaments, cut back on the partying... all these little things could help Adam turn into a Mega Star. Right now he's headed down the Canseco, J. Gonzalez, Sierra path. Good early careers but what could have been?

cincinnati chili
05-15-2005, 11:50 PM
This very well may be ploy by the Reds to get Adam to work harder. Of course it could backfire too. His work ethic is suspect and has caused a great deal of concern the past two seasons. Unfortuantely it has rubbed off on other players as well. (i.e Kearns, and former Red Brandon Larson) It takes a lot to light a fire under Adam. It takes even more to get him to do anyhting extra. Been there and witnessed it. Maybe this will do the trick.

Going to bed before 4 AM, quit hosting Playstation Tournaments, cut back on the partying... all these little things could help Adam turn into a Mega Star. Right now he's headed down the Canseco, J. Gonzalez, Sierra path. Good early careers but what could have been?

TC:

By these comments, do you imply that Dunn would be disappointed if the Reds traded him to a contender? If I were him, I'd party my way right out of town. :all_cohol

Team Clark
05-15-2005, 11:55 PM
No, I don't think he would be dissapointed. How could he be?

I was inferring that the Reds are frustrated with his work ethic and have employed many different methods to get him motivated. None have worked. Maybe this "rumor" will get him PO'd enough to put some real effort into being a ball player. Just showing up only gets you so far. Adam is also not very mature and his two best friends play for the Reds. He may not want to detach from the Reds emotionally because of that. That may be a bit of a reach but you never know with Adam.

baboone
05-16-2005, 12:03 AM
Dunn is still relatively cheap this year, so it's unlikely DanO will trade him. After the Wilson and Milton signing, if DanO gets fleeced on a Dunn trade, he's out of a job... which might not be a bad thing. Let's trade DanO and keep Dunn for now.

WVPacman
05-16-2005, 12:15 AM
Now what kind of statment do you guys think that would give the fans of the Reds? If they trade Dunn then they might as well trade Kearns,Pena,Casey and all the other good players on this team.I'll tell you what I would think if Dunn was traded for prospects.Id say here we go again unloading players right when we have a decent hitting team.They don't want to win if they start trading away our best players.

Dunn,Kearns,Pena should be here for a long time I would trade JR in a heartbeat just so we could keep the 3 youngsters.If Dano don't then hes crazy and needs to quit or be fired.We want to go forward not backward and thats what we will be doing if he trades Dunn.

TeamBoone
05-16-2005, 12:18 AM
Adam has never played for a winning baseball team at the major league level. Perhaps winning would improve his work ethic.

I'm only speculating, of course. Unfortunately, I have absolutely no way of knowing what goes on in Adam Dunn's head.

Regardless, I really really hope the rumor is untrue.

ws1990reds
05-16-2005, 12:20 AM
The only thing that leads me to believe that this rumour has some truth to it is that the Reds seem hell-bent on not negotiating a long-term contract with Dunn. The Reds apparently don't know the difference between signing a guy like Milton to a long-term contract, and a future HOF'er like Dunn. :rolleyes:

WVPacman
05-16-2005, 12:26 AM
The only thing that leads me to believe that this rumour has some truth to it is that the Reds seem hell-bent on not negotiating a long-term contract with Dunn. The Reds apparently don't know the difference between signing a guy like Milton to a long-term contract, and a future HOF'er like Dunn. :rolleyes:


You can say that again man!! Sometimes I think does Dano and the others know anything about baseball.If they do I wish they would start using their brains like all the other GM's and FO people do for other teams. :bang:

JaxRed
05-16-2005, 12:31 AM
Buckeye 33 that was a great post and I added to your rep because of it. While I don't believe this for a moment, if that package of prospects was the offer (without Castillo) I would make the deal.

The key to me is Hermida. That's about as close of a can't miss prospect as there is. Dunn is going to be expensive, and then he's going to be gone. We will still have 3 big time OF's. Willingham could help this year at catcher.

And I would make the move now not at All-Star break.

pedro
05-16-2005, 12:31 AM
Ok guys how long to you want us to hold on to our 4 outfielders? What good is that doing us?

That may be true.

If so, the order in which I would consider trades would have to be Griffey, Pena, Kearns and then Dunn.

I base this on my opinion regarding the risk/reward I associate to each player.

Griffey, of course, is expensive, and made of glass, but if he's healthy we get to watch a HOF in his golden (statistical) years.

Pena may very well have the highhest upside, but I believe he carries a great deal more risk than does Dunn, because of his lack of strike zone judgment and poor fielding. From a financial standpoint, the risk is minimal.

Kearns too has been fragile, although he has produced when healthy and is still cheap.

Dunn has been healthy and productive, despite his oddball skill set. He'll make 7 million next year IMO. The Reds should really sign him to LTC as he has the least risk IMO of all these players.

Honestly, if I had confidence that Griffey would be able to stay healthy, I would keep all 4 and trade Casey. Hell, I don't have confidence that he'll be healthy and I still say trade Casey anyway. Move Griffey to LF, Dunn to first, Pena to CF, and Kearns to RF. I'd take the risk for the chance to see Griffey excel. Either way it'll be way more interesting than Sean Casey, incredible human that he may be.

pedro
05-16-2005, 12:37 AM
TMBS, if you can't sign Dunn to an LTC you do have to trade him. He's too valuable to let walk. The Reds need to do this ASAP. If he is not signed by ST 2006 the Reds have to move him. They can not accept only a draft choice for Dunn, it would be stupid.

westofyou
05-16-2005, 12:44 AM
Going to bed before 4 AM, quit hosting Playstation Tournaments, cut back on the partying... all these little things could help Adam turn into a Mega Star. Right now he's headed down the Canseco, J. Gonzalez, Sierra path. Good early careers but what could have been?

Ahh yes clean living... but what of Waner, Mantle, and King Kelly they all partied and did fairly well.

Dale Murphy led a pretty clean life, where'd that get him? ;)

TeamBoone
05-16-2005, 01:16 AM
I guess I don't fully comprehend the problem of not going to bed until 4 am IF you're playing a night game the next day (and most are night games). He can still get 8 hours of sleep by getting up at noon and still have plenty of time to get to the park by 3 or 4 (what time do they have to be at the park?).

If he's doing this before a day game (of which there are relatively few in the grand scheme), then I would see it as a problem.

But I'm a night owl, so that probably warps my perspective.

westofyou
05-16-2005, 01:24 AM
But I'm a night owl, so that probably warps my perspective.

She types at 1:15 am

Anyway I agree, he could be snorting lines off the back of strippers like NPH in Harold and Kumar.

Instead he's probably drinking Miller Lite and playing video games until dawn.

Compared to my youth that's Seminary School.

WVPacman
05-16-2005, 01:27 AM
She types at 1:15 am

Anyway I agree, he could be snorting lines off the back of strippers like NPH in Harold and Kumar.

Instead he's probably drinking Miller Lite and playing video games until dawn.

Compared to my youth that's Seminary School.

No you guys are all wrong,I say he fish's all night long.Remember he loves his fishing. :thumbup:

pedro
05-16-2005, 01:32 AM
He's 24 years old. Why does he need 8 hours of sleep?

TeamBoone
05-16-2005, 01:43 AM
He's 24 years old. Why does he need 8 hours of sleep?

Good point! (actually, he's 25, but it's still a good point)

Revering4Blue
05-16-2005, 04:00 AM
I guess I don't fully comprehend the problem of not going to bed until 4 am IF you're playing a night game the next day (and most are night games). He can still get 8 hours of sleep by getting up at noon and still have plenty of time to get to the park by 3 or 4 (what time do they have to be at the park?).

If he's doing this before a day game (of which there are relatively few in the grand scheme), then I would see it as a problem.

But I'm a night owl, so that probably warps my perspective.

Agreed.

Not everyone goes to sleep at 9, waking up at 5 a.m to fill out the New York Times crossword puzzle.

Revering4Blue
05-16-2005, 04:25 AM
No reason to trade one of the young guys during the season, now if somebody wanted Casey or Jr that would be different.

Provided the 4 OFs and Casey remain relatively healthy and produce, I wouldn't be averse to waiting until the offseason to deal one. It worked in 1987. Granted, the Reds were in contention and really couldn't deal Stillwell or Parker.

Jr's injury history notwithstanding, DanO is sitting in the catbird's seat right now. Whether or not he can consumate a deal similar to the afforementioned '87 offseason deals is a legitimate concern.

Why rush?

Revering4Blue
05-16-2005, 05:03 AM
Any deal for Dunn should ONLY include pitchers. The Reds need to get as much good pitching as they can if they trade Dunn.

That may be true if your goal is merely a playoff appearence. But not if you are trying to build a championship-caliber club.

Given the overall lack of talent and depth within the organization, pitchers as well as positional players, the focus should be on accumulating as much talent as possible, regardless of position.

That was the mistake John Allen and company made during the 2003 firesale, as well as settling for cash considerations, of course. DanO did the same thing with
Reitsma, though I still like that trade better than the Williamson trade.

We need pitching, no doubt. But the cycle of reaching for pitchers at the expense of more talented players at other positions, which could be re-dealt for quality pitching, needs to be broken.

TeamDunn
05-16-2005, 05:15 AM
I guess I don't fully comprehend the problem of not going to bed until 4 am IF you're playing a night game the next day (and most are night games). He can still get 8 hours of sleep by getting up at noon and still have plenty of time to get to the park by 3 or 4 (what time do they have to be at the park?).

If he's doing this before a day game (of which there are relatively few in the grand scheme), then I would see it as a problem.

But I'm a night owl, so that probably warps my perspective.

It's probably what he is doing until 4:00 AM, not that he is up until 4:00 AM. :eek:

I guess sometimes these guys that have had natural talent all their "careers" (high school, college) think of this as the same type of thing. Everything will come easy to them so why put in the extra effort. It will come back to bite them eventually. I'm not talking just Dunn, I have no idea what he does off the field. In general though I wonder if lots of young players go through a stage...some grow up and come out of it, others end up like "the players that could have been". Sometimes I think of our younger players as some kind of fraternity (and all that that entails) :help:

I also hope they don't trade him, Creek would become a fan of the other team, pack up and move to another city...it just would not be pretty. :p:

smith288
05-16-2005, 08:24 AM
How do we even know Dunn wants to negotiate for long term? Perhaps he has made it known his intentions are to not even bother negotiating for a LT contract with the Reds but test the waters at the end of the season? Its his gamble but all the chips are in his corner. He already makes your typical MLB general manager drool even if he ends up with just 25 homers this year. His presense is known and he doesnt have to settle with perennial loser teams.

Perhaps Dunn sees exactly what we see in the Reds FO? He sees no light at the end of the tunnel and any vmail left by DanO is scoffed at and Dunn gets back to playing PS2?

Picture yourself being a slugger that is hitting hrs daily. You are playing for the Pittsburgh Pirates and you KNOW the league looks at you eagerly for the moment you hit the free agent market. Would you stay in Pitt or look for playing either for your hometown team or to a team most likely to end up in post season? You wont have to ask me twice, Pittsburgh aint my scene.

Maybe Dunn feels the same?

Dunn is young, talented, has his whole future ahead of him...why should he limit himself to only one option.

GoReds
05-16-2005, 08:43 AM
From what Team Clark is relaying, it sounds like the front office is holding off on a long-term deal until Adam shows the work ethic.

I think Adam is perhaps the best Reds player to come along since Eric Davis. But if he's not willing to put in the time to continue improving, I think the Reds are right for exploring other avenues now, while his value is at a high.

Raisor
05-16-2005, 08:56 AM
No, I don't think he would be dissapointed. How could he be?

I was inferring that the Reds are frustrated with his work ethic and have employed many different methods to get him motivated. None have worked. .

career OPS of .907 and he's not "motivated".

if the Reds actually believe this, then I have zero hope for the franchise.

ochre
05-16-2005, 09:37 AM
When OB hits .907 on his free agent acquisitions he can speak of other's work ethic.

flyer85
05-16-2005, 10:20 AM
DanO has neither the pesonality nor the skills to run a major league ball club. He seems to be paralyzed by indecision for the most part. He reminds of the classic management failure because he is afraid to make a decision. Any and almost every situation is allowed to become OBE.

rdiersin
05-16-2005, 10:54 AM
If the Marlins offered Scott Olsen, Jeremy Hermida, Josh Johnson, Josh Willingham, and Luis Castillo for Adam Dunn, Jiminez, and some minor league fodder I think I'd have to pull the trigger.

I was thinking the same thing as I read through this thread. FLA (anyone) would really have to wow me to get Dunn. But this would probably do it.

Team Clark
05-16-2005, 10:58 AM
WOY.. LOL! How can I argue with that? Clean living only gets you 30% of the HOF vote.

Team Clark
05-16-2005, 11:06 AM
Reminds me of the Paul O'Neill scenario when he was with the Reds. Paul did not work hard while he was a Red. Piniella was overly frustrated with Paul. So much talent, so much wasted. He had a lot of intensity and put a lot of effort forward don't get me wrong.

In Paul's words he did not WORK HARD at becoming a better ballplayer while he was in Cincinnati. Paul told me a few years ago that the trade to the Yankees really tipped the scales for him. He lifted weights differently, started watching hitting video religously, showed up EARLY to the ballpark to hit and WORK at becoming a GOOD Outfielder. As he said "These were things that were expected of me that I didn't expect of myself". We all know how his career ended up.

guttle11
05-16-2005, 11:11 AM
one of those "prospects" better be named Josh, AJ, or Dontrelle or no I would not even discuss it. That trade for Griffey, maybe

Raisor
05-16-2005, 11:17 AM
Let me put it this way, if Dunn's "problem" is staying up until 4am playing video games with his buddies, then I really think some others on the team need to be hanging out with him more.

Dude is OPSing over 1.000 this season. He's over .900 for his career. If he's not doing anything illegal, then I don't care what he does in his free time.

deltachi8
05-16-2005, 12:15 PM
Let me put it this way, if Dunn's "problem" is staying up until 4am playing video games with his buddies, then I really think some others on the team need to be hanging out with him more.

Dude is OPSing over 1.000 this season. He's over .900 for his career. If he's not doing anything illegal, then I don't care what he does in his free time.

well said!

AD needs to do a commercial with Jeter if this keeps up.

registerthis
05-16-2005, 12:25 PM
career OPS of .907 and he's not "motivated".

if the Reds actually believe this, then I have zero hope for the franchise.
I wonder if the Cardinals consider Albert Pujols to be motivated?

RANDY IN INDY
05-16-2005, 01:00 PM
Reminds me of the Paul O'Neill scenario when he was with the Reds. Paul did not work hard while he was a Red. Piniella was overly frustrated with Paul. So much talent, so much wasted. He had a lot of intensity and put a lot of effort forward don't get me wrong.

In Paul's words he did not WORK HARD at becoming ba better ballplayer while he was in Cincinnati. Paul told me a few years ago that the trade to the Yankees really tipped the scales for him. He lifted weights differently, started watching hitting video religously, showed up EARLY to the ballpark to hit and WORK at becoming a GOOD Outfielder. As he said "These were things that were expected of me that I didn't expect of myself". We all know how his career ended up.

And it's usually the hard work at becoming a better "ballplayer" that sets a player apart from the pack. Dunn could be a monster.

baboone
05-16-2005, 01:36 PM
DanO doesn't have the balls or the brains to pull off a Dunn trade. He's already got a couple of disasters in the Wilson and Milton signings, and can't afford another disaster. He'll play it safe and deal Randa, Merker, etc.

Blimpie
05-16-2005, 02:38 PM
Let me put it this way, if Dunn's "problem" is staying up until 4am playing video games with his buddies, then I really think some others on the team need to be hanging out with him more.

Dude is OPSing over 1.000 this season. He's over .900 for his career. If he's not doing anything illegal, then I don't care what he does in his free time.Couldn't agree more. Reminds me of the time during the NBA playoffs when all of the networks obsessed over the fact that Michael Jordan had an "off-game" immediately following a night where he was spotted in a casino until late. The guy did nothing illegal--yet--was villified and had his character questioned over and over again.

reds44
05-16-2005, 04:30 PM
No truth to this, If Dunn goes to the Marlins where does he play?
1st is Delgado, Left is M. Cabrera, Center is Pierre, Right is Encarnacion/Conine.
One of the above would have to be coming back. I don't see it.

Something interesting about that is, Lowell has been struggling and Cabrera has been playing some 3rd.

Red Leader
05-16-2005, 04:50 PM
I'm sure Cabrera would be shifted to RF, Dunn to LF and Delgado stays at 1B.

Encarnacion would be traded, moved to the bench, or released, same with Conine.

TeamBoone
05-16-2005, 05:34 PM
I'm sure Cabrera would be shifted to RF, Dunn to LF and Delgado stays at 1B.

Encarnacion would be traded, moved to the bench, or released, same with Conine.

I refuse to even speculate on what would happen to any team he MIGHT be traded to! I refuse to even speculate that he will be traded at all!

It's just bad karma.

Joseph
05-16-2005, 05:52 PM
I refuse to even speculate on what would happen to any team he MIGHT be traded to! I refuse to even speculate that he will be traded at all!

It's just bad karma.

You go TB. I don't like to think about the other teams either. Karma indeed, we need all the good karma we can get.

Red Leader
05-16-2005, 05:56 PM
I'm not saying that its a probability. I'm just saying the Marlins could make it work. If Dunn were traded to FLA for Burnett, DanO should be fired before the trade even gets processed, and on top of that, the city of Cincinnati should riot and burn the GABP to the ground.

Yes, I realize this post probably won't generate a lot of "good" karma. :laugh:

KronoRed
05-16-2005, 06:32 PM
Negative waves dude!!! ;)

TylerScottDavis
05-16-2005, 06:54 PM
Personally I'd do Dunn AND Kearns or Pena if I could get Willis / Pierre and one top minor league SP back in exchange. Willis = Dunn and Pierre > Kearns. IMO anyways.
Not going to happen though.

WVPacman
05-16-2005, 06:57 PM
I would like to see Willis in a Reds uni but it will take alot more than Kearns to get him from the Marlins.

KronoRed
05-16-2005, 06:59 PM
Also take about 15mill a year to keep him around

flyer85
05-16-2005, 08:17 PM
This very well may be ploy by the Reds to get Adam to work harder. Of course it could backfire too. His work ethic is suspect and has caused a great deal of concern the past two seasons. I was kind of hoping that lack of performance would be the reason for not offering a LT deal. However, that doesn't seem to be the case. Some guys have gotten LT deals with little performance at all.

TeamBoone
05-16-2005, 09:11 PM
I was kind of hoping that lack of performance would be the reason for not offering a LT deal. However, that doesn't seem to be the case. Some guys have gotten LT deals with little performance at all.

Do you feel he is not performing?

flyer85
05-16-2005, 09:20 PM
Do you feel he is not performing?No I was talking about the reasoning by the FO. Not liking a work ehtic will keep you from an LT deal but bad performance won't

Topcat
05-17-2005, 04:01 PM
If Dunn is traded thats an obvious message to the fans how much obrien and ownership has failed to show that the future is bright and the orginization is progressing in a positive light.

TeamBoone
05-17-2005, 04:18 PM
Geez! Isn't there a seminar or something that DOB and DM could go to in order to learn how to run/manage a baseball team? They have them for everything else!

Maybe a "How to Manage a Baseball Team for Dummies" book.

KearnsyEars
05-17-2005, 06:40 PM
Dunn isnt going anywhere....we can all relax.

Adam Dunn= Cornerstone of the franchise for the next 10+ years

KronoRed
05-17-2005, 06:42 PM
Ears..I wish I believed that, but Dunn will be making a lot of money soon..the Reds hate that

The_jbh
05-17-2005, 07:03 PM
Dunn isnt going anywhere....we can all relax.

Adam Dunn= Cornerstone of the franchise for the next 10+ years


Agreed. This is a guy that brongs people to the stand and Lindner knows this.


Where are all you coming up with this clubbing to 4am and stuff like that BS. Also playing video games till 4am? Give me a break you guys are just throwing crap around to attempt to make a point.

The fact of the matter is Dunn is the best reds' hitter since Eric Davis. He has had an OBP over .350 since since 2001, over .370 every season but but 1 during that span, he is a threat for 40+ homeruns a year, a .906 career OPS, scores close to 100 runs a year and is probabably a good bet to drive in atleast 100 runs every year. He is also average at the worst in the field. He has shifted from RF, LF, and 1B with minimal complaint (1B he does complain some but still does it)

I have always heard he is a very mellow guy. Love fishing, doesn't like the big city hoopla (quoted n saying that in SI 2 weeks ago.) Also in that magazine article said CIncinnati was perfect for him because of it's size and he wouldn't want to be in a NY market.

So basically the only thing you have on him in BA, which i think is negated by OBP (BA is the most overrated stat in baseball), his K's, sac flies, and video games.
SO basically you got little...


so why r we considering trading him? Oh yea... because we are the reds :bang:

TeamBoone
05-17-2005, 07:17 PM
Where are all you coming up with this clubbing to 4am and stuff like that BS. Also playing video games till 4am? Give me a break you guys are just throwing crap around to attempt to make a point.

I have always heard he is a very mellow guy. Love fishing, doesn't like the big city hoopla (quoted n saying that in SI 2 weeks ago.) Also in that magazine article said CIncinnati was perfect for him because of it's size and he wouldn't want to be in a NY market.

I think you may be over reacting. The information in your first paragraph above was provided by an extremely reliable poster who does have inside information.

However, having said that... if you go back and re-read the thread, no one was "throwing crap around" to make a point. Most, if not all, were saying that true or untrue, they didn't see it as a problem. He does work nights after all and still has plenty of time to get his beauty sleep.

One more thing.... just because he fishes doesn't mean he doesn't also like to party. But if his partying doesn't get in the way of his baseball, most don't care. BTW, no one said anything about him clubbing until 4 am.

Relax; no one is spreading crap about Adam.

Team Clark
05-17-2005, 07:19 PM
LOL! Didn't we cover this today in another thread.

No one (me) is throwing crap around. I share what I know. And when I speculate or guess, I say so. End of story.