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View Full Version : Has anyone seen this re:Griffey



kaldaniels
08-11-2005, 10:36 PM
Just got home..saw no related threads...Griffey has kicked it up a notch

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8829546/

paulrichjr
08-11-2005, 10:51 PM
Jr. is gone.

corkedbat
08-11-2005, 11:11 PM
Something sounds bogus to me.

captainmorgan07
08-11-2005, 11:17 PM
that's wat i thought corkedbat i don't believe this there's been nottin on any other websites or on tv about it

kyred14
08-12-2005, 12:24 AM
I find this to be almost impossible to believe. I think Jr. was either being sarcastic, or this is just complete BS. It just doesn't seem like something he would say.

Buckeye33
08-12-2005, 12:29 AM
It is quite odd.

Could be interesting though. Do you really think the Red Sox or Yankees would allow Griffey to go all the way through waivers to the White Sox?

Or do they really think the Reds might actually let him go for nothing, so they wouldn't claim him?

REDREAD
08-12-2005, 12:41 AM
I can believe he'd want to go to the White Sox. Remember guys, he loved Seattle too. His wife was from there, etc. But he thought Seattle ownership wasn't commited to bringing in the pitching needed to win. Now, he's been with the Reds for 5 years and they haven't been competitive at all (other than the first part of 2000, they were sort of contending until they dealt Neagle).

The guy has made no secret that he wants to win a ring before he retires. He's not going to do that here. It's totally logical that he'd want to be traded to a contender.
I don't know if he's going to put the heat on the Reds to get it done, but I'm sure he'd be easily talked into waiving his 10/5 to go to a contender.

jnwohio
08-12-2005, 12:44 AM
It is quite odd.

Could be interesting though. Do you really think the Red Sox or Yankees would allow Griffey to go all the way through waivers to the White Sox?

Or do they really think the Reds might actually let him go for nothing, so they wouldn't claim him?

I don't think anybody is going to risk inheriting that contract on a waiver claim. The remaining years @ 12 million per with half of it deferred @ 4% plus a 4 million buyout on the option year should scare anyone off, even the Yankees.

And what about the already earned deferred money, if you get him on waivers, does that obligation come with him or does it stay with the Reds? All this would be, negociable in a trade but not in a waiver claim. It would be whatever the rules say. Anyone know?

flyer85
08-12-2005, 12:45 AM
I can believe he'd want to go to the White Sox. ...The guy has made no secret that he wants to win a ring before he retires. the "ring" is the only thing missing on his resume. While it has no bearing on the HOF I doubt Jr would call his career a complete success without one. Time is running out and for Jr, getting dealt to a contender at the deadline may be his best chance.

RDriesen16
08-12-2005, 12:55 AM
knowing the way griff talks, he was probably joking around, he likes to do that. but if true, i hope so, i want to see him win.

also, like i said before. no deal that doesnt involve mcarthy. and hopefully young

KronoRed
08-12-2005, 01:30 AM
I would think the 700 anti JR brigade would be all over the airwaves if this were a serious demand.

smith288
08-12-2005, 01:40 AM
Looks like the same story about the Wsox trade but with more hyped up journalism...

WVPacman
08-12-2005, 01:55 AM
Man if this is true and he does want traded after all the bad stuff that he has put us threw with all the injurys then I see the fans really turning their backs on JR.We have watched him fail here for 3-4 years in Cincy and now that he is FINALLY having a good year he wants to be traded.


I say trade him then our outfield will finally be set the way it should have been with Dunn,Kearns,and Pena.

BYE GRIFFEY!!!!!!!! :mooner:

SteelSD
08-12-2005, 01:56 AM
Griffey: "I have control. The Reds and Chicago have to make a deal."

Translation- Chicago Version: "I want to be traded to the Chicago White Sox."

Translation- Reality Verson: "I can't consider or comment on how I'd use my 10-and-5 rights until the Reds and White Sox actually present a trade option to me."

---End Translation---

Really, the story posted appears to me to be an amalgam of a number of comments made about a potential trade that was accepted by both teams and was shot down by the Reds ownership before they ever approached Griffey about waiving his 10-and-5 rights in order to move to that team. Those high-level approvals happen all the time in regard to 10-and-5 rights and no-trade clauses before players (and their agents) are ever contacted about waiving their rights (see: Kenny Rogers, Phil Nevin).

There's no "demand" present unless you're a White Sox fan eating up what the media is attempting to feed you via dishonest headline.

What I find really silly (and always have) is the following quote:

Dan O'Brien: "My reaction is short and sweet," O'Brien told the newspaper. "Throughout July we had no conversations with Griffey or his agent about his 10-and-5 status, and that says it all."

First, that was said WAY before 8/11/05. Second, it doesn't "say it all". The fact that O'Brien had no "conversations" about Griffey's 10-and-5 rights says nothing other than there wasn't an ownership-approved trade that would have necessitated a conversation with Griffey (or his agent) about waiving his 10-and-5 rights. That doesn't, at all, mean there wasn't a deal in place. It just means that the deal never got past the top rung of the organization food chain.

But you'll note that O'Brien never said that the Reds didn't have conversations with the White Sox. You'll also note that O'Brien never stated a deal wasn't in place. All he said was that a deal wasn't presented to Griffey. That's true, of course, because the deal never got past Lindner. O'Brien technically didn't lie. But he also didn't exactly respect anyone when he positioned obfuscation as a "short and sweet" answer.

Slimy, he is.

WVRedsFan
08-12-2005, 02:06 AM
Looks like the same story about the Wsox trade but with more hyped up journalism...

Exactly. Same story and same quotes with the emphasis on "wanting to go," which he never said once. Good old MSNBC...not.

I got a kick out of the WGN guys last night promoting the Griffey trade to the Sox for some reason. They were absolutely giddy about the prospect of Junior going to the Sox. Strange. Not having to face him when we play the Cubs was probably the main reason.

WVRedsFan
08-12-2005, 02:09 AM
Man if this is true and he does want traded after all the bad stuff that he has put us threw with all the injurys then I see the fans really turning their backs on JR.We have watched him fail here for 3-4 years in Cincy and now that he is FINALLY having a good year he wants to be traded.


I say trade him then our outfield will finally be set the way it should have been with Dunn,Kearns,and Pena.

BYE GRIFFEY!!!!!!!! :mooner:

Huh? He didn't say that. Also, if you look at the statistics, Griffey would be sorely missed. Take 25 Hr's and 80 RBI's out of that outfield and you get lots less. Kearns and Pena cannot make that up--or at least not at this time.

Shaggy Sanchez
08-12-2005, 02:17 AM
Man if this is true and he does want traded after all the bad stuff that he has put us threw with all the injurys then I see the fans really turning their backs on JR.We have watched him fail here for 3-4 years in Cincy and now that he is FINALLY having a good year he wants to be traded.


I say trade him then our outfield will finally be set the way it should have been with Dunn,Kearns,and Pena.

BYE GRIFFEY!!!!!!!! :mooner:

Are you serious? We haven't had to go through anything like what he has gone through. I don't believe any of us had season ending injuries, long rehab assignments, multiple surgeries to put our body back together, our home fans boo us when we got hurt(even though they are the same ones that cheer when he hits a HR), our employer promise to put together a pitching staff that would contend and not do it, get beat up in the media, listen to people say his contract was what kept the Reds from winning even though he took less money to come here(and it was the Larkin, Casey, and Graves contracts that really hurt) and the list goes on.

Griffey has not failed here, when he has been healthy he has put up good numbers. In case you forgot he did put up these numbers in 2000: .271/.387/.943 with 40 HRs 118 RBI. So, I wouldn't say that he is finally having a good year for the Reds, I would say that after 3.5 years of injuries he is finally healthy. If you really want to look at numbers you could also make a case that his 111 games played in 2001 were more productive than what Casey has done this year, once again proving that this isn't the first time he has done anything here.

I don't think any of Griffey's true fans would turn their back on him for wanting to leave this mess and go to a contender. The people that would do that would probably be the same ones that were booing/cheering when he got hurt and then cheer this year when he is playing good.

Nugget
08-12-2005, 05:24 AM
Man if this is true and he does want traded after all the bad stuff that he has put us threw with all the injurys then I see the fans really turning their backs on JR.We have watched him fail here for 3-4 years in Cincy and now that he is FINALLY having a good year he wants to be traded.


I say trade him then our outfield will finally be set the way it should have been with Dunn,Kearns,and Pena.

BYE GRIFFEY!!!!!!!! :mooner:

You could probably add 30HR and 80RBI that the outfield will give away. It's not only the offence that Junior provides but the defence as well. Even after the injuries he is still the best outfielder the REDS have.

buckeyenut
08-12-2005, 07:23 AM
You could probably add 30HR and 80RBI that the outfield will give away. It's not only the offence that Junior provides but the defence as well. Even after the injuries he is still the best outfielder the REDS have.
Um, actually, no he is not. Kearns is.

And even though Jr has great instincts and gets jumps on the ball like few others, he has lost a few steps due to age and injury. He does not have good range at all.

I don't know a lot about the defensive statistics that are out now, but I am pretty sure that if we went from Jr in CF everyday to Pena in CF everyday, we would have a dropoff of probably less than 10 runs over the course of a season.

Little Alex
08-12-2005, 07:37 AM
No one wants to play for the Bad New Bears.

...and our beloved Reds have been the Bad News Bears pretty much since Marge.

Oh well, I'll get back to dreaming about our wildcard spot this year.

fielder's choice
08-12-2005, 09:23 AM
And even though Jr has great instincts and gets jumps on the ball like few others, he has lost a few steps due to age and injury. He does not have good range at all.


Have you been watching the same player as me? Do you remember that ball Randa hit in San Diego the other day, for example. How many other center fielders would have caught that ball? Very few.

larryboy
08-12-2005, 11:28 AM
I still have trouble seeing a trade being made durirng the season. The offseason will bring a new GM, and JR leaving town. I hope he gets to go to a place he'll be happy rather than just an escape from a bad situation. Seattle will put an offer in for him in Nov./Dec. but I can not see him approving that despite Seattle's confidence. The White Sox make more sense. I hope he does not go to the Yankees, that is an environment that is very harsh to say the least.

acredsfan
08-12-2005, 12:18 PM
Um, actually, no he is not. Kearns is.

And even though Jr has great instincts and gets jumps on the ball like few others, he has lost a few steps due to age and injury. He does not have good range at all.

I don't know a lot about the defensive statistics that are out now, but I am pretty sure that if we went from Jr in CF everyday to Pena in CF everyday, we would have a dropoff of probably less than 10 runs over the course of a season.You can't possibly be serious that our best outfielder is splitting time with Wily Mo. I am sorry, but that is just wrong. Kearns may be a good outfielder in the future, but he has struggled this year to say the least.

Austin Kearns:
SEASON TEAM POS G GS INN TC PO A E DP PB SB CS RF FPCT
2005 Cincinnati Reds OF 63 60 514.0 134 126 6 2 2 --- --- --- 2.39 .985

SEASON TEAM G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI TB BB SO SB CS OBP SLG AVG
2005 Cincinnati Reds 68 227 31 54 15 1 8 34 95 23 61 0 0 .315 .419 .238

Ken Griffey Jr:
SEASON TEAM POS G GS INN TC PO A E DP PB SB CS RF FPCT
2005 Cincinnati Reds OF 102 102 876.2 252 244 5 3 1 --- --- ---2.56 .988

SEASON TEAM G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI TB BB SO SB CS OBP SLG AVG
2005 Cincinnati Reds 106 399 70 114 28 0 25 78 217 46 79 0 1 .359 .544 .286

You tell me who the better player is...

redsrule2500
08-12-2005, 01:47 PM
The guy has made no secret that he wants to win a ring before he retires. He's not going to do that here. It's totally logical that he'd want to be traded to a contender.
I don't know if he's going to put the heat on the Reds to get it done, but I'm sure he'd be easily talked into waiving his 10/5 to go to a contender.

Mr. Optomistic!

redsrule2500
08-12-2005, 01:51 PM
Why is it that the story doesn't appear on the main page, the Reds page, the Sports page, or the baseball page?

Hmm..these two loook similar too...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8829546/
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/ id/8630071/

KronoRed
08-12-2005, 02:32 PM
You can't possibly be serious that our best outfielder is splitting time with Wily Mo. I am sorry, but that is just wrong. Kearns may be a good outfielder in the future, but he has struggled this year to say the least.


I think he was talking defensively.

Jjav829
08-12-2005, 03:16 PM
Griffey: "I have control. The Reds and Chicago have to make a deal."

Translation- Chicago Version: "I want to be traded to the Chicago White Sox."

Translation- Reality Verson: "I can't consider or comment on how I'd use my 10-and-5 rights until the Reds and White Sox actually present a trade option to me."

---End Translation---


White Sox fan here to clarify. You are right with this post. This article was nothing short of sloppy journalism. The interview was conducted by ESPN1000 baseball insider Bruce Levine and is set to air in its entirerty Sunday morning on a show called Talking Baseball. Griffey did indeed say, "The Reds and Chicago have to make a deal." However, he didn't mean it the way the "journalist" who wrote this article took it. Griffey was asked something about waiving his 10-5 rights and/or coming to Chicago. He responded by saying that Chicago is a great place, his family comes here a lot, etc. but then went on to say he is a Red for now. He made the statement, "The Reds and Chicago have to make a deal," meaning that he won't worry about going anywhere else because a deal has to be made first before he waives his 10-5 rights.

REDREAD
08-12-2005, 03:21 PM
Mr. Optomistic!

Well, I just don't think Jr has seen much in his 5 years here to be optimistic about. Even if the Reds got a genius GM this winter, Jr's contract is going to be up before they contend again.

fielder's choice
08-13-2005, 12:49 PM
http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050813/SPT04/508130363/1071

Reds, agent, reiterate there's no deal in the works

By Kevin Kelly
Enquirer staff writer

MILWAUKEE - The trade rumors linking Ken Griffey Jr. and the White Sox have resurfaced once again.

The Reds center fielder, who has the right to reject any trade, addressed the rumors Friday at Miller Park while also reiterating his desire to win a World Series before he retires.

"For me, it's going out, playing, and doing what I'm supposed to for this ballclub," Griffey said. "If the organization feels that they need to make a change with me, then we'll look at it and make up my mind when and if.

"If not, (I'll) continue doing what I'm doing. It's in my control, but it's not in my control. The only thing I have control over is, do I want to go? I have no control over who they talk to and what they talk about."

A recent USA Today Sports Weekly report said a deal had been struck to send Griffey to the White Sox for three prospects - with the Reds picking up a sizeable portion of the more than $40 million remaining on Griffey's contract that runs through 2008 with a club option for 2009 - but that Reds owner Carl Lindner ultimately vetoed the deal.

Reds chief operating officer John Allen said there was nothing to that report. General manager Dan O'Brien said then that he never talked to Griffey about a trade. Griffey and his agent, Brian Goldberg, said they were unaware of any potential trade.

The publication followed up the original report by stating Griffey, who has a short list of teams he would be willing to play for, "may be open to accepting a trade to the Chicago White Sox, if he clears waivers."

The Chicago Sun-Times, in Friday's editions, reported the White Sox could still be interested in Griffey.

A Reds official, speaking on condition of anonymity, reiterated Friday that nothing is going on.

Goldberg essentially said the same.

"The Reds told us right before the trade deadline that nothing was going on, and Junior wasn't going anywhere," he said Friday. "Until I hear otherwise from the Reds, and only the Reds, I happen to think that's true."

Griffey is in his sixth season playing for his hometown team, and playing well after undergoing surgery to repair a torn right hamstring in August 2004.

The 35-year-old entered Friday batting .286 with 25 home runs and 78 RBI, despite a slow start in April when he was still trying to get his legs under him. He's on pace to total 35 homers and 110 RBI this season.

The Reds were 52-62 and 20 games behind the first-place Cardinals in the National League Central Division through Thursday.

"No matter what my situation is, and what is being said, I depend on these (teammates) and these guys depend on me," he said. "So until otherwise, when this organization says, 'Do you want to do this,' these are the guys that I depend on."

Asked if he'd prefer to stay in Cincinnati, Griffey said: "I'd prefer to win."

The Reds have yet to make the playoffs since they acquired Griffey from the Mariners in February 2000.

And while he has played in the American League Championship Series, doing so with the Mariners in 1995, Griffey is still looking for his first chance at a World Series championship ring.

"That's the main reason why you play this game," he said. "As a kid you don't talk about how much money you're going to make as an athlete. You talk about hitting a home run in the All-Star Game. You're always talking about that three-balls, two-strikes walkoff home run in the World Series."

-------------------------------

Sounds like he wouldn't be too sad if he went to Chi-town.

RDriesen16
08-13-2005, 01:32 PM
Have you been watching the same player as me? Do you remember that ball Randa hit in San Diego the other day, for example. How many other center fielders would have caught that ball? Very few.the question is, have YOU been watching. ive seen so many balls that have dropped over his head yet not been hr's or balls that hit the wall on the fly. the old jr NEVER would have had that happen and most good cf's now wouldnt either.

Cardinal_Fan
08-13-2005, 11:34 PM
Are you serious? We haven't had to go through anything like what he has gone through. I don't believe any of us had season ending injuries, long rehab assignments, multiple surgeries to put our body back together, our home fans boo us when we got hurt(even though they are the same ones that cheer when he hits a HR), our employer promise to put together a pitching staff that would contend and not do it, get beat up in the media, listen to people say his contract was what kept the Reds from winning even though he took less money to come here(and it was the Larkin, Casey, and Graves contracts that really hurt) and the list goes on.

Griffey has not failed here, when he has been healthy he has put up good numbers. In case you forgot he did put up these numbers in 2000: .271/.387/.943 with 40 HRs 118 RBI. So, I wouldn't say that he is finally having a good year for the Reds, I would say that after 3.5 years of injuries he is finally healthy. If you really want to look at numbers you could also make a case that his 111 games played in 2001 were more productive than what Casey has done this year, once again proving that this isn't the first time he has done anything here.

I don't think any of Griffey's true fans would turn their back on him for wanting to leave this mess and go to a contender. The people that would do that would probably be the same ones that were booing/cheering when he got hurt and then cheer this year when he is playing good.

dude trading griffey would be the best thing ever for the reds. i'll concede that after all his injuries he's having a great year, but the fact remains you have 4 great outfeilders, and one of them (griffey) is getting up there in years and whether you like it or not is injury prone. Right now you can trade him and so what if you dont get very much (player wise) in return, because you'll be getting rid of at least part and im assuming a significant part of his salary. Getting rid of that salary would free up the money so that your new GM could go buy a good pitcher during the off season, like i dunno say a Matt morris from st louis. I say your new GM because i heard that he's beign fired, and i hope that's true because the current one is incompetant. But in conclusion if you want griffey around for another 4-5 years be ready to accept 4-5 more years of mediocrity which will cause you to lose all of the players you have currently who might be able to make up a contending team next year.

Peelboy
08-14-2005, 12:18 AM
FWIW, remember that at this point in the season, traded players have to clear waivers. Players not on the 40-man roster are excluded. It's pretty farfetched to think that any prospects who are good enough to be on the 40-man would clear waivers unless there's something pretty dramatically wrong with them (injury, or if they've already had their shot and busted).

Thus any trade of Griffey will be for non-40 man prospects. For the White Sox, this means no Brian Anderson or Brandon McCarthy. I think it might also mean no Rogowski. Chris Young is not on the 40-man.

sig
08-14-2005, 12:28 AM
I don't like the idea of trading Jr. but if it happens it happens. If he does move out, I sure hope they don't go forward with an outfield of Dunn, Kearns and Pena. That would be a defensive nightmare, IMO. If Dunn can move to first and a new CF be brought in, I think that would be a good plan. Casey is a great guy to have on the team but it's time for a first baseman who hits with power.

Cardinal_Fan
08-14-2005, 02:11 AM
FWIW, remember that at this point in the season, traded players have to clear waivers. Players not on the 40-man roster are excluded. It's pretty farfetched to think that any prospects who are good enough to be on the 40-man would clear waivers unless there's something pretty dramatically wrong with them (injury, or if they've already had their shot and busted).

Thus any trade of Griffey will be for non-40 man prospects. For the White Sox, this means no Brian Anderson or Brandon McCarthy. I think it might also mean no Rogowski. Chris Young is not on the 40-man.

all the reds have to worry about is getting rid of his salary. prospects would be ok but getting rid of his salary means you can buy someone good during the off season, who can lead your rotation.

Peelboy
08-14-2005, 06:49 PM
all the reds have to worry about is getting rid of his salary. prospects would be ok but getting rid of his salary means you can buy someone good during the off season, who can lead your rotation.

No according to a lot of what I've seen posted here. Comments like "Maybe you trade Griffey if they eat the whole salary AND send over a top pitching prospect and another good one".

Maybe the fact that no team was willing to risk having to take Griffey FOR FREE but eat the whole deal will put the whole "he's got tons of value" thing to rest. The prospects the Reds get back will be 100% commensurate with what $$$ they send along with Griffey. Send the whole contract = get back crap. Send a decent portion = get back a good prospect.

Jpup
08-14-2005, 08:59 PM
what is all of this talk about Griffey making it, partially, through waivers? BBTN has gone on and on about it. What does that mean?

jnwohio
08-14-2005, 09:28 PM
what is all of this talk about Griffey making it, partially, through waivers? BBTN has gone on and on about it. What does that mean?

Maybe "partial" means depite what most of the media has reported, somebody put in a claim on him and the Reds had to withdraw the waivers to keep from losing him. Sounds looney that anyone would take the risk of getting hung with his contract by blocking like that. If this is what happened give them bonus cajones points I suspose.

Procedurally, if a claim and withdrawal occurred, I believe that means if the Reds put him back on the wire for a 2nd time in this waiver period (i.e. thru the end of the season), they cannot pull him back and conversely, if he is out there again and you claim him, his contract is yours to keep, unless their are multiple claimers and he is awarded to a different claim.

Redsland
08-14-2005, 10:44 PM
I've never heard the term "partially through waivers."

If a club requests waivers on a guy and no team makes a claim within 72 hours, then they guy has passed through waviers. If anything else happens, he hasn't.

Possibly BBTN doesn't know what it's yammering on about? ;)

Peelboy
08-14-2005, 11:17 PM
IMO they're referring to "revocable waivers". So Griffey hasn't really been "waived" in the sense that it usually means, where he's available to any other team. The Reds can pull him back. Plus, IIRC on standard waivers, once the player clears, he has to be optioned down or released, which is not the case here. If he was claimed and they were to waive him again later - they'd have to release him.

I've never heard of "partial waivers" being used for a player that was claimed. That player just didn't make it through waivers.

Redsland
08-15-2005, 12:19 PM
They may be referring to revokable waivers, since those are the only ones in effect at this time of year, but Griffey cleared those waivers, according to published reports.

So, again, WTF are those "experts" on BBTN talking about?

:dunno:

wheels
08-15-2005, 12:30 PM
No according to a lot of what I've seen posted here. Comments like "Maybe you trade Griffey if they eat the whole salary AND send over a top pitching prospect and another good one".

Maybe the fact that no team was willing to risk having to take Griffey FOR FREE but eat the whole deal will put the whole "he's got tons of value" thing to rest. The prospects the Reds get back will be 100% commensurate with what $$$ they send along with Griffey. Send the whole contract = get back crap. Send a decent portion = get back a good prospect.

Oops.

My post made no sense, so now it's gone.