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Jeremy Piergallini
08-25-2005, 02:56 PM
What about the poor black athlete making millions or even hundreds of thousands playing overseas. They were given a free ride. I don't believe going to a black college would make any difference whether they get educated or not. The professor's job is to teach and mold when they can. YOu can't mold someone who doesn't care. The other side must care and must want to learn. Huggins also had white players there, though not very many. I don't like when the race issue is brought up. Jason Whitlock is a black man and I believe a very good sports journalist, but I do remember whenever there is something between white and black people, it, no matter what, becomes an issue of race with him. He, though, is no where near as bad as Wilbon.

KronoRed
08-25-2005, 03:03 PM
Phil Cox wants UC to be like Duke. That's not gonna happen. But even if it does is that good? I got this from bearcatnews.com

"A recent national champion, months after winning that title, had on its
roster a center who was kicked off his high school team after being
investigated for sexual assault. That team also had a shooting guard who
would be investigated for marijuana possession, a point guard cited for
underage drinking, a backup point guard who confronted an opposing coach
during a game and a backup center accused of beating up his girlfriend. Plus
it had (gasp) a transfer from another school. "
Duke 2001 is the team in question.

So Duke just hides it better? ;)

WVRed
08-25-2005, 03:07 PM
So Duke just hides it better? ;)

No, they just have the likes of Dookie V and Billy P(ACC)ker singing their praises and painting them out to be choirboys.

Matt700wlw
08-25-2005, 03:10 PM
And that's great if she sticks with her philosophy. If she's consistent across the board with these higher academic standards and holding coaches accountable for their personal behavior and the behavior of their athletes, it's a wonderful thing - as long as she's consistent. What's going to happen when a football player gets in trouble? If Dantonio isn't fired then she's opening herself up to the suspicions that all this was was a vendetta against Huggins and/or the basketball program.

If she wants to make UC a bastion of academia, that's wonderful. But it reminds me of what happened at the University of Iowa about 15-20 years ago. I think this was after the Walters/Bloom scandal where many college players took money from these agents before their eligibility was up. A newspaper did a little digging and found out several athletes at Iowa weren't exactly on the fast track for graduation. The classes they took and the grades they got were pretty embarrassing. Anyway the president at Iowa came out one day and said that he wanted to make incoming freshmen at Iowa ineligible for athletics. Nothing ever came of it but could you imagine what would happen if a school in a major conference made their freshmen ineligible while every other school didn't? This sounds a lot like what Zimpher is doing. Raising the bar for these athletes while other institutions not only in their conference but in the area aren't doing the same.

The accountability factor is already in question, considering Phil Cox is still her right hand man, and he has IRS problems (it's probably more than that), and has also had a DUI

....a bit shady

flyer85
08-25-2005, 03:12 PM
*

Matt700wlw
08-25-2005, 03:21 PM
A: The Big East is going to be a struggle. It is an awesome, awesome league. We're going to do the very best we can, and there might be some surprises there. I think a challenge is motivating. We're not going to embarrass ourselves. I will tell you that.



There's that winning attitude we've gotten used to in the last 16 years :rolleyes:



Our plan was to be one of the rare institutions in this country that could raise the bar on admissions while continuing to give opportunity and access to students who had not had the preparation they needed to go to college.

Huh??

Reds4Life
08-25-2005, 03:38 PM
There's that winning attitude we've gotten used to in the last 16 years :rolleyes:

No kidding. The goal is to not embarass ourself, wow, that's really raising the bar.

RosieRed
08-25-2005, 04:09 PM
No kidding. The goal is to not embarass ourself, wow, that's really raising the bar.

You see, players getting in trouble and/or don't graduate = embarrassing.

Bad basketball team = not embarrassing.

Or something like that :confused:

WVRed
08-25-2005, 04:16 PM
Huh??

Im scratching my head on that one too.

traderumor
08-25-2005, 04:44 PM
Jason Whitlock has confused a university with a reform school.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 05:48 PM
When I started going to UC in the 2000-2001 school year, in-state tuition was approximately $5,200 per year. This past school year for 2004-2005, tuition was up to about $8,400 per year. I don't know what the tuition is for 2005-2006 - it may have increased again - but rumors are swirling that even more increases are riding alongside Camp Nancy's high horse.


http://www.uc.edu/ucinfo/fee_schedule_05-06.pdf


And in Nancy's plan, she wants to hike tuition for DAAP, engineering and CCM beyond normal tuition rates.

Matt700wlw
08-25-2005, 05:58 PM
Lowest graduation rate in the NCAA tourney last year: University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee


Former employer of Nancy Zimpher...

Reds4Life
08-25-2005, 06:17 PM
Lowest graduation rate in the NCAA tourney last year: University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee


Former employer of Nancy Zimpher...

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Why am I not suprised?

Newport Red
08-25-2005, 08:30 PM
Q: One of the criticisms of your academic plan is that it's elitist and aims to turn UC into something it's not. How do you respond?

A: I don't think anything could be further from the truth in terms of our goals for this institution. We are a public university. By virtue of our designation as an urban university, we thought it shouted that we are committed to the community. Our plan was to be one of the rare institutions in this country that could raise the bar on admissions while continuing to give opportunity and access to students who had not had the preparation they needed to go to college. So I reject that criticism.

Run that by me again. She's going to raise the bar, then let students in who do not meet that bar? That's called not raising the bar.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 08:33 PM
Run that by me again. She's going to raise the bar, then let students in who do not meet that bar? That's called not raising the bar.

She's delusional.

Sham
08-25-2005, 08:46 PM
How about you guys give her about 4 years to institute the changes she wants, then see what the deal is? Just sayin.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 08:49 PM
How about you guys give her about 4 years to institute the changes she wants, then see what the deal is? Just sayin.

Well, I get to see the effects of her changes every day up close and personal. She gets it wrong more often than not.

For what it's worth...

MWM
08-25-2005, 08:50 PM
Why, even in this thread, are we still hearing about how Huggins "doesn't graduate players?"

Sham
08-25-2005, 08:57 PM
Well, I get to see the effects of her changes every day up close and personal. She gets it wrong more often than not.

For what it's worth...

So you have seen the millions she has raised for the varsity village project? There is a reason the board supports her, a big reason. Just deal with it.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 08:59 PM
So you have seen the millions she has raised for the varsity village project?


Actually no. That distinction belongs to her predicessor, Dr. Joseph Steger. All the construction occurring on campus is a result of his actions.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:03 PM
haha awesome paintmered. Zimpher is smoke and mirrors bigtime, she's a politician that is losing the pr battle.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:04 PM
Actually no. That distinction belongs to her predicessor, Dr. Joseph Steger. All the construction occurring on campus is a result of his actions.

Not what I heard, and not what the board of trustees thinks, clearly. What you guys think means nothing, sorry to break it to you.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:05 PM
Sham you are clueless. You think the board of trustees wouldn't know it's Steger? You are wrong, quit while you are ahead. It was Steger.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:05 PM
Donors step to the plate

as UC goes to work on Varsity Village
by John Bach

Green was certainly the color of the day inside Shoemaker Center March 17, 2003, and not only because it was St. Patrick's Day.

University officials accepted $10 million in cash from Fifth Third Bank that morning for the construction of Varsity Village, a week to the day after Richard Lindner committed $10.2 million to the same cause.

" We are doing this on every Monday or Tuesday," joked UC President Joseph Steger, in acceptance. "We need to find somebody for next week."

Though a third million-dollar Monday did not materialize, the athletics department is still well on its way toward an $80.3 million enhancement of its athletics complex, a move, officials say, will position all 18 varsity sports among the nation's elite. Some of the features of the project, which started in April, include an eight-story athletics center, a relocated baseball stadium, a tennis center and a renovated track and soccer venue.

In recognition of Lindner's generosity, the largest gift from an individual to one project in the university's history, UC's new complex will be named the Richard E. Lindner Varsity Village, and the new athletics center, the centerpiece of Varsity Village, will be named the Richard E. Lindner Center. Lindner is president of REL Group, a Greater Cincinnati-based holding company, and is former owner of the Thriftway supermarket chain.

The new facility will be the second on campus to bear the Lindner name. The first was the College of Business' Carl H. Lindner Hall, named after Richard's older brother, who has also given generously to UC.

"The University of Cincinnati is proud to be associated with Richard Lindner, a quiet benefactor who has assisted many worthy programs in the community," Steger said. "The difference this makes in the lives of everybody who comes through here we cannot even estimate."



Sham- Quit telling me what I should and shouldn't think. And quit telling us we don't have input or we have no recourse. We do, watch.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:07 PM
Not what I heard, and not what the board of trustees thinks, clearly.


Varsity Villiage predates Nancy Zimpher. The big donations by Richard Lidner, 5/3 Bank and the Gettler family do as well. As does Mainstreet and Stratford Villiage and the Calhoun Street project.....

http://www.horizons.uc.edu/0703/sports.htm

Steger was still president of UC when that was written.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:07 PM
Sham you are clueless. You think the board of trustees wouldn't know it's Steger? You are wrong, quit while you are ahead. It was Steger.

Yeah, Steger is the man, that's why he is gone and Zimpher can do what she pleases. You are right.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:09 PM
Yeah, Steger is the man, that's why he is gone and Zimpher can do what she pleases. You are right.


Wrong again. Steger retired as president after serving for many years.

Edit: He was president at UC for 19 years.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:10 PM
Varsity Villiage predates Nancy Zimpher. The big donations by Richard Lidner and 5/3 Bank do as well. As does Mainstreet and Stratford Villiage and the Calhoun Street project.....

http://www.horizons.uc.edu/0703/sports.htm

Steger was still president of UC when that was written.

Blah, blah, blah. You guys need to ask yourselves why they brought Zimpher here.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:11 PM
Scam is wrong a wee bit more than he is right.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:12 PM
Blah, blah, blah. You guys need to ask yourselves why they brought Zimpher here.

So anytime someone is hired it's automatically the perfect hire? Try again dude. She was brought her by the trusty bot to use her political bs and increase the brand equity of UC. I have no qualms with that, but being realistic and respecting people at the University should also be her goal. Not firing deans and hiring them with people that can't even practice in the state of Ohio. And certainly not disrespecting Bob Huggins and every athlete that has ever played for him. Nancy Zimpher is all smoke and mirrors, she cared nothing about the UC basketball program. She did this because of bogus reputation instead of fighting to defeat that bogus reputation. She wants a baseline 22 act for entrance into a public university. Nothing she does makes sense, nothing Phil Cox or the BOT does for that matter. Phil Cox wants UC in Clifton to be Duke or Stanford lol. There is nothing wrong with dreaming big, hell I want to play in the NBA. But dreams must equal some semblence of reality.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:13 PM
Scam is wrong a wee bit more than he is right.

Like when I said the board supports her? Hey you guys can point to the fact that Varsity village was started before she got here but you can't discount the funds she has raised for the project.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:15 PM
Are you serious? Of course the bot supports her or he wouldn't be fired. The Reds won today, and they lost yesterday. That means I'm right twice. Gee I'm a genius!

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:17 PM
So anytime someone is hired it's automatically the perfect hire?

If I remember correctly to when she was hired, she had a resume that would have made even me take a long look at her.

Ego and flawed ambition are hard to find on a resume though.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:18 PM
Are you serious? Of course the bot supports her or he wouldn't be fired. The Reds won today, and they lost yesterday. That means I'm right twice. Gee I'm a genius!

And exactly why does the BOT support her? Like it or not, she is a dynamic personality who knows how to run a University.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:18 PM
If I remember correctly to when she was hired, she had a resume that would have made even me take a long look at her.

Oh no doubt. Many times in life the wrong people are gonna have the right qualifications. Sometimes you make the wrong call.

Newport Red
08-25-2005, 09:19 PM
So anytime someone is hired it's automatically the perfect hire? Try again dude. She was brought her by the trusty bot to use her political bs and increase the brand equity of UC. I have no qualms with that, but being realistic and respecting people at the University should also be her goal. Not firing deans and hiring them with people that can't even practice in the state of Ohio. And certainly not disrespecting Bob Huggins and every athlete that has ever played for him. Nancy Zimpher is all smoke and mirrors, she cared nothing about the UC basketball program. She did this because of bogus reputation instead of fighting to defeat that bogus reputation. She wants a baseline 22 act for entrance into a public university. Nothing she does makes sense, nothing Phil Cox or the BOT does for that matter. Phil Cox wants UC in Clifton to be Duke or Stanford lol. There is nothing wrong with dreaming big, hell I want to play in the NBA. But dreams must equal some semblence of reality.

It's been a "few" years since I went to college. What does a 22 ACT equal in a SAT score.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:20 PM
And exactly why does the BOT support her?

They obviously don't have the guts to stand up to her. They also obviously bought into the bs stereotype of the Huggins program. That doesn't mean they are right by any stretch.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:21 PM
It's been a "few" years since I went to college. What does a 22 ACT equal in a SAT score.


I think it's around a 1000 on a 1600 scale. Now they have that essay so it isn't out of 1600 anymore.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:22 PM
They obviously don't have the guts to stand up to her. They also obviously bought into the bs stereotype of the Huggins program. That doesn't mean they are right by any stretch.

Yeah, right, those BOT guys are all gutless. Phil Cox is a former FBI agent. I'm sure he's gutless.

Newport Red
08-25-2005, 09:23 PM
They obviously don't have the guts to stand up to her. They also obviously bought into the bs stereotype of the Huggins program. That doesn't mean they are right by any stretch.

They also hired her in 2003. They don't want to admit a mistake and look incompetent themselves.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:24 PM
It reflects poorly on yourself to speak out against the very person you hired just two years earlier.


Edit: NR, you took the words right out of my mouth :thumbup:

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:25 PM
http://www.newsrecord.org/media/paper693/news/2005/05/25/News/Entrance.Requirements.To.Get.Harder-953935.shtml

So it's not just a 22. But it's also a 20 with top 75% of class. Why even use 22 for? Pr reasons. There will be NO special admissions for athletes either. Myself I don't quite understand that. So if you get a chance to admit the best piano player to CCM you wouldn't give any leeway? Isn't that better for the University? As long as they are close to standards.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:26 PM
Yeah, right, those BOT guys are all gutless. Phil Cox is a former FBI agent. I'm sure he's gutless.

He's also got tax liens on him right now and he's also got a dui. He's not one to be talking about being a role model. And a FBI agent? So once again we get into sham's for certain things in the world. Any FBI agent is a good man and has guts? I doubt that sir.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:31 PM
He's also got tax liens on him right now and he's also got a dui. He's not one to be talking about being a role model. And a FBI agent? So once again we get into sham's for certain things in the world. Any FBI agent is a good man and has guts? I doubt that sir.

Gotta say you don't have a clue about Phil Cox. I have met and talked to him, why don't you do the same before you trash him. Only fair.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:34 PM
I actually have a clue. Everyone in the city knows he's got a dui and tax liens. I'll trash him all I want for trashing me. And Nancy and Phil did. Frankly I would love to have the oppurtunity to speak with that man.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:41 PM
I actually have a clue. Everyone in the city knows he's got a dui and tax liens. I'll trash him all I want for trashing me. And Nancy and Phil did. Frankly I would love to have the oppurtunity to speak with that man.

So go see him, his financial consulting firms are all over town. Gotta say, though, he is one hell of a man.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 09:52 PM
So go see him, his financial consulting firms are all over town. Gotta say, though, he is one hell of a man.


Fair enough, but his criminal record reflects poorly upon MY school and it warrants his resignation.

We don't want a double standard now, do we?


For the record, I'm held to a much higher standard at my job than either Huggins or Cox.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 09:55 PM
Frankly I don't care how nice he was to you. I care about his doublespeak and the way he represents the university.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:58 PM
Fair enough, but his criminal record reflects poorly upon MY school and it warrants his resignation.

We don't want a double standard now, do we?


For the record, I'm held to a much higher standard at my job than either Huggins or Cox.

Well, it would help to know what his criminal record is. Tax disputes with the IRS are not criminal, and often are not wrong. I deal with the IRS daily.

Sham
08-25-2005, 09:59 PM
Frankly I don't care how nice he was to you. I care about his doublespeak and the way he represents the university.

Cool, I just think that if you talked to him in person you would get his view.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 10:00 PM
Well, it would help to know what his criminal record is. Tax disputes with the IRS are not criminal, and often are not wrong. I deal with the IRS daily.

"Not graduating your players" isn't a criminal offense either, but it reflects poorly upon UC and so does Cox's tax history.

A DUI conviction, however, is a criminal offense. If Huggs was forced to resign over these reasons, Cox needs to be held to the same standard.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 10:03 PM
I already have his view on record. He has spoken that he wants UC to be like Duke, Stanford, and Xavier. I don't want that and I don't think it's reasonable. I want higher standards, but I like being realistic. I also don't like the way he has publicly trashed Huggins and every player that played for him. Nothing he could say would appease me or most other Huggins fans. Darth and the bot wanted Huggins out and they were willing to lie and drag everyone through the mud. Most UC fans have been able to see through their little scheme.

Sham
08-25-2005, 10:04 PM
"Not graduating your players" isn't a criminal offense either, but it reflects poorly upon UC and so does Cox's tax history.

A DUI conviction, however, is a criminal offense. If Huggs was forced to resign over these reasons, Cox needs to be held to the same standard.

Seriously, a persons tax history is up to the courts. If he went to jail I would agree with you. Huggins wasn't fired for the DUI, so I don't know what your point is.

Sham
08-25-2005, 10:12 PM
I already have his view on record. He has spoken that he wants UC to be like Duke, Stanford, and Xavier. I don't want that and I don't think it's reasonable. I want higher standards, but I like being realistic. I also don't like the way he has publicly trashed Huggins and every player that played for him. Nothing he could say would appease me or most other Huggins fans. Darth and the bot wanted Huggins out and they were willing to lie and drag everyone through the mud. Most UC fans have been able to see through their little scheme.

I hear ya Cedric, but I just think that if you met Phil you would rethink things. Peace.

Cedric
08-25-2005, 10:15 PM
Have a good one.

Sham
08-25-2005, 10:15 PM
Have a good one.

You too, bud.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 10:15 PM
Huggins wasn't fired for the DUI, so I don't know what your point is.

You honestly think that if Huggins didn't have the DUI that the end result would be the same? Sure they didn't come right out and say it, but it provided a big reason to remove him as head coach.

I honestly thought he was going to be fired immediately after his DUI.

paintmered
08-25-2005, 10:17 PM
Guess it's time to agree to disagree for tonight Sham.

Goodnight.

Sham
08-25-2005, 10:20 PM
You honestly think that if Huggins didn't have the DUI that the end result would be the same? Sure they didn't come right out and say it, but it provided a big reason to remove him as head coach.

I honestly thought he was going to be fired immediately after his DUI.

Me too. I thought he would be canned after the DUI. I have been drinking, what was the question again?

TeamBoone
08-25-2005, 11:03 PM
Not what I heard, and not what the board of trustees thinks, clearly. What you guys think means nothing, sorry to break it to you.

That's pretty funny, considering the bulk of the construction began before 2003, when she came to UC.

Cyclone792
08-25-2005, 11:27 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb and make the wild guess that Sham works for Zimpher or the university in some regard ...

Cyclone792
08-25-2005, 11:34 PM
What you guys think means nothing, sorry to break it to you.

Who is you guys referring to?

Cedric, paintmered and myself ... all current students or alumni? Is this an implication that what the students think means nothing?

Nancy Zimpher has been booed heavily and regularly by the student body in public appearances ever since she was hired, much to the same degree that Bud Selig gets booed during MLB appearances. The students have despised her from Day 1, and all she's done since she's arrived is justify the student body's distaste of her.

DoogMinAmo
08-26-2005, 12:16 AM
http://www.uc.edu/ucinfo/fee_schedule_05-06.pdf


And in Nancy's plan, she wants to hike tuition for DAAP, engineering and CCM beyond normal tuition rates.

:eek: Got out of there just in time!

MWM
08-26-2005, 08:57 AM
Ah, the old "the person who has the job must know what they're doing, because afterall, they have the job." I heard the same things about Dan O'brien. The only question at this point is who will be in their current job longer......Zimpher or DanO.

WVRed
08-26-2005, 10:29 AM
Why, even in this thread, are we still hearing about how Huggins "doesn't graduate players?"

I think we need to bring back WOY's old signature.

"Nice opinion, please provide some FACTS to back it up."

M2
08-26-2005, 10:45 AM
I already have his view on record. He has spoken that he wants UC to be like Duke, Stanford, and Xavier. I don't want that and I don't think it's reasonable. I want higher standards, but I like being realistic.

Seems to me that you either have higher standards or you don't. BTW, a 22 ACT (1000 SAT) and top quarter of the class standard is fairly pedestrian in the academic world. That won't get you a sniff of Duke or Stanford. It's about what you'd see at a good state school, perhaps even a little low.

Chip R
08-26-2005, 11:16 AM
Seems to me that you either have higher standards or you don't. BTW, a 22 ACT (1000 SAT) and top quarter of the class standard is fairly pedestrian in the academic world. That won't get you a sniff of Duke or Stanford. It's about what you'd see at a good state school, perhaps even a little low.
And that's great. But, like you said, either have them or don't and enforce them. Don't make exceptions because a guy can run a 4.4 40 or averages 30 PPG but happens to have low test scores. The coaches don't admit these students, the university does. If a university is serious about only admitting students who have a 22 ACT or higher, they need to tell the coaches not to recruit players who don't fall into that category. If an O.J. Mayo didn't get the required test scores you don't admit him even though he's the best player in the country and a local legend. Actions speak louder than words and we'll see in the next few years at UC if Zimpher was sincere or just wanted Huggins out.

M2
08-26-2005, 12:39 PM
And that's great. But, like you said, either have them or don't and enforce them. Don't make exceptions because a guy can run a 4.4 40 or averages 30 PPG but happens to have low test scores. The coaches don't admit these students, the university does. If a university is serious about only admitting students who have a 22 ACT or higher, they need to tell the coaches not to recruit players who don't fall into that category. If an O.J. Mayo didn't get the required test scores you don't admit him even though he's the best player in the country and a local legend. Actions speak louder than words and we'll see in the next few years at UC if Zimpher was sincere or just wanted Huggins out.

On the athletics side (I was talking about non-athletic matters in my previous post), the key isn't so much that you be anal about the admissions standards. Plenty of schools relax admissions standards for prime athletes in high-profile sports. My alma mater does it for hockey players. The real key is that the institution demand the players take education seriously after they get in the door.

Most of the schools in the Big East are well-regarded educational institutions as well and it's not like the conference lacks quality players.

Is there a balancing act involved? Sure. Was Huggins inclined to attempt that balancing act? Maybe, maybe not. Does Zimpher have a clear idea as to how that balancing act can be achieved? Maybe, maybe not.

Cedric
08-26-2005, 12:48 PM
M2- College sports are a joke, I'm not arguing that. But you honestly can't field a competitive basketball team in Clifton with a 22 act limit. Notre Dame has easier admissions for their football team and they still are pretty weak. And they have the best tradition of any college sports team. How could anyone expect a public university like UC to compete? It's not a college for just the elite, it's a public university. It's not fair to the kids at Withrow, Walnut, Taft.

acredsfan
08-26-2005, 01:34 PM
I didn't read every post so sorry if I repeat what has already been said. I just have to say that Zimpher should be fired immediately! This is the most idiotic move ever made. Nancy has lost a ton of funding for the university, no matter how you look at it, the Mens basketball program was probably the biggest moneymaker on campus, that is taking a big hit, and it should. Nancy has not only ruined the athletic program, she has signed her own death warrant. She won't last at UC much longer, there's no way. I am a student at UC in the mechanical engineering department, which ranks in the top 10 year after year. The Architecture program is tops in the nation. The teaching, nursing, and pharmacy are also among the leaders in the nation. Nancy needs to remember, we are a public school, not a private, so it is UC's responsibility to offer an education to people who would otherwise not be able to attend college. All this talk of raising standards is just stupid. UC is an inner city school, there is no way they will ever become a Duke or anything close. Nancy will be gone soon, just wait and see. It is absolutely sick that any so called "professional" would treat her peers with such a dishonor. All of us here in the Cincy area saw this coming, she had something personal against Bob ever since she got here. It is a sad, sad situation that a power hungry woman just trying to make a name for herself in the national level would stoop this low. All the discussion at the beginning of the thread saying what they thought UC looked like to people outside the area just makes me laugh. If they only knew what Huggins did for the city and how much of a difference he made in the lives of some of the players. Also, people are saying that Huggins is the reason that these so-called "criminals" are getting into UC. Who here honestly thinks that Huggins has the final say in who he brings in. Of course he doesn't, Nancy or whoever the acting president was at the time have the final say, so if she wanted the school cleaned up, all she has to do would be screen the players he recruits, it's that simple. It is Nancy who is to blame for the trouble and bad press that UC is getting right now because of her bone-headed moves.

Reds Fanatic
08-26-2005, 01:38 PM
Andy Kennedy was officially hired as the interim coach today.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=2143604


Associated Press


CINCINNATI -- Andy Kennedy was hired as interim head coach at Cincinnati on Friday, two days after Bob Huggins was forced out.

Kennedy had been Huggins' top assistant and served as recruiting coordinator the past four years. Before that, he spent five years as an assistant at UAB, where he is the school's No. 2 career scorer.

The 37-year-old Kennedy said he is grateful for the opportunity, and he has Huggins' blessing.

"This has been a very difficult time for men's basketball at the University of Cincinnati," Kennedy said. "I have been given the charge to move this program forward, to put the focus back on our student-athletes."

Huggins quit Wednesday, a day after the school said he would be fired if he didn't resign. He agreed to a $3 million buyout for the rest of his contract.

Richard Katz, Huggins' lawyer, said Thursday he and the university's lawyer probably won't complete details of the buyout until next week.

The sides are discussing when Huggins will leave and how much he will get. The school is willing to let him stay as an adviser for three months, easing the transition to an interim coach.

Huggins led Cincinnati to No. 1 rankings, a Final Four and 14 consecutive NCAA tournament appearances during his 16 seasons at Cincinnati. The Bearcats also had numerous player arrests and violations during his stay, drawing NCAA probation.

"We will attack this mission head-on, as we were all taught by the man who brought this program back to life," Kennedy said.

"I would encourage everyone in the Cincinnati basketball family to allow themselves, in time, to begin the healing process. I feel very fortunate to have been a part of this proud program for the past four seasons, and I look forward to the challenges that lie ahead."

M2
08-26-2005, 01:57 PM
M2- College sports are a joke, I'm not arguing that. But you honestly can't field a competitive basketball team in Clifton with a 22 act limit. Notre Dame has easier admissions for their football team and they still are pretty weak. And they have the best tradition of any college sports team. How could anyone expect a public university like UC to compete? It's not a college for just the elite, it's a public university. It's not fair to the kids at Withrow, Walnut, Taft.

I agree major college sports are a joke or pathetic or a sham, take your pick.

From what I'm reading in this thread, I don't get the impression that UC will enforce a strict 22 ACT limit on basketball players. Instead I get the impression that the university expects the players to take academics more seriously from here on out. Perhaps there's hypocrisy at work in that Huggins did have his players hitting the books and that he was willing to do even more on that front.

UC will now be in the same league as UConn. You know what's in Storrs, CT? Nothing. Not a damn thing. It's a backwater hole. Yet the men's and women's basketball teams are powerhouses and the quality of the school has risen by leaps and bounds over the past 20 years. UNC's a public university, one of the best, and it manages to run a competitive basketball program too.

Good academics and competitive sports aren't mutually exclusive terms for public universities. It can be done.

On the non-athletic academics side, I'll reiterate that the general minimum standards you're talking about for UC are run-of-the-mill stuff. It's what you should expect from any competitive admissions school. 75th percentile sounds high, but what's the actual percentage of high school seniors who enter a four-year school? I'll guess 60% (and that may be high). If I'm anywhere close to right on that then you'd only have to be slightly better than average among the group of students going the four-year route in order to qualify. I don't know much about the ACT, but a 1000 SAT is actually below average.

And there's plenty of other solid state and private colleges to accommodate the students who fall short of the UC reqs. In other words, this doesn't strike me as particularly elitist.

Chip R
08-26-2005, 02:00 PM
On the athletics side (I was talking about non-athletic matters in my previous post), the key isn't so much that you be anal about the admissions standards. Plenty of schools relax admissions standards for prime athletes in high-profile sports. My alma mater does it for hockey players. The real key is that the institution demand the players take education seriously after they get in the door.

Most of the schools in the Big East are well-regarded educational institutions as well and it's not like the conference lacks quality players.

Is there a balancing act involved? Sure. Was Huggins inclined to attempt that balancing act? Maybe, maybe not. Does Zimpher have a clear idea as to how that balancing act can be achieved? Maybe, maybe not.

But that's what caused the trouble in the first place. The school let in players who clearly weren't model students. Some turned their lives around and have become very successful. Some were thugs and remained thugs. But it's much riskier to bring these kids in than it is with kids who have great test scores/grades and aren't from the inner city. If these universities want choir boys on their teams then they should recruit choir boys or kids most likely to be choir boys. I'm not saying UC can't recover from this. Many schools have had to replace great coaches and the program recovered. But I guess my big thing is the potential hypocrisy here. If a football player or two have problems with the law, is that coach going to suffer the same fate as Huggins? Is the football program and the new basketball coach going to be able to get kids in who don't meet the stricter requirements? I know that most of these Big East schools are fine educational institutions - as is UC. But they have problems too. UConn just had 2 guards on their basketball team arrested for robbery. Should Jim Calhoun start updating his resume? UC hasn't been any worse than most schools. And if we are talking about graduation rates, how do other schools compare? Duke certainly can't brag on 100% graduation rates any more since they are starting to have players leaving early for the NBA too. Now their kids may come back for their degrees but so do a lot of UC's kids. But Duke gets the publicity for it and UC looks like a reform school. I will admit that Huggins brought in many kids with questionable character. As I said some became good citizens and others didn't. But he realized that he needed to bring in better kids and has done that for the most part. And - as cited by others - more of his kids have started to get their degrees in a more timely manner. Jason Maxiell was the 1st round choice of the Pistons and he graduated in 4 years. No mean accomplishment at UC for any student - athlete or otherwise. So it seems that Huggins recignized there was a problem and went about trying to solve it or make it better. Yet he still pays the price for things that happened 10-15 years ago.

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 02:27 PM
How about you guys give her about 4 years to institute the changes she wants, then see what the deal is? Just sayin.

If she's still there in 4 years, I'd be surprised

CrackerJack
08-26-2005, 02:27 PM
UC hasn't been any worse than most schools.

I've heard this argument quite a bit and radio talk show hosts give the same argument about UConn's troubles of late and others. Most college basketball programs pale in comparison to UC's historied troubles and embarrassments - a school can only take so much of an image beating before someone pulls the plug.

I always find it curious how people in this city never blame Huggins' for any of his actions or hold him responsible for the kids he recruits or the way his program is run, never, ever is he blamed for anything - when in fact it's entirely his fault. I don't care what anyone says - he's had 16 years to turn things around and it just got worse. Only in the last 2-3 years did the grades show serious improvement across the board - when he was "forced" to do so.

The clear difference here is that UC has had continuous, non-stop, systematic problems for the last 10 years. Tarkanian was fired for the same reasons Huggins was - a systematic, on-going problem of school rules non-conformance and NCAA rules violations, as well as players who couldn't stay out of trouble with the law, constantly, not just every 5-10 years.

Sure, every major basketball program has it's problem athletes from time-to-time, most get slapped for it and clean up their mess long enough to avoid people getting fired etc.., or getting labeled with a thug image.

The fact is Huggins' program has had so many problems with breaking not only the school's rules, but NCAA rules and the law itself - that I can't even begin to recite the dozens of serious incidents that have occurred for so long, in addition to academically ineligible athletes or those that have had serious academic problems. It's ridiculous and embarrassing.

If Huggins wants to run an NBA prepatory program - fine - no problem with that here, it's silly to think a lot of those kids are college material - but if UC's president doesn't want to run a program for JUCO transfers looking for a way into the NBA - fine by me, it's her choice.

Huggins isn't exactly an innocent in all of this - the guy has real issues, but again he never, ever gets any blame for his program's problems.

I simply got tired of cheering for girlfriend and woman beaters, drunks, laziness, rapists, kidnappers, failing students, etc..., I found it hard to even care about most of the "I'm here to get paid" punks (with exceptions of course) or have any enthusiasm for his players - they were bad people and not worth respecting or even cheering for far too often, and the good kids he had in there (Maxiell comes to mind) were over-shadowed by the constant string of idiots.

Thank God it's over. Winning isn't everything.

RosieRed
08-26-2005, 02:30 PM
Nancy has lost a ton of funding for the university, no matter how you look at it, the Mens basketball program was probably the biggest moneymaker on campus, that is taking a big hit, and it should.

It was also the only profitable sport at UC:

According to data collected by the U.S. Department of Education from July 2003-June 2004, men's basketball was the only sport of 18 at UC to make a profit ($605,767).

DoogMinAmo
08-26-2005, 02:37 PM
I didn't read every post so sorry if I repeat what has already been said. I just have to say that Zimpher should be fired immediately! This is the most idiotic move ever made. Nancy has lost a ton of funding for the university, no matter how you look at it, the Mens basketball program was probably the biggest moneymaker on campus, that is taking a big hit, and it should. Nancy has not only ruined the athletic program, she has signed her own death warrant. She won't last at UC much longer, there's no way. I am a student at UC in the mechanical engineering department, which ranks in the top 10 year after year. The Architecture program is tops in the nation. The teaching, nursing, and pharmacy are also among the leaders in the nation. Nancy needs to remember, we are a public school, not a private, so it is UC's responsibility to offer an education to people who would otherwise not be able to attend college. All this talk of raising standards is just stupid. UC is an inner city school, there is no way they will ever become a Duke or anything close. Nancy will be gone soon, just wait and see. It is absolutely sick that any so called "professional" would treat her peers with such a dishonor. All of us here in the Cincy area saw this coming, she had something personal against Bob ever since she got here. It is a sad, sad situation that a power hungry woman just trying to make a name for herself in the national level would stoop this low. All the discussion at the beginning of the thread saying what they thought UC looked like to people outside the area just makes me laugh. If they only knew what Huggins did for the city and how much of a difference he made in the lives of some of the players. Also, people are saying that Huggins is the reason that these so-called "criminals" are getting into UC. Who here honestly thinks that Huggins has the final say in who he brings in. Of course he doesn't, Nancy or whoever the acting president was at the time have the final say, so if she wanted the school cleaned up, all she has to do would be screen the players he recruits, it's that simple. It is Nancy who is to blame for the trouble and bad press that UC is getting right now because of her bone-headed moves.

So I have been thinking about this, and I am really wavering. Is college truly for everyone? If you did not achieve a certain educational status or base of knowledge in high school, why should you be allowed in college?

Now maybe people change, and at some point become more interested or devoted to education. If this is true, I would hope some loophole would exist to allow them to retest and enter. But if they do not have basic levels of aptitude, then I think they should not make it into college. It is an institute of higher learning, a privelage not a right.

As it is there are articles of oversaturation of college graduates. I am curious how many would be weeded out if graduation and admission standards were raised.

For those who went to college, how many partied their way through it, or knew many who did? Would not the value of the degree be more to others and yourself if you truly had to work to get it, earning it and not just receiving for service time?

While college as a giant party seems like fun, and I along with many of you would hate to see all that go, if college was to truly be an institute of higher learning, than those who are not trying should not be allowed, just like the thugs and vagrants mentioned above.

I am just pointing out a bit of a double standard, and that reform should affect all, not just a basketball team.

Reds4Life
08-26-2005, 02:39 PM
Winning isn't everything.

The perfect motto for losers, has beens, and never will be's.

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 02:48 PM
And exactly why does the BOT support her? Like it or not, she is a dynamic personality who knows how to run a University.

Yeah...she's showing that with flying colors :rolleyes:

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 02:59 PM
Gotta say you don't have a clue about Phil Cox. I have met and talked to him, why don't you do the same before you trash him. Only fair.

Because facts are facts. Hypocrites are hypocrites. It is what it is

RosieRed
08-26-2005, 03:01 PM
So I have been thinking about this, and I am really wavering. Is college truly for everyone? If you did not achieve a certain educational status or base of knowledge in high school, why should you be allowed in college?

Now maybe people change, and at some point become more interested or devoted to education. If this is true, I would hope some loophole would exist to allow them to retest and enter. But if they do not have basic levels of aptitude, then I think they should not make it into college. It is an institute of higher learning, a privelage not a right.

As it is there are articles of oversaturation of college graduates. I am curious how many would be weeded out if graduation and admission standards were raised.

For those who went to college, how many partied their way through it, or knew many who did? Would not the value of the degree be more to others and yourself if you truly had to work to get it, earning it and not just receiving for service time?

While college as a giant party seems like fun, and I along with many of you would hate to see all that go, if college was to truly be an institute of higher learning, than those who are not trying should not be allowed, just like the thugs and vagrants mentioned above.

I am just pointing out a bit of a double standard, and that reform should affect all, not just a basketball team.

No, college isn't truly for everyone. But state schools such as UC have to be in a position to accept students that wouldn't get into private schools that have higher standards for admissions.

If you party your way through college, I think one of two things happens:

1. You figure out how to party and still get good enough grades to get your degree.

2. You don't figure out the above and you get suspended for bad grades and/or have to quit college.

And seeing as how the college isn't going to know who will or will not become a "partier," how could they have any control over it when it comes to admissions?

I coasted through a good number of my college classes, but still graduated with honors. Is that my fault, or the university's fault? Do I not deserve my degree because I didn't "try" as much as I could have?

DoogMinAmo
08-26-2005, 03:11 PM
No, college isn't truly for everyone. But state schools such as UC have to be in a position to accept students that wouldn't get into private schools that have higher standards for admissions.

If you party your way through college, I think one of two things happens:

1. You figure out how to party and still get good enough grades to get your degree.

2. You don't figure out the above and you get suspended for bad grades and/or have to quit college.

And seeing as how the college isn't going to know who will or will not become a "partier," how could they have any control over it when it comes to admissions?

I coasted through a good number of my college classes, but still graduated with honors. Is that my fault, or the university's fault? Do I not deserve my degree because I didn't "try" as much as I could have?

That would be for you to decide in hindsight.

As far as I understand Nancy's plan, she would be raising standards across the board, not just on admissions. So if people are "smart enough" to get in, and then coast and burn, they don't make it.

I am not saying UC should have the same standards as a Harvard, but it should have higher standards than a St. X.

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 03:24 PM
Anyone go to the Rally at Willies?

I couldn't make it due to other plans, and I really wish I could have. Somebody please be my eyes and ears.

What I saw on the news and the classiness of Bob Huggins and the things he said was truely something great.

He will be missed.

M2
08-26-2005, 03:50 PM
No, college isn't truly for everyone. But state schools such as UC have to be in a position to accept students that wouldn't get into private schools that have higher standards for admissions.

There's tiers of state schools though. For instance, I've got a lot of family in Pennsylvania and, from what I'm told, not just anyone gets a "Welcome to Happy Valley" letter in the Quaker State.

Penn State is the at the top of the Pennsylvania state school food chain. It wants the best students it can find. UC-Berkeley is the same sort of deal. UVA rules the roost in Virginia. I went to grad school at a second-tier state school there (James Madison). It was still a fine institution and I got a good education, but UVA's the prestige institution.

It sounds like UC's been marching up the food chain for a few decades, that it wants to be regarded as being among the better public institutions. IMO, there's nothing wrong with that. Someone has to be that school and over the course of time it will be a huge asset to the city if it can fill that role.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but UC never was a community college, was it? It's always been selective about who it admits, right? If so, then it's just a matter of UC finding its place in the larger college education mix. UC's not going to be the right spot for everyone and it shouldn't try to be.

And again, the standards that have been mentioned in this thread are not particularly high standards. If I had a 1000 SAT and ranked in the 75th percentile of my graduating class, there's little chance I'd have been accepted to my main state school.

RosieRed
08-26-2005, 04:08 PM
There's tiers of state schools though. For instance, I've got a lot of family in Pennsylvania and, from what I'm told, not just anyone gets a "Welcome to Happy Valley" letter in the Quaker State.

Penn State is the at the top of the Pennsylvania state school food chain. It wants the best students it can find. UC-Berkeley is the same sort of deal. UVA rules the roost in Virginia. I went to grad school at a second-tier state school there (James Madison). It was still a fine institution and I got a good education, but UVA's the prestige institution.

It sounds like UC's been marching up the food chain for a few decades, that it wants to be regarded as being among the better public institutions. IMO, there's nothing wrong with that. Someone has to be that school and over the course of time it will be a huge asset to the city if it can fill that role.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but UC never was a community college, was it? It's always been selective about who it admits, right? If so, then it's just a matter of UC finding its place in the larger college education mix. UC's not going to be the right spot for everyone and it shouldn't try to be.

And again, the standards that have been mentioned in this thread are not particularly high standards. If I had a 1000 SAT and ranked in the 75th percentile of my graduating class, there's little chance I'd have been accepted to my main state school.

I hear what you're saying, and I don't necessarily disagree. But having grown up in Cincinnati, UC has just always been a college that people who live here end up at. I know it has some really great schools within it's campus, but in general it's just ... well ... UC. Does that make sense? It's never been a community college, no. But it is a huge commuter college. Lots of kids from around here end up going to UC.

I don't know if it's always been selective about who it admits. I don't know anyone personally who has ever been rejected by UC, but that obviously doesn't mean the school doesn't turn people away.

I guess I've just never viewed UC as a bad school in the first place. I've never thought of it as a school that has low standards. I've thought of it like I think of most state schools -- somewhat reasonably priced, somewhat easy to get into, and a place you can get a good education. So maybe I just don't understand this push to make it more "academic," because I haven't ever really thought it wasn't academic in the first place. I considered going there, but decided I wanted to go away for college.

Overall, I guess I just worry that a lot of public universities are getting more selective, and certainly more expensive, and I don't know where it will stop. College is already hard to pay for, for most people, and when you couple the costs with rising admission standards ... well, I just hope there are still some good schools out there that remain reasonable 10 years from now.

paintmered
08-26-2005, 04:25 PM
There's tiers of state schools though. For instance, I've got a lot of family in Pennsylvania and, from what I'm told, not just anyone gets a "Welcome to Happy Valley" letter in the Quaker State.

Penn State is the at the top of the Pennsylvania state school food chain. It wants the best students it can find. UC-Berkeley is the same sort of deal. UVA rules the roost in Virginia. I went to grad school at a second-tier state school there (James Madison). It was still a fine institution and I got a good education, but UVA's the prestige institution.

It sounds like UC's been marching up the food chain for a few decades, that it wants to be regarded as being among the better public institutions. IMO, there's nothing wrong with that. Someone has to be that school and over the course of time it will be a huge asset to the city if it can fill that role.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but UC never was a community college, was it? It's always been selective about who it admits, right? If so, then it's just a matter of UC finding its place in the larger college education mix. UC's not going to be the right spot for everyone and it shouldn't try to be.

And again, the standards that have been mentioned in this thread are not particularly high standards. If I had a 1000 SAT and ranked in the 75th percentile of my graduating class, there's little chance I'd have been accepted to my main state school.


Well you have to understand that many of the colleges at UC have individual academic standards. There's some programs that a 4.0, 30+ ACT won't guarentee you acceptance (i.e. architecture).

Also, UC has direct admissions to all their programs and while their admissions standards might not be as high as comperable programs around the country, the retention rate is much lower. I swear the college of engineering's philosophy is "bring as many as we can in, weed as many as we can out".

But to answer your question about the community college M2, I don't think UC has ever been selective when it comes to admissions on the university-wide scale. If you weren't directly admitted into one of the colleges, you went to University College (similar to a community college atmosphere) but the graduation rate for UCollege students was abysmal so they did away with it a few years ago. But as far as I know, it has never been a community college.

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 04:31 PM
Bob Goin supports Bob Huggins
Posted By: Keith Wedinger
August 26, 2005
The following article comes from an athletic department employee who wanted to remain anonymous.

What nobody has caught on in this whole thing is that Bob Goin has resigned as athletic director because of this. He said it the other night at the football event and then repeated it to the athletic department staff shortly after that.

Bob had intended to retire at the end of next June, which would have allowed him not only to go through the first season in the Big East but also move into the new offices in Varsity Village. It would have been the culmination of two of Bob's biggest accomplishments.

Instead, Bob has asked the president to speed up the search to find his replacement so that this person is in place by the end of the year. He has also told the athletic department staff that if the media continues to paint him as the bad guy in this that he will leave sooner.

What people don't understand about Bob Goin is that he is very old school. As athletic director, he respects the people he works for -- the president and Board of Trustees -- and is obligated to do what they want.

I guarantee you that he was dying on the inside when he was sitting at that press conference the other night. There is nobody -- NOBODY -- that Bob Goin would fight harder for than Bob Huggins and to see him go down like this absolutely killed him. That is why he asked that they find his replacement sooner (it also would have been out of character for Bob to resign effective immediately -- he doesn't do things like that).

Nobody fought harder for Bob Huggins in this matter than Bob Goin. Unfortunately, the decisions were made well above Goin's head and he could do nothing about it.

When Huggins was picked up for the DUI, it was Goin who put himself on the line to keep him on the job. It was Goin who pissed off Zimpher by being too nice at the Saturday morning press conference, forcing Zimpher to later clarify the terms of Huggins' suspension (remember, they took away his car, cell phone, etc. and forbid him to talk to any UC employee -- that was all Zimpher).

Goin almost got fired for that stunt. Zimpher wasn't going to let Goin get away with anything again.

Bearcat fans can thank Bob Goin for the last eight years (or at least most of that time) of Bob Huggins at UC. For those who don't remember, when Goin came on board in 1997, the athletic department was in complete dissarray following the Gerald O'Dell debacle, the basketball program was headed towards probation because of infractions that were mostly made up (or at least greatly inflated) and Huggins had one foot out the door.

Goin's relationship with Huggins kept him here and Huggins responded to Goin's leadership positively. Goin is responsible for pushing Huggins to make changes within the program, doing so in a such a manner to make Huggins look good, even when something bad happened.

Do you want to know why the graduation rate has improved? Bob Goin

Do you want to know why the players who have stepped out of line the last few years have been disciplined? Bob Goin

Do you know why Huggins didn't leave for the NBA or West Virginia? Bob Goin

Do you want to know why UC is now in the Big East? Bob Goin

Do you want to know why UC is on the verge of having athletic facilities that compare to any other school in the country? Bob Goin

I personally mourn the early departure of Bob Goin because it will be a loss that will be impossible for UC to overcome. UC can find another skilled coach like Huggins to take over the reigns of the basketball program because Huggs has brought it to a level that made it a very desired position.

Where is UC going to find an administrator with the experience, skill and ability that Goin has? There aren't many people out there now. Most AD's are the slick marketing type who shake your hand with their right hand and stick a knife in your back with the left. It won't be pretty.

When Bob Goin came to UC, nobody wanted the position. Bad football, hot-head basketball coach, bad facilities, under-funded program and a bad president (well, now Steger didn't look that bad). UC only got Bob Goin because he had made a mistake (which he was later cleared of) and he needed a job.

By the way, for those of you out there who are taking the shots about Goin accepting the free roof from the contractor who did work at FSU, please understand this. Goin's wife, Nancy, bid the roof job out and took the lowest price. Bob had nothing to do with it, until he found out that there might be an ethics problem. Who turned the possible violation in? It was Goin. FSU then jumped to get rid of him (mostly because of the Foot Locker fiasco), not waiting to see what the outcome of the ethics hearing would be (again, he was later cleared).

The loss of Bob Huggins is understandably very hard for Bearcat fans to accept. What they don't understand is that the loss of Bob Goin is going to be even worse.




From bearcatnews.com

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 04:38 PM
A player's perspective:

A Cold Day In August
Posted By: Alex Meacham
alex@bearcatnews.com
August 23, 2005
It was a cold December night, 1987. My father Bob and I are walking up to the Cincinnati Gardens. UC is playing Virginia Tech. Bimbo Coles was VT's star and they had a very good team that season. My father and I were two of 1,368 fans in the stands.

It was a cold December night, 1992. My father Bob and I are walking up to The Shoemaker Center. UC is playing Memphis State. Penny Hardaway was Memphis State's star and they had a very good team that season. My father and I were two of 13,176 fans in the stands.

There is one difference between that 1987 and 1992 game. . .BOB HUGGINS! He pumped life into the basketball program, the University and this city.

Dr. Zimpher stated at Tuesday's press conference that UC|21 is underway. The whole University is being asked to raise the bar. The wonderful thing that Zimpher is trying to do with the University, Huggins had already done.

In 1989, Huggins took over a program that was down and out. By 1992 he had the team headed to the Final Four. He had raised the bar so that you can say the term "UC|21".

The board chairman reportedly has a DUI on his record and is apparently being investigated for tax fraud. Let's raise the bar for our Board of Trustees!

Jason Maxiell has turned out to be one of the finest young men and basketball players this University has ever produced. Under some of the new UC|21 guidelines Maxiell wouldn't be allowed to wear a basketball uniform. He is now a proud graduate, good citizen and employee of the NBA.

Eric Hicks came to UC rough around the edges. The President and the Board do not see Hicks as a good representative of the University. But yet this summer he represented our country as a member of the Olympic basketball team.

Every company, business or institution must have a leader with a vision. Dr. Zimpher has a vision. The problem is, it is the wrong one for this university's athletic department. Dr. Zimpher, Bob Goin and the Board of Trustee's have destroyed a family.

It was a cold December night 1999. This time I was walking into the Shoemaker Center by
myself. I was no longer one of 13,176 in the stands. I was one of twelve players on the bench.

Coach Huggins gave me a chance to be a walk-on player. This lead me to write a book on my experience playing for the Bearcats. That experience then lead me to start a non-profit organization working with kids, teaching them the game of life through basketball.

Thank you Coach Huggins for all that you have done for me and the city of Cincinnati.

I never thought there would be a cold day in August. But, today the face of UC basketball has been changed forever.

Alex Meacham
Former Walk-On 1997-2000
Author "Walk Of A Lifetime"
Co President, Shining Star Sports


From bearcatnews.com

Reds4Life
08-26-2005, 04:42 PM
If Goin was leaving anyway, he should have stepped up to the plate and voiced his disapproval for Princess Nancy's decision. He wouldn't have been the lone man standing, I bet others would have rallied around him, including students and alumni. He sold Huggs down the river to the wicked witch of Clifton.

Goin did a lot for UC no doubt, but when his program needed his help the most, he failed.

paintmered
08-26-2005, 04:44 PM
wicked witch of Clifton.

I prefer "Dictator of Clifton".

:D

Reds4Life
08-26-2005, 04:49 PM
Did you see the list of coaches being floated around? Ugh, it's horrible. Frickin' Pete Gillen and Fran Dunphy are on the list. :bang:

Word is Bob Knight would like to return to the midwest. His players have a very high graduation rate, and he's a proven winner. Plus..................then we can sell tickets to the Knight v. Zimpher cage match. I can see The General beating Nancy with her own broomstick. :evil:

Chip R
08-26-2005, 04:57 PM
If Goin was leaving anyway, he should have stepped up to the plate and voiced his disapproval for Princess Nancy's decision. He wouldn't have been the lone man standing, I bet others would have rallied around him, including students and alumni. He sold Huggs down the river to the wicked witch of Clifton.

Goin did a lot for UC no doubt, but when his program needed his help the most, he failed.

And he would have probably got fired too. Not a smart move for a guy of Goin's age to do that. I believe that he wanted Huggins and was against this sacking. But I bet Huggins would have told him not to quit. God knows who she would have got to replace Goin.

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 04:59 PM
It just came down. Goin is stepping down as of Jan 1st and will take another job in the University for the remaining 6 months of his tenure

Matt700wlw
08-26-2005, 04:59 PM
And he would have probably got fired too. Not a smart move for a guy of Goin's age to do that. I believe that he wanted Huggins and was against this sacking. But I bet Huggins would have told him not to quit. God knows who she would have got to replace Goin.

He better be a Prince. Oh wait, her people don't have to be...nevermind

Reds4Life
08-26-2005, 05:23 PM
I like Andy Kennedy, but he's getting the same screw job Huggins did. Think about it, how can he recruit with a 1 year deal? He can't. I doubt he'll even be able to do some nice damage control given his limited time here. Nancy didn't even bother to show up for his introduction today, even though she was in town. Pretty low class and petty IMO.

If Andy wins in the Big East, and since he's a former Huggins assistant, he'll likely have fan support. Is Zimpher going to put us through this AGAIN and fire a popular coach? Honestly, I think he's the best we can get. I know peope are floating some big names out there (Prosser, Knight, etc) but why on earth would these guys come here? Big time coaches aren't going to put up with Nancy involving herself in the program on a constant basis. Coaches want to WIN, and if she's going to handcuff this program to the point where it's going to be the doormat of the Big East she can forget about getting anyone worth a damn. I think Mick Cronin would be a great choice, excellent recruiter, knows the system well and would have fan support. But, given his connections to Bob I doubt he'd pass the white glove test. :(