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View Full Version : What's the wait on Wade Miller?



CincyFan
12-29-2005, 04:38 PM
We all know he is a DanO type of player. He can be signed for incentive laiden contract. He has above average stuff when healthy. DanO tried to make a push for him last season, but came up short. Why not take a chance on Miller? Any comments? I vote for miller unless a trade is in the works- he would be a top-tier pitcher in the rotation.

Another Big trend that I hope changes this year is the ability to bunt and sacrifice that crucial man on first- instead of always trying to hit one out of the park. I would be interested in seeing a stat on how bad the reds did in 2005 in getting players over to second on a sacrifice.

Thank You
CincyFan

SanDiegoRed
12-29-2005, 04:46 PM
Wade Miller when healthy would appear to be a top of the rotation kind of starter. I think the Reds should take a flyer on him also...

M2
12-29-2005, 04:48 PM
I don't think he is a DanO type of player. DanO seems to like guys with double-digit wins. Miller's last two seasons have been 4-4 and 7-7.

The Reds were 43/63 on sac attempts in 2005, not a good ratio, but they did lead the league in scoring, which is a better indicator of how they did in those "crucial man of first" situations.

CincyFan
12-29-2005, 04:52 PM
danO is the one that signed Miller to Houston Right?

BEETTLEBUG
12-29-2005, 04:52 PM
I agree with you about Wade Miller take a flyer on him, HURRY"

CincyFan
12-29-2005, 04:53 PM
M2 who do you see the reds going after?

CincyFan
12-29-2005, 04:56 PM
Signing him for 1.5mil would be an absolute steal in my opinion

danforsman
12-29-2005, 04:59 PM
Miller's stuff is above-average when healthy. He misses bats or saws them off when he's pitching well.

M2
12-29-2005, 05:02 PM
M2 who do you see the reds going after?

DanO's expressed a zeal for GB ratio of late, so I figure that's the guiding principle at the moment. Who that entails I don't know. It's starting to look like the Reds aren't going that hard after any pitcher, which might be a good thing in that it beats going hard after a bad pitcher.

I'd love to see the Reds sign Miller. I agree he could wind up being a steal, ace of the rotation in 2007 or 2008 even, but DanO seems to think that if you add pitching wins from the previous season it equates to total wins in the coming season. Miller just doesn't seem like the kind of risk he'd take.

paulrichjr
12-29-2005, 05:04 PM
Wade Miller has had a fairly major surgery and probably won't pitch much until at least May and then isn't expected to be fully recovered until 2007. (Labrum I believe)

Secondly a teammate of his told me last offseason that Mr Miller's work ethic was horrible and that his lack of physical fitness frustrates coaches.


These might be a couple of reasons why DanO (who DOES know Miller) hasn't gone after him. Personally, I would sign him to a 2 year contract with a base this year + incentives and a higher one next.

RedLegSuperStar
12-29-2005, 05:12 PM
Signing him for 1.5mil would be an absolute steal in my opinion

And With Him Coming Off Of A Shabby Season And An Injury That Would Be Just About Right.. Maybe Add Some Incentives To Where He Could Make Up To 5 Mil And Bam.. Watch Him Go Out There And Grind!

wheels
12-29-2005, 11:00 PM
I've heard conflicting things about Wade Miller's injury.

Ranging from ultra serious, to not as serious as it sounds.

Either way, make a play for the guy and see where it gets you. This is a move just begging to be made.

CincyFan
12-29-2005, 11:07 PM
all good points thank you for commenting. I believe signing miller would ultimately get the ball rolling in the pitching dept. Hopefully if they are interested, that they will continue to seek out that #1 starter.

CincyFan
12-29-2005, 11:10 PM
anyone see them getting weaver instead of Miller?

wheels
12-29-2005, 11:12 PM
anyone see them getting weaver instead of Miller?

Let's hope not.

Weaver would be clubbed senseless at GAB.

RedLegSuperStar
12-30-2005, 04:31 AM
I've heard conflicting things about Wade Miller's injury.

Ranging from ultra serious, to not as serious as it sounds.

Either way, make a play for the guy and see where it gets you. This is a move just begging to be made.

Well then maybe sign him to a 2 year deal for say 4 million with so incentives.. and handle it much like the cubs did with ryan dempster

RedsBaron
12-30-2005, 07:01 AM
Let's hope not.

Weaver would be clubbed senseless at GAB.
Sounds like DanO's kind of guy.:bang:

GoReds
12-30-2005, 08:02 AM
DanO's expressed a zeal for GB ratio of late, so I figure that's the guiding principle at the moment. Who that entails I don't know. It's starting to look like the Reds aren't going that hard after any pitcher, which might be a good thing in that it beats going hard after a bad pitcher.

I'd love to see the Reds sign Miller. I agree he could wind up being a steal, ace of the rotation in 2007 or 2008 even, but DanO seems to think that if you add pitching wins from the previous season it equates to total wins in the coming season. Miller just doesn't seem like the kind of risk he'd take.

I'm not sure what sort of pitcher DanO is looking. At first blush, it's all about the wins, but he signed Ortiz last year after a previous season of 5-7 4.43.

I think the name and reputation means more to DanO than anything else.

blumj
12-30-2005, 09:34 AM
I guess everyone's waiting for him to be able to throw again before they do anything, which I think I heard he could start next month.

tts1stros
12-30-2005, 01:57 PM
No no no no no. You do not want Wade Miller.

There's not even a chance he'll become the 01-02 pitcher he was with Houston.

Wade Miller tore his labrum, which is pretty much impossible to ever recover from. For comparison, Carlos Hernandez - another promising Astros pitcher - tore his labrum. After massive surgery and rehab, his high 90s fastball currently runs about 80, and his wicked curveball vanished. That was over 3 years ago. We just gave him his release.

There's a great article on Slate (http://www.slate.com/id/2100895) entitled "Labrum, It Nearly Killed Him: Why the torn labrum is baseball's most fearsome injury". It's actually a really interesting read, but this part pretty much summarizes the whole thing:

But if pitchers with torn labrums were horses, they'd be destroyed. Of the 36 major-league hurlers diagnosed with labrum tears in the last five years, only midlevel reliever Rocky Biddle has returned to his previous level. Think about that when your favorite pitcher comes down with labrum trouble: He has a 3 percent chance of becoming Rocky Biddle. More likely, he'll turn into Mike Harkey, Robert Person, or Jim Parque, pitchers who lost stamina and velocity—and a major-league career—when their labrums began to fray.

The Astros knew what they were doing when they didn't tender him a contract. The Red Sox couldn't believe their fortune when they got him for only $1.5 million (after all, this guy used to be great!). Now they realize it was a bad move: this year it was their turn not to tender him a contract.

It's a sad story for sure (I loved Wade Miller), but stay far far away from him.

paulrichjr
12-30-2005, 02:19 PM
No no no no no. You do not want Wade Miller.

Wade Miller tore his labrum, which is pretty much impossible to ever recover from. For comparison, Carlos Hernandez - another promising Astros pitcher - tore his labrum. After massive surgery and rehab, his high 90s fastball currently runs about 80, and his wicked curveball vanished. That was over 3 years ago. We just gave him his release.

There's a great article on Slate (http://www.slate.com/id/2100895) entitled "Labrum, It Nearly Killed Him: Why the torn labrum is baseball's most fearsome injury". It's actually a really interesting read, but this part pretty much summarizes the whole thing:



Makes you realize why our 2 labrum guys (Gardner, Pauly) didn't get picked up in the "left off of the 40" draft...

How can a team that is so bad at developing pitching have probably its best 2 pitching prospects go down with the dreaded labrum tear in the same season? We are snake bit.

Redmachine2003
12-30-2005, 02:37 PM
When was the last time we had a top pitching prospect not have arm or shoulder surgery? I think the Reds do to much tinkering with mechanics down in the minors. IMO you spend all your life throwing a certain way, you build up strength in certain muscles and tendons to have this motion. Now you get drafted by the Reds and they have you throw at a different angle or motion with out rebuilding the strength and balance for this new motion and you go out and try to throw 90 plus mph pitch instead throwing about 50% and slowly working your way back up to that 100%, your going to tear some thing.

StillFunkyB
12-30-2005, 05:01 PM
Someone go buy a bunch of Wade Miller baseball cards and mail them to DanO's office.

Unassisted
12-30-2005, 05:19 PM
Someone go buy a bunch of Wade Miller baseball cards and mail them to DanO's office.Did you read the 3 posts above your post? Miller might as well be wearing a "Do Not Touch" shirt.

Red Heeler
12-31-2005, 09:41 AM
$1 million spent on Wade Miller has a better chance of helping the Reds than does the $1 million that they will spend on Womack. However, I would sign him with the sole intent of dealing him at the trade deadline no matter how well he pitches.

StillFunkyB
12-31-2005, 11:11 AM
Did you read the 3 posts above your post? Miller might as well be wearing a "Do Not Touch" shirt.

No, I didn't. I retract my previous statement.

Nugget
01-02-2006, 06:10 PM
$1 million spent on Wade Miller has a better chance of helping the Reds than does the $1 million that they will spend on Womack. However, I would sign him with the sole intent of dealing him at the trade deadline no matter how well he pitches.

Actually it wouldn't because as Miller can't pitch until May at the earliest and history would show that if he was able to pitch he is not the Wade Miller that everyone is thinking of. Womack fills a position that the REDS struggled with last season. As much as I like Freel he is not an everyday 2B.

blumj
01-02-2006, 06:39 PM
I don't think anyone should sign Miller until they've at least seen him throw, and it's possible that he wouldn't sign anywhere without at least getting to the point where he can. If he throws for a few teams once he's capable of it, someone might make him a better offer.

Red Heeler
01-02-2006, 09:46 PM
Actually it wouldn't because as Miller can't pitch until May at the earliest and history would show that if he was able to pitch he is not the Wade Miller that everyone is thinking of. Womack fills a position that the REDS struggled with last season. As much as I like Freel he is not an everyday 2B.

The Reds will struggle with 2B again this year if Tony Womack sees significant time there. He was a complete offensive black hole in all but one of his major league seasons.

I agree that Wade Miller is likely to be done. However, he was good not too long ago.