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View Full Version : O'Brien fired, Kullman interm GM announcement at 5pm



macro
01-23-2006, 02:39 PM
Bill Cunningham says it's coming in from Fox Sports

RBA
01-23-2006, 02:40 PM
Whoa

vaticanplum
01-23-2006, 02:40 PM
Sweet Jesus

Please someone come dance with me

BCubb2003
01-23-2006, 02:41 PM
Well scratch my predictions for this season.

RBA
01-23-2006, 02:42 PM
Hey, MOD, you should give your own post a "sticky".

Aronchis
01-23-2006, 02:44 PM
All those threads and DanO/Cast.........though everything Cast said and did pointed to a quick termination of DanO.

Now I bet Dunn is traded the day before opening day.............;)

RFS62
01-23-2006, 02:44 PM
*ahem*

Where's MWM?

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 02:45 PM
This just made my week.




Seriously.

westofyou
01-23-2006, 02:46 PM
It's the polite way to take control, don't step on broken backs or hoist cut off heads.

Very Cincinnati, very nice.

Matt700wlw
01-23-2006, 02:47 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5271952?

Here's where we saw it

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 02:47 PM
Reds officials are refusing to comment on this at this time, so it remains a rumor for now.

RFS62
01-23-2006, 02:48 PM
Reds officials are refusing to comment on this at this time, so it remains a rumor for now.



They wouldn't refuse to comment if it was false!!!

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 02:49 PM
They wouldn't refuse to comment if it was false!!!

Yes, but until it's official anything can happen.

savafan
01-23-2006, 02:51 PM
Now it feels like Christmas!

RFS62
01-23-2006, 02:52 PM
Jack Bauer WISHES he was as tough as Castellini!!!!!!!

beb30
01-23-2006, 02:52 PM
The Cincinnati Reds' new owner continues to put his stamp on the team.

FOXSports.com has learned that Bob Castellini has fired general manager Dan O'Brien.
An announcement is set for Monday afternoon.

Friday, in his first day running baseball's oldest professional franchise, Castellini, a produce magnate, reorganized the front office and promised fans a championship.

Castellini's first move was to change the front office's structure. Chief operating officer John Allen will stay but will focus on the business side of the ballclub. O'Brien's replacement will run the baseball side, reporting directly to Castellini.

Heath
01-23-2006, 02:55 PM
I'm speechless.

Poor McClain. He's getting married. And he wasted $25 at GoDaddy.com ;)

Wow.

Who's next, Narron?

kaldaniels
01-23-2006, 02:56 PM
Could Sweet Lou be coming in as GM???

Aronchis
01-23-2006, 02:56 PM
I'm speechless.

Poor McClain. He's getting married. And he wasted $25 at GoDaddy.com ;)

Wow.

Who's next, Narron?

Na, Narron will nursemaid the Reds this year. Cast wanted Pinella to manage, but Lou wants to take a year off.

Also remember Cast praised Narron like Allen, that is a signal IMO. That DanO didn't get a kind word in that Presser, it was the writing on the wall.

Yachtzee
01-23-2006, 02:57 PM
Where were you when Dan O'Brien was fired?

bengalsown
01-23-2006, 03:00 PM
Where were you when Dan O'Brien was fired?

Sitting at my boring desk, doing my boring job.

It definitely brightened my day though :thumbup:

RFS62
01-23-2006, 03:01 PM
Kullman interim GM, 5:00 news conference, per wlw

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 03:02 PM
Kullman is the interm GM, per Seg on WLW.

It's confirmed, Obie gone.

Joseph
01-23-2006, 03:02 PM
OMG!

I never felt so happy about something so bad for someone else. :)

macro
01-23-2006, 03:02 PM
Didn't they say there would be a press conference at 5:00pm?

Falls City Beer
01-23-2006, 03:02 PM
Go Brad Go.

Again.

kaldaniels
01-23-2006, 03:04 PM
Anyone else having trouble picking up the webstream of the Big One???

Red Leader
01-23-2006, 03:04 PM
*ahem*

Where's MWM?

My guess is that he's working....trying to make a couple bucks to afford your steak dinner.

BCubb2003
01-23-2006, 03:04 PM
How soon before RedsZone crashes?

NC Reds
01-23-2006, 03:06 PM
I'm torn on this. I was not a fan of DanO because of some questionable FA signings, but he at least showed a high level of interest in developing a farm system. I was interested to see what the 2006 draft would look like.

Of course, if a good replacement is hired, this will work out nicely. First order of business, sign Dunn to LTC.

kaldaniels
01-23-2006, 03:07 PM
Do you all realize the consequences of this firing...expect an all out bidding war between the Red Sox and Yankees for now free-agent GM O'Brien!!! ;)

WVRed
01-23-2006, 03:08 PM
Per Rotoworld-


FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal is reporting that the Reds have fired general manager Dan O'Brien.
New owner Bob Castellini restructured the front office upon gaining control of the team last week. No word yet what happened between then and now that resulted in O'Brien's dismissal. It might be for the best. O'Brien wasn't as bad as many Reds fans believe, but he certainly wasn't an above average GM during his tenure. The Sean Casey trade -- actually one of his better moves -- had to be the final straw for some, especially since it didn't result in any free agent additions. If Castellini wants to energize the fan base, some sort of change was needed.

Falls City Beer
01-23-2006, 03:09 PM
Of course, if a good replacement is hired, this will work out nicely. First order of business, sign Dunn to LTC.

Order of business #1A: release Milton or trade him to Seattle + $8 million. Order of business #1B: lay the groundwork for Griffey deadline trade.
Order of business #2: sign two free agent pitchers next offseason for an immediate jolt to the team's fortunes so that other players will stick around.

WVRedsFan
01-23-2006, 03:12 PM
Well, some folks were right.

I knew DanO wouldn't last long, but this is a bonus.

For those who were disappointed on Friday, this should perk you up.

It did me (I was disappointed big time).

vaticanplum
01-23-2006, 03:13 PM
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060123&content_id=1299463&vkey=pr_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

I am delirious.

Boss-Hog
01-23-2006, 03:15 PM
Fabulous news...now let's hope the organization makes another smart move and hires the right person for the job this time around.

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 03:15 PM
Fay thinks Kullman will be interm until the end of the 2006 season.

WVRedsFan
01-23-2006, 03:17 PM
I have to wonder if something that was done in the last 72 hours got this ball rolling or if it was the plan all along?

Seems funny to appoint someone to new powers and then fire him on the next business day.

westofyou
01-23-2006, 03:19 PM
I have to wonder if something that was done in the last 72 hours got this ball rolling or if it was the plan all along?

Seems funny to appoint someone to new powers and then fire him on the next business day.He didn't appoint he stripped the layer away between them.

RFS62
01-23-2006, 03:20 PM
He didn't appoint he stripped the layer away between them.


Exactly. So he got to tell him instead of Allen.

WVRedsFan
01-23-2006, 03:20 PM
He didn't appoint he stripped the layer away between them.

True, but it seems strange that it was done this way.

WVRedsFan
01-23-2006, 03:21 PM
Exactly. So he got to tell him instead of Allen.

Now, it makes sense. Thanks, RFS!

I'm beaming.

SunDeck
01-23-2006, 03:22 PM
I have to wonder if something that was done in the last 72 hours got this ball rolling or if it was the plan all along?



Um...I couldn't care less. ;)

ED44
01-23-2006, 03:23 PM
Wow...this is GREAT news to read about after a VERY long Monday at the office.

RedsFan74
01-23-2006, 03:26 PM
Kinda makes you wonder "what coulda been" this offseason had the owners not dragged their feet and gotten around to approving the sale earlier. With someone other than O'Brien in place, one wonders what direction this team may have taken this offseason.

WVRed
01-23-2006, 03:34 PM
In the event Redszone goes down-

http://lastperson.suncircle.org/index.php/board,5.0.html

vaticanplum
01-23-2006, 03:40 PM
Up at the Enquirer now:

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060123/SPT04/301230016

The unfortunate picture they have of O'Brien on the front page makes him look very like the Cheshire cat.

MartyFan
01-23-2006, 03:40 PM
I thought DanO would be around for the contract...WOW!

Boss-Hog
01-23-2006, 03:41 PM
RedsZone shouldn't be going down...the server is in good hands (*knock on wood*)

MartyFan
01-23-2006, 03:44 PM
I have to wonder if something that was done in the last 72 hours got this ball rolling or if it was the plan all along?

Seems funny to appoint someone to new powers and then fire him on the next business day.

WV: I thought the same thing...wondering if there was a deal for a Dunn or Junior on the table that Dano wouldn't pull the trigger on...maybe it was on Rich or Womack?

RFS62
01-23-2006, 03:45 PM
RedsZone shouldn't be going down...the server is in good hands (*knock on wood*)


This should be a good test.

Oh happy day!!!!

Heath
01-23-2006, 03:49 PM
Sweet Jesus

Please someone come dance with me

I step on peoples feet. I'm too tall and lanky.....

I'm the only man in America who has a designated dancer....:D

BTW - Did DanO get fired? Is it real? Are we in Kansas anymore?

Heath
01-23-2006, 03:51 PM
This should be a good test.

Oh happy day!!!!


233 as of 3:52pm on Monday....

shredda2000
01-23-2006, 04:03 PM
Things are sure lookin' up :thumbup:

That's the only way they can go, right?

iaredsfan
01-23-2006, 04:05 PM
This has to be the best news of the off-season. I can't believe how inept O'Brien was, is, and always will be.

kbrake
01-23-2006, 04:09 PM
what a glorious thing to see after an exam. This just made my frickin year.

Strikes Out Looking
01-23-2006, 04:14 PM
The rumor is that DanO will be invited to Spring Training to compete for the second base job. It seems many left in the organization think he may actually be a better fit at 2b than either Aurilia or Womack.

Actually, I'm thrilled. My guess is his inability to get any pitching over the offseason (or last trading deadline) was his undoing.

MikeS21
01-23-2006, 04:19 PM
Dear Dan O'Brien - Three words: Monster dot Com

westofyou
01-23-2006, 04:20 PM
Dear Dan O'Brien - Three words: Monster dot Com
Two More

Avoid Ford

TStuck
01-23-2006, 04:21 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2303211

OMG - does anyone have some toilet paper? I just wet myself in the excitement! :D

Talk about making a splash!

Crap - just realized now I have to come up with a new friggin tag line :bang:

Reds Fanatic
01-23-2006, 04:23 PM
What great news. I was having a bad day at work and this has just made my day. Here is the article from Ken Rosenthal about the change and possible replacements.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5271952


Wasting no time initiating his overhaul of the Reds, new owner Robert Castellini has fired general manager Dan O'Brien, FOXSports.com has learned.

Castellini, who was approved as the team's owner by Major League Baseball only last Thursday, is expected to begin a search for a new GM immediately.
Brad Kullman, the Reds' director of major-league operations, will serve as interim GM

O'Brien's replacement will report directly to Castellini instead of chief operating officer John Allen, who has been removed from baseball operations and now will head only the business side.

The possible replacements for O'Brien include:


Former Orioles GM Jim Beattie, the favored candidate of Red Sox president Larry Lucchino — a close friend of Castellini's — during the Sox's recent GM search.

Twins assistant GM Wayne Krivsky, who was the runner-up to O'Brien when the Reds last made a change in Oct. 2003.

Braves assistant GM Frank Wren, who was the Orioles' GM in 1999.

Kullman, a leading internal candidate along with the Reds' director of international scouting, Johnny Almaraz.
It is an unusual time of year to fire a GM, but O'Brien's replacement will get the chance to evaluate the team from the start of spring training.

The Reds have had five straight losing seasons, including the past two under O'Brien. The team raised its payroll from $45 million to $62 million last season, but most of O'Brien's acquisitions — most notably free-agent left-hander Eric Milton — proved busts.

Rival general managers complained of the difficulty in dealing with O'Brien, who operated in methodical fashion and sought organizational consensus before making major moves.

MikeS21
01-23-2006, 04:25 PM
Someone clarify something. Brad Kullman is the one guy in the front office who pays attention to sabermetrics. Is this true?

Could this be a sign of the direction Castellini wants to go? (Paul DePodesta anyone?)

westofyou
01-23-2006, 04:26 PM
Someone clarify something. Brad Kullman is the one guy in the front office who pays attention to sabermetrics. Is this true?

Could this be a sign of the direction Castellini wants to go? (Paul DePodesta anyone?)
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1699
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1701

RedLegSuperStar
01-23-2006, 04:26 PM
I was scared they were going to keep dan o around for the season.. thank god someone woke up and started making good moves!

Caveman Techie
01-23-2006, 04:29 PM
Dear Mr. Castellini,

Thank You, for your gift earlier today. I found the timing to be odd, however I'm not going to complain. If it wouldn't be to presumptious of me could I impose one more request on you? Please call Paul Depodesta at your earliest convenience to inquire whether or not he would like to become a hero in Cincinnati.

Again, thank you so much for the gift I nearly cried when I found out about it.

Sincerly,

A Reds fan

MikeS21
01-23-2006, 04:37 PM
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1699
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1701
Thanks, woy. Those articles look good. This is VERY encouraging.

Team Clark
01-23-2006, 04:39 PM
Thank you... thank you... thank you. Now I will not have to be embarassed any longer. LOL! Thank you Mr. Castellini. Cahones the size of watermelons... bring it on.

MikeS21
01-23-2006, 04:44 PM
Thank you... thank you... thank you. Now I will not have to be embarassed any longer. LOL! Thank you Mr. Castellini. Cahones the size of watermelons... bring it on.
Hey TC, you mentioned Kullman as a GM possibility a couple years ago. Also, I seem to recall a Baseball America write-up that mentioned Kullman as an up-an-coming executive. Based on your converstaions with baseball people, what does he bring to the table? Could he be the answer Cincy fans are looking for, or should Castellini go ahead with a Krivsty or DePodesta?

Raisor
01-23-2006, 05:04 PM
DePo! DePo!

Heath
01-23-2006, 05:04 PM
Thank you... thank you... thank you. Now I will not have to be embarassed any longer. LOL! Thank you Mr. Castellini. Cahones the size of watermelons... bring it on.

NOW, will you apply for a job in Cincinnati???? :D

BTW - Nice deal for Baez. Wearing the DRay cap well.

Reds4Life
01-23-2006, 05:14 PM
DePo! DePo!

Cast says there is a need for Sabr and they have budgeted for it.

MWM
01-23-2006, 05:17 PM
*ahem*

Where's MWM?

This will be the mostenjoyable bet I ever have to pay off. You like Ponderosa?

RFS62
01-23-2006, 05:23 PM
This will be the mostenjoyable bet I ever have to pay off. You like Ponderosa?


I wouldn't take my dog to Ponderosa.

I believe you mentioned Ruth's Chris the other day when you were heckling me.

I wonder if they have any of this stuff there?

http://champagnegifts.com/id100052list283product.html

Little Alex
01-23-2006, 05:24 PM
very very very very good news.

Now if we can just find a GM that can play the "GM game" with the difficulty level set to "expert" (small market team) we will be set.

Doc. Scott
01-23-2006, 05:33 PM
very very very very good news.

Now if we can just find a GM that can play the "GM game" with the difficulty level set to "expert" (small market team) we will be set.

Out of the Park 2006 will be out soon enough. Surely $34.99 isn't out of the budget.

TeamBoone
01-23-2006, 05:35 PM
Where were you when Dan O'Brien was fired?

Ironically, cleaning the litter box. :p:

RFS62
01-23-2006, 05:36 PM
Ironically, cleaning the litter box. :p:


Wow, how fitting.

So was Castellini

smith288
01-23-2006, 05:40 PM
Ironically, cleaning the litter box. :p:
That is an insult to litterboxes everywhere.

Raisor
01-23-2006, 05:41 PM
DePO! DePO!

IowaRed
01-23-2006, 05:44 PM
I'm hardly ever in favor of a person losing their job but I must say that this made my day. Now, as with the Casey money, it's what you do with "it" that matters

Cigar2
01-23-2006, 05:46 PM
Good start, Let see else what Cast does for the future.

RFS62
01-23-2006, 05:48 PM
Kullman on wlw right now

MWM
01-23-2006, 05:49 PM
As much as I'd love to have DePo, he'd never survive in Cincinnati. It would take a couple of years to turn it around, and the good ole' boy media network would light him up worse than LA ever did. He'd be absolutely miserable.

Too bad this didn't happen in October before the off-season moves were made.

SteelSD
01-23-2006, 05:56 PM
As much as I'd love to have DePo, he'd never survive in Cincinnati. It would take a couple of years to turn it around, and the good ole' boy media network would light him up worse than LA ever did. He'd be absolutely miserable.

I dunno. If Depodesta is ever going to make a real name for himself as a GM, I think it's going to have to be with a team like Cincinnati. And I'm not sure that the Cinci media could possibly light him up near as badly as the LA flamethrowers did. I just don't think there's enough potential media volume to do it considering the market.

Raisor
01-23-2006, 05:59 PM
I dunno. If Depodesta is ever going to make a real name for himself as a GM, I think it's going to have to be with a team like Cincinnati. And I'm not sure that the Cinci media could possibly light him up near as badly as the LA flamethrowers did. I just don't think there's enough potential media volume to do it considering the market.


I want DePo just because it would cause Marty's head to explode.

Red Leader
01-23-2006, 06:00 PM
I want DePo just because it would cause Marty's head to explode.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

So true. That would be a battle of epic proportions.

Falls City Beer
01-23-2006, 06:00 PM
I dunno. If Depodesta is ever going to make a real name for himself as a GM, I think it's going to have to be with a team like Cincinnati. And I'm not sure that the Cinci media could possibly light him up near as badly as the LA flamethrowers did. I just don't think there's enough potential media volume to do it considering the market.

I agree. Cincinnati media is kittenish compared to LA--the media have clout in LA--they bound and gagged DePo and threw him in the trunk.

DePo would be a perfect fit--he'd be active (which the town would like), and he'd improve the team (which the town would like). Truth be told, Cincinnati in general has no idea who DePo is or what sabremetrics is, so I don't think that will be an issue either way.

RedsIn07
01-23-2006, 06:06 PM
Kullman on wlw right now
Anything said worth noting?

RFS62
01-23-2006, 06:09 PM
said he told Castellini he wanted to be considered for the job.

one thing slightly ominous, talking about a long term contract for Dunn. He said they definitely didn't want to go to arbitration, and wanted to settle before the hearing. But that it was difficult to spend a large amount of the budget on any one player, when talking about the long term possibility.

Maybe nothing to it, but he did say it.

Says he has the green light to make moves until new man is hired.

vaticanplum
01-23-2006, 06:16 PM
This article is cracking me up:

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/sports/AP-BBN-Reds-OBrien-Fired.html?n=Top%2fNews%2fSports%2fBaseball%2fMajo r%20League%2fCincinnati%20Reds

The two have different management styles, though it wasn't immediately clear whether that was a major factor in the decision. Castellini spoke passionately about his love for the game and his commitment to getting the franchise turned around fast. O'Brien is analytical and deliberate, preferring to study all sides of an issue before making a decision.

translation: Castellini wants the baseball team to win and may do crazy stuff to get there. Dan O'Brien doesn't know whether his shoes are on the right feet.

wheels
01-23-2006, 06:17 PM
Says he has the green light to make moves until new man is hired.

I wonder what deals are going through his head right now.

I would think a big splash type deal might be in order.

corkedbat
01-23-2006, 06:18 PM
I want DePo just because it would cause Marty's head to explode.

Which is OK, because the hair would contain the schrapnel, meaning no collateral damage.

BoydsOfSummer
01-23-2006, 06:27 PM
If Kullman 'kulls' Womack after his morning coffee tomorrow, it will change my whole belief system and I will be in church somewhere on sunday. Because that will prove there is a god.

Nugget
01-23-2006, 06:45 PM
Not saying its a bad move - after all Kullman did initiate the Harang trade.

However, if the REDS do go down the sabrmatics line I will have lost faith in baseball.

wheels
01-23-2006, 06:47 PM
Kullman can't be looking forward to cleaning up the mess DanO created with the infield.

The best he can do is relegate Aurilia and Womack to bench duty, and possibly DFA them when they get too snippy about it.

westofyou
01-23-2006, 06:48 PM
However, if the REDS do go down the sabrmatics line I will have lost faith in baseball.

You mean like they did when they had the BRM and led the world in K's and walks?

That sucked.

wheels
01-23-2006, 06:48 PM
Not saying its a bad move - after all Kullman did initiate the Harang trade.

However, if the REDS do go down the sabrmatics line I will have lost faith in baseball.

:wave:

Nice knowin' ya.:p:

Nugget
01-23-2006, 06:48 PM
As much as people here love him - Freel is not an everyday 2B as last year showed. The REDS would do better with either Womack or RA at 2B. Bergolla will be there next year if he shows the improvement that EE did in AAA this year.

Nugget
01-23-2006, 06:51 PM
You mean like they did when they had the BRM and led the world in K's and walks?

That sucked.

SABR is great for the fantasy baseballers out there but if you like baseball and all its intracacies that the NL still has then its more than just the stats. Oakland has been competitive but that has been because of their farm system. But isn't it peculiar that they haven't won a world series with five of the best starting pitchers out of the last five seasons. And when Depo had full control of LA they actually went backwards.

westofyou
01-23-2006, 06:54 PM
SABR is great for the fantasy baseballers out there but if you like baseball and all its intracacies that the NL still has then its more than just the stats. Oakland has been competitive but that has been because of their farm system. But isn't it peculiar that they haven't won a world series with five of the best starting pitchers out of the last five seasons. And when Depo had full control of LA they actually went backwards.

Sabr is a group that meets about baseball.

Sabermetrics is the study of numbers in baseball.

The rest isn't really germaine to the discussion, since I never said Baseball was all stats or that the A's were the blueprint for Sabermetrics.

harangatang
01-23-2006, 06:54 PM
SABR is great for the fantasy baseballers out there but if you like baseball and all its intracacies that the NL still has then its more than just the stats. Oakland has been competitive but that has been because of their farm system. But isn't it peculiar that they haven't won a world series with five of the best starting pitchers out of the last five seasons. And when Depo had full control of LA they actually went backwards.

Watch your step around here

Sean_CaseyRules
01-23-2006, 07:03 PM
And then all the Reds fans rejoiced.....................

pedro
01-23-2006, 07:04 PM
Not saying its a bad move - after all Kullman did initiate the Harang trade.

However, if the REDS do go down the sabrmatics line I will have lost faith in baseball.

If one more person rips sabermetrics without even being able to spell it I will lose faith in all humanity.

steig
01-23-2006, 07:27 PM
I'm drinking tonight to celebrate the end of the DanO era

savafan
01-23-2006, 07:34 PM
As I understand it, the Reds will be interviewing 8 GM candidates over the next 3 weeks.

NewEraReds
01-23-2006, 07:35 PM
This article is cracking me up:

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/sports/AP-BBN-Reds-OBrien-Fired.html?n=Top%2fNews%2fSports%2fBaseball%2fMajo r%20League%2fCincinnati%20Reds

The two have different management styles, though it wasn't immediately clear whether that was a major factor in the decision. Castellini spoke passionately about his love for the game and his commitment to getting the franchise turned around fast. O'Brien is analytical and deliberate, preferring to study all sides of an issue before making a decision.

translation: Castellini wants the baseball team to win and may do crazy stuff to get there. Dan O'Brien doesn't know whether his shoes are on the right feet.
which is exactly what people said wouldnt be what cast would be like. which is why they didnt want him. just carl junior. guess no huh.

as to the lt with dunn. i dont know. i do think cast wants shorts deals with all to allow the new gm to evaluate everyone and have the freedom and ability to shape the team next year

Nugget
01-23-2006, 07:36 PM
If one more person rips sabermetrics without even being able to spell it I will lose faith in all humanity.

Well there is one good thing about it - as long as you get the numbers right spelling doesn't make a difference.;)

MrCinatit
01-23-2006, 07:47 PM
i just saw a spot on CNN saying, traditionally, this is the worst day of the year.
i now officially beg to differ.
what got a chuckle out of me was the headline stating this was a surprise for Dan0. it was for me, as well, but i am sure our reactions were much different.
this does give me faith that the new owners are a bit more serious about this whole, mysterious "winning" thing. :party:

creek14
01-23-2006, 08:13 PM
I'm going to go dance naked. (on my way to the shower).

If I were male, I would have a lot of man love for RCast right now.

pedro
01-23-2006, 08:20 PM
Well there is one good thing about it - as long as you get the numbers right spelling doesn't make a difference.;)

besides, don't they spell it sabourmetrics down under?

Falls City Beer
01-23-2006, 08:22 PM
besides, don't they spell it sabourmetrics down under?

smart arse. :p:

LvJ
01-23-2006, 08:24 PM
We had a deal there
We nearly signed it with our blood…
An understanding
I thought that you would keep your word
I’m disappointed
I’m aggravated
It’s a fault I have, I know
When things don’t go my way I have to

Blow up in the face of my rivals
I swear and I rant, I make quite an arrival
The men are surprised by the language
They act so discreet, they are hypocrites so fook them too!

:dancingco Great day to be a Reds fan.

This absolutely made my month. :ughmamoru :runaway:

Raisor
01-23-2006, 08:32 PM
. And when Depo had full control of LA they actually went backwards.

2004-Playoffs
2005-Injuries, massive injuries.

I'd also argue that DePo never had "full" control.

Yachtzee
01-23-2006, 09:31 PM
"It's easy to grin
when your ship comes in
and you've got the stock market beat.

But a man worthwhile
is a man who can smile
when his pants are too tight in the seat."

CincyReds2003
01-23-2006, 09:44 PM
"It's easy to grin
when your ship comes in
and you've got the stock market beat.

But a man worthwhile
is a man who can smile
when his pants are too tight in the seat."


Thank you Judge Smails!!:D

remdog
01-23-2006, 09:56 PM
2004-Playoffs
2005-Injuries, massive injuries.

I'd also argue that DePo never had "full" control.

2004 - Credit Jim Tracy
2005 - Poor roster management, bad team chemisty - lose Jim Tracy

Many of you are in love with DePodesta but many of his problems (both within the team offices and in the press) were self-inflicted. At least some of the results ride on his own shoulders. He's young and perhaps he's had time to reflect on better ways to communicate his evaluations. He may have had time to learn and improve based upon his Dodger experience. That would not be a bad thing. It's called growing.

Rem

KronoRed
01-23-2006, 10:07 PM
Where were you when Dan O'Brien was fired?
Sleeping, I had good dreams too..a good omen :D

Topcat
01-23-2006, 10:27 PM
Originally Posted by Yachtzee
Where were you when Dan O'Brien was fired?


Actually I was out buying beer and was totally unaware of this event. I was drinking cuz I am a Reds fan and its hurt for a very long time :(

George Foster
01-23-2006, 11:08 PM
Not to rain on our parade but with a budget of only 60-65 million and no real farm system, does it matter who is the GM? Can a good GM give us a division championship or just make us a .500 with such a small budget? Is there really a difference between 81-81 and 72-90. Either way, we are not playing in October. Is is going to take 3-5 drafts before we see improvement? If you don't have a big budget don't we have to rely on our farm system? True a good GM can find "diamonds in the rough" but to bank on this is a gamble. The reasons why the A's and Twins, who are small budget teams, are in the "hunt" come September, is a great Farm system which we don't have.

If we can't increase our budget by 15 million, to sign 2 good free agent pitchers then we must rely on a farm system. If we get a good GM who can evaluate high school and college pitching we are still at least 3 years away from winning the cental division.

Falls City Beer
01-23-2006, 11:09 PM
Not to rain on our parade but with a budget of only 60-65 million and no real farm system, does it matter who is the GM?.

Yes.

vaticanplum
01-23-2006, 11:15 PM
Not to rain on our parade but with a budget of only 60-65 million and no real farm system, does it matter who is the GM?

I would argue that it matters more. You say that the real need of a small- or mid-market team is a good farm system. To develop that, you need a good GM.

I don't necessarily think that GMs deserve all of the credit or backlash that they get. A lot depends on circumstances and every team is different. But Dan O'Brien mashed this team to pieces from top to bottom and a new GM could make a huge difference for this team.

I don't expect immediate results. I don't even necessarily WANT them, as that would probably entail many expensive, short-term, eleventh-hour decisions. But a good GM will turn things around for this team over the next 3-5 years, and s/he can certainly do that with $65 million. That's not even penny change in major-league baseball.

George Foster
01-23-2006, 11:21 PM
I would argue that it matters more. You say that the real need of a small- or mid-market team is a good farm system. To develop that, you need a good GM.

I don't necessarily think that GMs deserve all of the credit or backlash that they get. A lot depends on circumstances and every team is different. But Dan O'Brien mashed this team to pieces from top to bottom and a new GM could make a huge difference for this team.

I don't expect immediate results. I don't even necessarily WANT them, as that would probably entail many expensive, short-term, eleventh-hour decisions. But a good GM will turn things around for this team over the next 3-5 years, and s/he can certainly do that with $65 million. That's not even penny change in major-league baseball.

I agree. You pretty much said the same as I did. My point was that we should not expect "a winner" this next season. It's going to take time because we can't go out and sign big name pitchers. A good GM can make us a .500, but with a small market budget, it will take time to make us a contenda'!

MWM
01-24-2006, 12:14 AM
I'm not sure anyone ever said he was a good CF. I think the point was that he's a better option than Junior.

KronoRed
01-24-2006, 01:29 AM
Yes.
Word.

A good GM would not dump a large amount of a small payroll on junk.

SirFelixCat
01-24-2006, 05:17 AM
If I were male, I would have a lot of man love for RCast right now.

I am and I soooo do! Now let's just hope that he does well choosing the/our GM.


But as of right now, I give the new head honcho a big :thumbup: .


:beerme:

Unassisted
01-24-2006, 09:25 AM
MLB Radio has an archive of the first 5 minutes of yesterday's BobCast presser announcing DanO's firing at

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/radio/mlb_radio_archive.jsp

For posterity's sake, it's listed under January 23, 2006 under the show "Stayin' Hot with Seth and Bone."

If you didn't hear it live, he lists what he's looking for in the next GM.

REDREAD
01-24-2006, 10:16 AM
Someone clarify something. Brad Kullman is the one guy in the front office who pays attention to sabermetrics. Is this true?

Could this be a sign of the direction Castellini wants to go? (Paul DePodesta anyone?)

I'm not sure we've seen evidence of that. Kullman appeared to be open to many different ideas. Remember that article where he talked about analyzing brain waves in ballplayers?

FYI, Bowden was a big believer in computer projections of players. He was criticized for letting Brady Clark go because the computer modeling said that Clark was nothing special (and that was a reasonable assumption, IMO).

REDREAD
01-24-2006, 11:07 AM
2004 - Credit Jim Tracy
2005 - Poor roster management, bad team chemisty - lose Jim Tracy

Many of you are in love with DePodesta but many of his problems (both within the team offices and in the press) were self-inflicted. At least some of the results ride on his own shoulders. He's young and perhaps he's had time to reflect on better ways to communicate his evaluations. He may have had time to learn and improve based upon his Dodger experience. That would not be a bad thing. It's called growing.

Rem

That's a fair assessment in my opinion. Not every GM that is in the sabermatics club is automatically going to succeed. There's more to the job of GM than evaluating talent (be it traditional or by the numbers).

Depodesta may or may not do better in his next gig, but I think it's fair to say that he failed in LA. If there was bad relations with his boss or the "old school" people, he brought at least some of it on himself. At one point, everyone in the organization liked him enough to hire him, right?

westofyou
01-24-2006, 11:10 AM
2005 - Poor roster management, bad team chemisty - lose Jim Tracy
http://www.realgmbaseball.com/src_teamarticle/184/20050925/the_injury_factor/


With the season beginning to come to a bitter end, the Los Angeles Dodgers find themselves at a complete loss. Not only are they completely out of a pennant race, but are now battling to stay out of last place. The Dodgers slipped very quickly these last few weeks with the San Diego Padres holding a 5 game lead over the Giants, while LA is now 9 games back. There won’t be any comeback stories to talk about this year at Chavez Ravine, only the dismal season to look back on and question. When discussing how this Dodger year transpired, the only logical explanation would be the injury bug. Many Dodgers lay open to the bug that hit their clubhouse this year. Here’s how it played out:

• When the Dodgers acquired RF J.D. Drew back in January of 2005, GM Paul DePodesta thought he had brought in an immediate threat to the lineup. Sure, Drew’s name did in fact look nice on paper, but there would also be the consequences of signing a player who had several stints with the disabled list in his past. Throughout his career, Drew was considered a potential standout only if could remain healthy. While with the Atlanta Braves in 2004, Drew did just that and had a great season. He batted .305 with 93 RBI and belted 31 homeruns. Now the right fielder was definitely on the rise of being able to produce more seasons like he did in ’04. His value now had surely risen with the impending off-season and him being a free agent… As of July 4th a broken wrist has ended his season.

• The former CY Young award winner Eric Gagne opened spring training with a lingering elbow injury. Many can say he was rushed back to quickly, but Gagne thought otherwise. He only lasted 14 games posting 8 saves and a 2.70 ERA… His season officially ended in June when the Dodgers announced that he would have to go under the knife to fix his right elbow. Now with Gagne being down for the remainder of the year, the bullpen was at a loss of who to name the closer.

• The Gold Glove SS Cesar Izturis would now be the latest victim to fall prey to the sidelines. Izturis began the year hitting like a machine and propelled the offense as the lead-off hitter. As the All Star break neared, a lingering back problem had taken a toll on the young Dodger. He would unfortunately have to sit back and watch the mid summer classic from the NL dugout. Finally, in early September Izturis would be transferred to the disabled list with now a severe elbow problem that requires Tommy John surgery. He’s not only finished with this year, but is now set to return some time next year around the All Star break.

• Catcher Paul Bako was signed in the off season to back up starting catcher Jason Phillips, but a knee injury would end his season as it required surgery. He had only lasted 13 games for the Dodgers, but would continue to be a helpful addition to the clubhouse. He took the young called up catcher Dioner Navarro under his wing to teach him some techniques about the position.

• RP Kelly Wunsch pitched only in 45 games for the Dodgers before tearing a ligament in his right ankle. This injury would affect the team’s bullpen needs to face opposing left handed batters. Wilson Alvarez wasn’t pitching like he once did last year for the Dodgers which didn’t make him a reliable RP this year. Wunsch is expected to be ready for the start of the 2006 season.

• CF Milton Bradley was shut down in late August due to a partially torn left patella tendon. His season unfortunately did not end as he planned. The internal problems within the clubhouse and his recent domestic issues just may have ended his tenure in Los Angeles. Milton Bradley’s days in a Dodger uniform may be numbered.

The injuries have indeed been a serious repercussion on why the Dodgers will not participate in postseason play. Manager Jim Tracy had to do something he had never done since being with the Dodgers. He basically said that they need to play out the remainder of the season with respect for the integrity of the game. They may be out of a divisional race, but focusing on the games ahead is just as important. Staying positive is an essential element that needs to be taken seriously by them if they want to compete for years to come. This season did not go as they had hoped for, but it did bring some bright talent to the table.

When players began to go down, we began to see names we were unfamiliar with. Oscar Robles contributed his quick lead off approach when Izturis went down. Jason Repko filled in smoothly in the outfield playing great defense in place of Drew and Bradley. Dioner Navarro is a young stud that should be ready for a catching role next year possibly as a starter. Navarro has been well received by the pitching staff since being called up from the minors. Willy Aybar is well deserving of a roster spot for next years club. He has been filling in at 3B and 2B and is batting .397 with a homerun. Yes this season has been one in which all Dodger fans would like to forgot, but the future looks great with these up and coming prospects.

savafan
01-24-2006, 11:10 AM
IIRC, Ray Knight, first at bench coach and then as manager, used extensive statistical research via computer from the dugout to evaluate situations and matchups.

westofyou
01-24-2006, 11:13 AM
IIRC, Ray Knight, first at bench coach and then as manager, used extensive statistical research via computer from the dugout to evaluate situations and matchups.
He was more of teh fielding chart wizard.

But Davey Johnson played for Earl Weaver and he was what some would scream and moan about being "Too sabr"

RedsManRick
01-24-2006, 11:20 AM
IIRC, Ray Knight, first at bench coach and then as manager, used extensive statistical research via computer from the dugout to evaluate situations and matchups.

There's a difference between understanding stats and using them. I just got done with Three Nights in August and couldn't stand the constant "Well, he's 2 for 10 against him in his career, better bring in a pinch hitter who's for 3-9..." type comments that LaRussa continually made (or were attributed to him).

It seems that many people in baseball like to equate looking at numbers with real statistical anlaysis and research. I have no idea how Ray Knight used them, but I have an inkling he was more in the LaRussa mold than not.

Puffy
01-24-2006, 11:21 AM
But Davey Johnson played for Earl Weaver and he was what some would scream and moan about being "Too sabr"

Yup. I remember when Davey was with the Mets he was way ahead of his time using stats and matchups to dictate gameplans.

RFS62
01-24-2006, 11:23 AM
He was more of teh fielding chart wizard.

But Davey Johnson played for Earl Weaver and he was what some would scream and moan about being "Too sabr"



Before the term "sabermetric" was ever known in baseball circles, the Orioles clubhouse used the phrase "book him" for Earl's strategic moves. Mainly matchups, Earl was ahead of his time in platooning and knowing the numbers.

westofyou
01-24-2006, 11:31 AM
Mainly matchups, Earl was ahead of his time in platooning and knowing the numbers.Casey Stengel platooned religiously, picked it up whilst playing for the Dodgers, apparently Casey was crap against LH's and often ended up watching the game when they were on the mound.