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View Full Version : Grienke leaves KC Spring Training?



ED44
02-27-2006, 12:26 PM
I saw where Grienke left KC's Spring Training for undisclosed reasons. Anyone heard anything else about this?

Chip R
02-27-2006, 12:30 PM
http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/SPT0401/602270366/1072/SPT04

ROYALS: Zack Greinke left the team Sunday, and there are no indications when he might return.

Club officials said Greinke had gone back to his home in Orlando, Fla. The 22-year-old right-hander was 5-17 with a 5.80 ERA in 33 starts last season.

"He's gone home for personal matters," Royals manager Buddy Bell said. "That's all I can say about it. He's just got permission to go home and take care of a few things."

flyer85
02-27-2006, 12:56 PM
I've heard he has demanded a trade to the Reds.

KronoRed
02-27-2006, 01:03 PM
Bet we could get him for Womack right now ;)

Jr's Boy
02-27-2006, 01:48 PM
I've heard he has demanded a trade to the Reds.

Heard from where?

registerthis
02-27-2006, 02:17 PM
I've heard he has demanded a trade to the Reds.

He wants to be King of the Scrapheap.

flyer85
02-27-2006, 05:11 PM
I hope this isn't similar to Josh Hamilton but as I recall this is how the issues first came to light with him.

BEETTLEBUG
02-27-2006, 05:30 PM
I would trade them Womack and Hudson

Boss-Hog
02-27-2006, 05:54 PM
I would trade them Womack and Hudson
...two guys who were available for nothing this offseason. Everyone passed then.

dougdirt
02-27-2006, 05:55 PM
I hope this isn't similar to Josh Hamilton but as I recall this is how the issues first came to light with him.

Do the minors have a different type of drug testing than the majors do? I really dont know this one, but I sure hope it isnt the same type of situation, as I have been a big fan of Greinke for a while.

flyer85
02-27-2006, 06:04 PM
Do the minors have a different type of drug testing than the majors do? I really dont know this one, but I sure hope it isnt the same type of situation, as I have been a big fan of Greinke for a while.The only difference I know of is that the minors have had random drug testing for a long time, it is recent in the majors.

dougdirt
02-27-2006, 06:13 PM
OK, thanks for that one flyer. I would think if he were in the same boat as Hamilton then, that he would have failed a test somewhere along the lines... I guess we will all find out eventually...

HotCorner
02-27-2006, 06:14 PM
Speculation is that he's lost his confidence and had a falling out of sorts with Bell ...

http://mb3.scout.com/fkansascityroyalsfrm1.showMessage?topicID=4996.top ic

Ravenlord
02-27-2006, 06:20 PM
Speculation is that he's lost his confidence and had a falling out of sorts with Bell ...

seems most talented rush job pitchers lose their confidence and either wash out, or find it again around age 30...or the arms are destroyed in the rush.

registerthis
02-27-2006, 06:21 PM
That's a funny board. This post in paricular made me blow filtered water out of my nose:

"well, if that is the case and Greinke is being a baby. We MAY want to consider trading him. Greinke would reel in Kearns or Wily Mo Pena straight up."

The sacry thing is, were DanO still in control, he very well MAY have.

Red Leader
02-27-2006, 06:37 PM
That's a funny board. This post in paricular made me blow filtered water out of my nose:

"well, if that is the case and Greinke is being a baby. We MAY want to consider trading him. Greinke would reel in Kearns or Wily Mo Pena straight up."

The sacry thing is, were DanO still in control, he very well MAY have.

I'd trade WMP for him. I'd start with asking for a prospect in that deal as well, but if they didn't want to give me one that I wanted, I wouldn't hang up the phone too quickly.

registerthis
02-27-2006, 06:45 PM
I'd trade WMP for him. I'd start with asking for a prospect in that deal as well, but if they didn't want to give me one that I wanted, I wouldn't hang up the phone too quickly.

I'd be very hesitant. Greinke was EXTREMELY hittable last year. Plus, he's predominantly a flyball pitcher, which can be a scary thing in the GAB. He's pitched in a pitcher-friendly park during his 2 MLB seasons, I'd expect those HR totals to shoot up if he came to Cinci.

Jr's Boy
02-27-2006, 06:48 PM
Heck, he had no run support in K.C. either.

OnBaseMachine
02-27-2006, 06:57 PM
I would trade Pena for Greinke only if Gordon was included in the deal as a PTBNL or if Billy Butler were involved.

Greinke is too hittable to just trade Pena for, imo.

dougdirt
02-27-2006, 07:38 PM
no way would you get Butler or Gordon straight up for WMP, much less with Greinke also tossed in.

Redmachine2003
02-27-2006, 08:01 PM
How about Pelland and Denorfia for Greinke, since Greinke value has drop through the floor.

MartyFan
02-27-2006, 08:20 PM
How about Pelland and Denorfia for Greinke, since Greinke value has drop through the floor.

Hmmm...nah

Shaknb8k
02-27-2006, 09:57 PM
There is only a few players in the whole organization that could draw Gordon straight up so we might as well throw him out. I say Kearns or Pena for Greinke straight up is the only thing. Im not sure if i would do that or not. But if you want Greinke and a top prospect u better plan on giving up a lot more than kearns or pena.

OnBaseMachine
02-27-2006, 10:19 PM
no way would you get Butler or Gordon straight up for WMP, much less with Greinke also tossed in.

No way KC can get Pena for Grienke then.

dougdirt
02-27-2006, 10:27 PM
thats fine onbase. I wouldnt trade Pena for Greinke straight up either, but I wouldnt be asking for Gordon or Butler with him if I wanted to get a deal done becuase the GM might just hang up and not take your call anymore.

Krusty
02-28-2006, 01:00 AM
Oh, I would offer Pena for Grienke. I don't know what it is with the Royals but they screw up young pitchers probably just as bad as the Reds. Sounds like Grienke needs a change of scenery and is definitely in Buddy Bell's doghouse.

Johnny Footstool
02-28-2006, 10:22 AM
People only want Greinke because they remember all those comparisons to Greg Maddux from a few years back. Funny, but you rarely hear those two pitchers mentioned in the same sentence anymore, unless it's "Greinke is no Greg Maddux."

He's a typical "pitch to contact" junkballer. The Reds don't need that. They need a fireballer with a streak of wildness. Any deals with the Royals for pitching need to start with J.P. Howell.

registerthis
02-28-2006, 10:27 AM
People only want Greinke because they remember all those comparisons to Greg Maddux from a few years back. Funny, but you rarely hear those two pitchers mentioned in the same sentence anymore, unless it's "Greinke is no Greg Maddux."

He's a typical "pitch to contact" junkballer. The Reds don't need that. They need a fireballer with a streak of wildness. Any deals with the Royals for pitching need to start with J.P. Howell.

I'd do Pena for Howell in a heartbeat--I don't think the Royals would though!

M2
02-28-2006, 10:36 AM
Jim Pittsley, Dan Reichert, Chris George, Jimmy Gobble, Zack Greinke -- can anyone prove they weren't all the same guy?

lollipopcurve
02-28-2006, 10:39 AM
I still like Greinke's stuff. Take a look at his 2004 season -- at what, age 20? None of those guys M2 mentions ever performed like that in the majors. But his head has come unscrewed, so all bets on his future are off.

flyer85
02-28-2006, 10:41 AM
If you have seen Greinke pitch you would realize he can reach back and dial it up to 94-95 when he wants to.

rdiersin
02-28-2006, 10:42 AM
People only want Greinke because they remember all those comparisons to Greg Maddux from a few years back. Funny, but you rarely hear those two pitchers mentioned in the same sentence anymore, unless it's "Greinke is no Greg Maddux."

He's a typical "pitch to contact" junkballer. The Reds don't need that. They need a fireballer with a streak of wildness. Any deals with the Royals for pitching need to start with J.P. Howell.

Everything I've ever heard about Howell is that he is not a fireballer, but that he has below average velocity. He does have the steak of wildness I guess with those high walk totals. I'm not opposed to trading for JP Howell, because I think he could be a good pitcher, but then again I would trade for Greinke too. FWIW, Pecota likes Greinke a bit better than Howell. (It doesn't seem terribly high on either). Also, I don't think Pena is the person to trade for either of these two guys.

M2
02-28-2006, 10:46 AM
If you have seen Greinke pitch you would realize he can reach back and dial it up to 94-95 when he wants to.

I've seen him pitch and never seen him throw that hard. The guy works 88-90 most days with a little extra on his best days. He's never going to overpower major league hitters and he doesn't really have a swing and miss breaking pitch either. He's been as overrated and overmatched as any pitcher in recent memory.

Johnny Footstool
02-28-2006, 11:08 AM
Everything I've ever heard about Howell is that he is not a fireballer, but that he has below average velocity.

True, "fireballer" is not the best term to describe Howell. It just seemed more exciting than saying "guy with good stuff."

M2
02-28-2006, 11:29 AM
Funny line from the sponsor of the Zack Greinke page on www.baseball-reference.com:

"I'm not sure Allard Baird is smarter than a Bag of Hammers."

Steve4192
02-28-2006, 12:42 PM
Every time I hear Grienke's name, I think of the 20 year-old stud in 'MVP Baseball 2005' who is nearly unhittable in the video game. Darn near every time I start up a new game in franchise mode, the first thing I do is trade for him and Dontrelle Willis. I'm thinking about not buying the 2006 version just so I don't have to be depressed about how bad he has become.

flyer85
02-28-2006, 12:45 PM
I've seen him pitch and never seen him throw that hard.I have on numerous occasions. 2 - 3 times a game he will reach back for something extra. However, he generally works right around 90 and he has no business being in the majors at this point. If he is going to be good KC will have wasted his cheap years learning to get major league hitters out. I think the best thing to do for young pitchers is to leave them in the minors until they are ready to get major league hitters out. Rushing them like the Tigers did with Bonderman and the Royals with Greinke is just stupid

M2
02-28-2006, 01:14 PM
I have on numerous occasions. 2 - 3 times a game he will reach back for something extra. However, he generally works right around 90 and he has no business being in the majors at this point. If he is going to be good KC will have wasted his cheap years learning to get major league hitters out. I think the best thing to do for young pitchers is to leave them in the minors until they are ready to get major league hitters out. Rushing them like the Tigers did with Bonderman and the Royals with Greinke is just stupid

If he can do that, it's probably not good for his arm at this time. Rearing back for 4-5 MPH is what makes things inside you go pop.

Though I agree completely about the stupidity of struggling teams squandering cheap years on young pitchers who aren't yet ready. It's insanity. Not only is it a great way to get a pitcher out of kilter, it's fiscal suicide. Even if these guys do pan out, it's likely another organization that will reap the benefits. These kids will be free agents at age 26 and they probably won't be what you'd consider a plus pitcher until they turn 24 or 25. I'd much rather put them through a longer minor league apprenticeship so that they're ready to give you five or six good years once they hit the majors.

Red Leader
02-28-2006, 01:19 PM
Bring up Homer Bailey!!

ED44
02-28-2006, 01:59 PM
The jury is still out on Grienke. From the few times I have seen him pitch, I like his stuff, it's obvious it's there. However, I think he was just brought up too early, and in turn, has had his confidence ruined. I would definitely inquire with KC to see what it would take to get him. He is young and change of scenery could do him some good. Maybe it wouldn't even take Wily Mo if he has totally fallen out of the loop in KC, but if it did, I think I would make that trade still. Kearns on the other hand, I would not trade for him. It would still be worth the phone call to see what the asking price is, when you're in need of pitching as bad as we are.

Red Heeler
02-28-2006, 05:49 PM
Though I agree completely about the stupidity of struggling teams squandering cheap years on young pitchers who aren't yet ready. It's insanity. Not only is it a great way to get a pitcher out of kilter, it's fiscal suicide. Even if these guys do pan out, it's likely another organization that will reap the benefits. These kids will be free agents at age 26 and they probably won't be what you'd consider a plus pitcher until they turn 24 or 25. I'd much rather put them through a longer minor league apprenticeship so that they're ready to give you five or six good years once they hit the majors.

This is a major inefficiency in the market that a smart team would do well to take advantage of. You would need a stud scouting/stats team to do it, but the payoffs would be enormous. Every season, there are talented pitchers who have not lived up to expectations to date available for trade with a minor investment in talent. One could have had Ben Sheets for Wily Mo and Bobby Basham a couple years back. I've never seen Greinke throw a pitch, but he is the type, if not the target, that a smart GM should seek.

dougdirt
03-03-2006, 03:19 PM
Espn is reporting that he left camp due to "On-going emotional issues". Not really sure what that means exactly, but I am hoping he gets things turned around for himself, then he can worry about his baseball career after that.

savafan
03-03-2006, 08:20 PM
I've heard two different reports. One, Greinke is simply tired of playing for the Royals, and two, he is considering taking up golf professionally on the PGA tour.

Chip R
03-03-2006, 11:09 PM
If I were a pitcher and I heard I might be traded to the Reds, I might have emotional problems too. ;)

Seriously, I hope things work out for him.

ED44
03-03-2006, 11:56 PM
If I were a pitcher and I heard I might be traded to the Reds, I might have emotional problems too. ;)

Seriously, I hope things work out for him.

I hadn't heard anything about him coming to Cincy (at least concrete...mostly a rumor here and there). I wouldn't mind having him though. Plus, I would think he would be happy to leave KC and come to the Reds. At least, he would get some run support (something he has lacked while at KC).

I'm with you though, I hope he gets things straightened out and gets his life back on track.

Chip R
03-04-2006, 12:34 AM
I hadn't heard anything about him coming to Cincy (at least concrete...mostly a rumor here and there). I wouldn't mind having him though. Plus, I would think he would be happy to leave KC and come to the Reds. At least, he would get some run support (something he has lacked while at KC).

Well, I was just kidding there. I've heard rumors that He'd be traded here - mostly for Kearns - and I was just thinking that a pitcher might not like to be traded here because of the HRs GAB gives up.

M2
03-04-2006, 12:35 AM
I've heard two different reports. One, Greinke is simply tired of playing for the Royals, and two, he is considering taking up golf professionally on the PGA tour.

Robin Yount once considered a life in the PGA too.

ED44
03-04-2006, 12:48 AM
Well, I was just kidding there. I've heard rumors that He'd be traded here - mostly for Kearns - and I was just thinking that a pitcher might not like to be traded here because of the HRs GAB gives up.

My mistake...and I can understand you thinking he may not want to step on the mound at GABP too. :beerme:

I wouldn't mind seeing the Reds contacting KC to see if they are looking to deal him though.

savafan
03-08-2006, 03:05 PM
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/baseball/mlb/kansas_city_royals/14043050.htm?source=rss&channel=kansascity_kansas_city_royals

By BOB DUTTON
The Kansas City Star

SURPRISE, Ariz. — Royals pitcher Zack Greinke is undergoing counseling from a sports psychologist near his home in Orlando, Fla., as part of a treatment program for longstanding emotional issues, The Star has learned from multiple sources.

Club officials declined to confirm that Greinke is undergoing such treatment, and efforts to contact Greinke and his family were unsuccessful.

Club officials did say Greinke, 22, appears to be making progress in dealing with what they still term “personal matters,” but they remain leery of predicting any timetable for his return.

“I’ve talked to him quite a bit,” manager Buddy Bell said. “He seems to be doing better, but I don’t have any expectations on when he’s coming back. He’s dealing with it as best he can. I hear a little energy in his voice.”

Club officials bitterly denounced reports suggesting a confrontation with Bell triggered Greinke’s Feb. 25 departure from camp.

“I’m getting feedback about that — if that’s what you want to call it,” general manager Allard Baird said, “and it’s extremely unfair to Buddy Bell.

“It disturbs me because the relationship between those two people has actually allowed Zack to move forward to address these personal matters. People who are out there saying Buddy drove him out of camp are one of two things: They’re very misinformed, or two, they’re liars.”

Bell was similarly vehement.

“That’s obviously not the case,” he said. “I don’t even like commenting on it, but it’s totally irresponsible. That’s just people running out of things to write about or talk about.

“You don’t just make up stuff. That (messes) up someone’s life when it’s not true. I know people have a job to do, but if you can’t get the information, you just make it up?”

Sources told The Star that Greinke is dealing with emotional issues that prevented him from adapting to the big-league lifestyle, but club officials remain confident he will return to the Royals.

“Zack is important to this team,” owner David Glass said, “and we believe he’s going to get his personal situations squared away and be a contributor this year. We just have to take a real positive approach because this kid is going to be back.”

Baird and Bell previously indicated that Greinke needs to be in camp by mid-March to remain a candidate for the opening-day roster. That seems unlikely because sources now suggest a best-case scenario is for Greinke to return in two to three weeks.

“I think he’s making progress and moving forward,” Baird said. “The time frame, I just don’t know. And I don’t want to guess. We’ll see.”

If Greinke returns this month, he would probably remain in Arizona for extended spring training when the club breaks camp. He could also probably spend a brief period in the minors before returning to the big-league club.

Greinke was the sixth overall pick in the 2002 draft. He was picked as baseball’s minor-league player of the year by The Sporting News in 2003 and the club’s pitcher of the year as a rookie in 2004.

But Greinke struggled last season, when he went 5-17 with a 5.80 ERA in 33 starts.

Super_Barry11
03-08-2006, 04:31 PM
Royals pitcher Zack Greinke is undergoing counseling from a sports psychologist near his home in Orlando, Fla., as part of a treatment program for longstanding emotional issues, The Star has learned from multiple sources.

Too bad I don't have my doctorate yet... That sports psychologist could have been me!! :)

I hope he works through things and that everything turns out alright.