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View Full Version : Miltons Mechanics are a mess!! He has to be hurt



redsfan4445
04-18-2006, 11:03 PM
I just finished watching Milton on Baseball Tonight Give up those homers and I was like WOW he is Hurt!.. last year he did the same thing, he didnt drive towards the plate and this keeps his pitches up in the zone, which end up over the fence... This spring i saw his game he pitched dominating for 5 innings.. he was the Milton of the old Twins.. driving towards the plate.. finishing off his pitches and keeping the ball down in the zone and his body low on his delivery... Last year i wrote to the Reds, Chris Welsh and told them he was pitching like he was hurt! it was either his back, because he wasnt driving towards the plate and keeping his pitches up (EXCEPT that great Washington Game at home after my letter!!) then back to the same old Milton!, OR if it wasnt his back it was his groin.. but nobody questioned Milton.. SURPRISE in spring training he admited he had a knee problem.. a injury he hid and hurt the Reds... NOW tonight, he was not even trying to extend his front leg towards home and i bet his knee is bothering him again!! I am not a pitching coach, but i have watched mechanics of pitchers and if i can see it why cant the pitching coaches see it? does anyone agree with me?? its so frustrating.. they pay pitching coaches to watch this stuf and ours never can tell when a pitcher isnt using proper mechanics.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:07 PM
he has a degenrative knee condition, DanO knew that when he signed him.

TOBTTReds
04-18-2006, 11:09 PM
Watching him @ chicago, I felt he only followed through on about 1/3 his pitches then. On his FB, he spins like a top on his right foot and doesn't bend at the waist. Only his breaking balls was he following through.

George Foster
04-18-2006, 11:09 PM
Was he hurt the first 2 games and the last game of spring training when he pitched so good? I'll reserve judgement until the next start.

reds44
04-18-2006, 11:10 PM
Was he hurt the first 2 games and the last game of spring training when he pitched so good? I'll reserve judgement until the next start.
The 1st 2 games of this year I can't tell you how many balls were hit to the warning track against him.

Caveat Emperor
04-18-2006, 11:14 PM
Neck strain from doing the "Crap, I wonder where that one is landing"-look one too many times.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:16 PM
Was he hurt the first 2 games and the last game of spring training when he pitched so good? I'll reserve judgement until the next start.I saw that first game in ST when he hitting 94. He was a different pitcher that night. The fastball was jumping and his curve had bite. It has been slowly downhill from there.

I saw his first start against Pittsburgh on that Friday and he topped out at 88 that night and most of his fastballs were 86. I was worried but was willing to chalk it up to a cold night. He did OK but it was obvious he would not long get away with that quality of stuff. Tonight the weather was great. I think he has issues with the knee that will no longer allow him to be a major league starter.

paintmered
04-18-2006, 11:18 PM
I wasn't looking at the gun after every pitch, but I didn't see him get beyond 88mph tonight.

George Foster
04-18-2006, 11:20 PM
I saw that first game in ST when he hitting 94. He was a different pitcher that night. The fastball was jumping and his curve had bite. It has been slowly downhill from there.

I saw his first start against Pittsburgh on that Friday and he topped out at 88 that night and most of his fastballs were 86. I was worried but was willing to chalk it up to a cold night. He did OK but it was obvious he would not long get away with that quality of stuff. Tonight the weather was great. I think he has issues with the knee that will no longer allow him to be a major league starter.
Has anybody heard about the radar gun at GABP being a little slow? He was hitting 92mph in Chicago. just wondering.

redsfan4445
04-18-2006, 11:20 PM
Your Right Flyer85 on that spring training game.. that was the Milton that we were supposed to sign!.. not the one that hides his injuries... i didnt see his 1st 2 games of the season or his last spring training game.. but seeing the highlightts tonight.. there is a prb with him and i am 100% sure its his knee!

WMR
04-18-2006, 11:20 PM
Milton for closer??? We seem to have a penchant for 8 million dollar closers...

seriously, maybe he can perform at his ST levels if he knows it's only for an inning???

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:22 PM
If he knee is aching already it will only get worse. The Reds have two srarting pitchers who have almost nothing to get hitters out with on a consistent basis.

I was shocked when I saw Williams and his 81-82 mph fastball the other day. The poor starters completely expose an overmatched bullpen. I would DL Milton and put Williams in the pen and give Germano and Belisle a try.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:25 PM
Has anybody heard about the radar gun at GABP being a little slow? He was hitting 92mph in Chicago. just wondering.other guys made it jump that night. it's not just the gun. His fastball had no pop because he wasn't getting out there and really finishing off his pitches like that night in the spring. The less you get out of your legs the farther the pitch has to travel and the extra inches sometimes can make all the difference.

paintmered
04-18-2006, 11:27 PM
Has anybody heard about the radar gun at GABP being a little slow? He was hitting 92mph in Chicago. just wondering.


Belisle hit 93 on the radar today at the stadium. I think it's accurate +/- 1mph.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:27 PM
Milton for closer??? We seem to have a penchant for 8 million dollar closers.it really seems as if he is finished as an effective ML pitcher. I don't really see how a move to the pen will help.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:29 PM
Belisle hit 93 on the radar today at the stadium. I think it's accurate +/- 1mph.Belisle really needs to be given some time in the rotation. His mechanics are a bit complicated and it is almost impossible for him to keep them in sync getting very irregular work in the pen.

reds44
04-18-2006, 11:31 PM
Belisle really needs to be given some time in the rotation. His mechanics are a bit complicated and it is almost impossible for him to keep them in sync getting very irregular work in the pen.
I agree. He is not a reliever.

paintmered
04-18-2006, 11:32 PM
Belisle really needs to be given some time in the rotation. His mechanics are a bit complicated and it is almost impossible for him to keep them in sync getting very irregular work in the pen.


I think he's the next guy into the rotation when Narron/Krivsky have had enough of Williams and Milton. As bad as Milton was today, his outing was still better than Williams the other day.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:37 PM
I think he's the next guy into the rotation when Narron/Krivsky have had enough of Williams and Milton. As bad as Milton was today, his outing was still better than Williams the other day.Williams was as bad as I have seen. When your fastball is 80-82 and change at 75-76 there is no way to be succesful especially because his change doesn't have much tumble. His curve was non-existent.

RedsMan3203
04-18-2006, 11:39 PM
Lets see how Milton rebounds from this start....

This is the 1st time he pitched on 4 days rest correct?

Maybe he needs 5 days all the time with his knee...

Im not sure... But with last year still fresh in everyone's mind... 1 bad outting and everyone is sure quick to jump on him.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:42 PM
Lets see how Milton rebounds from this start....

This is the 1st time he pitched on 4 days rest correct?

Maybe he needs 5 days all the time with his knee...
because his stuff has slowly faded since that first ST start. If it's his knee and extra day isn't going to mean anything.

Plus tonight he faced a bunch of guys that belong in AAA.

Raisor
04-18-2006, 11:45 PM
Im not sure... But with last year still fresh in everyone's mind... 1 bad outting and everyone is sure quick to jump on him.


If he'd been good last year, who cares about one bad start? Since he wasn't just bad, but had one of the worst years ever for a pitcher, then yeah, one bad start matters.

flyer85
04-18-2006, 11:49 PM
If he'd been good last year, who cares about one bad start? Since he wasn't just bad, but had one of the worst years ever for a pitcher, then yeah, one bad start matters.Especially in a lineup with only one hitter with any signifcant major league experience(Cabrera). Ramirez, Uggla, Aguila, Abercrombie and Olivo would still be in the minors with most organizations.

Krusty
04-18-2006, 11:59 PM
I'm willing to give him a pass for this outing. If he can give us quality starts every two out of three games, I will take it. Bronson Arroyo didn't look too hot Sunday against the Cards but I haven't real heard that many complaints.

Raisor
04-19-2006, 12:02 AM
I'm willing to give him a pass for this outing. If he can give us quality starts every two out of three games, I will take it. Bronson Arroyo didn't look too hot Sunday against the Cards but I haven't real heard that many complaints.


Arroyo has been halfway decent over his career. Milton has been beyond bad the last two years and well below average for his career.

So yeah, there's a slight difference.

flyer85
04-19-2006, 12:07 AM
I'm willing to give him a pass for this outing. If he can give us quality starts every two out of three games, I will take it. Bronson Arroyo didn't look too hot Sunday against the Cards but I haven't real heard that many complaints.That's because Arroyo is not coming off a season where he was one of the worst starting pitchers in major league history. Milton says thank you Jose Lima.

Comparing the Cards to the Fish is a non starter as well.

Krusty
04-19-2006, 12:15 AM
That's because Arroyo is not coming off a season where he was one of the worst starting pitchers in major league history. Milton says thank you Jose Lima.

Comparing the Cards to the Fish is a non starter as well.

I'm telling ya the Fishes aren't going to be as bad as people make them out to be. They do have some young talent.....especially in the pitching department.

MattyHo4Life
04-19-2006, 06:45 AM
Comparing the Cards to the Fish is a non starter as well.

Why not? The Cards are a Triple A team. They only have two Major League hitters. ;)

Kc61
04-19-2006, 07:08 AM
Belisle really needs to be given some time in the rotation. His mechanics are a bit complicated and it is almost impossible for him to keep them in sync getting very irregular work in the pen.

Fine, as long as the rotation is in Louisville.

Last time down there, by the way, he had a 5.21 ERA.

membengal
04-19-2006, 07:33 AM
Because Arroyo's bad start didn't leave the team with zero chance to win...that's one HUGE difference...

OnBaseMachine
04-19-2006, 07:52 AM
Why not? The Cards are a Triple A team. They only have two Major League hitters. ;)

Yep, they do.

If you want want to continue to think that David Eckstein, Yadier Molina, Juan Encarnacion, So Taguchi, Hector Luna, and Skip Schumaker are good hitters, then you believe it. But it's far from the truth.

Red Rover
04-19-2006, 09:28 AM
Milton is most likely a lost cause, so you have to hope to trade him as soon as possible. The only way to trade him is to some how increase his value. There are a few ways that I feel might help. Never pitch him on 4 days rest and never pitch him behind Claussen to the same team. Other teams have adjusted to the left handed, same speed pitcher from the night before, therefor setting up Milton for failure. I think BC and EM have got to be split up if you want any success. Just my 2 cents.

flyer85
04-19-2006, 09:36 AM
If the Cards(?) and Marlins have a bunch of AAA hitters does that mean the Reds have a group of sub AAA pitchers?

OnBaseMachine
04-19-2006, 09:38 AM
If the Cards(?) and Marlins have a bunch of AAA hitters does that mean the Reds have a group of sub AAA pitchers?

AA pitchers. I've seen AAA staffs better than the one the Reds currently have.

redlegs2370
04-19-2006, 10:58 AM
Milton is most likely a lost cause, so you have to hope to trade him as soon as possible. The only way to trade him is to some how increase his value. There are a few ways that I feel might help. Never pitch him on 4 days rest and never pitch him behind Claussen to the same team. Other teams have adjusted to the left handed, same speed pitcher from the night before, therefor setting up Milton for failure. I think BC and EM have got to be split up if you want any success. Just my 2 cents.

Great Point Red Rover, teams do adjust and BC and EM are similar type pitchers.

redsfan4445
04-22-2006, 07:29 PM
Well I called that right!!.. i knew he was hurt.. what bothers me is our wonderful pitching coaches and manager couldnt see he wasnt driving towards the plate and then during the game Welsh says Hume doesnt really loook at mechanics.. i was like WHAT??? how the heck can you be a pitching coach and ignore mechanics?? that told me why they didnt see it was obvious Milton was hiding a injury and Wilson was throwing across his body whcih causes injury... really made me wonder what Bob would say about that comment on TV today...

djsauter
04-22-2006, 08:02 PM
Two things

1.) For all of you who want to trade him, go ahead. You won't get more than some left over bobble-heads in return.

2.) For those of you who think his problem is his injury, get real. Most pitchers with a broken arm could pitch better than he has in the past year.

TeamBoone
04-22-2006, 08:36 PM
In the past year, yes. In the past month, he was far better than he had been since he joined the Reds... consistently, until his last outing.

And, obviously, they did notice his mechanics (regardless of what Chris Welsh said), because it seems to me they've jumped on it quite quickly.

remdog
04-22-2006, 10:45 PM
By TeamBoone: "And, obviously, they did notice his mechanics (regardless of what Chris Welsh said), because it seems to me they've jumped on it quite quickly.


But not as quickly as 'Zoners have jumped on Eric Milton. ;)

Rem

membengal
04-23-2006, 10:37 AM
But not as quickly as 'Zoners have jumped on Eric Milton. ;)

Rem

yeah. they sure were wrong about that.