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View Full Version : PROSPECT: Joey Votto - 1B [AA] 2002 draft (RD 2) DOB: 9-10-83



BuckeyeRedleg
04-19-2006, 02:57 PM
2006 numbers so far in AA-Chattanooga (updated thru 7-28):

389 AB (1st in Southern League)*
19 HR (1st in Southern League)*
61 RBI (2nd in Southern League)*
35 2B (1st in Southern League)*
.321 AVG (1st in Southern League)*
.403 OBP (3rd in Southern League)*
.568 SLG (1st in Southern League)*
.971 OPS (1st in Southern League)*

87 K, 53 BB

.082 IsoD
.247 IsoP

*(minimum 2.7 plate appearances per team game)




Numbers prior to 2006, through 4 years of Rk, A-, and A+:

1549 AB's
52 HR
265 RBI
.278 AVG
.379 OBP
.452 SLG
.831 OPS

.......and 27 steals



Joey Votto is putting up very good numbers so far in AA. It's early, but this could be his year he breaks out. With Florida being in town, I think it's an appropriate time to compare Votto to their top prospect, Jeremy Hermida. They both were drafted high out of high school in 2002. Hermida in the 1st round, Votto in the 2nd. Hermida is 6-4, 200 and Votto is 6-2, 222. They are both powerful LH hitters and are within 4 months of each other in age.

Now, why couldn't Votto be on the same upward trend as Hermida was in 2005? He can, just a year behind. Let's blame it on being a Canadian. Blame Canada.

Let's take a look....



Prior to Hermida's breakout 2005 campaign, he put up the following numbers in 2003 and 2004 between low A and high A at 19 and 20 years of age:

808 AB's
16 HR
99 RBI
.790 OPS*
173 K's
122 BB's

Now, taking the angle that Votto is a year behind Hermida (for whatever reason). These are his numbers in 2004 and 2005 between low A and high A (same levels) at 20 and 21 years of age:

939 AB's
36 HR's
175 RBI
.840 OPS*
253 K's
142 BB's

Hermida's breakout season (at age 21) in AA (Southern League - same league Votto is currently in) last year consisted of:

386 AB's
18 HR's
63 RBI
.968 OPS
89 K's
111 BB's

Now, coming into this season he is regarded as the top Florida prospect, in an organization deep in talent.


I know, it's early and we have a small sample size here, but if Votto keeps tearing it up, I think the comparison is fair. In fact, I see no reason why Votto couldn't rise to the ranks of a Hermida and get some quality AB's with the big club late in 2006 and be a big time major league prospect for 2007.


*OPS numbers are not exact, but within .005 (give or take 5 points).

TOBTTReds
04-19-2006, 09:39 PM
I've always liked the guy. Got to see him play in Dayton all the time a couple years ago. I would love for him to have a very good year and be our 1B next year. He will have a better chance of starting in 07 if we are bad this year bc he will get more AB's. If we contend, we will be on the bench come September. I expect him to see time.

Edd Roush
04-19-2006, 10:09 PM
Hey BuckeyeRedleg,

Thank you so much for compiling all of these stats for us to read here on my favorite site on the 'net. I don't have enough time with school to do all of this but it's nice to have this sort of insight.

BuckeyeRedleg
06-15-2006, 10:56 PM
2006 numbers so far in AA-Chattanooga (updated thru 6-14):

249 AB's (4th in SL)*
9 HR (7th in SL)*
34 RBI (10th in SL)*
61 K (8th in SL)*
32 BB (11th in SL)*
.305 AVG (7th in SL)*
.383 OBP (8th in SL)*
.514 SLG (4th in SL)*
.897 OPS (7th in SL)*

.078 IsoD
.209 IsoP

*(minimum 2.7 plate appearances per team game)

BuckeyeRedleg
06-17-2006, 11:55 AM
2006 numbers so far in AA-Chattanooga (updated thru 6-16):

259 AB's (2nd in SL)*
11 HR (2nd in Southern League)*
40 RBI (4th in Southern League)*
62 K
32 BB
.317 AVG (3rd in Southern League)*
.390 OBP (7th in Southern League)*
.548 SLG (2nd in Southern League)*
.939 OPS (1st in Southern League)*

.073 IsoD
.229 IsoP

BuckeyeRedleg
06-19-2006, 10:39 AM
2006 numbers so far in AA-Chattanooga (updated thru 6-18):

268 AB's (1st in Southern League)*
13 HR (1st in Southern League)*
43 RBI (2nd in Southern League)*
152 TB (1st in Southern League)*
.321 AVG (3rd in Southern League)*
.392 OBP (7th in Southern League)*
.567 SLG (2nd in Southern League)*
.959 OPS (1st in Southern League)*

63 K, 32 BB

.071 IsoD
.246 IsoP

*(minimum 2.7 plate appearances per team game)

BuckeyeRedleg
06-22-2006, 01:00 PM
Joey Votto Triple Crown watch (thru 6-21):

14 HR (1st in Southern League)
46 RBI (1st in Southern League)
.315 AVG (3rd in Southern League)

dougdirt
06-22-2006, 01:12 PM
I really hope Votto doesnt come close to challenging for the Triple Crown... I think he has earned a promotion to Louisville, and wouldnt be suprised if doesnt get it sometime in the next month.

Scrap Irony
06-22-2006, 01:53 PM
What's the reasoning behind moving him to AAA? He'll arguably face more talented hurlers in AA. Stuff matters, at this point.

Too, a Triple Crown gives him publicity, and, in turn, attractiveness to other teams. If the Reds are willing to deal him, his year at AA is directly proportional to the quality of starting pitcher likely to receive.

BuckeyeRedleg
06-22-2006, 02:03 PM
If he's tearing it up in AA, he could just as well finish out the year in AA, challenge for the triple crown in the process, and then jump straight to the Reds in September for some late-season AB's before challenging for the !B job in 2007 (as long as Dunn is not moved there).

There's one other factor to consider. If the plan is to move to Dunn to 1B in 2007 and beyond, maybe they want Votto's triple crown stats looking pretty at AA, so that he makes good trade bait.

BuckeyeRedleg
06-22-2006, 02:03 PM
Scrap. I didn't see your post before making mine. Well said.

BuckeyeRedleg
06-28-2006, 06:10 PM
Joey Votto Triple Crown watch (thru 6-27):

15 HR (1st in Southern League)*
48 RBI (2nd in Southern League)**
.314 AVG (3rd in Southern League)***

*Votto is up 2 HR's on #2 Ryan Christianson (13 HR).

**He is 2 RBI behind Craig Brazell (50 RBI).

***In BA, he is currently behind Matt Kemp (.327) and Danny Richar (.325). Kemp will soon be removed from the lead because he will not have enough AB's to qualify (2.7 PA's/gm) as he is up with the Dodgers and doing fairly well right now.


As most already know, Votto was named to the Southern League All-Star team (with Aaron Herr, Noochie Varner, Jon Coutlangus, and David Shafer) to be played July 10, in Montgomery, AL.

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060628/SPORTS/606280378/1002

BuckeyeRedleg
07-06-2006, 01:58 PM
Joey Votto Triple Crown watch (thru 7-5):

17 HR (1st in Southern League)*
53 RBI (2nd in Southern League)**
.322 AVG (1st in Southern League)***


*He is 3 HR up on #2, Scott Moore (WTN).

**He is 2 RBI behind Craig Brazell (55 RBI).

***He is now .006 (.322 - . 316) ahead in avg on Danny Richar (TEN).

Votto has to be one of the hottest hitters in any organization right now and appears to indeed be comparable to Jeremy Hermida (2005) as mentioned in the first post of this thread.

Now, Votto is roughly 100 Plate Appearances from matching up with Hermida's 2005 season (also in the Southern League), but here's how they compare so far. Same league, Hermida one year younger in 2005 as Votto is in 2006.

Hermida: 386 AB's......Votto: 323 AB's
Hermida: 18 HR's.......Votto: 17 HR's
Hermida: 63 RBI........Votto: 53 RBI
Hermida: .968 OPS....Votto: .975 OPS
Hermida: 89 K's........Votto: 72K's
Hermida: 111 BB's.....Votto: 40 BB's

Plate discipline seems to be the only major difference between Hermida 2005 and Votto 2006, as Votto is "on pace" for roughly half the total number of walks in 2006 (55) as Hermida had in 2005 (111).



By the way, Votto also leads the Southern League in games, hits, runs and his 15 SB's put him 6th in the league in that category. 15 steals? Are you kidding me? Not bad for a first-basemen. Anyway, if he keeps this up, he has to be considered for Minor League player of the year.

membengal
07-06-2006, 02:19 PM
I would sincerely hope the Reds have penciled him in for a challenge for 1b next spring.

dougdirt
07-06-2006, 02:19 PM
Quick question....check out yesterdays box score for the lookouts game. It says Votto hit a HR and had 2 RBI. Which would put him at 18 HR and 55 RBI. However, neither of these show up in his numbers on his profile on milb.com. Anyone have any idea what that is all about?

NJReds
07-06-2006, 02:21 PM
I would sincerely hope the Reds have penciled him in for a challenge for 1b next spring.

If he keeps up the torrid pace, I wouldn't mind seeing him get a few hacks in Sept.

BuckeyeRedleg
07-06-2006, 02:42 PM
Quick question....check out yesterdays box score for the lookouts game. It says Votto hit a HR and had 2 RBI. Which would put him at 18 HR and 55 RBI. However, neither of these show up in his numbers on his profile on milb.com. Anyone have any idea what that is all about?

If that is true, Doug, then he may have finally taken over 1st in the Triple Crown.

Blue
07-06-2006, 03:00 PM
If that is true, Doug, then he may have finally taken over 1st in the Triple Crown.

I think they ususally don't update those stats until the next game.

dougdirt
07-06-2006, 03:44 PM
They usually have the stats updated the next morning following the game, however that doesnt appear to have happened for Votto.

OnBaseMachine
07-06-2006, 07:00 PM
The HR happened, milb must have made a mistake or something.

The Lookouts forced extra innings when Votto and Herr hit back-to-back home runs in the seventh. Votto followed Javier Colina's two-out single with his team-leading 18th homer. Herr, who went 4-for-7 and fell a triple short of the cycle, sent a shot over the left-field wall for his 11th dinger.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_88679.asp

Benihana
07-06-2006, 08:33 PM
If he keeps up the torrid pace, I wouldn't mind seeing him get a few hacks in Sept.

Agreed. Assuming he doesn't completely drop off, Votto should start the second half of the year in AAA and get a ML callup on September 1st. I would not only pencil him in to compete for the starting 1B job in 2007, I would say he's gotta be the favorite. An IF of Votto, Phillips, FeLo and EdE for the next five years sounds PRETTY GOOD to me!

schroomytunes
07-07-2006, 09:15 AM
I agree I think he has earned the right to get a september call-up, at least let him get 20 so at bats against ML pitching, and see what he does then let him challenge for the 1st base job in 2007.

chicoruiz
07-07-2006, 06:23 PM
Quick note: Votto was just named the #3 first base prospect in the minors by Kevin Goldstein of Baseball Prospectus, which is kind of nice. Daric Barton and James Loney were 1 and 2.

OnBaseMachine
07-08-2006, 08:18 AM
FARM REPORT: Joey Votto hit his second home run in as many games in Double-A Chattanooga's 13-2 loss to West Tenn. He leads all minor-league players in total bases and is tied for the most hits. He leads the Southern League in average (.325), home runs (19) and RBI (56).

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060708/SPT04/607080386/1071

BuckeyeRedleg
07-08-2006, 08:35 AM
From the BA chat thread:

Q: Charles Berg from Houston, Texas asks:
Early Top 5 to watch for the minor league player of the year award?

A: Chris Kline: Berg-Piece, Wow. Good question, even though it's not early. We start tracking players for our minor league POY watch as camp breaks. Right now I'll go with Jay Bruce, Alex Gordon, Chuck Lofgren, Yovani Gallardo and Homer Bailey.

I guess Votto has to be considered in that group as well. That makes three Reds prospects that realistically could be player of the year.

OnBaseMachine
07-09-2006, 09:38 AM
Chattanooga's Joey Votto, whose 19 homers have him on pace to surpass the 30-homer total, something only 30 Southern League hitters have done since '71, and who is gunning for a Triple Crown. He also leads the league with 56 RBIs and a .327 average. His league-leading 109 hits have him in position to threaten ex-Lookout Kevin Rhomberg's 25-year-old league record of 187.

http://www.al.com/sports/huntsvilletimes/index.ssf?/base/sports/1152437080104090.xml&coll=1

dabvu2498
07-10-2006, 10:00 AM
From: http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/checking-in-on-the-eastern-and-southern-leagues/

GPA=Gross Production Average


ORG AGE PLAYER POS AB H BB SO HR GPA Notes
CIN 22 Joey Votto 1B 333 109 43 76 19 .331 Leads league
LA 22 Andy LaRoche 3B 230 71 41 32 9 .309 Promoted to PCL
CHC 26 Nic Jackson OF 221 69 25 44 3 .292
SD 23 George Kottaras C 257 71 50 68 8 .290
CIN 25 Aaron Herr 3B 296 92 22 78 11 .288
TB 22 Elliot Johnson 2B 322 97 25 76 13 .287 10 of 13 HR at home
CHW 24 Corey Smith 3B 261 70 48 57 10 .284
ARI 24 James D'Antona 3B 272 76 36 56 12 .283
ARI 23 Danny Richar 2B 316 98 38 48 5 .278 .327 GPA at home
CHC 22 Scott Moore 3B 299 83 25 86 14 .276



Pleasant Surprise of the First Half

Joey Votto has had an up-and-down career in the Reds system. This is a good year for him; he is on pace to hit over 30 home runs with a .400 OBP. Only one player, Josh Phelps, has finished with comparable numbers in the Southern League during the past five years. Chattanooga is a hitter-friendly place to play, but Votto has actually hit 13 of his 19 home runs on the road in the Southern League.

OnBaseMachine
07-10-2006, 01:54 PM
Votto tidbit from BA:

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/futuresgame/261899.html

KittyDuran
07-10-2006, 04:47 PM
From Playball! 4/18/03:

OnBaseMachine
07-12-2006, 09:20 AM
Votto XBH chart:

http://firstinning.com/i/chart/2006-47-vot-1983-09-10.gif

edabbs44
07-12-2006, 09:29 AM
Only one player, Josh Phelps, has finished with comparable numbers in the Southern League during the past five years.

Wow...Josh Phelps??? :D

Redhook
07-12-2006, 09:31 AM
Good chart. It's good to see he not only has the ability to hit to all fields, but he also has pretty good power going the other way too. I was very impressed watching him the other day, the first time I've seen him play. He looks very solid at the plate with good bat control. I wouldn't be surprised if he's starting up here next year and I actually hope that's the case.

OnBaseMachine
07-14-2006, 09:22 AM
Baseball fans and scouts get a look at up-and-comers
By Larry Moko
The Hamilton Spectator
(Jul 14, 2006)

Baseball fans and scouts attending the SANDLOTT Under-15 World Wood Bat Championship in Hamilton can judge for themselves whether the Canadian Thunderbirds have another "Red-hot" prospect in their lineup.

Red, as in Cincinnati Reds.

Former Thunderbird Joey Votto is currently tearing it up at the Double A level with Cincinnati's farm team in Chattanooga. He's playing first base and is batting .315 with 14 home runs and 46 RBI.

Earlier this week, the Etobicoke native was a centre of attention during Major League Baseball's all-star festivities in Pittsburgh, when he played for the World Team against Team USA at the annual Futures Game.

"Joey started with me in 2002," said Mel Oswald, president and CEO of the Hamilton-based Canadian Thunderbirds Elite organization.

"We had a number of scholarship offers for him. He turned it down. He was drafted in the second round (44th overall) by Cincinnati and I believe he got a $680,000 US signing bonus."

Oswald says the New York Yankees, who didn't have a first-round selection that year, were interested in using their first pick to take Votto.

"Now, he's considered one of the very top prospects in the Cincinnati organization."

Votto, who also was groomed in the Etobicoke Rangers system, attended Thunderbirds' annual banquet last year and was named the T-Birds' player of the decade.

"He hit the hell out of the baseball," Oswald recalled of Votto's play as an 18-year-old."He was a funny character. At times he would arrive late for practice. He was a great sleeper, but once he put that uniform on ....

"I have no doubt that within a year or two Joey will be playing Major League baseball."

http://www.hamiltonspectator.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=hamilton/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1152827413724&call_pageid=1112274690688&col=1112274690734

Caveat Emperor
07-14-2006, 03:44 PM
If he keeps up the torrid pace, I wouldn't mind seeing him get a few hacks in Sept.

I'd say they almost have to take a look at him in September.

With the Reds sending Kearns & Lopez away, it opens a big need for extra production in the offense next season -- production which Votto could give them at some point next year via a callup. They've gotta see what they have in him; if they like what they see, that's one less bat they have to go buy in the offseason to make up, production-wise.

BuckeyeRedleg
07-29-2006, 05:27 PM
Joey Votto

Southern League Triple Crown watch (thru 7-28):

19 HR (1st in Southern League)
61 RBI (2nd in Southern League)*
321 AVG (1st in Southern League)

5 RBI behind Craig Brazell (JAX)

Blue
07-29-2006, 06:50 PM
I'll be interested to see how well he does once he's in the big leagues. His numbers are outstanding, but his strikeout rate makes me think his average will be much lower in the majors. However, if he were in the Yankees, Mets, Red Sox, or Cubs farm system, he would be recieving much more praise.

OnBaseMachine
08-06-2006, 01:19 PM
Translating minor-league statistics is very controversial. But this week we saw some great, comprehensive work courtesy of blogger Chone Smith (lanaheimangelfan.blogspot.com). Highlights include Howie Kendrick's 1.039 OPS at Triple-A Salt Lake translating to .797 in the majors. Smith says the two best minor-league performances of 2006 by top prospects are by Milledge (OPS translated to .826 in the majors) and Reds first base prospect Joey Votto (.822 translated OPS). Remember, there is a huge difference between the hitter friendly Pacific Coast League and International League.

http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/273-08062006-694125.html

OnBaseMachine
09-04-2006, 12:47 PM
With one regular season game left, Votto's numbers look like this: .319/.410/.550 - .959 OPS.

-70 XBH in 504 atbats (46 2B, 2 3B, 22 HR).
-78 walks in 504 atbats.

Reds fans couldn't have asked for a better season out of Joey Votto. His great plate discipline has returned and his strikeouts have dropped from 1 K/3.8 atbats last year to 1 K/4.7 this year. Not bad at all. And obviously his power developed this year like I expected. Votto is well on his way to developing into a very good major leaguer with his ceiling probably being a Justin Morneau type of player with maybe a little less power and better plate discipline.

BuckeyeRedleg
08-25-2010, 09:53 PM
I must admit, I feel like a proud papa.

Bump.....nearly four years later.

Funny how much of this thread was discussing Votto going for the triple crown in '06.

Mario-Rijo
08-25-2010, 10:51 PM
I must admit, I feel like a proud papa.

Bump.....nearly four years later.

Funny how much of this thread was discussing Votto going for the triple crown in '06.

I never even seen this thread back then, never knew the Yanks were looking at him unfortunately for them they didn't have a 1st rounder that year and we stole him. That's what you get New York for singing every FA imaginable, I hope you like Tex and that massive deal who really isn't the hitter Votto is, although he's no hound dog himself.

NorrisHopper30
08-26-2010, 12:23 AM
Nice find!!

nemesis
08-26-2010, 05:14 AM
Votto is well on his way to developing into a very good major leaguer with his ceiling probably being a Justin Morneau type of player


Really good comparison back then by OBM...

BuckeyeRedleg
08-26-2010, 09:35 AM
Really good comparison back then by OBM...

Heck yeah! I missed that the first go around. That's awesome.

TStuck
08-26-2010, 10:34 AM
What was really, really interesting was looking in retrospect at the side by side comparisons of Joey to Jeremy Hermida. Hermida was all the rage ( I even picked him for 1 of my fantasy teams his 1st year up with Fla.). And just look at them side by side now :eek: Sure glad we've got Joey!

lidspinner
08-26-2010, 11:00 AM
I even seen a few posts wondering if we were going to trade him...boy am I glad that did not happen

krm1580
08-26-2010, 11:41 AM
It funny this has been bumped. I just came across my old 2004 Baseball America prospect handbook and there was Joey Votto at #4 behind

#1 Ryan Wagner
#2 Edwin Encarnacion
#3 Brandon Claussen

As bad as those top 3 are, they at least made the majors. The rest of the top 30 in the book (besides Votto) never made it out out the minors. It is amazing to think how bad this farm system was only a short time ago.

membengal
08-26-2010, 12:09 PM
Somewhere in the distant past of this forum are some arguments over whether Joey Votto had legit homerun power. There were some who said he would never be more than a 20-HR power type guy and used his minor league stats to that point to make that arugment.

GIDP
08-26-2010, 01:40 PM
Votto certainly has exploded over any type of projections you could give thats for sure.

He always seemed like a .280-.300 hitter with a good eye and a .500 slugging kid. I dont think anyone could have honestly expected what he has given.

He's one of the cases you can point to when you hear the saying "power is the last thing to come". His power taking a step forward more than we could have expected has turned him into an all star type of talent to being a MVP one.

Brutus
08-26-2010, 08:15 PM
I must admit, I feel like a proud papa.

Bump.....nearly four years later.

Funny how much of this thread was discussing Votto going for the triple crown in '06.

I also found the Triple Crown discussion rather Freudian.