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OnBaseMachine
04-27-2006, 01:29 AM
I'm going into Krusty mode here for a minute. Tell me what you think of this deal.

Reds acquire:

1B Ryan Shealy
RHP Jason Jennings

Rockies acquire:

C Jason LaRue/Javier Valentin(their choice of a catcher)
OF Chris Denorfia
2B William Bergolla

While I would hate to give up Jason LaRue and especially Chris Denorfia, you know the old cliche about giving up something good...Anyway, I have already professed my man-love for Ryan Shealy in other threads so I won't even explain the reasoning of acquiring him. I would suggest looking into Jeff Francis first to see if the Rockies have soured on him, but I imagine they will hang on to him.

Jennings is a guy that I think could succeed outside of Coors Field. He induces a lot of grounds balls with his sinker: 2002-1.64 G/F ratio, 2003-1.51, 2004-1.54, 2005-1.83, 2006-1.18. Again, I think he could turn into a decent pitcher if ever gets out of Coors Field.

Check out his home/road splits:

2002

Home-5.65 ERA
Road-3.35 ERA

2003

Home-4.64 ERA
Road-5.38 ERA

2004

Home-6.15 ERA
Road-4.86 ERA

2005

Home-5.16 ERA
Road-4.87 ERA

2006

Home-5.68 ERA
Road-4.50 ERA(One start)

While his road ERA is still not that great, pitching in Coors Field has a way of messing with your head so I wouldn't worry too much about that. Still only 27 years old, Jennings has already had three seasons of 180+ innings pitched, including a 201 inning season in 2004. Jennings instantly gives the Reds another potentially solid innings eater to stick behind Claussen.

The Rockies need a catcher, the Reds need more pitching, what's not to like about the deal?

LaRue will make 3.9 million is 2006; Jennings 4.5 million. Not too big of a difference and definitely not a deal breaker.

Redeye fly
04-27-2006, 01:39 AM
Depends on just how much Coors has messed with his head and what if any bad habits have resulted from a mechanics standpoint. I'm honestly not real sure what to think of our pitching coach situation. Ruhle has had the health issues this year and I think Hume might be alright but he's still unproven. I'm not sure how much luck we might have with a pitcher we'd have to "fix",even a little. Guys like Daryl Kile and Mike Hampton rebounded after getting out of Coors, but those are two guys who had been successful before and went to better teams that had two of the more highly regarded pitching coaches in baseball in Dave Duncan and Leo Mazzone.

M2
04-27-2006, 01:48 AM
I love the idea of trying to pluck either Jennings or Jeff Francis from the Rockies. Getting Shealy on top of that would be icing on the cake.

I've always maintained that pitchers in that organization have a value that's tumbling rapidly toward zero. Get them at sea level and they might rebound, but at high altitude all they're ever going to achieve is getting their heads kicked in on a regular basis.

WVPacman
04-27-2006, 01:57 AM
I love the idea of trying to pluck either Jennings or Jeff Francis from the Rockies. Getting Shealy on top of that would be icing on the cake.

LOL,M2 I was thinking of the same thing!! Jennings or Francis would help us out alot.I would'nt mind trading Larue b/c I honestly think his days are numbered here b/c he acts like he is'nt happy here and he is always pouting about something like playing time.

As far as our (for now) pitching coach Hume goes I think he has proven his self.Our starting rotation was suppose to be one of the worst in the league this year and he has been a major reason why our starting rotation has'nt been as bad as they said they would be. I know our rotation still has along ways to go to even be mentioned as a GOOD rotation BUT they aren't as bad as they said they was going to be and I thing Hume deserves alot of credit for that.

Redeye fly
04-27-2006, 02:07 AM
A fair point PacMan.

Personally, I'm still of the wait and see mindset when it comes to Hume. I don't know if he's necessarily done anything. I think everyone expected Harang to be pretty solid and as much as I like what Arroyo has done, I wonder if we're seeing a little bit of the Danny Jackson effect here. Beyond those two, there really hasn't been anything to get too excited about. Claussen can give you some good outings. After that it's still pretty ugly and up in the air as to what kind of effort we're going to get from our starting pitchers.

I do like what we did in the spring, bringing in Soto and Browning. I'm sure Rijo could impart some wisdom as well.

WVPacman
04-27-2006, 02:16 AM
Redeye,good post and I see what you are saying about Classen,Williams with their on and off good outings. The way that our pen has started to pitch good on a daily basis if those two could give us 6 inning every outing then we should be in good shape b/c of our pen has finally woke up and started pitching good.I think Hume would be satifyed with those outing IF our pen keeps pitching like that.

buckeyenut
04-27-2006, 06:47 AM
I like the deal. An easy one to pull the trigger on, maybe for both sides.

Personally, I'd rather hold onto Denoforia and deal someone else. I'd also rather deal Valentin and hold onto LaRue. But neither would stop me from doing the deal you have outlined.

Krusty
04-27-2006, 11:29 AM
As mentioned, I like the deal but I would rather keep Denorifia.

Newman4
04-27-2006, 12:11 PM
You guys may want to check out some minor league guys in the Rocks system as well. Look up Juan Morillo and Ubaldo Jimenez. Also, see what you think of Josh Newman's K/9 and BA against.

oneupper
04-27-2006, 02:35 PM
I'd be willling to give them Kearns and Bergolla.
Denorfia continues to rake in AAA (.365/.437/.524). He deserves a shot.

Kearns has more perceived power and therefore is probably a better fit for Colorado.

Guacarock
04-27-2006, 03:10 PM
The Rockies' catching situation is getting more desperate. After 15 games and 48 AB, Ardoin has yet to collect his first RBI and is posting an anemic .188 batting average.

That suggests Larue or Valentin could be a cornerstone to a trade with the Rockies.

Add some major-league ready prospects like Bergolla and Denorfia, and yes, we might swing a starting pitcher in return along with 1B stud Ryan Shealy.

The only fly in the ointment. The Rockies won't want to deal Shealy until Helton returns off the DL, which is still another week or so away. If Helton has a more extended stay on the DL, then Shealy isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

flyer85
04-27-2006, 03:25 PM
The Rockies won't want to deal Shealy until Helton returns off the DLShealy is on the DL as well although I don't see why Helton on the DL is a real issue since Shealy isn't playing.

Sabo Fan
04-27-2006, 04:16 PM
Figure out a way to get J.D. Closser in that deal and it'll be great. Add in a guy like Elizardo and maybe they go for it.

I like the idea of offering a LaRue/Denorfia package around to see what that'll net. I like both of those guys but LaRue has a lot of innings logged on those knees and Denorfia could very well be a player, but I think he's more valuable to this organization as trade bait than as a starting outfielder. I fully expect Jay Bruce to get fast-tracked and be here in 2008 and I'm guessing that Griffey plays one more year after this and won't move from CF, making Denorfia little more than a 4th OF.

flyer85
04-27-2006, 04:19 PM
The real issue is that for the most part their aren't real incentives for teams to make a major trade at this point in the season. Most teams are still the mode of assessing their potential needs and trying to figure out if they are really a contender.

Guacarock
04-27-2006, 04:32 PM
The real issue is that for the most part their aren't real incentives for teams to make a major trade at this point in the season. Most teams are still the mode of assessing their potential needs and trying to figure out if they are really a contender.

But if you're the Rockies and your starting catcher doesn't have an RBI for the first month of the season, that's not just a long-range, potential need -- that's an urgent, festering, gaping hole to plug.

Especially with the Rockies locked in a tie for first place in the NL West with the SF Giants. Admittedly, the two teams are barely above .500, and only a half-game ahead of the Diamondbacks.

But after the many years of famine in Denver, the pressure is building to produce a winner. Even if we don't call them about Shealy, something tells me they might be calling us about our catching surplus.

Aronchis
04-27-2006, 04:36 PM
Deno is just toying with minor league pitching, he needs to be called up somewhere.

I think either Freel or Deno go at some point if Kearns isn't traded.