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View Full Version : how would we treat bonds if he were a red?



toledodan
05-08-2006, 03:37 PM
i know i don't care much for bonds but how would we react and judge him if he played for cincinnati? he was almost dealt to us prior to the 1990 season for scott scudder and another minor league pitcher that i can't remember.

KronoRed
05-08-2006, 03:39 PM
I'd bet 90% of the fan base would love him..sadly.

toledodan
05-08-2006, 03:44 PM
I'd bet 90% of the fan base would love him..sadly.


thats what i was thinking. its like having kids. no matter what they do you still love them. i couldn't even begin to guess how the fan base would react if it were griffey instead of bonds in that situation. i'm glad everyone knows griffey is clean.

Falls City Beer
05-08-2006, 03:44 PM
I'd bet 90% of the fan base would love him..sadly.

No way. Bonds is the antithesis of scrappy. He would have been treated coldly before the steroid thing and out and out destroyed afterwards.

flyer85
05-08-2006, 03:47 PM
I have never liked Bonds but I can honestly say I don't know how I would react if he had been a Red.

Red Heeler
05-08-2006, 03:47 PM
Bonds would never have been well liked in Cincy, a city that did not embrace Eric Davis in his prime. Cincinnati likes tough, little white guys who get their uniforms dirty early and often. Bonds regular pulling of the race card would not have played well.

Falls City Beer
05-08-2006, 03:54 PM
Bonds would never have been well liked in Cincy, a city that did not embrace Eric Davis in his prime. Cincinnati likes tough, little white guys who get their uniforms dirty early and often. Bonds regular pulling of the race card would not have played well.

Right. I'd go so far as to say that Bonds in Cincinnati would have been an absolute impossibility. Not from a money standpoint, but from a fan disfavor perspective.

Red Heeler
05-08-2006, 03:57 PM
Right. I'd go so far as to say that Bonds in Cincinnati would have been an absolute impossibility. Not from a money standpoint, but from a fan disfavor perspective.

I agree. Even had he been traded to the Reds, he would not have been long for the team. Fan pressure would have ridden him out of town even had his monetary demands not.

Falls City Beer
05-08-2006, 04:00 PM
Think about how Cincinnatians treat a good ole boy from Texas when he drops a few fly balls and whiffs a bit too often. Then imagine that leftfielder is Bonds. Ouch.

MattyHo4Life
05-08-2006, 04:01 PM
Bonds would never have been well liked in Cincy, a city that did not embrace Eric Davis in his prime. Cincinnati likes tough, little white guys who get their uniforms dirty early and often. Bonds regular pulling of the race card would not have played well.

Sounds just like St. Louis.

Roy Tucker
05-08-2006, 04:18 PM
He would have lasted in Cincinnati about as long as he did in Pittsburgh. Once he was free agent eligible, he would have been long gone for the big bucks. Which I can't blame him for.

I have to say, I positively and absolutely couldn't stand Deion Sanders before his stint(s) with the Reds. Even though I still think he was one of the biggest hot dogs that ever lived, I think of him a little bit more kindly because of his Reds years.

Falls City Beer
05-08-2006, 04:20 PM
I have to say, I positively and absolutely couldn't stand Deion Sanders before his stint(s) with the Reds. Even though I still think he was one of the biggest hot dogs that ever lived, I think of him a little bit more kindly because of his Reds years.

"It Must Be the Money."

smith288
05-08-2006, 04:51 PM
I would loathed his signing....

I dont like Pete Rose (as a person) and I wouldnt like Bonds.

Big Daddy P
05-08-2006, 04:53 PM
I'd treat him like the lying, nasty, racist, cheating man that he
is.

Any questions?

top6
05-08-2006, 04:54 PM
didn't we almost trade for him again when he was with the Giants? i'm almost positive that Bowden said this once.

EDIT:

after some further research, I don't think it's fair to say we "almost" traded for him. but it sounds like Bowden tried to get him.

http://www.cincypost.com/sports/bonds021100.html

smith288
05-08-2006, 04:59 PM
Chances are that if the Reds had acquired Bonds they wouldn't have been able to afford Junior.

Chances are Bonds would have been gone shortly after AND we would have been out a Ken Griffey Jr. too. Glad that didnt occur.

Blimpie
05-08-2006, 05:16 PM
I think Adam Dunn would have every right to ask that his recliner be retrieved from the dumpster.

BCubb2003
05-08-2006, 05:40 PM
Like Pete Rose.

TOBTTReds
05-08-2006, 06:09 PM
How could anyone think we would love this guy? Especially when 3/4 the reds fans dislike Griffey when he is hurt. He is supposed to be a very nice PERSON, and a lot fun with media and others.

Reds fans are VERY bandwagon. Who is calling for Freel to play every single day today? He is batting .205 in the last 3 weeks or so and I haven't heard anyone cry when he is benched. I'd say we would love him during his 73 year, then dislike him during any decent.

registerthis
05-08-2006, 06:41 PM
I've just been thnking about this, and I realized that Bonds is the first player who is threatening a long-established number and I've been actively rooting for him to fail. I cheered for him when he hit 74, I cheered for McGwire and Sosa, I've cheered for pretty much every other player when they achieve such rare heights.

But not Bonds. And I think that is a really sad commentary.

Mario-Rijo
05-08-2006, 07:09 PM
I just don't like the guy, and nothing would change that. I hated Kal Daniels because of his holier than thou attitude, of course I didn't realize how bad his attitude was until he left the uniform. Before that he was actually a favorite of mine. Had I known I might have tried to be more understanding as to why his 'tude sucked, then again if I didn't feel it was a good enough reason (unlikely) it would not have changed my mind. If he had a good reason I might have changed my stance a bit, but not enough to call him a favorite again.

I see Bonds as a much more hated version of Kal Daniels. And even though I have come to respect some parts of his game and he has been able to shake the "Choke" label a bit in my mind, he's still a horse's rear end and most likely the most succesful cheater of all time. The bottom line is he's simply too arrogant, too much of a primadonna and too much of a clubhouse cancer for me to ever have "liked" him.

That said I would have put up with most of it had he been a Cincinnati Red. Sans the cheating!!!!!!!

Jr's Boy
05-08-2006, 07:19 PM
After seeing that laser lastnight he hit,I wish the Reds would have gotten him in his prime.

Blimpie
05-08-2006, 07:32 PM
After seeing that laser lastnight he hit,I wish the Reds would have gotten him in his prime.Ironically, in his prime, Barry was not hitting lasers like the one last night....

KronoRed
05-08-2006, 07:33 PM
No way. Bonds is the antithesis of scrappy. He would have been treated coldly before the steroid thing and out and out destroyed afterwards.
He is now, but way back when he stole a lot of pointless bases and that seems to be filed under scrappy ;)

The_jbh
05-08-2006, 08:40 PM
this board? hell i dont think there is a player we like if hes even playing mediocore. Some people think Adam Dunn is the problem here what if he had bonds? WORSE than womack or aurilla?

Sham
05-08-2006, 08:53 PM
Bonds would never have been well liked in Cincy, a city that did not embrace Eric Davis in his prime. Cincinnati likes tough, little white guys who get their uniforms dirty early and often. Bonds regular pulling of the race card would not have played well.

Great point about ED. There was so much negativity around that guy, and he never played the race card, and even tolerated it when Marge called him her million dollar ---. Man, I liked him, he was a good man. Pete Rose, not so much.

StillFunkyB
05-08-2006, 10:37 PM
One needs only to look at how KGJ has been treated to know the answer to the title of this thread.

KGJ has been treated like absolute garbage for something that is beyond his control.

You think Bonds would be treated better for allegedly (this is America, last time I checked, and until proven guilty...) cheating?

BTW, I'm not defending Bonds either, but nothing has been proven yet. Sadly, I don't think we will ever know the truth.

registerthis
05-09-2006, 11:08 AM
You think Bonds would be treated better for allegedly (this is America, last time I checked, and until proven guilty...) cheating?

BTW, I'm not defending Bonds either, but nothing has been proven yet. Sadly, I don't think we will ever know the truth.

You know, I really get tired of people busting out the line about "This is America, everyone's innocent until proven guilty." Bullocks.

People are considered innocent in terms of their legal culpability. "Innocent until proven guilty" has jack-all to do with people's opinions and feelings. The two have nothing to do with each other, people really need to wrap their head around that concept.

Falls City Beer
05-09-2006, 11:18 AM
You know, I really get tired of people busting out the line about "This is America, everyone's innocent until proven guilty." Bullocks.

People are considered innocent in terms of their legal culpability. "Innocent until proven guilty" has jack-all to do with people's opinions and feelings. The two have nothing to do with each other, people really need to wrap their head around that concept.

While you're right, it doesn't have anything to do with people's emotions and feelings, it's not a bad check for stanching mob mentality, in all of its loose forms. No, it's not a court of law, but it is equally flawed and simplistic to pretend to know things that one can't honestly possibly know.

Most of the worst opinions (and yes, some opinions and feelings ARE bad, wrong morally--not simply misguided) arise from kneejerk, unexamined feelings and emotions.

westofyou
05-09-2006, 11:26 AM
You know, I really get tired of people busting out the line about "This is America, everyone's innocent until proven guilty." Bullocks.

People are considered innocent in terms of their legal culpability. "Innocent until proven guilty" has jack-all to do with people's opinions and feelings. The two have nothing to do with each other, people really need to wrap their head around that concept.
I get tired of the aligning of real crimes with the crime a man committed against his body and a game that has morped into a business myself.

vic715
05-09-2006, 02:00 PM
I was in the stands the night that Joe Morgan came back to Cincy for the 1st time with the Astro's. I'll never forget the way the Boo-birds drilled him that night. Here was a 2 time MVP for 2 World Championship teams just 5 years earlier and he was treated like dirt. Its Hard to say that the fans here treat players of color differently because I was also there the night Perez came home and I was almost afraid the Stadium was going to collapse for the thundering footsteps and cheering going on.But it does seem that guys like Davis, Parker and even Griffey are not given the benifit of the doubt when they are hurt or not playing up to par.So in that retrospect Bonds wouldn't last half a season here. It would be very hard to embrace him as a Red.

vaticanplum
05-09-2006, 03:32 PM
Great point about ED. There was so much negativity around that guy, and he never played the race card, and even tolerated it when Marge called him her million dollar ---. Man, I liked him, he was a good man.

He's also extremely even-handed about this in his autobiography. He addresses the racism issue, critically but not angrily, but also tells some great anecdotes about those brief moments in Cincinnati when people went out of their way to tell him how much he meant to them. It's extraordinary really, and normally I'm not a big fan of comparisons...but here is Bonds, born with a silver spoon in his mouth, raised in privilege in the Bay area, blessed with a legendary baseball lineage with both his father and grandfather, naturally gifted, every advantage, vs. Davis who came up from poverty in LA, surrounded by drugs, and just played, played, played. I don't mean to say that Bonds's life has been inherently easy, but Davis really made good, didn't he?

Eric Davis's autobiography is full of errors, both factual and grammatical, but it's a fun, fun read that I'd recommend to Reds fans. I can send people extra copies (I have three. No, really.)

OUReds
05-09-2006, 03:42 PM
I get tired of the aligning of real crimes with the crime a man committed against his body and a game that has morped into a business myself.

With respect, I thought it was illegal to purchase/aquire steroids without a valid perscription/medical reason.

registerthis
05-09-2006, 04:28 PM
Most of the worst opinions (and yes, some opinions and feelings ARE bad, wrong morally--not simply misguided) arise from kneejerk, unexamined feelings and emotions.

True, but I don't think that's the case here. People's anger at Bonds I think can be explained because Bonds is the figurehead of the bloated, steroids-infused baseball player. He's the brightest star to have been caught with his hands in the cookie jar, and people aren't happy about that. Bonds has never been a popular player--respected once, but never a fan favorite--so I don't think you can classify the vitriol being spewed at Bonds as "kneejerk."

I mean, I've disliked the guy since the mid-90s. :)

registerthis
05-09-2006, 04:29 PM
I get tired of the aligning of real crimes with the crime a man committed against his body and a game that has morped into a business myself.

Oh come on, you've been on the Peanut gallery, you know I get angry at a lot more than 'roids, WOY. :D

Redeye fly
05-09-2006, 11:57 PM
I just don't like the guy, and nothing would change that. I hated Kal Daniels because of his holier than thou attitude, of course I didn't realize how bad his attitude was until he left the uniform. Before that he was actually a favorite of mine. Had I known I might have tried to be more understanding as to why his 'tude sucked, then again if I didn't feel it was a good enough reason (unlikely) it would not have changed my mind. If he had a good reason I might have changed my stance a bit, but not enough to call him a favorite again.

I see Bonds as a much more hated version of Kal Daniels. And even though I have come to respect some parts of his game and he has been able to shake the "Choke" label a bit in my mind, he's still a horse's rear end and most likely the most succesful cheater of all time. The bottom line is he's simply too arrogant, too much of a primadonna and too much of a clubhouse cancer for me to ever have "liked" him.

That said I would have put up with most of it had he been a Cincinnati Red. Sans the cheating!!!!!!!

You know, I seriously wonder if the Kal Daniels attitude issue was a little bit overblown. I say this only because of an exchange I overheard between Kal and another player one time. This was when I was in junior high or high school, so it would have been late 80's/early 90's. I think it was right about the time Kal went (was traded to?) the Dodgers. Even though he was no longer a Red, Kal was traveling with some Reds, and uh, I guess Reds relatives (like Byron Larkin) in those Reds vs. your high school faculty basketball games. At halftime I remember going with everybody else to get some autographs from some Reds. I don't remember who the player was, but he was sitting right beside Kal, and asked "How's your attitude, Kal?", and Kal said in what seemed to be a joking or sarcastic tone "It's getting worse!"

Now I don't know, that particular player could have been a close friend or someone who would have been inclined to defend Kal. But it's possible the whole thing could have been overblown, at least a little. Two sides to every story I guess. If a player just doesn't want to talk to the media because he's a little more introverted, be might be described in said media as "moody, difficult, and having a bad attitude".

Red Heeler
05-10-2006, 09:57 AM
I wouldn't really say that Daniels had a bad attitude, exactly. It is just that he, like Willie Greene after him, did not seem to want to be a baseball player.