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View Full Version : Freel needs regular days off



RedsManRick
05-18-2006, 02:12 PM
I've always been one who says Freel should be playing every day based on his performance. However, I've got to say, he was really struggling the last 2 weeks or so. Since given a few days off, he's looking much better. Not that I want him on the bench, but there really seems to be some merit to the idea that to get his best, he needs to have regular days off.

jimbo
05-18-2006, 02:18 PM
I'd like to see the guy harness his aggressiveness somewhat. He's had too many rally killers lately by making bonehead mistakes on the basepaths. I like Freel's approach to the game but he isn't a smart player. I like his role as a utilility guy who will average around 3-4 starts a week.

Falls City Beer
05-18-2006, 02:23 PM
There may validity to it; trouble is with that theory, Freel put up his best numbers as an everyday starter in 2004. So, the numbers say otherwise.

Kc61
05-18-2006, 02:23 PM
I will take this guy on my team any day. He does make overaggressive errors. But he also gets on base and makes things happen.

Right now, I would dump about 15 of these guys for nothing. I'd keep Freel

Falls City Beer
05-18-2006, 02:24 PM
I will take this guy on my team any day. He does make overaggressive errors. But he also gets on base and makes things happen.

Right now, I would dump about 15 of these guys for nothing. I'd keep Freel

In large part I agree.

NJReds
05-18-2006, 02:25 PM
There may validity to it; trouble is with that theory, Freel put up his best numbers as an everyday starter in 2004. So, the numbers say otherwise.

Was that 'pre' toe injury?

Falls City Beer
05-18-2006, 02:27 PM
Was that 'pre' toe injury?

I don't know. He was excellent in 103 games in 2005. No, that's not an everyday player, but what it does tell me is that Freel produces when he's in the lineup not out of it.

dabvu2498
05-18-2006, 02:28 PM
Was Freel hitting leadoff in 2004???

Falls City Beer
05-18-2006, 02:33 PM
Was Freel hitting leadoff in 2004???

I believe so. Does it make much difference *where* he was hitting? In a full-season's worth of ABs, he had a .375 OBP. And used great speed. He was an elite top of the order hitter.

dabvu2498
05-18-2006, 02:57 PM
I believe so. Does it make much difference *where* he was hitting? In a full-season's worth of ABs, he had a .375 OBP. And used great speed. He was an elite top of the order hitter.

I'd say it matters to the pitchers who were pitching to him where he was hitting in the order.

ochre
05-18-2006, 03:01 PM
Only the first time through the order.

dabvu2498
05-18-2006, 03:06 PM
Only the first time through the order.

Hitting after the pitcher (1st) or before (8th) would matter quite a bit most every AB.

RedsManRick
05-18-2006, 03:10 PM
I don't know. He was excellent in 103 games in 2005. No, that's not an everyday player, but what it does tell me is that Freel produces when he's in the lineup not out of it.

Umm.. duh?

The point is that in any 15 game stretch, it's possible we'll get better production out of 12 games of Freel and 3 of somebody else than we would out of 15 games of Freel.

I'm not advocating he play only 2-3 times a week. I'm saying he shouldn't be playing 20 days in a row without a day off. There's some grey room to play with there...

dabvu2498
05-18-2006, 03:12 PM
I'm not advocating he play only 2-3 times a week. I'm saying he shouldn't be playing 20 days in a row without a day off. There's some grey room to play with there...

I like the idea of him getting 15/20 plate appearances per week. If he's hot, ride him, if he's cold, play him less. That's one thing the "depth" of this team should allow once (if) everyone is healthy.

Falls City Beer
05-18-2006, 03:14 PM
Umm.. duh?

The point is that in any 15 game stretch, it's possible we'll get better production out of 12 games of Freel and 3 of somebody else than we would out of 15 games of Freel.

I'm not advocating he play only 2-3 times a week. I'm saying he shouldn't be playing 20 days in a row without a day off. There's some grey room to play with there...

So glad you picked up on the sarcasm.

I'll make it easy. Freel. Leadoff.

And spend your time worrying how to relegate Phillips to the bench.

RedsManRick
05-18-2006, 04:09 PM
So glad you picked up on the sarcasm.

I'll make it easy. Freel. Leadoff.

And spend your time worrying how to relegate Phillips to the bench.

I decided to look at Freel by month since 2004 -- AB's and the standard 3 stats.

4/04: 67 AB, .254/.296/.403 - .699 OPS, 3 SB
5/04: 86 AB, .244/.381/.326 - .707, 5
6/04: 84 AB, .274/.408/.321 - .729, 6
7/04: 92 AB, .315/.394/.348 - .742, 6
8/04: 83 AB, .253/.354/.325 - .679, 8
9/04: 93 AB, .312/.390/.484 - .874, 9

4/05: 44 AB, .341/.453/.455 - .907, 5
5/05: 92 AB, .304/.418/.467 - .886, 8
6/05: 45 AB, .200/.333/.222 - .556, 8 (DL on 6/19)
7/05: 41 AB, .366/.409/.439 - .848, 8 (5 in LA) (off DL on 7/20)
8/05: 44 AB, .182/.234/.295 - .529, 0 (DL on 8/16)
9/05: 95 AB, .253/.355/.337 - .691, 7 (off DL on 9/4)

4/06: 76 AB, .263/.434/.329 - .763, 8
5/06: 39 AB, .179/.220/.205 - .425, 2

I'm not sure if there's anything to be made from this other than:
- his worst OPS month in 2004 came after a 92 AB month
- he was horrible and injured in May 05 after a 92 AB month
- he was initiatially good upon returning from DL in July, hit & ran his ass off for 2 weeks, then sucked again and went back on the DL in August
- he played all of Sept 05 and had an average month
- he played quite a bit in April (busiest April of his career) then tanked in May in '06

Now I'm am fully aware of all sample size considerations and the inherent performance variabilty of any major leaguer. Offensively speaking, I would much rather have Freel out there than a Womack or Phillips. However, if sitting Freel twice week means a day of Rich Aurilia or Scott Hatteberg and it means the .280/.400./.450 version of Freel when he's in there and keeping him off the DL, I'd take it.

griffeyfreak4
05-19-2006, 09:05 AM
Freel is the best leadoff hitter we got, and should play the majority of the games. He is a great defensive centerfielder, and should also play there most of the time. I agree with you that he does need some rest, but he should play majority of the time.

This guy is great at creating things on the basepaths and scoring runs. He does make mistakes, but who doesn't? He is way better than Deno, and should play over him any day of the week.

Maybe it's just me, but a Freel, FeLo combo is a lot more dangerous than a Deno, FeLo combo, but I have been hearing a lot lately that Deno is more wanted than Freel.

jimbo
05-19-2006, 11:58 AM
This guy is great at creating things on the basepaths and scoring runs. He does make mistakes, but who doesn't?

Freel makes a lot of mental mistakes on the basepaths and has been a rally killer twice in the last two weeks because of those mistakes. I like Freel, I just don't make him up to be what a lot of Reds fans do. I don't think he is a smart player and he has shown that he is not effective when he plays everyday. I like him in the utility role where he is now getting 3-4 starts a week.

Falls City Beer
05-19-2006, 12:11 PM
I like him in the utility role where he is now getting 3-4 starts a week.

I wouldn't mind this if Freel were being platooned with another good-fielding, smart-hitting guy like Denorfia. But that's not how the team is currently operating, so I want Freel in there as often as humanly possible.

jimbo
05-19-2006, 12:43 PM
I wouldn't mind this if Freel were being platooned with another good-fielding, smart-hitting guy like Denorfia. But that's not how the team is currently operating, so I want Freel in there as often as humanly possible.

With Phillips' numbers declining, a platoon at second base is becoming a possibility.

Falls City Beer
05-19-2006, 03:27 PM
With Phillips' numbers declining, a platoon at second base is becoming a possibility.

If I'm the Reds' manager, Phillips is a pinch-runner, a la Dave Roberts.

KronoRed
05-19-2006, 03:45 PM
I think Phillips' D is a little better then Dave Roberts ;)

Raisor
05-19-2006, 03:53 PM
I need a day off myself.

KronoRed
05-19-2006, 04:16 PM
I need a day off myself.
You are not scrappy then.