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View Full Version : Dave Williams DFA!



Danny Serafini
05-20-2006, 01:48 PM
Just came up on the team press notes.

reds44
05-20-2006, 01:50 PM
YES!!!!!!!!

Woo-hoo!!

Thank God we made the right choice!

:beerme: :beerme: :beerme:

gitrdunn44
05-20-2006, 01:51 PM
Woo hoo!

TeamBoone
05-20-2006, 01:51 PM
Wow! Though it should have happened, I'm stunned that it actually did.

You go Krivsky!

Redhook
05-20-2006, 01:52 PM
I now have even more respect now for Narron and Krivsky. That's great news in more ways than one! :jump:

Joseph
05-20-2006, 01:53 PM
Amazing that this guy was the best we could have gotten for Casey. I guess the DFA shows he wasn't injured as was speculated.

fisch11
05-20-2006, 01:54 PM
Good news. Hopefully this gives Elizardo the spot in the rotation.

reds44
05-20-2006, 01:55 PM
Wow we DFA'd him even though he has an option left? That is kind of surprising, but either way I like it.

Glad Krivs didn't let the Casey trade get in the way of making the right move.

Caveat Emperor
05-20-2006, 01:56 PM
Amazing that this guy was the best we could have gotten for Casey. I guess the DFA shows he wasn't injured as was speculated.

Tony Womack - DFA
Dave Williams - DFA

As bad as Dan O'Brien got trashed on this board, maybe even we really didn't appreciate what an absolutely awful general manager he was.

Good move, I suppose -- though now I wonder if they'll actually find a trading partner for him. Are the Mets desperate enough?

Joseph
05-20-2006, 01:59 PM
I can't imagine anyone giving up anything for Dave Williams unless they think he was tipping his pitches and can fix it. Sorry, bad joke.

Heath
05-20-2006, 02:03 PM
I hope Dave Williams enjoys Louisville. Maybe he can pal around with Joe & Darrell.

Chip R
05-20-2006, 02:04 PM
Wow we DFA'd him even though he has an option left? That is kind of surprising, but either way I like it.

Glad Krivs didn't let the Casey trade get in the way of making the right move.
Very surprising they would do that instead of sending him to AAA. Now watch the Cards sign him and see him stick the ball up our collective youknowwhats when he pitches against us.

jimbo
05-20-2006, 02:06 PM
I'm just so happy to hear that Krivsky and Co. made the right decision, and not the politically correct one. I am gaining more and more respect for this new owner and GM everyday.

Joseph
05-20-2006, 02:07 PM
Question:

Do I recall correctly that the DFA means we have 10 days to trade, release, or outright him to the minors? Could this be simply rolling the dice to remove him from the 40 man then? Or perhaps do I remember that incorrectly?

westofyou
05-20-2006, 02:08 PM
Designated for Assignment

You'll sometimes read that a player has been "designated for assignment."

What does this mean? Essentially, it allows a club to open up a roster spot while it figures out what it's going to do with a player. As we'll see below, there are certain situations in which a team needs a player's permission to either trade him or send him to the minors. So rather than force the player to make a quick decision, the team can simply designate him for assignment while he decides.

More commonly, a player is designated for assignment so the club can open up his roster spot while they're waiting for him to clear waivers, which can take four or five days. Occasionally, a club will designate a player for assignment while they're trying to trade him. That's what happened to Hideo Nomo this past June.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/s/transanctionsprimer.html

Fullboat
05-20-2006, 02:09 PM
Talk about Addition by Subtraction.:thumbup:

Joseph
05-20-2006, 02:13 PM
Thanks WOY.

So essentially then, there is still the chance that he ends up in Louisville to work on things if he's not claimed.

Not saying it will happen, but that it could happen, ala Danny Graves in Cleveland recently.

cincyinco
05-20-2006, 02:15 PM
I generally never feel good about someone losing their job, and still not sure I feel good for Dave Williams... but I sure do feel good for the Cincinnati Reds. Outside of his 2nd from last start, and his first start, he's been attrocious.

Out with the old and in with the new!

Reds4Life
05-20-2006, 02:17 PM
Well, gotta give it to Wayne and Big Bob, they aren't afraid to dump anyone at anytime.

CTA513
05-20-2006, 02:21 PM
Heres the transaction from espn.com

Activated pitcher Eric Milton from the 15-day disabled list; designated pitcher Dave Williams for assignment.

:thumbup:

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:22 PM
Thinking like the bean counter that I am, I wonder how big of a reserve the new owners put out there to cover "Correcting errors of prior front office?" :evil:

Hopefully there's enough left to get rid of Rick White's $1M salary eventually as well.

This is a very encouraging move from the perspective of giving bad players/pitchers very little leash.

NatiRedGals
05-20-2006, 02:25 PM
Joe Mays wont be as bad as this guy! But idk what happen to Williams i know he aint that bad i mean he did make it this far any info on family problems or life problems?

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 02:26 PM
:)

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:29 PM
Joe Mays wont be as bad as this guy! But idk what happen to Williams i know he aint that bad i mean he did make it this far any info on family problems or life problems?i can think of a life problem he now has...like where he will be moving to next.

oneupper
05-20-2006, 02:33 PM
The Pirates will pick him up, essencially making the Casey trade a giveaway.

UPRedsFan
05-20-2006, 02:34 PM
So when Ramirez goes to the #5 spot, who goes to long relief? I guess is may be Belisle by default but I'd rather see him get more regular work to develop into the 7th inning guy.

Dunner44
05-20-2006, 02:38 PM
Horray!!!!

reds44
05-20-2006, 02:39 PM
This offeseason under O'Brien:
Reds trade Sean Casey to Pirates for Dave Williams
Reds trade for Tony Womack, announce him starting 2nd baseman

Under Krivsky this season:
Reds DFA Tony Womack

Then today:
Activated pitcher Eric Milton from the 15-day disabled list; designated pitcher Dave Williams for assignment

Dan'O was the worst GM in the history of baseball. Thank God he was fired and Krivsky is now here.

membengal
05-20-2006, 02:39 PM
Once again, Krivsky earns my trust. Bless him.

Redhook
05-20-2006, 02:41 PM
Well, gotta give it to Wayne and Big Bob, they aren't afraid to dump anyone at anytime.

This also furthers my belief that Bob will definitely spend at/or before the trading deadline if we're still in contention. Ownership is really making all the right moves. It's fun to see this team and organization evolve into a winner. :beerme:

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:42 PM
Now, get rid of McCracken and quit yanking Denorfia around

Kc61
05-20-2006, 02:43 PM
Time to give the Lizard the full shot. He is still young, but seems to have some good attributes. Good command and doesn't seem to fade in the sixth and seventh innings. May be a touch short on stuff, but only 23 and could become a harder thrower as he develops physically.

Like Shackelford, I think Lizard deserves a full major league shot based on performance. Shack has struggled a bit this year, but you can't leave minor leaguers at AAA forever. Once a guy earns a shot by his performance, he should get it, and Lizard deserves it now.

Kc61
05-20-2006, 02:45 PM
The Pirates will pick him up, essencially making the Casey trade a giveaway.

Fine with me. I can live with Hatte and Aurilia at first base for awhile. Combined they cost a lot less than Casey.

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:47 PM
Kc,

I agree. Lizard has shown growth thus far from last year, which isn't surprising considering he has always had great control. Now, he seems to be using the control to his advantage, as in keeping the ball down and on the edges. The development of the changeup has also helped give him a third pitch. Good to see the old guy with no ceiling gone instead of playing the options game like we grew so accustomed to under the last two regimes.

Redhook
05-20-2006, 02:49 PM
Now, get rid of McCracken and quit yanking Denorfia around

I think McCracken is already packing his bags. Do you think they'll call up Deno over Cody Ross? Ross' assignment is almost over. We'll risk losing him if we don't bring him up here.

Tommyjohn25
05-20-2006, 02:49 PM
You know what's cool? As a Reds fan I have come to expect the worst from the Front Office for the last several years, Rcast and Kriv are breaking the mold and restoring my long lost faith and optimism with moves like this one.

:thumbup:

Aronchis
05-20-2006, 02:50 PM
There is the 2nd contract eaten, more to come.............

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 02:51 PM
I think McCracken is already packing his bags. Do you think they'll call up Deno over Cody Ross? Ross' assignment is almost over. We'll risk losing him if we don't bring him up here.
I wouldn't lose too much sleep if we lost Cody Ross.

reds44
05-20-2006, 02:52 PM
I would much rather have Ross up here in a part time role then Deno. Keep Deno in AAA until he can get consistent at bats up here.

oneupper
05-20-2006, 02:52 PM
Fine with me. I can live with Hatte and Aurilia at first base for awhile. Combined they cost a lot less than Casey.

Oh..I agree, but it's just ironic. And shows what a bad return DanO got for Sean.

That would make it ironic AND moronic.

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:52 PM
I think McCracken is already packing his bags. Do you think they'll call up Deno over Cody Ross? Ross' assignment is almost over. We'll risk losing him if we don't bring him up here.Good point. Forgot about Ross being on the rehab stint. Ok, so trade one of Kearns, Freel, Griffey or LaRue, for pitching, get rid of McCracken, and bring up Denorfia at that time.

traderumor
05-20-2006, 02:55 PM
I wouldn't lose too much sleep if we lost Cody Ross.
Ross is going to get a shot, they traded for him and are eventually going to give something up. That would be very wasteful to release him without giving him any chance at all.

pedro
05-20-2006, 02:55 PM
I think McCracken is already packing his bags. Do you think they'll call up Deno over Cody Ross? Ross' assignment is almost over. We'll risk losing him if we don't bring him up here.


I believe they acquired Ross to be a spare OF so I believe he is the one that will get the call. I think they'll keep Denorfia in the minors to stay sharp in case they trade an OF or one becomes injured.

Reds4Life
05-20-2006, 02:55 PM
I doubt the market for LaRue is going to be that good. My guess would be that Kearns gets moved. The Yankees want him, but they've got nothing in minors for us. :(

Redhook
05-20-2006, 02:57 PM
I wouldn't lose too much sleep if we lost Cody Ross.

I wouldn't either. However, Wayne seems to have the magical touch right now. He brought Phillips here, gave him a chance, and he's turning into a really good player. I trust Wayne's evaluation of talent. I'd like to see Cody Ross play, just to see if he's any good.

Kc61
05-20-2006, 02:58 PM
I wouldn't worry too much about Ross, McCracken, Denorfia and all that. Backup outfielders is not the main issue.

The bullpen is the main issue. Now that the rotation looks semi decent for awhile, the bullpen must be addressed.

CTA513
05-20-2006, 03:01 PM
I wouldn't lose too much sleep if we lost Cody Ross.

Then it would have been a waste to trade for him and then let him go without giving him a chance.

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 03:07 PM
Then it would have been a waste to trade for him and then let him go without giving him a chance.
Just like Womack...except Womack wasn't acquired by Kriv. Ross will be activated and Q will go home, but I don't think Ross gives us much more than Deno would. I mean, I saw Deno save a baby from a burning building on the news last night. What else does this guy need to prove?

Dunner44
05-20-2006, 03:19 PM
Could Ross and McQ both stay up? With DW gone, the pen is not going to be nearly as overworked. I don't think Burns has worked an inning yet, so there's no need to keep him around (unless he replaces Rick White ;) )

GOREDSGO32
05-20-2006, 03:26 PM
Drop McCracken and White next. Ross is a good player, I saw him play last night, he was 2-3 with an RBI .. he's been tearing it up .. why just let him go and keep an aging sub .200 pinch hitter?

redsrule2500
05-20-2006, 03:30 PM
He did have that one good outing...or was it two?

One against the Nationals and the other against the Cards B Team?

CrackerJack
05-20-2006, 03:39 PM
Good news on this sunny Saturday afternoon. Just saw this thread and was made aware of it. Thank God we no longer have to endure him.

Dan O'brien - the legacy continues.

redsrule2500
05-20-2006, 03:48 PM
Why did we hire Dan Obrien anyway? Before he even came here you could tell he would fail. From the Rangers to the Reds...great idea!

Tommyjohn25
05-20-2006, 03:51 PM
Yeah I'd like to see what C Ross can do up here. Besides, it would be a shame to let him go when his only AB resulted in getting hbp by Oswalt.

Matt700wlw
05-20-2006, 03:56 PM
I'm so glad to have a competent baseball man as the GM.

He makes the right decisions to help this team WIN...what a nice change of pace.

You stink...you go. Period.

Too bad Krivsky has to keep cleaning up Dan's messes....but he's doing a hell of a job so far.

Aronchis
05-20-2006, 03:57 PM
Why did we hire Dan Obrien anyway? Before he even came here you could tell he would fail. From the Rangers to the Reds...great idea!

We were close to a sale.

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 03:59 PM
Billy Wagner quietly choking this game away...what a meltdown.

traderumor
05-20-2006, 04:01 PM
I wouldn't worry too much about Ross, McCracken, Denorfia and all that. Backup outfielders is not the main issue.

The bullpen is the main issue. Now that the rotation looks semi decent for awhile, the bullpen must be addressed.
Those players and the degree of depth they provide make things like addressing the bullpen possible through trade.

Matt700wlw
05-20-2006, 04:03 PM
I think McCracken is already packing his bags. Do you think they'll call up Deno over Cody Ross? Ross' assignment is almost over. We'll risk losing him if we don't bring him up here.

I don't think they're going to call Denorfia up until there's a spot for him to play everyday.

That day could come this season....but right now, it's not here.

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 04:08 PM
I don't think they're going to call Denorfia up until there's a spot for him to play everyday.

That day could come this season....but right now, it's not here.
I think that is just a convenient excuse. The guy will be 26 in 2 months and has proven that he is done with AAA. If he was 22 then I would agree with keeping him down there, but at 26 he should be in the majors everyday. With the amt of lineup shuffling Narron does, Deno would get plenty of ABs.

Kc61
05-20-2006, 04:11 PM
Those players and the degree of depth they provide make things like addressing the bullpen possible through trade.

I agree. For example, if a catcher goes, Cody Ross or Denorfia will probably take his place on the bench. Good to have the depth.

But the main issue for this team is not McCracken vs. Ross vs. Denorfia. I think they will all get a shot eventually. McCracken is a switch hitter and I don't mind having him around for awhile (although that error really set me off).

The Reds must get another late inning reliever who can spell Coffey and Weathers. With Mercker hurt and generally unsteady this year, this is an absolute must.

Red in Chicago
05-20-2006, 04:15 PM
wow, i'm imprest that they decided to do this, but like chip said earlier, watch the cards turn him into the next cy young ;)

KronoRed
05-20-2006, 04:16 PM
:clap:

If this were Dan O he would have waited till July :D

Heath
05-20-2006, 04:17 PM
:clap:

If this were Dan O he would have waited till July :D

of 2007.

He's a left-hander, you know.

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 04:19 PM
I agree. For example, if a catcher goes, Cody Ross or Denorfia will probably take his place on the bench. Good to have the depth.

But the main issue for this team is not McCracken vs. Ross vs. Denorfia. I think they will all get a shot eventually. McCracken is a switch hitter and I don't mind having him around for awhile (although that error really set me off).

The Reds must get another late inning reliever who can spell Coffey and Weathers. With Mercker hurt and generally unsteady this year, this is an absolute must.
Agreed, but we need more than 1.

Aronchis
05-20-2006, 04:21 PM
Agreed, but we need more than 1.

But that is all your likely to get, or at least be effective. The Reds probably can turn 1 more starter and 1 more reliever, but your reaching after that.

MrCinatit
05-20-2006, 04:36 PM
And Dan0's legacy continues to shine brighter than a burnt out match buried in the sand.
Good move. I really don't think sticking Williams in the pen would have been an answer, either.

LexingtonRedsFan
05-20-2006, 04:37 PM
anyone think that brandon claussen is sweating bullets as he might be next on the "perform or get chopped" block?

KronoRed
05-20-2006, 04:39 PM
I can't imagine anyone giving up anything for Dave Williams unless they think he was tipping his pitches and can fix it. Sorry, bad joke.
Hey..someone picked up Danny Graves ;)

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 04:42 PM
anyone think that brandon claussen is sweating bullets as he might be next on the "perform or get chopped" block?
I think Claussen has a longer leash. But I don't think anyone is safe.

kyred14
05-20-2006, 04:44 PM
anyone think that brandon claussen is sweating bullets as he might be next on the "perform or get chopped" block?

Umm..... no

Redhook
05-20-2006, 04:48 PM
Ross is a good player, I saw him play last night, he was 2-3 with an RBI .. he's been tearing it up .. why just let him go and keep an aging sub .200 pinch hitter?

I haven't seen Ross play yet, and I would guess that most of us here haven't either since he's only had one at-bat for the Reds and not too many with the Dodgers earlier this year. How good is he? You can tell alot about someone watching them play. I'm just curious. Could you compare him to anybody?

Falls City Beer
05-20-2006, 04:48 PM
anyone think that brandon claussen is sweating bullets as he might be next on the "perform or get chopped" block?

As long as he doesn't show up 17 pounds overweight. :devil:

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 04:50 PM
You can tell alot about someone watching them play.
You don't say...

Marty and Joe
05-20-2006, 04:51 PM
I like the move, but, might have done it with White first and moved Williams to long relief.

Either way - I like the decisions this front office is making.

Believe C Ross up and McCraken or White/Burns is next.

Topcat
05-20-2006, 05:00 PM
Just a comment on this move is all. Very pleased by it :D ..,,, as a side note though why is this any different than some of those nba trades where you acquire cheaper garbage to rid a team of a over priced under productive player?

PuffyPig
05-20-2006, 05:08 PM
anyone think that brandon claussen is sweating bullets as he might be next on the "perform or get chopped" block?

Claussen is no where close to getting chopped. He's actually piching pretty good.

edabbs44
05-20-2006, 05:12 PM
Just a comment on this move is all. Very pleased by it :D ..,,, as a side note though why is this any different than some of those nba trades where you acquire cheaper garbage to rid a team of a over priced under productive player?
Because the Reds aren't saving money by cutting DWill. Williams is still getting paid by Cincy.

redsmetz
05-20-2006, 05:20 PM
Here's Marc's blog on the move:


You already know by now that Dave Williams was designated for assignment today. Every list I've seen this year said he had an option remaining, so perhaps the Reds just want to get rid of him. If so, I give them credit for deciding he's just not a guy that can help them and moving on, rather than wasting time sending him to Louisville.

OnBaseMachine
05-20-2006, 05:38 PM
Great move.

I'm liking Castellini and Krivsky more and more each day.

Topcat
05-20-2006, 05:51 PM
Because the Reds aren't saving money by cutting DWill. Williams is still getting paid by Cincy.

True but inregards to Casey's subtraction money was free'd up for Hatt and Aurillia's contracts. The point I guess I am making is I think its worked out well for the Reds. I also regard the new management with a high regard for getting rid of unproductive players ie.Williams and Womack.

Cigar2
05-20-2006, 06:00 PM
WayneO and CasO showing that they are not afraid to make moves.
While not worrying to much about the negative money impact.

redsmetz
05-20-2006, 07:05 PM
I'm guessing that by designating him, they have the possibility someone can claim him on waivers thereby absorbing his contract. I doubt that will happen. I think too though that if he clears waivers, he is most likely a free agent and can sign with whoever either with a major league or minor league contract (similar to what we did with Joe Mays). Of course, should he clear and not sign elsewhere, he would be able to take an assignment to Louisville. I also am guessing this clears a 40 man roster spot (which they didn't need to do, just needed room on the 25 man roster). Just some thoughts.

George Foster
05-20-2006, 08:05 PM
I generally never feel good about someone losing their job, and still not sure I feel good for Dave Williams... but I sure do feel good for the Cincinnati Reds. Outside of his 2nd from last start, and his first start, he's been attrocious.

Out with the old and in with the new!

Don't feel sorry for him. Professional sports and detroit union jobs are the only ones in the USA that you can perform substandard and still get paid.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-20-2006, 09:14 PM
I know this is subjective and there is no real way to measure it, but Dan O'Brien has got to be the worst GM in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter.

One couldn't try to suck that bad and succeed doing so like good old DanO.

No wonder I've been so grumpy for that past three years. I thought it was me.

paulrichjr
05-20-2006, 09:32 PM
I know this is subjective and there is no real way to measure it, but Dan O'Brien has got to be the worst GM in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter.

One couldn't try to suck that bad and succeed doing so like good old DanO.

No wonder I've been so grumpy for that past three years. I thought it was me.


I think it is ironic that everyone is saying how bad DanO was (which he was) but no one has mentioned that the Lizard is being put in his place...and has pitched good... and was traded for by the one and only DanO.

Joseph
05-20-2006, 09:34 PM
I think it is ironic that everyone is saying how bad DanO was (which he was) but no one has mentioned that the Lizard is being put in his place...and has pitched good... and was traded for by the one and only DanO.

Sure, spoil the piling on.

Seriously, thats a good point, and one I won't even make a negative comment about.

It8ifyifitsgrif
05-20-2006, 09:37 PM
I'm guessing that by designating him, they have the possibility someone can claim him on waivers thereby absorbing his contract. I doubt that will happen. I think too though that if he clears waivers, he is most likely a free agent and can sign with whoever either with a major league or minor league contract (similar to what we did with Joe Mays). Of course, should he clear and not sign elsewhere, he would be able to take an assignment to Louisville. I also am guessing this clears a 40 man roster spot (which they didn't need to do, just needed room on the 25 man roster). Just some thoughts.

The way I understand it is that for Williams to collect his cash he has to accept the assignment..unlike Graves (he had enough service time collect either way if i recall correctly)

Nugget
05-20-2006, 10:10 PM
This is a bit off topic but could the Cody Ross fans let me know why Ross would be so much better than McCracken as a reserve outfielder. He had some pretty good stats to start the year in the hitting category but has anybody actually seen him play this year and compared his fielding. Is he fast on the bases and a capable defensive replacement in the outfield.

Joseph
05-20-2006, 10:17 PM
I think the choice of Ross is a case of youth vs age. Ross is younger with some potential, and Q is old and 'done' as a player.

KronoRed
05-20-2006, 10:39 PM
I think the choice of Ross is a case of youth vs age. Ross is younger with some potential, and Q is old and 'done' as a player.
That's my feelings on it, Q was never very good, Ross might be something.

BigRed
05-20-2006, 10:41 PM
Could be that the Reds sent Ross on this rehab assignment to evaluate him playing everyday at Louisville. I thought it seemed questionable being put on the DL for the pinky finger thing.

The Williams move: It just goes to show how bad Dan O was. Can anyone name 1 good move that Dan O made outside of possibly Elizardo. He was truly pathetic.

IslandRed
05-20-2006, 10:58 PM
Don't feel sorry for him. Professional sports and detroit union jobs are the only ones in the USA that you can perform substandard and still get paid.

True, Dave Williams hasn't exactly been poorly compensated for his trouble. But it's also worth remembering that the contract cuts two ways. If Williams had thrown ten straight shutouts, he'd still be getting paid peanuts relative to the typical starting pitcher.

It's also worth noting that Williams is in his ninth year of professional baseball and has had, to date, exactly zero say in where he plays ball. I don't get paid what a major league ballplayer does, but I get to work where I want, and if I don't like what's going on in my company I can walk myself across the street to a place I like better.

BuckeyeRedleg
05-20-2006, 11:59 PM
I think it is ironic that everyone is saying how bad DanO was (which he was) but no one has mentioned that the Lizard is being put in his place...and has pitched good... and was traded for by the one and only DanO.

What's that they say about a blind squirrel?

Guacarock
05-21-2006, 02:00 AM
This is a bit off topic but could the Cody Ross fans let me know why Ross would be so much better than McCracken as a reserve outfielder. He had some pretty good stats to start the year in the hitting category but has anybody actually seen him play this year and compared his fielding. Is he fast on the bases and a capable defensive replacement in the outfield.

Baseball America ranked Cody Ross as the best defensive outfielder in the LA Dodgers minor league system last year. Earlier, he was judged best all-around outfielder in the Detroit Tigers' minor league system. He has some pop, and in his injury rehab at Louisville, he's hit for a higher average than Denorfia.

So, yes, I do expect him to see him soon with the big club. Given the opportunity, let's hope he delivers.

Doc. Scott
05-21-2006, 02:05 AM
Baseball America ranked Cody Ross as the best defensive outfielder in the LA Dodgers minor league system last year. Earlier, he was judged best all-around outfielder in the Detroit Tigers' minor league system. He has some pop, and in his injury rehab at Louisville, he's hit for a higher average than Denorfia.

So, yes, I do expect him to see him soon with the big club. Given the opportunity, let's hope he delivers.

I'm not sure if the Reds have the perception that he can play center. Now, from what the scouting reports say and from the woeful lack of range we get from our starting CF, I'd be willing to bet $100 Ross is no worse, but if McCracken's sticking around, it's because of CF. No other reason.

Guacarock
05-21-2006, 02:24 AM
I'm not sure if the Reds have the perception that he can play center. Now, from what the scouting reports say and from the woeful lack of range we get from our starting CF, I'd be willing to bet $100 Ross is no worse, but if McCracken's sticking around, it's because of CF. No other reason.

Ross has been playing RF or LF for the Louisville Bats, with Denorfia in CF. So the team doesn't appear to be evaluating Ross as a potential CF replacement.

Still, Ross has put on quite a show -- 3 HR and 6 RBI, with a .348 average in his 45 at bats with Louisville. By comparison, Denorfia is hitting .333, with 3HR and 13 RBI in 109 at bats.

Perhaps, even after a Ross callup, the Reds might retain McCracken because of CF. Or they could just rely on Griffey and Freel to get the job done, knowing they could use Kearns in a tight pinch, and beckon Denorfia should any of those guys get injured.

Newman4
05-21-2006, 08:15 AM
Dare I say they do the ultimate and DFA Eric Milton?

Matt700wlw
05-21-2006, 10:29 AM
Dare I say they do the ultimate and DFA Eric Milton?

I would be surprised if that happened....

Redhook
05-21-2006, 10:42 AM
Dare I say they do the ultimate and DFA Eric Milton?

Not quite yet. Milton was hitting 94 on the gun earlier this year before his injury. I think he topped out last night at 89. Not good. If, and this may be a big IF, he can get back to 94 he should be pretty effective. If not, it'll be home run derby again for the opponent. I'm going to try to remain optimistic and hope that he was just 'rusty' last night.

On the bright side....

We now have Joe Mays in Louisville ready to take Milton's spot, if needed....lol. :beerme:

Heath
05-21-2006, 11:11 AM
We now have Joe Mays in Louisville ready to take Milton's spot, if needed....lol. :beerme:

Joe Mays is Eric Milton left-handed and cheaper. FWIW

DoogMinAmo
05-21-2006, 12:43 PM
I think it is ironic that everyone is saying how bad DanO was (which he was) but no one has mentioned that the Lizard is being put in his place...and has pitched good... and was traded for by the one and only DanO.

Blind... squirrel... nut?

But seriously, while DanO may have been hideously inept at running a major league team, his element was the developmental system. I feel more comfortable about the chances with his minor leauge acquisitions than anything he has done for the major league team (Not saying much, huh?).

He managed to overhaul a flailing South American/ dominican program, with Cueto as some small sample size yet current proof. As much luck as it may be, we have 2 high school pitchers that are managing more than any could in the previous regime. And while the tandem starter system was flawed, I aplaud the out of the box thinking, unusual considering his "binder"/ by the books reputation.

That is about all the good you will hear me state on this man. It's Wayne and Bob's team now, and I am much happier with the job they seem to be doing.

oneupper
05-21-2006, 01:00 PM
I know this is subjective and there is no real way to measure it, but Dan O'Brien has got to be the worst GM in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter.



I'd try Allard Baird of the KC Royals perhaps?

DanO was probably bottom three or four in baseball...which is bad enough.

Matt700wlw
05-21-2006, 01:20 PM
Had Krivsky gotten hired instead of DanO (which is what should have happened), I wonder where this team would be today?

M2
05-21-2006, 01:34 PM
Nice to see Krivsky once again turning up his nose at trash.

I was amazed when folks tried to rally behind Dave Williams after the deal. He's an awful pitcher no matter what your particular bent on baseball is.

IMO losing Williams is a case of good riddance. Eric Milton's contract will probably prevent an outright release in his case, at least until they try him first as a short man in the pen (which is where I'd have slotted him to start with, no point in delaying the inevitable).

DanO was as awful a GM as any I've ever seen. Allard Baird is equally as bad (and Dan O'Dowd is thoroughly wretched as well), but you don't get worse than DanO.

As far as Ramirez is concerned, he's already starting to get his head kicked in and his ERA (which is artificially good at the moment) will take a quick tumble. He's pyrite, much like Taylor Buchholz, who gained backers in these parts a few weeks ago only to reveal his true self immediately afterwards.

Matt Belisle is probably the team's best current choice for a #4 guy. There is no particularly good choice beyond him. That's why, fun as the Reds are on offense, they aren't really much of a threat for the long haul -- they'll give up too many crooked numbers.

Anyway, I like that the club is being run by folks who know better than to tolerate a Dave Williams for very long.

Steve4192
05-21-2006, 03:00 PM
Dan O'Brien has got to be the worst GM in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter.
Mike Brown (NFL) and Isiah Thomas (NBA) say hi!

KronoRed
05-21-2006, 04:02 PM
I would be surprised if that happened....
I would, Milton was a Twin and I think that wins him some sort of Twin bias with Krivsky, besides, no owner other then the ones in New York is going to eat 16 million bucks.

Redhook
05-21-2006, 04:05 PM
Had Krivsky gotten hired instead of DanO (which is what should have happened), I wonder where this team would be today?

1st place

Matt700wlw
05-21-2006, 04:37 PM
Mike Brown (NFL) and Isiah Thomas (NBA) say hi!

Mikey Boy's not so bad anymore...

KronoRed
05-21-2006, 04:43 PM
Mikey isn't running that FO anymore, the years where he was the GM win him the award in a land slide.

RANDY IN INDY
05-21-2006, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by M2:

Matt Belisle is probably the team's best current choice for a #4 guy.

On the money.

TeamBoone
05-21-2006, 09:17 PM
Had Krivsky gotten hired instead of DanO (which is what should have happened), I wonder where this team would be today?

I'm sure they would be well on their way, but remember... Lindner was the owner then so there would have been some limitations. Though I have no doubt that Krivsky would have spent more wisely (if Allen would have let him).

traderumor
05-21-2006, 09:29 PM
As far as Ramirez is concerned, he's already starting to get his head kicked in and his ERA (which is artificially good at the moment) will take a quick tumble. He's pyrite,I'm not sure I'd say a 1.38 WHIP and .429 SLG against thus far is exactly getting one's head kicked in. He gave up a homer to Burnitz the other day, but one of his starts was five hits in four innings (six unearned runs) and seven hits in six innings with 7 K's against Philly. Ramirez has used his control to improve keeping the ball out of the middle of the plate, is regularly hitting 90-91 on his fastball, and has shown an improved changeup to go with the slider.

reds44
05-21-2006, 09:31 PM
I'm really not so sure why some people are so down on Ramirez.

Cedric
05-21-2006, 09:34 PM
I'm really not so sure why some people are so down on Williams.

Why? Because he's one of the worst pitchers in the major leagues.

TeamBoone
05-21-2006, 11:49 PM
Reds GM Krivsky makes bold move dumping pitcher Williams
By Hal McCoy / Dayton Daily News

DETROIT | When a general manager is timid about making controversial transactions, his peers say, "He won't pull the trigger."

That can't be said about Cincinnati Reds General Manager Wayne Krivsky, who not only isn't afraid to pull the trigger, he fully loads the gun and sometimes aims it at his own head.

Krivsky made his boldest move yet when left-handed starting pitcher Dave Williams was designated for assignment Saturday.

Why is it bold?

• The Reds now have nothing to show for Sean Casey, the player former general manager Dan O'Brien traded to Pittsburgh to get Williams.

• If no team claims Williams and he accepts an assignment to Class AAA Louisville, the Reds remain responsible for his $1.5 million contract.

• Williams has an option, but by designating him, the Reds obviously hope another team claims him and picks up his contract, on which Williams is still owed $1 million.

But it was a good move, a wise move. Williams was 2-3 with a 7.20 ERA in eight starts. He was superb two starts ago, holding the Phillies to two runs and five hits over 8 1/3 innings in a 2-0 loss, then was putrid in his last start, giving up six runs to Pittsburgh in the first inning of a game the Reds came back to win, 9-8.

"He just wasn't getting it done," said Krivsky. "The consistency just wasn't there. He didn't consistently have command of all his pitches. He showed flashes of being what you want him to be."

Pitcher Bronson Arroyo, Williams' best friend on the team, said Krivsky's move sends a clear and present message.

"I was surprised in that this team being a small-market team that it didn't option a guy with a guaranteed contract," said Arroyo. "That kind of says to us that, hey, they want a winner around here and are willing to eat a contract worth a $1 million. They're willing to make this team better, no matter what the cost.

"It's a bummer for a player, but it always comes down to the same old stuff, that it's a business," Arroyo added.
Manager Jerry Narron admitted that it was a surprising and bold move, but agrees.

"Maybe (it's a surprise), but he has been inconsistent and we feel Elizardo Ramirez will be more consistent in that starting role," he said. Ramirez moves into Williams rotation spot Tuesday at home against Milwaukee.

"When I talked with Williams, he did not make any excuses and just said, 'I can pitch better,' but being the fifth starter there were times we weren't able to keep him on that fifth day. It wasn't easy for him," said Narron.

If no team claims him and the Reds don't trade him, Williams can report to Louisville and Narron said, "If nobody picks him up, hopefully he'll go to Louisville, pitch well, and help us somewhere in the future."

The main concerns with Williams, other than his inability to get anybody out at times, were that his fastball rarely topped 84 mph, and twice this season he gave up important home runs on 64 mph curveballs.

"We were concerned about (velocity), but the big thing was there was a world of difference when he got hit and when he didn't. The game against the Phillies he was outstanding, kept everything down," Narron said.

"But to be successful at this level you have got to be consistent. You can't go out there any day with lack of command unless you have great stuff," Narron added. "Throwing in the low 80s, you aren't going to trick a lot of people when you are up in the zone.

"He won 10 games last year for a last-place team (Pittsburgh), so I know he is better than what we've seen," concluded the Reds manager.
http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/content/sports/reds/daily/0521redsnotesweb.html

reds44
05-21-2006, 11:52 PM
Why? Because he's one of the worst pitchers in the major leagues.
Woops meant Ramirez not WIlliams.

REDREAD
05-22-2006, 09:01 AM
This offeseason under O'Brien:
Reds trade Sean Casey to Pirates for Dave Williams
Reds trade for Tony Womack, announce him starting 2nd baseman
.

Don't forget that DanO called Williams a "potential ace starting pitcher" :laugh: I've got to find that clipping. :laugh:

registerthis
05-22-2006, 09:44 AM
"In our minds, (Williams) has the necessary profile to pitch in our ballpark," O'Brien said. "He's delighted to come to a team like ours that can score a lot of runs. He feels it's an opportunity for him to take a step forward in his career."

-Dan O'Brien, December 8, 2005

Ltlabner
05-22-2006, 07:00 PM
I just watched Grande interview the Kriv on FSN. What a breath of fresh air. The guy continues to impress me with his skills and "no nonsense" attitude. The above article spells it out...yea, it costs us $1m but we want a winner.

Durring the interview the Kriv mentioned the pick up of Mayes. Again, a breath of reality. He came right out and said that he knew his numbers were harsh but it was a low risk chance to see if a change of scenery would help him out. No BS, no window dressing. Just cut to the chase.

Matt700wlw
05-22-2006, 07:05 PM
"In our minds, (Williams) has the necessary profile to pitch in our ballpark," O'Brien said. "He's delighted to come to a team like ours that can score a lot of runs. He feels it's an opportunity for him to take a step forward in his career."

-Dan O'Brien, December 8, 2005

:bash: :explode: :oops: :all_cohol