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reds44
06-10-2006, 09:19 PM
I am glad Marty has faith in us, and doesn't think we need an overahaul to make this playoffs. :rolleyes:

Marty says:
We won't make the playoffs with this defensive alignment.

How does he fix it?
-Trade Dunn
-Edwin to 1B
-Felipe to 3B

Of course he doesn't tell you who should play SS then. He irks me sometimes.

flyer85
06-10-2006, 09:22 PM
Of course he doesn't tell you who should play SS then. that would obviously be Rich.

KronoRed
06-10-2006, 09:22 PM
I know a better one, Dunn to 1st and Jr to left with Freel in CF, but then Dunn is still on the team so I guess it's not acceptable ;)

CTA513
06-10-2006, 09:24 PM
I know a better one, Dunn to 1st and Jr to left with Freel in CF, but then Dunn is still on the team so I guess it's not acceptable ;)

Trade Arroyo back for Pena and have him play shortstop. ;)

:devil:

reds44
06-10-2006, 09:24 PM
I know a better one, Dunn to 1st and Jr to left with Freel in CF, but then Dunn is still on the team so I guess it's not acceptable ;)
And where would you put EE then? I mean even though he has awesome range, and an amazingly strong arm, he can never develop into a good defensive 3B.


;)

CTA513
06-10-2006, 09:25 PM
And where would you put EE then? I mean even though he has awesome range, and an amazingly strong arm, he can never develop into a good defensive 3B.


;)


Have him become the 5th starter.

:evil:

flyer85
06-10-2006, 09:25 PM
I know a better one, Dunn to 1st and Jr to left with Freel in CF, but then Dunn is still on the team so I guess it's not acceptable ;)I think Marty would disagree, he seems pretty sure that Dunn is the biggest problem this team has.:laugh:

OnBaseMachine
06-10-2006, 09:49 PM
Here's mine:

-Dunn to first base
-Lopez to second base
-Phillips to SS
-Marty to the unemployment line

M2
06-10-2006, 09:58 PM
Later in the day, Marty went on a call-in doctor show and endorsed amputating a leg as a cure for migraine headaches.

KronoRed
06-10-2006, 10:22 PM
Have him become the 5th starter.

:evil:
That's where Kearns is

CTA513
06-10-2006, 10:41 PM
That's where Kearns is

He can start every fifth day and then play the outfield when hes not pitching.


:devil:

RedsMan3203
06-11-2006, 01:27 AM
Here's mine:
-Marty to the unemployment line

Thats a kick to the jimmy.

GAC
06-11-2006, 05:46 AM
You want Freel, with a career .756 OPS and .385 SLG% in CF? he had a little spurt this past week where he hit a couple Hrs. He's now hit a grand career total of 15 Hrs. He'll regress. ;)

No thanks. I'll stick with JR until someone really shows a valid argument that he is a detriment to this team out there. Sure has looked fine to me from both an offensive and defensive standpoint (even losing a step). ;)

Freel is a solid "fill-in"/utility player - and that is exactly how they should continue to use him. He is also a very streaky player who has hot and cold spells.

I understand people's love for scrappy players. To bad those type of players are not the norm anymore.

Dunn to 1B? I think most have no problem with it; but I reallly like Hatteberg who this year has given us a .289 BA .401 OB% .447 SLG% .848 OPS, and I really hate to lose that out of this lineup just to move Dunn to 1B[/b].

And IMO, Dunn is always going to be a defensive liability wherever he plays. He is not gonna win a GG. So moving him to 1B is not gonna cure our defensive woes IMO. But again - I'm not against it.

Where are a majority of our errors coming from? 3B (EE - 14) and SS (Lopez - 11). And I have heard it suggested that we need to move EE to 1B, and switch Lopez and Phillips.

Now the Lopez-Phillips switch is not a bad idea IMO. Though Lopez has only played, in his career, a total of 12 games at 2B. Are we gonna show the same impatience with him there as he gets acclimated to the position?

We have a relatively young INF. And we are gonna have to take our lumps while they learn the positions, and how to play with each other.

remdog
06-11-2006, 08:24 AM
I have no problem with switching Phillips and Lopez nor Dunn to first but I don't think the Reds would do that until next spring. Likewise JR. to left if that ever happens. If you leave JR. in center you can always use Freel and/or Denorfia in left but, again, I don't think that will happen until ST.

I have no problem losing Hatteberg at all. He's had a good (not great) year and has pretty much played at his peak so far in '06. My regret is that dang Broussard/Branyon trade a couple of years back: an Aruilla/Broussard platoon over at first would be looking pretty good right now!

Once again Marty proves he's a great broadcaster and a crappy GM. :p:

Rem

Chip R
06-11-2006, 09:07 AM
I think we have somewhat of a paradox at 1st. There is no one on this team who is a natural 1st baseman. I know a lot of 1st basemen found their way over to 1st from other positions and did well but Hatteberg is the closest we have to a natural 1st baseman. I bring this up because I believe that several of those errors that Lopez and Encarnacion have made may not have been errors if there was a good fielding 1st baseman playing there. Aurilia is adequate but he is not a great fit there. Jr. and Dunn shall not be moved, Encarnacion has about an inning of experience there and I do not think anyone relishes Valentin playing 1st except in a pinch.

So what do you do if you are the Reds next year? Do you go out and get a J.T. Snow type 1st baseman? He may save the left side of the IF some errors but he may not be able to give you much punch or be able to get on base at an adequate clip. Or do you tell Dunn or Jr. that they are playing 1st next year whether they like it or not? Do you move EE over there and hope his replacement can hit as well as he can while providing good defense? Do you just keep the status quo? Do you try to go after Sean Casey as a free agent? There are not any easy answers.

Cooper
06-11-2006, 09:51 AM
I'm beginning to think Marty's thoughts about Dunn are shaded by personality issues. Marty cannot see any good tha Dunn has to offer -often times going out of his way to make a negative comment re: Dunn. Makes me wonder if Dunn doesn't "deal" with Marty on a personal basis i.e. giving Marty the type respect he's become used to. It really sounds as if the man can make an unbiased assessment of Dunn skills. I really believe he thingks Dunn might be the worst players on the team. At this point, it's kinda sick and dysfunctional....maybe they're both to blame, but Marty has the soap box and his use of it insures more damage will be done to Dunn....but it looks as if Marty is the sicker of the 2.

Candy Cummings
06-11-2006, 09:53 AM
Man, Marty has it in for Dunn. I don't think those fixes are going to get this team to the playoffs. Defense is a problem, but the bullpen is a bigger problem. But the starting 8 can score, and that's what keeps us afloat, along with improved starting pitching.

I am a Marty fan. He and Joe made me a baseball fan when I was a kid. But he has a blind spot on Adam Dunn.

westofyou
06-11-2006, 09:57 AM
Worried about LF defense?

Then you really are spending a large amount of time hiding other issues you have with the player IMO.

Which is fine, but place that in the context that it belongs, don't hide it in the bushes with a lame excuse about LF defense.

BTW Marty... who do you trade Dunn to and for who?

Who plays SS?

Who replaces the 47 runs that Dunn has scored?

Highlifeman21
06-11-2006, 10:01 AM
Trade Arroyo back for Pena and have him play shortstop. ;)

:devil:

Remember when in consecutive STs they had Kearns and Pena try their respective hands @ 3B?

Glad those experiments failed.

Highlifeman21
06-11-2006, 10:03 AM
Here's mine:

-Dunn to first base
-Lopez to second base
-Phillips to SS
-Marty to the unemployment line

Mr. Brennaman, after all these years of service to the Reds, we'd like to give you a gold watch.... and your pink slip.

I couldn't agree more with that D alignment, OBM.

Krusty
06-11-2006, 10:21 AM
The Royals, Phillies and Cardinals made the playoffs with Lonnie Smith as a LF and man, he was bad.

VR
06-11-2006, 11:05 AM
Get the 1st sackers to wear this, and all those problems on the left side of the infield go away.

http://www.lukecole.com/Roadside%20Attractions/HugeObjects/glove.jpg

redsfan30
06-11-2006, 11:15 AM
I am glad Marty has faith in us, and doesn't think we need an overahaul to make this playoffs. :rolleyes:
Why is it ok for 90% of this site to say the same exact thing...this current team can't make the playoffs....but when Marty says it, it's a problem?

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 11:39 AM
I am glad Marty has faith in us, and doesn't think we need an overahaul to make this playoffs. :rolleyes:

Marty says:
We won't make the playoffs with this defensive alignment.

How does he fix it?
-Trade Dunn
-Edwin to 1B
-Felipe to 3B

Of course he doesn't tell you who should play SS then. He irks me sometimes.


Let's play his game for a moment.

EE 1b
Freel 2b
Phillips SS
Lopez 3b
Kearns RF
Griffey CF
Denorfia LF
Ross C

Also still gives you the flexibility to use Rich and Hatte if needed, or the option to trade one of them.

Trade Larue....package him if you have to with Dunn, get a TRUE ace (zito anyone?) or stellar bullpen help....or both if you can.

Doesn't sound half bad, does it?

Chip R
06-11-2006, 11:48 AM
Why is it ok for 90% of this site to say the same exact thing...this current team can't make the playoffs....but when Marty says it, it's a problem?

How would you feel if Bob or Wayne or Narron said that this team cannot make the playoffs? Like him or not, Marty reaches a lot of fans and is very influential. People trust him more than anyone associated with the Reds. If you are listening to Marty and he says things like that, if you think highly of Martys opinion, are you going to be more or less likely to buy a ticket and watch a game? Or watch it on TV? The difference is, no one gives a crap about what we think. We are fans, we are supposed to be either wildly optimistic or wildly pessimistic about our team, sometimes during the same game. Whether Marty believes it or not, part of his job is public relations. Now he does not have to come out and say that its in the bag for the Reds to make the playoffs but he could say they have a decent chance because of x, y amd z.

reds44
06-11-2006, 12:50 PM
Let's play his game for a moment.

EE 1b
Freel 2b
Phillips SS
Lopez 3b
Kearns RF
Griffey CF
Denorfia LF
Ross C

Also still gives you the flexibility to use Rich and Hatte if needed, or the option to trade one of them.

Trade Larue....package him if you have to with Dunn, get a TRUE ace (zito anyone?) or stellar bullpen help....or both if you can.

Doesn't sound half bad, does it?
How dare you try to make sense of that carziness Matt.
;)

westofyou
06-11-2006, 12:51 PM
Doesn't sound half bad, does it?Sounds like one hand clapping.

Possibly, that's worst defense then they already have.

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 12:52 PM
Sounds like one hand clapping.

Possibly, that's worst defense then they already have.

It's scrappy though :D

TeamBoone
06-11-2006, 01:01 PM
Why is it ok for 90% of this site to say the same exact thing...this current team can't make the playoffs....but when Marty says it, it's a problem?

I totally agree with what Chip said.

Plus, I don't think people on this board are as upset about that statement as they are about Marty's "solutions".

- Trade Dunn: totally agree with whomever said how do you replace the 47 runs he's scored so far (and it's not even mid June yet). Plus, we all know he'll have 100+ RBIs. Do you really think Denorfia is a replacement for Dunn?

- EE to 1B... what a perfect waste of the Reds 3B of the future. He's very very good at that position, despite the errors. Most of those errors will go away with more playing time. People (including Marty) tend to forget how young he is and how little time he's actually had at the big league level.

My solution:

- Leave Dunn alone.
- Leave Encarnacion alone.
- Perhaps flip-flop Lopez and Phillips, but not until ST 2007.

Thankfully, Marty is NOT the Reds' manager. He ticking me off more and more and more every single time he opens his mouth. Someone with a bit of clout should tell him to just shut the ____ up!

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 01:08 PM
Thankfully, Marty is NOT the Reds' manager. He ticking me off more and more and more every single time he opens his mouth. Someone with a bit of clout should tell him to just shute the ____ up!

Why are us fans allowed to voice our opinions, but as soon as Marty, who is also a fan, does, he gets crucified?

Is it because he has a microphone?

reds44
06-11-2006, 01:10 PM
Why are us fans allowed to voice our opinions, but as soon as Marty, who is also a fan, does, he gets crucified?

Is it because he has a microphone?
As the announcer for the last 32(???) years, Marty is more then just a fan, and he knows that.

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 01:11 PM
As the announcer for the last 32(???) years Marty is more then just a fan, and he knows that.

True.

Falls City Beer
06-11-2006, 01:12 PM
Is it because he has a microphone?

Yes.

Consider this: would it be appropriate for the Secretary of Defense to call certain generals incompetents and failures?

Marty can think it, but it's bad business to say it.

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 01:14 PM
Yes.

Consider this: would it be appropriate for the Secretary of Defense to call certain generals incompetents and failures?

Marty can think it, but it's bad business to say it.

One's baseball...one's National Security.

There's a bit of a difference.

BoydsOfSummer
06-11-2006, 02:00 PM
Everytime I talk to my uncle, who is a major fan and never misses a game, I have to "De-Martify" him. He parrots the same drivel Marty does about certain players. I then explain otherwise and he always says, "Well,that makes alot of sense."

Point being,there are thousands and thousands of "uncles" out there who take what Marty says as gospel truth. And he's wrong,dead wrong, about some of it. His "I'm Marty-Freakin'-Brennaman" non-objective views border on all-out lies in some cases. For example: "Adam Dunn is not a run producer." A sweet little nugget I've heard him say at least twice. That is irresponsible when you have the sort of influence on casual baseball fans that Marty tends to have.

backbencher
06-11-2006, 03:48 PM
Why is it ok for 90% of this site to say the same exact thing...this current team can't make the playoffs....but when Marty says it, it's a problem?

Perhaps because Marty also says things like "seven runs down, Dunn hits a home run."

I never question whether anyone would be happier if the Reds won or lost. On occasion I do question that with Marty.

Matt700wlw
06-11-2006, 03:49 PM
Perhaps because Marty also says things like "seven runs down, Dunn hits a home run."

I never question whether anyone would be happier if the Reds won or lost. On occasion I do question that with Marty.

Yeah...he wants them to lose.

Please.

KronoRed
06-11-2006, 03:53 PM
Doesn't sound half bad, does it?
Sounds awful to me.

backbencher
06-11-2006, 04:12 PM
Yeah...he wants them to lose.

Please.

Wants them to lose? Nah. Nor is he a Grande, enraptured by the other team.

Consumed by scheudenfreude? Seems to fit.

Heath
06-11-2006, 04:26 PM
Once again Marty proves he's a great broadcaster and a crappy GM. :p:
Rem

Quote of the Day.

That should also end this thread.

Heath
06-11-2006, 04:28 PM
Get the 1st sackers to wear this, and all those problems on the left side of the infield go away.

http://www.lukecole.com/Roadside%20Attractions/HugeObjects/glove.jpg

toss in some elevator shoes, and Hatteburg's a gold-glove winner.

TeamBoone
06-11-2006, 08:02 PM
Is it because he has a microphone?

Pretty much.

His crustyness/malcontent/and often erroneous "opinions stated as fact" rub off on the listening fan base.

I think several people posted in a different thread their feelings... when asked why they felt that way they replied "because Marty said so". Everything he says is stated as fact; very rarely have I heard any of his remarks prefaced by "in my opinion".

Unassisted
06-11-2006, 08:17 PM
Everytime I talk to my uncle, who is a major fan and never misses a game, I have to "De-Martify" him. He parrots the same drivel Marty does about certain players. I then explain otherwise and he always says, "Well,that makes alot of sense."Since Marty works for the Reds, it would be nice if someone on the club payroll would enlighten him about some of that newfangled thinking now being employed in the dugout and FO. When he says the things that are reported here, it's sounds as if he's rowing his canoe upriver. He'll end up where everyone else does at the end of the season, but it sure would be easier on the listeners in that canoe with him if he rowed the same direction as Reds management. :evil:

M2
06-11-2006, 08:37 PM
I totally agree with what Chip said.

Plus, I don't think people on this board are as upset about that statement as they are about Marty's "solutions".

- Trade Dunn: totally agree with whomever said how do you replace the 47 runs he's scored so far (and it's not even mid June yet). Plus, we all know he'll have 100+ RBIs. Do you really think Denorfia is a replacement for Dunn?

- EE to 1B... what a perfect waste of the Reds 3B of the future. He's very very good at that position, despite the errors. Most of those errors will go away with more playing time. People (including Marty) tend to forget how young he is and how little time he's actually had at the big league level.

My solution:

- Leave Dunn alone.
- Leave Encarnacion alone.
- Perhaps flip-flop Lopez and Phillips, but not until ST 2007.

Thankfully, Marty is NOT the Reds' manager. He ticking me off more and more and more every single time he opens his mouth. Someone with a bit of clout should tell him to just shute the ____ up!

What she said. I'd consider shifting Dunn to 1B in order to Jr. to LF and improve the CF defense, but Marty's "solutions" clearly revolve around trying to put another dig in on two players he's made into his personal targets.

REDREAD
06-12-2006, 03:43 PM
I'm beginning to think Marty's thoughts about Dunn are shaded by personality issues. .

That would be my guess. Somehow Dunn got in the permanent doghouse. Now he can't do any good in Marty's eyes. Maybe Dunn made a joke about Marty's son or something :laugh: or some other remark implying that Big Headed Marty isn't the center of the Reds' universe.

Sometimes people deserve to be in Marty's doghouse, but I can't see why Marty is on a crusade to make Dunn look as bad as possible.

REDREAD
06-12-2006, 03:47 PM
Let's play his game for a moment.

EE 1b
Freel 2b
Phillips SS
Lopez 3b
Kearns RF
Griffey CF
Denorfia LF
Ross C



Woah man, now you've downgraded defense at every infield position. You've got 3 guys learning new positions in the middle of the season (although Phillips would probably do ok). Plus Freel is not a good defender at 2b. Freel is an OF that is passable in the infield on a short term basis only.

REDREAD
06-12-2006, 03:52 PM
Perhaps because Marty also says things like "seven runs down, Dunn hits a home run."

I never question whether anyone would be happier if the Reds won or lost. On occasion I do question that with Marty.

I think Marty truly enjoys it when Dunn strikes out with men in scoring position or "fails" in another way. Marty would rather have his "right" opinion reinforced in his own mind than see the Reds win.

Marty stopped caring about the Reds W-L about 5 years ago. Now it's the "Marty Stories and Comments" show in his mind. I've suggested this before (or maybe it was someone else's idea).. Why not take Marty out of the booth and give him a one hour pregame show where he can tell all his stories, give his opinions and have people call in to brown nose him? He could even have a trivia question on the show. He doesn't care about the game anymore.

NJReds
06-12-2006, 03:57 PM
I think Marty truly enjoys it when Dunn strikes out with men in scoring position or "fails" in another way. Marty would rather have his "right" opinion reinforced in his own mind than see the Reds win.


That's the feeling I get with most "fans" that don't like Dunn.

KronoRed
06-12-2006, 04:27 PM
That's the feeling I get with most "fans" that don't like Dunn.
Same here, I think Dunn bashers go freaking giddy when he fails, someone to blame.

pedro
06-12-2006, 04:32 PM
It's scrappy though :D

Well "scrappy" does contain the word I'm thinking of when contemplating the idea of trading Dunn adn Larue for Zito. :)

KronoRed
06-12-2006, 04:34 PM
Welcome back Pedro :wave:

registerthis
06-12-2006, 04:49 PM
The team must be losing again, because we have an anti-Marty thread.

Ho hum.

Roy Tucker
06-12-2006, 04:51 PM
Adam parked in Marty's parking spot.

Matt700wlw
06-12-2006, 04:52 PM
Well "scrappy" does contain the word I'm thinking of when contemplating the idea of trading Dunn adn Larue for Zito. :)

You're telling me you wouldn't take Zito?

He's pitching awesome, and you put him a new league, and he'd pitch even better....like Arroyo.

(not neccessarily for those players, I just threw names out there)

pedro
06-12-2006, 04:55 PM
You're telling me you wouldn't take Zito?

He's pitching awesome, and you put him a new league, and he'd pitch even better....like Arroyo.

(not neccessarily for those players, I just threw names out there)

I like Barry just fine and he is the type of talent the Reds should be trying to get. It's more an issue of what you give up for a guy in his walk year who isn't likely to re-sign with your club.

Matt700wlw
06-12-2006, 05:04 PM
I like Barry just fine and he is the type of talent the Reds should be trying to get. It's more an issue of what you give up for a guy in his walk year who isn't likely to re-sign with your club.

I think if Zito was/is/becomes an option, and a trade can get done, they need to get him to sign a deal that keeps him here longer than just the 2nd half of the season (2 or 3 years I would say).

Otherwise, I don't do it.

pedro
06-12-2006, 05:37 PM
I think if Zito was/is/becomes an option, and a trade can get done, they need to get him to sign a deal that keeps him here longer than just the 2nd half of the season (2 or 3 years I would say).

Otherwise, I don't do it.

I think the Reds would have better luck convincing a guy from east of the rockies to sign in cincy. I just don;t see Zito ever doing that.

M2
06-12-2006, 05:39 PM
I think the Reds would have better luck convincing a guy from east of the rockies to sign in cincy. I just don;t see Zito ever doing that.

I think he will. I just think it will be with the Mets.

pedro
06-12-2006, 05:44 PM
I think he will. I just think it will be with the Mets.

Much easier to convince a west coast guy to play in NYC or Boston. I have no problem envisioning that.

registerthis
06-12-2006, 06:12 PM
Much easier to convince a west coast guy to play in NYC or Boston. I have no problem envisioning that.

Yep, Newport and King's Island can only take you so far.

pedro
06-12-2006, 06:19 PM
Yep, Newport and King's Island can only take you so far.

Conversely I'm sure there are some guys too whom a place like Cincinnati may be attractive.

Yachtzee
06-12-2006, 08:12 PM
Yep, Newport and King's Island can only take you so far.

Take them to the Hofbrauhaus. That ought to do it.

cincinnati chili
06-13-2006, 08:56 AM
I have no problem with saying he believes the Reds will not win the division without reinforcements.

I do have a problem with him calling for the trading of specific players.

Lastly, not that I don't trust the source, but did we ever get confirmation that he actually said this (audio clip... something in print). Sometimes these things get taken out of context.

GAC
06-13-2006, 09:13 AM
Why are us fans allowed to voice our opinions, but as soon as Marty, who is also a fan, does, he gets crucified?

Is it because he has a microphone?

Because he's not a stat guy..... there, I said it. ;)

P.S. - I don't agree with alot of the stuff Marty says either (just for the record).

And yes, I think he's got it in for Adam Dunn. I haven't heard him say anything nice about Dunn yet this season.

But the one thing I like about Marty (and also Nuxie), above alot of other broadcasters (WGN for instance), is they don't sugar coat it but are very open about voicing their opinion (and criticisms). And yes, it is just their opinion.

Marty is opinionated? Wow - every step back and take a look in the mirror, because we all are. ;)

And sometimes it has gotten them in trouble. But I don't want an annoucer who simply "tows the company line" and is afraid to speak up and voice themselves because it might upset some of the fan base.

So what if he calls for the trading of certain players. Do you actually think that is gonna influence Krivsky or Castellini?

IMO - there aren't too many players on this team that are untouchable if the price/return is right.

And on this forum, and thread alone, I've seen some pretty wild scenarios for trades, etc. presented.

Yet it's different for Marty because he's behind a mike?

Yachtzee
06-13-2006, 09:52 AM
Yet it's different for Marty because he's behind a mike?

Yes. The Reds and MLB don't put the games on the radio as a public service. They put the Reds on the radio to sell baseball (and other things). They can sell baseball just fine with a homer or even someone who presents an objective view. With an announcer presenting an objective view, you are informing your fan base so that they may make an informed decision and most fans appreciate that. However, if your announcer is using his bully pulpit to air his perceived grievances against certain players, it does no one favors. Not the team, not the fans, and not the announcer.

If Marty wants to give his opinion about whether he thinks certain players are any good, he's welcome to take Andy Furman's job at WLW where he can do as he wishes. But while he's broadcasting for the Reds, he should be doing his job, calling games, and not trying to do someone else's by playing backseat GM.

TRF
06-13-2006, 10:46 AM
Not sugar coating it is one thing. Having the voice of the Reds, on their flagship station openly slamming, not criticizing, but saying that this team cannot reach the playoffs because of players X,Y, and Z is flat wrong. Especially when the Reds are7-10 games over 500, flopped in and out of 1st place and lead in the wildcard.

GABP should be packed every night, but Marty's words imply that is a waste of time. In '99 there at least was the excuse of the construction of Paul Brown Stadium. Is another stadium going up that I haven't heard about?

Marty is bad for the financial status of this organization. His words have an effect, and are taken by many older listeners as gospel when it comes to the Reds. He should be talking the team up while being critical of individual game performance. At least when WLW finds someone to explain the game to him.

flyer85
06-13-2006, 10:49 AM
Marty has become a curmudgeon in his old age.

Matt700wlw
06-13-2006, 03:11 PM
Not sugar coating it is one thing. Having the voice of the Reds, on their flagship station openly slamming, not criticizing, but saying that this team cannot reach the playoffs because of players X,Y, and Z is flat wrong. .

Am I flat wrong to say this team cannot reach the playoffs with a bullpen consisting of players T, U, V, W, X, Y, and Z?

No.

:)

KronoRed
06-13-2006, 03:15 PM
Are you on the radio?

TRF
06-13-2006, 05:35 PM
Am I flat wrong to say this team cannot reach the playoffs with a bullpen consisting of players T, U, V, W, X, Y, and Z?

No.

:)

If you say the team cannot win with one of your marquee players, call for him to be traded, and you have a mic that reaches potentially a million listeners or more, you damn right you can't.

He hurts the bottom line Matt. Revenue.

MWM
06-13-2006, 07:16 PM
Publicly saying that your current team has no chance of the playoffs while they're in first place (or almost in first place) is completely inappropriate for any employee of the organization. If I publicly said, in a forum where large numbers of shareholders could hear, that my company had no chance to compete with our competitors that would be grounds for firing.

Being critical of individual players while calling a game - fine. But publicly stating that the current product isn't capable of going to the playoffs while you're trying to get fans to come to the games is WAY out of line for any employee of the organization. And publicly lobbying to trade certain players is also not something that a play by play radio announcer should be doing. It's not about whether he's right or wrong in what he's saying, it's about what's appropriate for an employee, especially a very well known employee, to being saying publicly. If Lance or the Angry Guys are saying I wouldn't object at all.

Matt700wlw
06-13-2006, 07:16 PM
Are you on the radio?

Not yet :D

pedro
06-13-2006, 07:17 PM
Publicly saying that your current team has no chance of the playoffs while they're in first place (or almost in first place) is completely inappropriate for any employee of the organization. If I publicly said, in a forum where large numbers of shareholders could hear, that my company had no chance to compete with our competitors that would be grounds for firing.

Being critical of individual players while calling a game - fine. But publicly stating that the current product isn't capable of going to the playoffs while you're trying to get fans to come to the games is WAY out of line for any employee of the organization. And publicly lobbying to trade certain players is also something that a play by play radio announcer should be doing. It's not about whether he's right or wrong in what he's saying, it's about what's appropriate for an employee, especially a very well known employee, to being saying publicly. If Lance or the Angry Guys are saying I wouldn't object at all.

exactly

GAC
06-13-2006, 07:29 PM
He is saying the same thing that most on here have been saying. Yet because he is an employee of WLW he somehow shouldn't be broadcasting it over the open air.

Is he really saying anything that the fans themselves haven't already said (and believe)? Lets get real here!

Marty has not only been the Reds announcer for over 30 years, he's also a HUGE FAN of this ballclub.

It doesn't bother me one bit that he says things that just may very well be true - but obviously hard for some to swallow. ;)

MWM
06-13-2006, 07:31 PM
He is saying the same thing that most on here have been saying. Yet because he is an employee of WLW he somehow shouldn't be saying it.

Marty has not only been the Reds announcer for over 30 years, he's also a HUGE FAN of this ballclub.

It doesn't bother me one bit that he says things that just may very well be true - but obviously hard for some to swallow. ;)

GAC, he's an employee of the Reds. If he were just an employee of WLW I wouldn't care.

If you were interviewed publicly and said that you think Honda cars are inferior to Toyota, how long would you keep your job? It's inappropriate for ANY employee of ANY organization to say those things publicly, even if said things are true. This isn't about only Marty. If Vin Scully said such things publicly it would be just as wrong. Really, this seems like common sense.

pedro
06-13-2006, 08:20 PM
Marty has not only been the Reds announcer for over 30 years, he's also a HUGE FAN of this ballclub.



could have fooled me.

REDREAD
06-14-2006, 08:28 AM
GABP should be packed every night, but Marty's words imply that is a waste of time.
....
Marty is bad for the financial status of this organization. His words have an effect, and are taken by many older listeners as gospel when it comes to the Reds. He should be talking the team up while being critical of individual game performance. At least when WLW finds someone to explain the game to him.

Exactly. I listened to the Brewers game last night and he had some real "gems". Even though it was a close game. He'd say stuff like "Unlike the Reds, the Brewers manage to get a hit with runners in scoring position". The way he was announcing, you'd think you were following the worst team in baseball.

Marty also had a stupid comment about how it was dumb to pitch Arroyo and Harang back to back because if they both lose, the team is likely to have a long losing streak. :laugh: Umm, Marty... if they don't pitch back to back and still lose their starts, doesn't it have the same effect? Anyhow, he harped on it for quite awhile.

Basically, Marty is a guy that actively LOOKS for things to complain about this club, because he thinks it makes him look smarter. He's honestly making a fool out of himself. Not only that, but after hearing him last night, I'm less inclined to listen tonight. I used to listen to every game possible, but now Marty is so cranky and distracted, I can only stomach listening to 2-3 games/week on average.

registerthis
06-14-2006, 09:53 AM
Conversely I'm sure there are some guys too whom a place like Cincinnati may be attractive.

Yeah, people from Cleveland. ;)

Heath
06-14-2006, 10:13 AM
GAC, he's an employee of the Reds. If he were just an employee of WLW I wouldn't care.

Which, IIRC, is the exception, not the norm. Most, if not the rest of all announcers in professional sports, are employed by the radio station/TV station that employs them.

Which makes Marty's comments more interesting, but then its leveraged by the fact that Bob Castellini's "Power of Tradition" includes Marty Brennaman.

M2
06-14-2006, 10:16 AM
Which, IIRC, is the exception, not the norm. Most, if not the rest of all announcers in professional sports, are employed by the radio station/TV station that employs them.

Actually I believe that's wrong. I know the announcers in Boston, New York and Philly are employed by the team.

Heath
06-14-2006, 10:19 AM
Actually I believe that's wrong. I know the announcers in Boston, New York and Philly are employed by the team.

That's the beauty of the word IIRC :D

I thought I remembered that the Reds were one of the few teams that actually paid broadcasters, the other teams had "consent" on the choices. But that might have been a while ago.

princeton
06-14-2006, 10:35 AM
Publicly saying that your current team has no chance of the playoffs while they're in first place (or almost in first place) is completely inappropriate for any employee of the organization. If I publicly said, in a forum where large numbers of shareholders could hear, that my company had no chance to compete with our competitors that would be grounds for firing.


got me a huge promotion once, as well as lifelong antipathy from several of my supervisors. oddly, the first was bad and the second was cool.

KronoRed
06-14-2006, 03:18 PM
Yeah, people from Cleveland. ;)
Or Kansas City :evil:

gm
06-14-2006, 04:50 PM
I'll bet Marty loved calling Dunn's walk-off HR today

flyer85
06-14-2006, 11:44 PM
I'll bet Marty loved calling Dunn's walk-off HR todayLet's see, the ball almost cleared the sun deck, Marty didn't mention that. However, he did point out both before and after the break what a bad pitch Kolb made. The poor pitch was the focus of his comments.

Ron Madden
06-15-2006, 03:19 AM
There is no doubt in my mind that...

1. Marty earned his induction into the HOF. Nobody makes the dramatic game winning call as well as Marty.

2. Marty isn't half as good doing PBP as he used to be.

3. Marty loves the fact that he has been here longer than any Beat Writer (except McCoy), Player, Coach, Manager, GM, or Owner. They all kiss his butt because he has the power of the microphone.

He has abused that power. Cincinnati was once known as a Baseball Town with Knowledgible BaseBall Fans. Not Anymore.

Now every beat writer, local sportscaster and casual fan parrots Martys opinion or suffer the sting of "The Hall Of Famers" tounge.

Many will disagree and slam me for this but I really believe Marty is the main reason for the dumbing down of Reds Fans. :(

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 08:18 AM
Let's see, the ball almost cleared the sun deck, Marty didn't mention that. However, he did point out both before and after the break what a bad pitch Kolb made. The poor pitch was the focus of his comments.:confused: I thought it was a FANTASTIC call! Everytime they have played it I get goosebumps. But if you want to hear it that way, so be it...:(

GAC
06-15-2006, 08:58 AM
GAC, he's an employee of the Reds. If he were just an employee of WLW I wouldn't care.

OK. So he is suppose to somehow gloss over the lack we are all seeing on this team, or not mention it at all? Tow the company line so to speak when the team MAY be showing certain weaknesses that may very well be their downfall this year?

The ship may be sinking, but I'll forever sing it's praise?

Should he be allowed to criticize this dreadful bullpen on the air... or talk about how terrible our defense is, as well as other areas of lack, that it may catch up to us and keep us from a post-season appearance? Or is that a No-No too because management, or the fans, may get upset over it?


If you were interviewed publicly and said that you think Honda cars are inferior to Toyota, how long would you keep your job? It's inappropriate for ANY employee of ANY organization to say those things publicly, even if said things are true.

If it's the stark naked truth, then my saying it publically, while in an official capacity for Honda, may cost me my job. That is obviously a risk/cost that I (and Marty in his position) would have to weigh beforehand. But it could also back-fire and make the company also look bad for disciplining an employee who speaks the truth from a position of wanting to improve the company (product).

But that is my (or Marty's) risk/decision. It shouldn't bother/concern anyone else.

Would it be OK for him to have said it last year when the team had no chance?

I look at it this way - the fans get upset when they feel they are not being noticed or listened to by management on the shape/condition of the team. They have, in the past, been basically ignored.

Adding a voice like Marty's, who has an avenue that the fans don't have - he is a member of the media that is heard by alot of people (including management) - makes it that much sweeter IMO.

I have no problem with people who disagree with Marty over statements said concerning baseball philosophy/approach to the game. Or even his ego.

That's different IMO.

But one aspect I have always liked about Marty is his bluntness, and having no fear of saying on the air what so many of us already may agree with.

If he ends up being Martyred (there is a pun there somewhere), then that is his risk/business. Other then that, it doesn't bother me one bit.

GAC
06-15-2006, 09:03 AM
It seems to me that some people (fans) just don't like Marty (which is fine), and are using this situation to pile on him even more because they don't care for him as an announcer (and it's not so much his comment on the Chicago radio as much). ;)

membengal
06-15-2006, 09:06 AM
GAC, that's a little simplistic. I went to the HoF to see his induction (more so than to see Perez go in), I had grown up listening to Marty, I think his game calls are among the best (or were).

The critiques herein are valid. I say that as someone who once hugely respected what Marty gets done in the booth. At times the "criticisms" or "telling it like it is" from Marty borders on seemingly irrational hatred, and anything that pokes that world view of his draws derision (like, say, a stat at odds with his perception). That's too bad, because IT DID NOT USED TO BE THAT WAY with him.

But it is now.

It is what it is, but I sure do understand the frustration people sometimes feel with him, and understand it big time.

GAC
06-15-2006, 09:32 AM
At times the "criticisms" or "telling it like it is" from Marty borders on seemingly irrational hatred, and anything that pokes that world view of his draws derision (like, say, a stat at odds with his perception). That's too bad, because IT DID NOT USED TO BE THAT WAY with him.

I fully understand, and agree, with that mem. I don't deny that aspect of Marty's personality. He's like any other broadcaster/media type that has been on the air as long as he has been, and garnered the reputation/credentials that he has - it gives them all an ego, and that the universe centers around themselves as they like to hear themselves speak.

But I'm referring to his specific remarks made on the Chicago radio station. And we really don't know he said it EXACTLY as he is being quoted because the transcipt of the show is not available.

Maybe it's just the way this listener interpreted it? Possible?

But I also see people showing that same irrational hatred towards Marty over philosophical differences. And they use situations like this to pile on the guy even more for that, then what he said on the radio the other day.

In other words, they look for opportunities.

Moosie52
06-15-2006, 09:42 AM
Do people even listen to Marty on the radio any more? Most of the games are on television.

Chip R
06-15-2006, 09:52 AM
Do people even listen to Marty on the radio any more? Most of the games are on television.

A lot of folks like to watch TV and turn down the sound and listen to the radio.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 09:53 AM
Let's see, the ball almost cleared the sun deck, Marty didn't mention that. However, he did point out both before and after the break what a bad pitch Kolb made. The poor pitch was the focus of his comments.

He said Kolb made a mistake and Dunn made him pay for it--after he finished excitedly calling the HR itself. He's said the same thing about hundreds of bombs.

Let's not go so far trying to dig up conspiracies that aren't there.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 09:56 AM
:confused: I thought it was a FANTASTIC call! Everytime they have played it I get goosebumps. But if you want to hear it that way, so be it...:(

It was a great call. But, some people find fault with Dunn no matter what he does, and it seems the same can be said about Marty. And on and on it goes...

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 10:28 AM
GAC, that's a little simplistic. I went to the HoF to see his induction (more so than to see Perez go in), I had grown up listening to Marty, I think his game calls are among the best (or were).

The critiques herein are valid. I say that as someone who once hugely respected what Marty gets done in the booth. At times the "criticisms" or "telling it like it is" from Marty borders on seemingly irrational hatred, and anything that pokes that world view of his draws derision (like, say, a stat at odds with his perception). That's too bad, because IT DID NOT USED TO BE THAT WAY with him.

But it is now.

It is what it is, but I sure do understand the frustration people sometimes feel with him, and understand it big time.You think Marty is bad with the "criticisms"... you should hear me at home or in the car! :redface: I make Marty look like a saint...;) I do behave myself at the ballgame (esp. when I'm with others or in a crowd) but all alone up in the rafters of GABP, I'm muttering like Yosemite Sam. :laugh:

GAC
06-15-2006, 10:33 AM
You think Marty is bad with the "criticisms"... you should hear me at home or in the car! :redface: I make Marty look like a saint...;) I do behave myself at the ballgame (esp. when I'm with others or in a crowd) but all alone up in the rafters of GABP, I'm muttering like Yosemite Sam. :laugh:

Really? Gee, that is a side of you I'd like to see some time. You don't also chew tobbacco do you? ;)

But I have no problem at all with Marty's criticisms or observations. Do iagree with them all? Heck no! But I don't think he should be restricted from expressing them.

membengal
06-15-2006, 10:37 AM
That's fair kitty, and I do too.

But you and I are not on the mic, and Marty is. That makes a WORLD of difference from where I sit.

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 10:41 AM
That's fair kitty, and I do too.

But you and I are not on the mic, and Marty is. That makes a WORLD of difference from where I sit.True... BUT what if he didn't do "it"? There would be just as much flack for that as well. The fans here on RedsZone are different than the average Reds fan - and so far they haven't asked for Marty's head on a platter [yet].

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 10:42 AM
Really? Gee, that is a side of you I'd like to see some time. You don't also chew tobbacco do you? ;)

But I have no problem at all with Marty's criticisms or observations. Do iagree with them all? Heck no! But I don't think he should be restricted from expressing them.You don't know me very well, do you? :devil: Second paragraph...:thumbup: I would say it's about 60-40 on what I agree with what Marty says.

GAC
06-15-2006, 10:48 AM
You don't know me very well, do you?

I've just never seen you spit when we all go out and bar hop. :lol:

flyer85
06-15-2006, 10:54 AM
:confused: I thought it was a FANTASTIC call! Everytime they have played it I get goosebumps. But if you want to hear it that way, so be it...:(Marty has always been excellent of conveying the emotion of the moment and he did so in this case, I only turned it on the bottom of 11th because I was expecting something to happen.

But after seeing the replay I was surprised he did not comment on the blast almost clearing the sundeck and instead used the opportunity to tell me what a poor pitch Kolb made(and did it again after the break). WHen I saw the replay I was expecting that Kolb threw a belt high fastball in the middle of the plate but that wasn't the case either. The pitch was just above the knees(3-4 inches) and caught about six inches of the inside part of the plate. Did he miss location? Yes but it was not a terrible pitch as he kept it down.

M2
06-15-2006, 11:00 AM
Most every HR comes off a pitch where the pitcher missed his location. Pitchers miss location all the time, often badly, but players do not always crank those mistakes into the upper deck.

Chip R
06-15-2006, 11:01 AM
True... BUT what if he didn't do "it"? There would be just as much flack for that as well. The fans here on RedsZone are different than the average Reds fan - and so far they haven't asked for Marty's head on a platter [yet].

The counter argument to criticism of Marty's criticisms is "Well, you don't want a homer like Harry Carey or a mealy mouth like George Grande, do you?" Why does it have to be one or the other? Fair criticism is one thing. But Marty seems to turn his criticisms into vendettas. And it's not just Dunn either. I even heard a caller complain to Tracy Jones last week that Marty was too negative even though he likes Marty. Marty has an opinion. That's great but since he is somewhat an ambassador for the Reds and a lot of people's eyes, it doesn't make a lot of sense for him to continually trash the team and players. Especially when the Reds aren't drawing that well.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 11:07 AM
Why does it have to be one or the other? Fair criticism is one thing. But Marty seems to turn his criticisms into vendettas. And it's not just Dunn either. I even heard a caller complain to Tracy Jones last week that Marty was too negative even though he likes Marty.

Imagine if Marty were the PBP guy for the Royals. :help:

RANDY IN INDY
06-15-2006, 11:09 AM
I've heard the call 3 times and I don't know why anyone would complain.:dunno:

Chip R
06-15-2006, 11:17 AM
I've heard the call 3 times and I don't know why anyone would complain.:dunno:

It lacked scrappiness. ;)

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 11:20 AM
I've heard the call 3 times and I don't know why anyone would complain.:dunno:Same here... but what do I know? ;)

flyer85
06-15-2006, 11:35 AM
I've heard the call 3 times and I don't know why anyone would complain.:dunno:nothing wrong with the call.

It was what he said after the call, all he did was tell me what a bad pitch Kolb made, Marty made it sound like anyone would have hit that pitch out of the park to end the game(obviously Dunn did nothing special).

Blimpie
06-15-2006, 11:41 AM
nothing wrong with the call.

It was what he said after the call, all he did was tell me what a bad pitch Kolb made, it sounded like anyone would have hit that pitch out of the park to end the game.I listened to the final four innings and Marty was relentlessly bashing Dunn for the usual things: no hitting with RISP and striking out.

When the Brewers walked Hatteberg late in the game in order to face Dunn, Marty was beside himself. He kept repeating over and over again, "What does THAT tell ya?...All major league baseball teams do their homework. What does THAT tell ya?"

Once was enough, but he was still blabbering his same mantra when Dunn returned to the plate with runners on in the 11th. Of course, Dunn then hits the walk off and Marty gets another "classic home run call" he could stuff in his vault.

reds44
06-15-2006, 12:25 PM
I listened to the final four innings and Marty was relentlessly bashing Dunn for the usual things: no hitting with RISP and striking out.

When the Brewers walked Hatteberg late in the game in order to face Dunn, Marty was beside himself. He kept repeating over and over again, "What does THAT tell ya?...All major league baseball teams do their homework. What does THAT tell ya?"

Once was enough, but he was still blabbering his same mantra when Dunn returned to the plate with runners on in the 11th. Of course, Dunn then hits the walk off and Marty gets another "classic home run call" he could stuff in his vault.
It tells you that the Brewers weren't afraid of Dunn, maybe the should have been.

:beerme:

TeamBoone
06-15-2006, 01:02 PM
I've heard the call 3 times and I don't know why anyone would complain.:dunno:

I don't think it was the call that people are complaining about (except his elimination of just how big a bomb it actually was); instead, it was his repeated statement that it was a bad pitch, intimating that if it had not been a pitcher's mistake, Dunn would never have hit it (or that anybody could hit it)... justifying his very public opinion that Dunn's a lousy player with a patheticly low BA that brings nothing of value to this team and should be traded.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 01:29 PM
instead, it was his repeated statement that it was a bad pitch, intimating that if it had not been a pitcher's mistake, Dunn would never have hit it (or that anybody could hit it)...

Oh come on. Every single home run hit (with rare exceptions) is a pitcher's mistake. I heard the entire sequence, and what was said was "Kolb left one out over the plate, and Dunn made him pay for it."

There's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Jpup
06-15-2006, 01:38 PM
Oh come on. Every single home run hit (with rare exceptions) is a pitcher's mistake. I heard the entire sequence, and what was said was "Kolb left one out over the plate, and Dunn made him pay for it."

There's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

that's not what Marty said, but there wasn't anything wrong with what he said. I don't recall him saying anything about Dunn making him pay. I just listened to it 3 times.

It's at about 3:36:00 of the archive on mlb.com.

Before the pitch Marty said something like, "We'll see if Kolb goes away and gets Dunn to chase." Thus the comments about Kolb making a mistake. He said that Kold made a huge mistake and Dunn "cracked" his 23 HR of the season.

This is nitpicking to the extreme is someone is complaining about the HR call.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 01:48 PM
that's not what Marty said, but there wasn't anything wrong with what he said. I don't recall him saying anything about Dunn making him pay. I just listened to it 3 times.

I believe what I'm referring to is the wrap-up portion after the game, when he was describing the scoring.

But, good God yes, this is picking nits if I ever saw it.

flyer85
06-15-2006, 02:02 PM
Oh come on. Every single home run hit (with rare exceptions) is a pitcher's mistake. I heard the entire sequence, and what was said was "Kolb left one out over the plate, and Dunn made him pay for it."
SO does Marty generally make it a point to emphasize how bad a pitch was evrry time somebody hits a HR? I rarely listen live anymore but I do replay a lot of the HR calls on mlb.com and I don't recall on a Reds player hitting a HR Marty emphasizing how bad a pitch was.

Sure, most HRs are balls left in the middle of the plate but the pitch wasn't actually that bad. Kolb caught more of the plate than he wanted to but he had it down and it was not in enough. I was surprised when I actually saw the play because I was expecting a meatball and it was not that.

Marty certainly didn't emphasize that it was a bomb and it truly was because I was expecting a HR that landed 6-8 rows deep not one that almost cleared the sun deck because those are extremely rare.

My questions are
1) Does Marty generally point out(multiple times) how bad a pitch was when a player hits a HR?
2) If he doesn't then why he choose Dunn's game winning HR to make the point?

registerthis
06-15-2006, 02:15 PM
SO does Marty generally make it a point to emphasize how bad a pitch was evrry time somebody hits a HR? I rarely listen live anymore but I do replay a lot of the HR calls on mlb.com and I don't recall on a Reds player hitting a HR Marty emphasizing how bad a pitch was.

Sure, most HRs are balls left in the middle of the plate but the pitch wasn't actually that bad. Kolb caught more of the plate than he wanted to but he had it down and it was not in enough. I was surprised when I actually saw the play because I was expecting a meatball and it was not that.

Marty certainly didn't emphasize that it was a bomb and it truly was because I was expecting a HR that landed 6-8 rows deep not one that almost cleared the sun deck because those are extremely rare.

My questions are
1) Does Marty generally point out(multiple times) how bad a pitch was when a player hits a HR?
2) If he doesn't then why he choose Dunn's game winning HR to make the point?

Really...is this what we're left to complain about? Whether or not Marty equally disperses observations about home runs hit by certain Reds players?

Yeesh. :rolleyes:

membengal
06-15-2006, 02:23 PM
In fairness register, that is not an answer to flyers' questions, it ducks the questions.

To the extent that Marty plays favorites in the booth, that blows. And, yes, Richie Aurilia gets a mega pass from Brennamen as compared to say, Dunn or EE. And for those of us that want to listen to the game without the personal disgust of Marty with regards to individual players, well, that gets really old. Marty's perceptions shape his calls and reactions. No biggie, we are all shaped by our perceptions. It is his abject unwillingness to examine his perceptions that gets really old. Really old.

reds44
06-15-2006, 02:23 PM
Does anybody have a link to the call?

RFS62
06-15-2006, 02:37 PM
Oh come on. Every single home run hit (with rare exceptions) is a pitcher's mistake.


Sorry, but I completely disagree with that.

In fact, it's a pet peeve of mine. Many, many times hitters hit good pitches, exactly where the pitcher was trying to put it.

Jpup
06-15-2006, 02:51 PM
Does anybody have a link to the call?

mlb.com has it if you subscribe. It's at about 3:36:00 of the broadcast.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 03:02 PM
In fairness register, that is not an answer to flyers' questions, it ducks the questions.

I'm not ducking any questions--but what am I going to say? "I analyzed 20 Marty home run calls, and in 8 of those he emphasized the quality of the pitch?"

It's ridiculous. I think the call was fine, I can't believe people are making an issue about it. Thus, I don't think the questions warrant a response.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 03:06 PM
Sorry, but I completely disagree with that.

In fact, it's a pet peeve of mine. Many, many times hitters hit good pitches, exactly where the pitcher was trying to put it.

Few hitters can routinely hit truly good pitches out of the park--it's an exceedingly difficult thing to do. I don't know how you would qualify "many, many times" but i'd wager--were there a way to track such things--that the majority of home runs hit were hit on pitches that did not go where the pitcher wanted them to go, or the pitcher intentionally grooves one thinking that the batter will be looking for something else. Certainly, SOME home runs are hit oon exceptionally good pitches, but those are the exception rather than the rule.

KronoRed
06-15-2006, 03:59 PM
It was a good pitch, the kind Dunn usually misses.

RANDY IN INDY
06-15-2006, 04:08 PM
The bashing of Dunn. The defense of Dunn. It's truly worth a lot of laughs.

flyer85
06-15-2006, 05:04 PM
Many, many times hitters hit good pitches, exactly where the pitcher was trying to put it.they sometimes get hits on them, they rarely hit HRs unless your name is Pujols or Guerrero.

registerthis
06-15-2006, 05:34 PM
The bashing of Dunn. The defense of Dunn. It's truly worth a lot of laughs.

I don't think anyone here is bashing'defending Dunn? This seems to be about Marty, unless the thread has secretly morphed into something I am not aware of... :confused:

Yachtzee
06-15-2006, 07:21 PM
I didn't hear the call myself. I'm inclined to believe that Marty made a great call, because I've listened to Marty all of my baseball-loving life and if there's one thing Marty has a knack for, it's understanding the moment and making a great call. I don't think that has ever been an issue with Marty. I've heard Marty make many HR calls for Dunn and Wily Mo where he's said that it was an especially long blast. He's had many great calls that give me goose bumps.

On the other hand, I think I fall in line with Chip, membengal and Team Boone. I enjoy Marty when he does PBP from an objective viewpoint. And I don't care that Marty prefers certain stats that I don't like as much. But I can't stand the way he constantly harps on certain players no matter what they do, even when they do well. It also bugs me when he plays "see no evil" with players he likes. When he does stuff like that, it's a disservice to the fans, the team and himself. And when Marty gets to the point when his voice is dripping with disgust, I have to turn him off because the kid in me still holds out hope that the Reds have a chance to come back and win any game. Marty's overt pessimism may well be the dagger that kills that kid.

westofyou
06-15-2006, 07:30 PM
And when Marty gets to the point when his voice is dripping with disgust, I have to turn him off because the kid in me still holds out hope that the Reds have a chance to come back and win any game. Marty's overt pessimism may well be the dagger that kills that kid.

And THAT Is why this "kid" who got to town 1 year after Marty, doesn't listen to the Reds feed anymore.

And it has nothing to do with Adam Dunn, Willie Green, Kal Daniels, Chris Sabo or any other Red that Marty might have taken a dislike to.

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 07:38 PM
I'm not ducking any questions--but what am I going to say? "I analyzed 20 Marty home run calls, and in 8 of those he emphasized the quality of the pitch?"

It's ridiculous. I think the call was fine, I can't believe people are making an issue about it. Thus, I don't think the questions warrant a response.I think a lot of people do analyze Marty's words on anything Dunn - including game winning HRs - don't you? :laugh:

M2
06-15-2006, 07:46 PM
I think a lot of people do analyze Marty's words on anything Dunn - including game winning HRs - don't you? :laugh:

I didn't hear the call, but analyze schmanalyze. Marty's transparent when it comes to Dunn.

TeamBoone
06-15-2006, 09:22 PM
It has absolutely nothing to do with the call... it was after.

RANDY IN INDY
06-15-2006, 10:04 PM
It's crazy. I've never seen anything like it. I like Adam Dunn, but it is almost hilarious how some come to his defense over a radio call. Unbelievable! :laugh:

RANDY IN INDY
06-15-2006, 10:05 PM
And the thing is, that Marty did a great job with the call.:laugh:

RANDY IN INDY
06-15-2006, 10:06 PM
And the after was nothing out of the ordinary either. Amazing. You guys have got to be looking hard for a reason:laugh: .

KittyDuran
06-15-2006, 10:23 PM
And the thing is, that Marty did a great job with the call.:laugh:You could just hear it in Marty's voice that it was a HR! :)

pedro
06-15-2006, 10:23 PM
It's crazy. I've never seen anything like it. I like Adam Dunn, but it is almost hilarious how some come to his defense over a radio call. Unbelievable! :laugh:

You know, I don't think this is a case of people coming to Dunn's defense over a call as much as people taking exception with the manner in which Marty does his job, an issue that extends over many years and concerns his quite obvious vendetta towards numerous players.

westofyou
06-15-2006, 10:27 PM
I didn't hear the call, but I could swear that most have mentioned that Marty is a grumpy gus, maybe some find it charming, I find it annoying.

KronoRed
06-15-2006, 10:31 PM
I'm not in the grumpy fan area ;)

deltachi8
06-15-2006, 10:57 PM
I'm not in the grumpy fan area ;)

Grumpy rocks.


I'm oooooold! And I'm not happy! And I don't like things now compared to the way they used to be. All this progress -- phooey! In my day, we didn't have these cash machines that would give you money when you needed it. There was only one bank in each state -- it was open only one hour a year. And you'd get in line, seventeen miles long, and the line became an angry mob of people -- fornicators and thieves, mutant children and circus freaks -- and you waited for years and by the time you got to the teller, you were senile and arthritic and you couldn't remember your own name. You were born, got in line, and ya died! And that's the way it was and we liked it!

cincinnati chili
06-15-2006, 11:36 PM
Sorry, but I completely disagree with that.

In fact, it's a pet peeve of mine. Many, many times hitters hit good pitches, exactly where the pitcher was trying to put it.


You're a good man, 62. Baseball is a zero sum game. Some times a pitcher gets a win and quality start merely because he dodged several bullets. Sometimes, he has electric stuff, and a hitter manages to lay into one.

All a pitcher can do is minimize risk. He can't eliminate it.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 12:19 AM
I didn't hear the call, but I could swear that most have mentioned that Marty is a grumpy gus

Which didn't come across at all on Dunn's HR call.

Ron Madden
06-16-2006, 03:43 AM
THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE CALL. :bang:

Everyone in this thread agrees it was a great call. Marty is the best ever calling a game winning play. It's his snide remarks before and after the call that a few of us hold in question.

What we all must come to grips with is.. Marty is a great at PBP when he wants to be and that aint as often as it once was.

His job is to call PBP, He never was, is not and never will be a good judge of talent. His job is not to Scout, Manage or try to be the GM of this team. We would all be better of if he just does his job.

GAC
06-16-2006, 04:42 AM
And the thing is, that Marty did a great job with the call.:laugh:

Yep.

I was listening to (and watching) the game. Marty, and most announcers, have done this a million times - as soon as the ball leaves the bat you know it was gone.

And he was right - Kolb left the pitch up. You knew it as soon as he threw it that it was definitely not where he wanted it when facing an Adam Dunn.

He pulled a Rick White, a Kent Mercker, a Eric Milton, a Brian Shackelford, a Brandon Claussen, a David Weathers, a Esteban Yan, and a Dave Williams.

And I'm one who believes that Marty is giving Dunn a hard time this year.... but this is really reaching folks.... really, really reaching.

And I'm referring to his remarks after the call too. Nothing said there, out of the usual Brenneman post-game chatter, that should be construed as Marty trying to demean or take the luster off Dunn's Hr.

RFS62
06-16-2006, 07:53 AM
Baseball is a zero sum game. Some times a pitcher gets a win and quality start merely because he dodged several bullets. Sometimes, he has electric stuff, and a hitter manages to lay into one.

All a pitcher can do is minimize risk. He can't eliminate it.


Yep. And from the point of view of the participants, a pitcher is trying to hit a spot. And a hitter is trying to recognize the pitch and square it up.

That's how you decide how you did on a pitch by pitch basis.

If a pitcher hits his spot, and get's hammered, what else could he do but tip his hat and know you did what you were trying to do?

The players and coaches understand this. Luck plays a big part in it, both ways.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 09:31 AM
THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE CALL. :bang:

Save your forehead some damage there, Ron, I know what the point is.

And my point is I heard the whole thing--straight through the Brennamen Report. And all this "he de-valued Dunn's HR because he kept remarking what a horrible pitch it was" stuff is just nonsense--people looking for stuff to complain about that just isn't there.

You sure can tell it was an off day yesterday... :)

WMR
06-16-2006, 10:07 AM
Going on a visitor's radio station, as the voice of the Reds, and saying that the Reds HAVE NO CHANCE of making the playoffs is clearly wrong and I can't believe people are willing to debate that Marty should be allowed to pull such crap as one of the faces of the franchise.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 10:18 AM
Going on a visitor's radio station, as the voice of the Reds, and saying that the Reds HAVE NO CHANCE of making the playoffs is clearly wrong

It clearly is wrong, because according to the original post, that's not what Marty said.


We won't make the playoffs with this defensive alignment.

That's a vastly different sentiment than the one you're suggesting.

WMR
06-16-2006, 10:29 AM
Okay, that's cool, don't try to build up a team that is leading the WC and in a fight for the division, tell us why they won't make the playoffs unless they dismantle their core.

M2
06-16-2006, 10:41 AM
Okay, that's cool, don't try to build up a team that is leading the WC and in a fight for the division, tell us why they won't make the playoffs unless they dismantle their core.

That wouldn't be dismantling the core of the team. Marty would still be doing the radio broadcasts for the club if it moved out the guys in his dohouse, which means the core of the Reds would remain intact. It all starts in the booth.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 10:45 AM
That wouldn't be dismantling the core of the team. Marty would still be doing the radio broadcasts for the club if it moved out the guys in his dohouse, which means the core of the Reds would remain intact. It all starts in the booth.

Or, he could be implying that a series of moves--FeLo and Phillips swapping places, Dunn to 1st, Junior to left--would vastly improve this club's defense. And with it, our chances of remaining competitive--a sentiment expressed on this board many, many times.

M2
06-16-2006, 10:50 AM
Or, he could be implying that a series of moves--FeLo and Phillips swapping places, Dunn to 1st, Junior to left--would vastly improve this club's defense. And with it, our chances of remaining competitive--a sentiment expressed on this board many, many times.

No, Marty lacks that kind of nuance. He's the poster boy for the old Suicidal Tendencies tune "Controlled by Hatred."

Roy Tucker
06-16-2006, 10:52 AM
I think they should have signed Marty instead of Castro.

Marty looks like the scrappy utility infielder type.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 11:03 AM
No, Marty lacks that kind of nuance. He's the poster boy for the old Suicidal Tendencies tune "Controlled by Hatred."

Well, I don't know what he truly meant by "not going to make the playoffs with this defensive alignment," but I sure am reading a lot of whacky theories.

M2
06-16-2006, 11:09 AM
Well, I don't know what he truly meant by "not going to make the playoffs with this defensive alignment," but I sure am reading a lot of whacky theories.

I don't have any theories. I'm just busting on Marty.

reds44
06-16-2006, 11:17 AM
Or, he could be implying that a series of moves--FeLo and Phillips swapping places, Dunn to 1st, Junior to left--would vastly improve this club's defense. And with it, our chances of remaining competitive--a sentiment expressed on this board many, many times.
I was listening to it, and he didn't want Felipe and BP swapping places.

He was cleary targeting EE, Felipe, and Dunn. He wanted Dunn to be gone, EE to 1st, and Felipe to 3B.

registerthis
06-16-2006, 11:22 AM
He was cleary targeting EE, Felipe, and Dunn. He wanted Dunn to be gone, EE to 1st, and Felipe to 3B.

Well that's just stupid. Although getting Dunn out of left field wouldn't be a bad thing, I get the feeling Marty wants him gone from more than his outfield position...

KronoRed
06-16-2006, 03:47 PM
Well that's just stupid. Although getting Dunn out of left field wouldn't be a bad thing, I get the feeling Marty wants him gone from more than his outfield position...
He's not a Marty player

I think Castro is though :D

pedro
06-16-2006, 04:08 PM
Marty's biggest problem is that he is incapable of even considering that he might not be right in some instances. Smartest man on the planet he is.

RANDY IN INDY
06-16-2006, 04:41 PM
That, in itself, seems to be a universal problem.

gm
06-16-2006, 05:30 PM
He wanted Dunn to be gone.

Then Team Clark drops his bombshell yesterday that the Reds would take a #2 starter or 3 pitching prospects for AD, move Jr. to LF and callup Deno.

Coincidence?

pedro
06-16-2006, 05:34 PM
Then Team Clark drops his bombshell yesterday that the Reds would take a #2 starter or 3 pitching prospects for AD, move Jr. to LF and callup Deno.

Coincidence?

You mean the same bomb where he suggested that Orlando Hernandez might have be an acceptable #2 target for such a trade or that the Reds were willing to accept that little for Dunn and still have to pay part of his salary over the next two years?

I'll believe it when it happens. Until then it's just as idle of speculation as anything else posted on this board IMO.

gm
06-16-2006, 05:48 PM
I'll believe it when it happens. Until then it's just as idle of speculation as anything else posted on this board IMO.

Yeah, it wasn't like brooklynred dropped in to call another shot

MWM
06-16-2006, 06:13 PM
That sure makes sense. Wayne's first order of business is to sign Dunn to a three year deal for pretty good money. Then after two months of baseball where he's done just about what he's done every other year in his career, Krivsky decides he's worth only a #2 and is willing to throw in cash just to get rid of him. Uh huh!

TeamBoone
06-16-2006, 07:01 PM
That sure makes sense. Wayne's first order of business is to sign Dunn to a three year deal for pretty good money. Then after two months of baseball where he's done just about what he's done every other year in his career, Krivsky decides he's worth only a #2 and is willing to throw in cash just to get rid of him. Uh huh!

I don't want to see it happen, but if WK thinks it would get this team over the hump, nothing he does would surprise me... because a whole lot of his moves have been surprising.

BoydsOfSummer
06-17-2006, 11:55 AM
That second inning with Hal last night was a beauty. Marty (while Hal nodded yes incessantly) raked Claussen over the coals. There was a gutpile left after that one. Followed by a lovefest for Castro worthy of a Grande-iose bubbling over Jimmy and the Cards. Granted,Claussen sucks and deserves some criticism and he could leave the rotation at anytime and it won't hurt my feelings. But I almost got physically ill during that I-love-you-you-love-me Hal and Marty party last night. I had to turn it off actually.

I think I'm just gonna start skipping Marty innings and dial up the Bad Boy.

KronoRed
06-17-2006, 03:57 PM
Do the Reds have a Spanish radio broadcast?

If so, I'm thinking of learning Spanish to follow the game on the radio ;)

Matt700wlw
06-17-2006, 04:00 PM
Do the Reds have a Spanish radio broadcast?

If so, I'm thinking of learning Spanish to follow the game on the radio ;)

We did one game last year....not sure it went over to well, though.

However, she was a part of it...


http://www.wkrc.com/images/bios/Rionda_Sasha_WEB.jpg http://i.imdb.com/mptv1.gif

http://www.imdb.com/gallery/hh/0727835/HH/0727835/iid_879842.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Rionda,%20Sasha"]http://www.imdb.com/gallery/hh/0727835/HH/0727835/iid_879842.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Rionda,%20Sasha

KittyDuran
06-17-2006, 04:03 PM
We did one game last year....not sure it went over to well, though.

However, she was a part of it...


http://i.imdb.com/mptv1.gifGetting a red "x" Matt...

KittyDuran
06-17-2006, 04:03 PM
Fixed! :beerme:

Matt700wlw
06-17-2006, 04:03 PM
Getting a red "x" Matt...

Not now.

KronoRed
06-17-2006, 04:09 PM
Should bring it back

Just sayin :D

KittyDuran
06-17-2006, 04:09 PM
She definitely does not have a face for radio...:)

Matt700wlw
06-17-2006, 04:11 PM
Should bring it back

Just sayin :D


I won't argue that :D

Yachtzee
06-17-2006, 05:32 PM
We did one game last year....not sure it went over to well, though.

However, she was a part of it...


http://www.wkrc.com/images/bios/Rionda_Sasha_WEB.jpg http://i.imdb.com/mptv1.gif

http://www.imdb.com/gallery/hh/0727835/HH/0727835/iid_879842.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Rionda,%20Sasha"]http://www.imdb.com/gallery/hh/0727835/HH/0727835/iid_879842.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Rionda,%20Sasha


Ay Carumba!

I can hear Hispanic George Grande now...."Buenos Dias, Sasha!"

TeamBoone
06-17-2006, 06:26 PM
I believe they do have a Spanish broadcast, but I'm not sure if they do every single game. They've done more than one though. Every once in awhile they show the guy in the booth on FSN during the game... and it was a guy.

Matt700wlw
06-17-2006, 07:41 PM
I believe they do have a Spanish broadcast, but I'm not sure if they do every single game. They've done more than one though. Every once in awhile they show the guy in the booth on FSN during the game... and it was a guy.

Could be. I know we did one radio one last year

redsrule2500
06-17-2006, 11:37 PM
Marty knows more than all of you!!

westofyou
06-18-2006, 12:05 PM
Marty knows more than all of you!!
Yeah... and Bush won in 2004, your post is chock full of information!!

pedro
06-18-2006, 12:52 PM
Marty knows more than all of you!!

yeah, but does he know how to make a number #3 from Casa Nueva?

deltachi8
06-18-2006, 03:25 PM
I know a guy named Bob.

Just sayin

KronoRed
06-18-2006, 03:59 PM
yeah, but does he know how to make a number #3 from Casa Nueva?
If he doesn't it's cause it's not "important" and "clutch"

;)