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View Full Version : A real, legit closer is what we need..now



George Foster
06-13-2006, 01:51 AM
I think that the time is now to make a deal for a real closer. You can make an augument that if we had a REAL stopper in the bull pen, we could have won at least 2 of the 4 games we have lost in a row. Coffey, who pitched far better as a set up guy could have pitched against the Cubs and not have given up the grandslam. He could have pitched the 8th tonight against the Brewers and held the lead (actually started the inning and not take over for Mercer with men on base). I can live with our starting pitching the rest of the season, I can even live with the current defensive lineup, errors included.

We score enough runs to keep us in most games. (a chance to win in the ninth, 3 of our 4 current losses)

If the management thinks Kearns and Dunn is our future...fine, then you need to package Deno, and whoever to get a closer. Deno has nothing else to prove in AAA, he's ready for the majors, either with us or another ball club. His trade value has never been higher.

If Deno is our future, then Kearns needs to be traded. We have something to trade that has value. With a real closer, there is no reason why we can't win 90 games this year. Even with the current bullpen, we are 8 games over
.500 and on pace to win 93 games. The time is now...let's get it done.

KronoRed
06-13-2006, 01:56 AM
I don't think we need a top closer, just another reliable arm in the pen to go with Coffey, one can set up the other can close.

reds44
06-13-2006, 02:27 AM
I don't think Deno would bring you a closer. Lopez, Dunn, or Kearns it would probably take to get a "lights out" closer. Deno would probably bring you a more of Damaso Marte type from the Pirates.

Jpup
06-13-2006, 07:55 AM
The Reds need more than a legit closer. They need a complete overhaul of the bullpen. The Reds bullpen is as bad as any they have had in the last 5 years. Coffey has been good until this point, but he hasn't been so great the last couple times out.

tick, tick, tick...it's time for Krivsky to make some moves.

oneupper
06-13-2006, 08:00 AM
These are liget...will calm down your nerves in those ''closing" situations..:)

http://www.allnative.com/images/3227.jpg

MrCinatit
06-13-2006, 08:07 AM
A complete bullpen overhaul could be for the better. Get rid of the dead weight: White, Yan, Mays, Merker, Hammond. Stop relying on the has beens for your setup men, and make some trades for some younger, fresher, yet proven arms.
Gee, that sounds easy on paper.
Too bad it is not so.

Jpup
06-13-2006, 08:36 AM
A complete bullpen overhaul could be for the better. Get rid of the dead weight: White, Yan, Mays, Merker, Hammond. Stop relying on the has beens for your setup men, and make some trades for some younger, fresher, yet proven arms.
Gee, that sounds easy on paper.
Too bad it is not so.

i think it will eventually happen, but in will probably be November or December before it does.

edabbs44
06-13-2006, 09:29 AM
I don't think we need a top closer, just another reliable arm in the pen to go with Coffey, one can set up the other can close.
Agree that we don't need another closer...disagree b/c we need more than one arm. But it's a start.

TeamBoone
06-13-2006, 02:07 PM
The term closer is overrated. Send Coffey in when he's needed the most... and if he needs to pitch two innings, by all means do it!

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, why does that mean he can't be used as he was before? It's obvious it was more productive.

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, is it etched in stone so deep that it can't be recinded?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean the Reds would rather succumb to defeat than use him in the most effective manner?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean he automatically qualifies for one inning?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean he automatically qualifies for only the 9th inning?

If the answer to any of these questions is yes, then something is radically wrong. Let's get back to winning games and one thing that's going to help the team do that is to use Coffey whenever a tight situation warrents it. It was working; this new set up is not.

smith288
06-13-2006, 02:35 PM
Hammond's been actually pretty decent since his early season sucktitude. That guy could pitch until 90 yrs old with the lack of stress that a 55mph puts on an arm...

IowaRed
06-13-2006, 02:42 PM
Hammond's been actually pretty decent since his early season sucktitude. That guy could pitch until 90 yrs old with the lack of stress that a 55mph puts on an arm...

Hammond has really surprised since his, as you so eloquently put it, early season suckitude. I bet he's the pitcher that the most people have seen and said "I could hit that"

Strikes Out Looking
06-13-2006, 05:35 PM
Rather than a "closer" I'd like a couple of healthy arms that can pitch in the 7th and 8th inning to help bridge the game to Mr. Coffey.

As a suggestion, how about bring Elmer Dessens back from KC? He can't be that expensive and he may be able to do the job (at least better than a Mr. White from Springfield has done).

KoryMac5
06-13-2006, 06:24 PM
No one has been able to step up and fill the void that was left when Coffey became closer. The 7th and 8th innings are now trouble spots where it was the 9th that was shaky when Weathers was healthy. Narron needs to scrap the closer role and turn to a new term stopper until a trade can be made or we trust some guys we have in the minors. If a starter gets in trouble in inning 7 bring Coffey in to stop the rally then. No need to save him for the 9th when we are behind. Have to change your philosophy to fit the team you have.

westofyou
06-13-2006, 06:30 PM
The Reds need inning eaters from the age of 23-30, guys with stuff and the ability to top 70 innings. A BP of guys in their 30's with slow junk and no staying power is late inning batting practice.

It's been 4 seasons since the Reds sniffed one of those guys much alone two or three. Coffey's a good start but I'd like 2 more of him, then guys like Hammond compliment them.

fisch11
06-13-2006, 06:46 PM
We need another Todd Coffey and we'll be fine. Todd Coffey isn't "lights out" material, but he's pretty dang good. Another guy like him to come in and get outs with inherited runners is what we need.

edabbs44
06-13-2006, 06:51 PM
The term closer is overrated. Send Coffey in when he's needed the most... and if he needs to pitch two innings, by all means do it!

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, why does that mean he can't be used as he was before? It's obvious it was more productive.

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, is it etched in stone so deep that it can't be recinded?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean the Reds would rather succumb to defeat than use him in the most effective manner?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean he automatically qualifies for one inning?

Just because he's been officially named the Reds closer, does it mean he automatically qualifies for only the 9th inning?

If the answer to any of these questions is yes, then something is radically wrong. Let's get back to winning games and one thing that's going to help the team do that is to use Coffey whenever a tight situation warrents it. It was working; this new set up is not.
I understand your point, but let's look at this another way. Does anyone else think being elevated to closer is kind of a reward? If the Reds kept Coffey as a set-up man, he will obviously earn less money when it comes to arbitration time. If the Reds keep him out of the closer role, does anyone else think Coffey would eventually become bitter b/c the Reds are basically depriving him of money? Just a thought.

TeamBoone
06-13-2006, 07:02 PM
I understand your point, but let's look at this another way. Does anyone else think being elevated to closer is kind of a reward? If the Reds kept Coffey as a set-up man, he will obviously earn less money when it comes to arbitration time. If the Reds keep him out of the closer role, does anyone else think Coffey would eventually become bitter b/c the Reds are basically depriving him of money? Just a thought.

Coffey seems to be a pretty level headed, mature guy who's truly happy to be playing baseball in the big leagues. I also think he wants to do whatever it takes to be a winner, whether it requires him to be the stopper or the closer.

If the team continues to win, another decent arm will be found to supplement his, thus cementing his future as the closer. And I firmly believe Todd isn't thinking money right now; he's thinking win, win, win. His money will come.

NewEraReds
06-13-2006, 07:28 PM
I think that the time is now to make a deal for a real closer. You can make an augument that if we had a REAL stopper in the bull pen, we could have won at least 2 of the 4 games we have lost in a row. Coffey, who pitched far better as a set up guy could have pitched against the Cubs and not have given up the grandslam. He could have pitched the 8th tonight against the Brewers and held the lead (actually started the inning and not take over for Mercer with men on base). I can live with our starting pitching the rest of the season, I can even live with the current defensive lineup, errors included.

We score enough runs to keep us in most games. (a chance to win in the ninth, 3 of our 4 current losses)

If the management thinks Kearns and Dunn is our future...fine, then you need to package Deno, and whoever to get a closer. Deno has nothing else to prove in AAA, he's ready for the majors, either with us or another ball club. His trade value has never been higher.

If Deno is our future, then Kearns needs to be traded. We have something to trade that has value. With a real closer, there is no reason why we can't win 90 games this year. Even with the current bullpen, we are 8 games over
.500 and on pace to win 93 games. The time is now...let's get it done.
um, we need more than a closer. we need like 5 arms for the pen.

Mario-Rijo
06-13-2006, 07:36 PM
I think that if JN really was pointing fingers at anyone for switching Coffey he is a bigger fool than what I think he might be. Because like has been mentioned it doesn't matter where you put Coffey because no one else has been consistently getting guys out all year long, and you are going to lose the game somewhere if this is the case. The bottom line is that we probably need at least 2 good arms in that pen along with Coffey, Weathers when he gets healthy, Mercker if he can bounce back & Hammonds has his place, in order to have a real shot at the playoffs.

OldRightHander
06-13-2006, 08:03 PM
I bet he's the pitcher that the most people have seen and said "I could hit that"

Actually, I never looked at him and had that thought, but...never mind.

Spitball
06-13-2006, 08:20 PM
um, we need more than a closer. we need like 5 arms for the pen.

The Cubs went out and spent 6 million combined on Bobby Howry and Scott Eyre. With Aardsma and Ohman, they have some decent, inexpensive arms that will allow them to move one or both of their expensive acquisitions. Why pay to have an expensive bullpen when you're in fifth place and have alternatives?

They are struggling and are a team in need of a rebuilding plan in my opinion.
I wonder if Ryan Wagner would be attractive enough to entice them to make an early move to unload their two expensive luxuries, Eyre and Howry? They would give the Reds' pen some depth and give them a chance to stay in the race. Wagner would be a high price, but a gamble I'd make for a chance to compete.

Jpup
06-15-2006, 04:24 AM
Actually, I never looked at him and had that thought, but...never mind.

:lol:

now that's funny. :laugh:

schroomytunes
06-15-2006, 04:42 AM
I think we will see an improvement in the bullpen when Belisle comes back and we DFA Rick "springfield" White.:beerme:

Outshined_One
06-15-2006, 04:43 AM
I used to think that the transition to closer was a non-issue and that the whole "closer mentality" thing was bunk.

And then I saw LaTroy Hawkins...which pretty much made me throw that supposition out the window.

griffeyfreak4
06-15-2006, 02:12 PM
Trade Adam Dunn!!! :laugh:

No, seriously I agree with Foster. Deno is ready, and my first instinct is to package Kearns with LaPoo and get some BP help immidiately.