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View Full Version : Mays most likely to take Brandons next start Per Marcs Blog



NatiRedGals
06-17-2006, 12:16 AM
The writing's on the wall

It's safe to assume Brandon Claussen won't be making his next scheduled start Wednesday against the Mets. Asked that question directly tonight, this is what Jerry Narron had to say:

"Brandon Claussenís been in our rotation all year. He did have a good outing last time, we are looking for him to be more consistent and give us some good outings. We definitely gave Joe Mays a chance to get stretched out a little bit tonight. You face a lineup like that, youíve got to have good stuff. You cannot go out there half-stepping."

One other telling comment from Narron:

"I would like to see Brandon be aggressive, I would like to see him make some quality pitches, I would like to see him get some guys out early in the count. For whatever reason, right now heís not doing that for us."

Claussen, a stand-up guy, was very emotional after the game. He knows what's coming, and he certainly took as professional an approach as you could ask for when questioned about it.

"I havenít done my job lately, and if thatís the decision they feel is going to help this ballclub, then I will support that decision 100 percent," he said. "If they believe that I can still get the job done in the starting rotation, Iíll support that 100 percent. I feel that whatever decision is made is going to be the right decision and I will never argue that at all."

savafan
06-17-2006, 12:18 AM
Ugh...

I know Claussen has been bad, but Mays was even worse when starting for the Royals.

The Baumer
06-17-2006, 12:22 AM
Considering how mental the game of baseball is, wouldn't you think pitching for a team as terrible as Kansas City could have an adverse effect on your performance? Just a thought.

TeamBoone
06-17-2006, 12:23 AM
Oh good grief... from the frying pan into the fire. He's certainly no improvement.

I must admit that this is one move by Krivsky that I totally don't get. The guy is certainly no upgrade.

There has GOT to be a better solution. I have more faith in AAA pitchers than I do in Mays.

I truly feel sorry for Brandon. An occasional bad outing is to be expected, but I don't understand how he can be decent one outing and stink up the joint the next. That said, I'm sure he feels pretty bad about it too.

RedLegSuperStar
06-17-2006, 12:25 AM
I actually thought that when Claussen got pulled. I didn't think Mays, but I figured Brandon wouldn't get to start his next game.

BCubb2003
06-17-2006, 12:26 AM
For me, right now, Joe Mays is in the "Krivsky must know what he's doing zone" but it's not a very big window. Maybe he'll be the Brandon Phillips of castoff pitchers.

Tornon
06-17-2006, 12:28 AM
If I remember correctly, most of Krivsky's moves have been questioned so far and they have turned out okay for the most part. Many people didn't like getting Arroyo for WMP.. that's been great for us. Most people didn't like Scott Hatteberg, he has been a solid 1B & OBP guy. Nobody could understand why we would trade for David Ross, he is slugging almost .800. Now, I understand that everything Krivsky touches cannot turn to gold but he has a great track record so far, so I am willing to give him a chance on this move as well.

TeamBoone
06-17-2006, 12:33 AM
I haven't questioned any of his moves, because I think he's a smart judge of talent. But I totally think he's out on a limb on this one. He hasn't been very good, especially tonight.

flyer85
06-17-2006, 12:39 AM
Mays has some movement but after seeing him tonight he is not likely to be the answer. He has a short stride and pitches from a very upright position and really struggled to drive the ball down in the zone. He left a lot of pitches up and I am guessing that's what got him killed in KC and I also didn't see anything resembling a decent changeup

Unassisted
06-17-2006, 12:40 AM
I predict Mays will benefit from his unfamiliarity in the NL, at least for a few starts, before he returns to career norms. He'll definitely benefit from greater run support than he got in KC.

Krusty
06-17-2006, 12:41 AM
Does Claussen still have options? If he does, send him down to Louisville to work out his problems.

flyer85
06-17-2006, 12:46 AM
I predict Mays will benefit from his unfamiliarity in the NL, at least for a few starts, before he returns to career norms. He'll definitely benefit from greater run support than he got in KC.whenyour ERA is over 9 you better have run support. Mays is nothing but flotsam. He will fail if they try using him in any role other than long relief, there's a reason he was released by the worst team in baseball

flyer85
06-17-2006, 12:46 AM
Does Claussen still have options? No

savafan
06-17-2006, 12:49 AM
I would try Gosling, Burns or Germano before I'd go to Mays.

HBP
06-17-2006, 12:49 AM
How about a compromise: Claussen to the pen, Mays stays in the pen, White gets DFA, and Dumatrait gets a few starts to see if he can handle the bigs.

flyer85
06-17-2006, 12:50 AM
The Reds don't have a good answer at this point. I wouldn't mind seeing Belisle get a shot.

TeamBoone
06-17-2006, 12:51 AM
How about a compromise: Claussen to the pen, Mays stays in the pen, White gets DFA, and Dumatrait gets a few starts to see if he can handle the bigs.

Not a bad plan... with one exception, DFA Mays right along with White.

savafan
06-17-2006, 12:52 AM
How about a compromise: Claussen to the pen, Mays stays in the pen, White gets DFA, and Dumatrait gets a few starts to see if he can handle the bigs.

I'm cool with that too.

KronoRed
06-17-2006, 02:03 AM
Not a bad plan... with one exception, DFA Mays right along with White.
Agreed, he's junk.

I'm almost ready to say go with the 4 man rotation.

vic715
06-17-2006, 02:30 AM
The Reds don't have a good answer at this point. I wouldn't mind seeing Belisle get a shot.
He's definitly the one more deserving than Mays.If and when he's ready I'd give him every chance to be a starter.

RedsMan3203
06-17-2006, 02:33 AM
Hey... at this point... it doesn't matter who starts in BC's spot... It can't get any worse...


Give Homer a shot.... ;)


Errr...


I mean... Let Mays see what he can do... coudln't hurt... IF he gets shelled.. Let Matt get it a throw... If he fails... Try BC again... He gave his arm some rest and got his mind clear.. if he fails.... Well.. then... I don't know.

spaethc
06-17-2006, 03:23 AM
I will admit that I do not know much about Mays, but Claussen is terrible and I am do not want to see him start again.

savafan
06-17-2006, 03:23 AM
I mean... Let Mays see what he can do... coudln't hurt... IF he gets shelled.. Let Matt get it a throw... If he fails... Try BC again... He gave his arm some rest and got his mind clear.. if he fails.... Well.. then... I don't know.

Maybe they could try Jeff Shaw. ;)

KronoRed
06-17-2006, 03:24 AM
He is a local boy :D

savafan
06-17-2006, 03:31 AM
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=MLB&id=2756&line=181829&spln=1

After Brandon Claussen was lit up on Friday, Reds manager Jerry Narron hinted that Joe Mays could be moved into the club's rotation.
If the Reds are trying to motivate Claussen, pulling him out of the rotation for a couple of turns wouldn't be a bad idea. Mays, though, would be a dreadful choice to replace him, even if he has allowed just one earned run in seven innings since joining Cincinnati as a reliever. The Reds got rid of their best alternative when they dumped Dave Williams.

KronoRed
06-17-2006, 03:52 AM
Mays or Dave Williams?

How bout we forfeit?

Phhhl
06-17-2006, 03:54 AM
Maybe Claussen helps the pen? Rollie Fingers was on with Lance the other night, and basically he got chased to the pen by racking up a series of horrible starts. I still like Claussen's stuff. I didn't see tonight's start, but many times Brandon gets in trouble the second time through the lineup. He won't have that problem now, and he may be able to add a mph or two on his fastball pitching short stints.

Anyway, I think his comments show him to be a standup guy. This has to be tough for him. It's been two and half months of misery, but last year proved the guy can pitch at this level. As pitching poor as this organization still is, we need to hang in there with Brandon Claussen.

Guacarock
06-17-2006, 05:59 AM
Maybe Claussen helps the pen? Rollie Fingers was on with Lance the other night, and basically he got chased to the pen by racking up a series of horrible starts. I still like Claussen's stuff. I didn't see tonight's start, but many times Brandon gets in trouble the second time through the lineup. He won't have that problem now, and he may be able to add a mph or two on his fastball pitching short stints.

Anyway, I think his comments show him to be a standup guy. This has to be tough for him. It's been two and half months of misery, but last year proved the guy can pitch at this level. As pitching poor as this organization still is, we need to hang in there with Brandon Claussen.

Claussen will rebound. For now, he can help in our pen, which really does need the help.

He's too young and too skilled to toss aside the way the Reds cut Williams.

I'm not going to sugarcoat his 14 starts so far in '06. They have been all over the map. Some gems, some true disasters.

In his favor, he's not received much run support, so whether he's pitched well or poorly, our hit-a-homer-or-miss offense has left him hanging out to dry, flying solo. That has to be discouraging, especially for a kid.

Also, it's baffling why so many of his starts have come back-to-back with Milton when their deliveries and repertoires are so similar. If it was up to me, I would have sandwiched Ramirez between them instead of having them follow each other in sequence.

But, of course, it wasn't up to me. And now, for 3-8 obvious reasons, it's clear why the team might be more inclined to try out Claussen in the pen as opposed to leaving him in the rotation.

My ardent hope: He'll give this ragtag, ratty bullpen a second anchor besides the bounce they get from Coffey. And secondarily, that Mays doesn't blow this last chance to prove himself a capable starter, even after being cut by KC. New team, new league. If he can't make it here and now, he probably can't make it anywhere.

BigRed
06-17-2006, 10:40 AM
I am sure that Wayne is lighting up the phone lines trying to find a starting pitcher for next week. Mays is just all they have right now. I agreed with the poster that suggested Belisle once he is healthy. I think that he is the best option we have left in the system. I think that Belisle has the stuff and a history of starting to get the job done. Regarding Claussen, he has the ability and showed it being our 2nd best starter last year. He may be in a funk where the bullpen time might allow him to relax and refocus. I guess we'll see what Wayne and Jerry decide to do.

IslandRed
06-17-2006, 11:15 AM
The Reds don't have a good answer at this point.

And that's the cold, hard truth.

Jpup
06-17-2006, 11:29 AM
And that's the cold, hard truth.

and, it appears, they are not doing anything about it. :help:

RedsMan3203
06-17-2006, 11:37 AM
Once moved to the pen... Jerry can't forget about him and he has to show confedence in him to throw in during the game.... This is going to be rough.

Jpup
06-17-2006, 11:41 AM
Like I posted in another thread, Claussen is the best option at the moment. Krivsky doesn't appear to be doing anything to fix the pitching problems. Outside of Arroyo he has done nothing but provide lip service to the the severe lack of arms in the Reds organization. It's the middle of June and the Reds bullpen is worse than it was under Dan O'brien. That's something to be proud of.

MartyFan
06-17-2006, 12:04 PM
Could the problem Mays had in KC be mechanics? I mean Krivsky talks to everyone in his organization pretty much about every move he makes before he makes it...ther must be more than just Krivsky thinking that Mays could turn it around...true?

As for Claussen...the one thing that was always said about him when he was in Columbus and he proved it by the way he took the mound even when he first arrived in Cincy...was that he was not easily shaken...rattled or beaten mentally at the game...would he make bad pitches? sure, but he would not be beat mentally...if someone like this is shaken right now, myeb a step back and refocusing is what he needs to lock it in.....I also think he needs another pitch to help keep others off balance.

As for what Krivsky is or isn't doing to address the needs of this team, don't forget that the guy only got here the week before Spring training started and he has done more to improve this team than DanO did in two years...this team was projected to finish DEAD LAST....not only in the division but some thought in all of the NL...so, for this team to perform at this level is a gift...they have been playing soe over their heads and if they finish at .500 this year it will be a step in the right direction...of course that means they pretty much continue playing the way they are right now for the rest of the year...I hope not but the reality is it could happen.

I think that the D needs to be sured up...getting Castro is good...he is so solid defensively that his bat is neither a +/-...if he can help these other young positional players become more stable that is great...then we have our OF...Junior is decent in CF, not great, not horrible...but if he had a left and right fielder who could field he would be that much better...of course the answer is to move Junior or Dunn to 1B...then either bring Denorfia or another CF in to play CF to dover the turf.

Jpup
06-17-2006, 12:25 PM
Could the problem Mays had in KC be mechanics? I mean Krivsky talks to everyone in his organization pretty much about every move he makes before he makes it...ther must be more than just Krivsky thinking that Mays could turn it around...true?

As for Claussen...the one thing that was always said about him when he was in Columbus and he proved it by the way he took the mound even when he first arrived in Cincy...was that he was not easily shaken...rattled or beaten mentally at the game...would he make bad pitches? sure, but he would not be beat mentally...if someone like this is shaken right now, myeb a step back and refocusing is what he needs to lock it in.....I also think he needs another pitch to help keep others off balance.

As for what Krivsky is or isn't doing to address the needs of this team, don't forget that the guy only got here the week before Spring training started and he has done more to improve this team than DanO did in two years...this team was projected to finish DEAD LAST....not only in the division but some thought in all of the NL...so, for this team to perform at this level is a gift...they have been playing soe over their heads and if they finish at .500 this year it will be a step in the right direction...of course that means they pretty much continue playing the way they are right now for the rest of the year...I hope not but the reality is it could happen.

I think that the D needs to be sured up...getting Castro is good...he is so solid defensively that his bat is neither a +/-...if he can help these other young positional players become more stable that is great...then we have our OF...Junior is decent in CF, not great, not horrible...but if he had a left and right fielder who could field he would be that much better...of course the answer is to move Junior or Dunn to 1B...then either bring Denorfia or another CF in to play CF to dover the turf.

Mays has always been horrible. He just keeps getting worse.

So, your theory is that since the Reds have been playing over their head. Krivsky gets a pass. It's not hard to see that the pitching stinks. If he doesn't know yet, something might be wrong with him.

I highly doubt the Reds will finish about .500 unless some trades are made within the next couple of weeks to get some real pitching. I think that a lot of our predictions for the season are going to end up becoming about right. 81 wins might be a miracle for this staff. Even if they get to .500, it's not good enough. I'm tired of settling. While other teams are trying to improve their clubs, it always seems the Reds are spinning their wheels. Go do something.

Jr. is bad in CF.

RANDY IN INDY
06-17-2006, 12:40 PM
I think it's funny that a lot of people think you can just wave the magic wand and fix it. Make a trade for a quality pitcher, yesterday, and all things are good. Unfortunately, there usually isn't an excess of quality pitching that is available, there are a lot of teams looking for it, and those that have it aren't usually willing to readily deal it, unless you want to give away the ranch to get it.

Jpup
06-17-2006, 12:44 PM
I think it's funny that a lot of people think you can just wave the magic wand and fix it. Make a trade for a quality pitcher, yesterday, and all things are good. Unfortunately, there usually isn't an excess of quality pitching that is available, there are a lot of teams looking for it, and those that have it aren't usually willing to readily deal it, unless you want to give away the ranch to get it.

I don't know, but I'm sure you could get an arm or two for the Reds left and right fielders. Their shortstop isn't too bad either.

You have to give up something to get something. The Reds have 2 or 3 guys, at least, on the farm that would net some pitching help. You just have to pull the trigger. I'm sure the Sox would trade Garcia for a package containing Jr. as well.

IslandRed
06-17-2006, 12:54 PM
I highly doubt the Reds will finish about .500 unless some trades are made within the next couple of weeks to get some real pitching. I think that a lot of our predictions for the season are going to end up becoming about right. 81 wins might be a miracle for this staff. Even if they get to .500, it's not good enough. I'm tired of settling. While other teams are trying to improve their clubs, it always seems the Reds are spinning their wheels. Go do something.


If the situation is so far gone that finishing 81-81 is a miracle in your opinion, dealing for enough pitching to make the playoffs (which will probably take 90-92 wins at minimum) would be an even bigger miracle.

Matt700wlw
06-17-2006, 01:10 PM
How about a compromise: Claussen to the pen, Mays stays in the pen, White gets DFA, and Dumatrait gets a few starts to see if he can handle the bigs.

Thinking outside the box. How dare you. :)

TeamBoone
06-17-2006, 01:24 PM
I think that the D needs to be sured up...getting Castro is good...he is so solid defensively that his bat is neither a +/-...if he can help these other young positional players become more stable that is great...then we have our OF...Junior is decent in CF, not great, not horrible...but if he had a left and right fielder who could field he would be that much better...of course the answer is to move Junior or Dunn to 1B...then either bring Denorfia or another CF in to play CF to dover the turf.

I am actually shocked by this statement. I read it and went "huh!" as a little electrical shock flowed through my system. Austin Kearns is a very very good defensive right fielder.

Redhook
06-17-2006, 01:39 PM
How about a compromise: Claussen to the pen, Mays stays in the pen, White gets DFA, and Dumatrait gets a few starts to see if he can handle the bigs.

I like this idea, but I think we might have to suffer through a couple Mays' starts before Dumatrait will get a chance. Don't get me wrong, I'd love for Mays to pitch well, but the odds of him pitching well for the rest of the year are slim to none.

I really hope Dumatrait gets a chance up here soon. And here's why. He could pitch great like Elizardo. You never know. Ramirez was putrid last year and wasn't exactly tearing it up this year in AAA (3.94 ERA....not great), but Milton went down and it opened the door for Ramirez. I'm not afraid to admit that I wasn't excited when the Lizard came up here in April, but he's convinced me over and over again that he's a good pitcher. Luckily for us, Ramirez was able to slide right into our rotation and it's worked out great. But what if he had pitched a day or two before he was needed up here, we may have seen Darrel May or someone else up here. Thank goodness that didn't happen. We got lucky. My point is this, I know our AAA pitchers aren't very good and don't project to be very proficient in the majors, but I'd like to see a couple of them get a chance over has-beens like Mays and White. Dumatrait pitched 7 shutout innings the other day giving up only 3 hits. He's pitching well, I'd like to see him get a chance....soon.

Bobcat J
06-17-2006, 02:17 PM
I didn't see tonight's start, but many times Brandon gets in trouble the second time through the lineup. He won't have that problem now, and he may be able to add a mph or two on his fastball pitching short stints.


Claussen's awful in the first inning he pitches. His carrer numbers in the 1st innning pitched are:



Inn ER K BB H ERA K/9 K:BB WHIP
58 40 35 24 64 6.27 5.43 1.46:1 1.52


I don't care if the opposing batters don't seeing him a second time. If Claussen's career numbers hold, he would give up an awful lot of runs in the pen. Of course, all 58 of his 1st innings pitched were starts, so they were against the top of the line-up. His ERA might not be 6.27 but I suspect he would still give up a fair amount of runs early in his outings.

saboforthird
06-17-2006, 02:28 PM
Ugh...

I know Claussen has been bad, but Mays was even worse when starting for the Royals.

Yes, he was bad for the Royals. But, he ain't been bad yet for the Reds. I think that's the reason they're going with Mays for now. Sometimes a player just needs a change of scenery. Claussen has "seen" enough time at the big leagues. Shape up or ship out.