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View Full Version : Encarnacion's Market Value



Jpup
07-15-2006, 01:45 AM
So, since it seems obvious that Narron isn't going to play Edwin Encarnacion everyday, I was thinking that it's time to trade him for some starting pitching. In your opinion, what is he worth? Don't get me wrong, I think it's a bad idea to trade him away, but if he sits, he is useless to the team.

Here is what I don't understand. You trade away the biggest right handed power bat that you have in Austin Kearns, but yet you can't play the best one you have left? We heard all the excuses that Narron was just holding Encarnacion out because he was still hurting a little and they wanted to be cautious. He started on Thursday night, but he sits on Friday night for no reason other than Narron has a fetish for old dudes that can't hit or field very well.

Seriously, what's with Jerry Narron and old guys? Rich Aurilia couldn't catch a cold and Royce Clayton proved he is no better than Lopez with the glove. Get rid of the old guys.

What do you expect that the Reds could get for Edwin Encarnacion in a trade for starting pitching? What is his market value to someone like San Diego who is really needing a 3rd baseman with some pop?

Patrick Bateman
07-15-2006, 01:49 AM
I'm guessing EE may still have some lingering ankle injuries and they don't want to play him everyday.

At least that's what I'm hoping the reason is, otherwise I simply don't know what to say.

Jpup
07-15-2006, 01:58 AM
I'm guessing EE may still have some lingering ankle injuries and they don't want to play him everyday.

At least that's what I'm hoping the reason is, otherwise I simply don't know what to say.

my question was more to do with trading him and what the Reds could get in return.

Patrick Bateman
07-15-2006, 02:07 AM
my question was more to do with trading him and what the Reds could get in return.

Well my point was that Narron may actually like EE and would play him at 100% thus there would be no need to trade him like you suggested. I have no real basis to back-up that thought other then it would make more sense then Narron just being completely incompetent.

Phhhl
07-15-2006, 02:07 AM
I wouldn't at all be surprised to see the Reds look into converting him into an outfielder at this point. Surely, they are not blind to his hitting prowess. Despite the trade, I do not believe the front office to be THAT stupid. Denorfia has some intriguing skills, but I just don't see him as a long-term solution. Unfortunately, Narron is probably going to "platoon" him with Aurilia the remainder of this season, but it wouldn't surprise me it all to see Edwin go to winter ball and play a corner outfield position to get ready for 2007.

Bruce, Votto, Encarnacion and maybe Phillips is about all we have for a lineup looking five years ahead. It could be a good one, but it is getting a little threadbare after the debacle of yesterday.

Jpup
07-15-2006, 05:00 AM
Bruce, Votto, Encarnacion and maybe Phillips is about all we have for a lineup looking five years ahead. It could be a good one, but it is getting a little threadbare after the debacle of yesterday.

Dunn? I sure hope he's here in 5 years.

GAC
07-15-2006, 05:42 AM
Trade value? Not much at this stage.

No one is gonna let pitching go - except no risk, unproven prospects - for one who, yes, has a possible upside, but is yet unproven on the ML level.

reds44
07-15-2006, 01:00 PM
With Kearns and Felipe gone, I honestly feel that EE isn't going anywhere. He and Dunn are what Wayne is going to build his offense around.

Thankfully Narron doesn't control who is traded.

oregonred
07-15-2006, 03:22 PM
With Kearns and Felip gone, I honestly feel that EE isn't going anywhere. He and Dunn are what Wayne is going to build his offense around.

Thankfully Narron doesn't control who is traded.

Agree, hope we're right ;)

KronoRed
07-15-2006, 03:54 PM
How much value could a kid have when the other GM can say "well how good can he be with who've you've got starting over him" ;)

Not saying he's worthless, but he won't bring anything other then low level prospects

reds44
07-15-2006, 03:57 PM
How much value could a kid have when the other GM can say "well how good can he be with who've you've got starting over him" ;)

Not saying he's worthless, but he won't bring anything other then low level prospects
I disagree. People would give up a mjor league player for a young 3rd baseman that is producing.

GAC
07-15-2006, 03:59 PM
Thankfully Narron doesn't control who is traded.

Some wish Krivsky didn't control it either after the trade the other day, and recent acquisitions over the last couple of weeks. :lol:

PuffyPig
07-15-2006, 05:07 PM
EE has lots of trade value, but it doesn't matter as he isn't being traded.

I believe he's sitting becuase he's hurting a bit. Even if Narron wants to get him back slowly, it doesn't undo (form a trade value sense) what he's accomplished to date.

There's no chance that they will groom him for the OF. OF's are easy to find. Thirdbaseman are not easy. He'll be a fine fielder with more experience.

Jpup
07-15-2006, 11:42 PM
EE has lots of trade value, but it doesn't matter as he isn't being traded.

I believe he's sitting becuase he's hurting a bit. Even if Narron wants to get him back slowly, it doesn't undo (form a trade value sense) what he's accomplished to date.

There's no chance that they will groom him for the OF. OF's are easy to find. Thirdbaseman are not easy. He'll be a fine fielder with more experience.

If he's still hurt, why haven't we heard anything from Narron or anyone else about it. It's apparent that Narron has chosen to use Aurilia instead. This offense isn't going to make it without EE or sombody else that can drive the ball. There are too many judy hitters in the lineup IMO.

captainmorgan07
07-16-2006, 12:17 AM
there not trading him krisky already said that so we can all stop wit the rumors why jerry doesnt play him nobody knos

dsmith421
07-16-2006, 01:35 AM
It's gotta be frustrating for a GM when you build a team to fill specific roles and the manager completely ignores them in order to play favorites. There is one standard for Rich Aurilia and another standard for everyone else on this team, and it's sickening. I fear we are starting down the road of destroying yet another promising player's career due to managerial incompetence.

Jpup
07-16-2006, 02:20 AM
there not trading him krisky already said that so we can all stop wit the rumors why jerry doesnt play him nobody knos

who is starting rumors?

GAC
07-16-2006, 06:59 AM
It's gotta be frustrating for a GM when you build a team to fill specific roles and the manager completely ignores them in order to play favorites.

If that were the case then I don't think Kriv would put up with it. And I doubt it is. Kriv, on the pre-game last night said Clayton is a proven veteran and leader on the field. So I doubt he is frustrated. I am. I hate Clayton! ;)

I simply hold onto the hope and belief that Kriv has Castro or Clayton here as short term solutions for the remainder of '06. They are simply here to fill a void that was created at SS with the trading of Felipe in order to try and improve our late inning relief.

Have we improved our BP? That is yet to be seen.

Have we really "killed" ourselves at the SS position? Defensively - No. Offensively - a definite downgrade IMO, but the numbers Lopez was putting up this year make it shaky

A .507 OPS in July, and a .743 overall. Not an impressive '06 season overall IMO.

And people talk about Aurilia's hitting against righties (and I agree). Maybe we should have sat Lopez against lefties (.559 OPS)?

And some can talk all they want about Lopez and Kearn's age and how they were "entering" their prime - upside - and all that good stuff. I respect that, but it is very subjective IMO.

Kearn's, over the last three years has produced a...

.246 BA .340 OB% .445 SLG% .785 OPS

Were these two gonna get better? Maybe, Maybe not. I'm not one who puts that much faith in projections of future production. Everyone thought Lopez finally "put it together" after last year's performance. Then I look at this year's.



There is one standard for Rich Aurilia and another standard for everyone else on this team, and it's sickening. I fear we are starting down the road of destroying yet another promising player's career due to managerial incompetence.

I really don't think that is gonna happen. I want to see EE in there as much as possible; but giving him reduced playing time in the second half isn't gonna damage his pysche IMO. He's young. I think the fans are more upset then EE.

But Aurilia's defensive numbers at 3B have exceeded EE's. And there is no great disparity in their offensive numbers when one looks at BA, RBIs, SLG%. EE has a better OB%, which gives him an edge in OPS (.814 vs .848).

I wanted to look up some more comparative numbers on Baseball Prospectus.... but the site is down!

But again - look at the defensive disparity. That is the reasoning behind this decision IMO.

Overall edge? Aurilia, because of his better defensive numbers, and yes, INF experience. One can label that "veteran presence" all they want; but the bottomline is a numbers game.

The bottomline is - and I believe this wholeheartedly - this management feels they have a better shot this year at making the post-season, or at least keeping that hope alive, with Aurilia getting a majority of the playing time at 3B.

I am not saying I necessarily agree with that decision - simply that I understand the reasoning why.

I understand all this talk about EE's youth, his "upside" and potential. But right now those are immeasurable intangibles. Positives yes, in many fans minds; but again - look at the comparative numbers.

I have stated before that my belief with EE is that you leave him in there and "endure" the errors/lack in overall defense at 3B while he learns/matures.

And most feel that way.

But we are not running this team, and have the pressure on us to win, so it is easy for us, as fans, to say that. Our job is not on the line. It's really no risk for us. We're not the ones who will get yelled at, maligned in the media and by sports pundits.... and maybe even fired, if it fails! :lol:

GAC
07-16-2006, 07:03 AM
dbl post