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View Full Version : Was this the big trade...



djc27osu
07-15-2006, 08:16 PM
I don't post much I just enjoy reading what everyone else has to say. Anyways, I read a few days back that Buster Olney mentioned the Reds were working out a deal that was just as big if not bigger than the A-Rod trade. Surely and hopefully this was not the trade he was talking about, even though I am starting to like the trade more and more. Does anyone know what that possible BIG trade could of been?

dunner13
07-15-2006, 08:28 PM
I wonder if at one point they were talking of a 3 way trade possibly involoving the nationals and marlins, but that fell through so they just made a trade with the nationals.

Unassisted
07-15-2006, 08:30 PM
It was a rumored 3-way trade with Florida and Baltimore that would have brought Miguel Tejada and Dontrelle Willis to Cincinnati. I don't remember who else was purportedly involved.

I honestly think that the euphoria from that notion is what made the trade that finally did happen look so lame to some people.

Blue
07-15-2006, 08:34 PM
I think someone made the whole thing up. I don't think Olney ever said that, and I doubt there was ever a conversation close to the rumored deal.

redsfanmia
07-15-2006, 08:51 PM
I was listening to Baseball Prospetis (sp?) radio today and they were talking about the Reds having alot of interest in Migel Tejada and that they doubt the Wayne K is done dealing. It sounded to me like they thought that this deal was a precurser to a bigger deal down the road. They didnt mention any names in return for Tejada but just that they were pursuing him.

savafan
07-15-2006, 09:09 PM
I was listening to Baseball Prospetis (sp?) radio today and they were talking about the Reds having alot of interest in Migel Tejada and that they doubt the Wayne K is done dealing. It sounded to me like they thought that this deal was a precurser to a bigger deal down the road. They didnt mention any names in return for Tejada but just that they were pursuing him.

Who's left that could bring back Tejada?

marcshoe
07-15-2006, 09:24 PM
The Post writer who linked Tejada to Grimsley, then recanted (I can't remember his name) said that Baltimore wants a top-of-the-rotation starter for Tejada. Unless he's talking future (Homer), and I don't think he is, the Reds can't help there (and no, I don't think Milton qualifies:p:).

redsfanmia
07-15-2006, 09:43 PM
I dont know what Baltimore was looking for in return I just know they were talking about Tejada to the Reds. I doubt it happens but its nice to be involved in trade rumors.

dabvu2498
07-15-2006, 09:44 PM
Who's left that could bring back Tejada?
Someone who's at AA.

redsfanfalcon
07-15-2006, 10:08 PM
Couldn't Tejeda be a free agent if he is traded in the middle of a multi-year contract? Would it really be worth trading for him for just a few months?

crazybob60
07-15-2006, 10:27 PM
Couldn't Tejeda be a free agent if he is traded in the middle of a multi-year contract? Would it really be worth trading for him for just a few months?

To answer your question, no I really don't think it would be and I really don't think it would be worth getting him either because we would have to give up ALOT as well, unless of course we can get more than just him in return such as in the three team trade idea.

Blue
07-15-2006, 10:56 PM
Couldn't Tejeda be a free agent if he is traded in the middle of a multi-year contract? Would it really be worth trading for him for just a few months?

He could demand a trade, and if he is not traded by a certain date, his contract would be voided and he would become a free agent. I doubt he'd demand a trade, though, should some stroke of genius bring him to Cincinnati.

KronoRed
07-15-2006, 11:03 PM
Someone who's at AA.
Won't be near enough

bengalred
07-15-2006, 11:09 PM
Won't be near enough
Maybe Adam Dunn??????

Brutus
07-15-2006, 11:36 PM
Wouldn't a trade involving Ken Griffey Jr. and Miguel Tejada (among others) be just as big if not bigger than the A-Rod deal? I have no idea if any such deal is even in or was in the works, but with those players involved (or as the previous poster mentioned, Adam Dunn involved), I would say that would be a big deal.

steig
07-16-2006, 12:03 AM
If the Reds are willing to take on all or most of Miguel's contract then they probably wouldn't have to give up much at all. The biggest advantage to the O's is to get rid of his contract so they can go after more pitching for next year. Or to just cut the budget and realize they can't compete at this time against the Yankees and Red Sox. I think it has been seen in previous trades that if you take on the large contract you don't have to give up much in return. I believe the Randy Johnson deal worked out similar but I don't remember the exact prospects dealt.

guttle11
07-16-2006, 12:09 AM
Won't be near enough

For the Orioles, that's probably more than enough.

Lopez, Kearns, Wagner, and the Reds taking all of Tejada's contract coulda been enough.

jmac
07-16-2006, 12:41 AM
dunn 2nd
griff 3rd
aurilia 4th :rolleyes:
tejada 5th

Rob Dicken
07-16-2006, 12:44 AM
Griffey and Dunn won't be traded.

Griffey will finish his career in Cincinnati. He makes like 11 million or so a year, and he has like 4 more years on his contract. So, trading him wouldn't make sense on any behalf's part.

flyer85
07-16-2006, 12:52 AM
The Reds basically spent their capitol on this deal. Not much left to trade unless they raise the white flag.

Jpup
07-16-2006, 12:54 AM
The Reds basically spent their capitol on this deal. Not much left to trade unless they raise the white flag.

Homer
Votto
Bruce
Wood
Valentin

They still have a few.

Highlifeman21
07-16-2006, 12:55 AM
Trade Homer Bailey.

Trade him now.

flyer85
07-16-2006, 12:56 AM
Homer
Votto
Bruce
Wood
I seriously doubt they will trade any of those guys, certainly the Twins didn't do it that way.

edabbs44
07-16-2006, 12:57 AM
Homer
Votto
Bruce
Wood
Valentin

They still have a few.
Valentin? Bruce and Homer have to stay...anyone else can go if there is younger talent coming back.

RedsFanatic
07-16-2006, 12:59 AM
This team won't be winning the WS this year. No need to get trade the future (Votto, Bailey, Bruce) for an early round playoff flameout. Almost all of our team's best players haven't entered their primes yet and with our potential superstars in Bailey and Bruce, I forsee some fun in the future.

Jpup
07-16-2006, 01:01 AM
I seriously doubt they will trade any of those guys, certainly the Twins didn't do it that way.

We were discussing in another thread that some rumors are out that Brandon Webb could be had.

I would trade Bailey and whoever else they want for Brandon Webb in a heartbeat.

RedsFanatic
07-16-2006, 01:23 AM
I wouldn't. This is Webbs first dominated year. While he has always been good the bounces can go your way one year and make you look like something you aren't. With that said I would give up Votto in a package for Webb, but not Homer.

DoogMinAmo
07-16-2006, 01:32 AM
Griffey and Dunn won't be traded.

Griffey will finish his career in Cincinnati. He makes like 11 million or so a year, and he has like 4 more years on his contract. So, trading him wouldn't make sense on any behalf's part.


Two more years of Griff, just two more. Then he will be gone just in time to get out of the way of the Boss.

KronoRed
07-16-2006, 01:37 AM
Homer
Votto
Bruce
Wood
Valentin

They still have a few.
Smart teams don't gut their farm system when they can't free spend their way out of it (yankees)

Blue
07-16-2006, 01:53 AM
I wouldn't. This is Webbs first dominated year. While he has always been good the bounces can go your way one year and make you look like something you aren't. With that said I would give up Votto in a package for Webb, but not Homer.

The guy has a career 3.22 ERA. His worst "bounce" was a 3.59 ERA in 2004. They'd have to be stupid to trade him for just 1 prospect. Even if that prospect is Homer Bailey.

Razor Shines
07-16-2006, 02:06 AM
Two more years of Griff, just two more. Then he will be gone just in time to get out of the way of the Boss.
I realize that Jr. isn't the player he used to be, and his OBP is low (right now), but he's still producing. His career OBP is .374 I gotta believe by the end of the season he'll get it up to around .350 and probably drive in about 95 runs. You make it sound like he's horrible.

Razor Shines
07-16-2006, 02:09 AM
The guy has a career 3.22 ERA. His worst "bounce" was a 3.59 ERA in 2004. They'd have to be stupid to trade him for just 1 prospect. Even if that prospect is Homer Bailey.
I agree Webb's only 26, I think, and he is one of the best ground ball pitchers I've ever seen. I would love to see him pitching in Cincy even if it means Bailey. Or Bailey and Votto, like some have said.

DoogMinAmo
07-16-2006, 02:14 AM
I realize that Jr. isn't the player he used to be, and his OBP is low (right now), but he's still producing. His career OBP is .374 I gotta believe by the end of the season he'll get it up to around .350 and probably drive in about 95 runs. You make it sound like he's horrible.

How long can you wait for an old player to regain the form of his youth, or even the health of his youth? For what he is being paid, and even more importantly the percentage of team budget, he is not producing enough. I will enjoy the bright spots, but color me disappointed no matter WHAT happens in these next 2.5 years if Junior's option for 2009 is picked up.

REDREAD
07-16-2006, 02:16 AM
Couldn't Tejeda be a free agent if he is traded in the middle of a multi-year contract? Would it really be worth trading for him for just a few months?

Unless Tejada has a special contract clause (which I doubt), if he's traded to the Reds, at the end of the year, he can demand a trade. So the Reds would be able to flip him for more talent. So, that's not a huge problem to worry about.

jnwohio
07-16-2006, 02:36 AM
Unless Tejada has a special contract clause (which I doubt), if he's traded to the Reds, at the end of the year, he can demand a trade. So the Reds would be able to flip him for more talent. So, that's not a huge problem to worry about.

Whether he would demand a trade or opt for free agency probably comes down to whether he thinks he could get more more in the long run by doing so. He's got a pretty big contract as it is. I am sure his agent would take a long look at the market before advising him to dump it.

redsmetz
07-16-2006, 04:13 AM
Griffey and Dunn won't be traded.

Griffey will finish his career in Cincinnati. He makes like 11 million or so a year, and he has like 4 more years on his contract. So, trading him wouldn't make sense on any behalf's part.

Griffey is signed through 08 with a 14M Club option, 4M buyout for 09

Jpup
07-16-2006, 04:43 AM
I realize that Jr. isn't the player he used to be, and his OBP is low (right now), but he's still producing. His career OBP is .374 I gotta believe by the end of the season he'll get it up to around .350 and probably drive in about 95 runs. You make it sound like he's horrible.

he is pretty bad this year.

Highlifeman21
07-16-2006, 09:10 AM
So I'm curious...

Why all the manlove for Homer Bailey?

I was schooled on Joey Votto (thanks to those of you opening my eyes to a potential future 1B for the Reds!), but I'm not sold on Homer Bailey at all. Maybe I need another prospect lesson to realize what I can't see about Homer Bailey, at this point in his development I don't understand why he's seemingly deemed untouchable.

What is it about Homer Bailey that some of you think makes him the answer to some of our future rotation questions? On his current time table, I'd be surprised if he made an impact for the Reds until the 2008 season at the earliest, most likely the 2009 season.

So, fellow Members of the Board, I ask you, what is so special about Homer Bailey, and why shouldn't we trade him for something that can help us in 2007, rather than him maybe helping us in 2009?

For the record, I still have him going the Howington/Gruler route.

Unassisted
07-16-2006, 12:48 PM
So, fellow Members of the Board, I ask you, what is so special about Homer Bailey, and why shouldn't we trade him for something that can help us in 2007, rather than him maybe helping us in 2009?Because he's a future ace starter and those are: too expensive for a small market club like the Reds to acquire through free agency; and impossible to acquire in a trade without giving up multiple quality players in return.

Highlifeman21
07-16-2006, 02:55 PM
Because he's a future ace starter and those are: too expensive for a small market club like the Reds to acquire through free agency; and impossible to acquire in a trade without giving up multiple quality players in return.

But what makes him a future ace starter? Same was said about Howington and Gruler, and I think Howington is bagging groceries, and I think Gruler is pumping gas...

Who's to say he won't be a back of the rotation guy like Elizardo Ramirez?

uteroasis
07-16-2006, 07:47 PM
But what makes him a future ace starter? Same was said about Howington and Gruler, and I think Howington is bagging groceries, and I think Gruler is pumping gas...

Who's to say he won't be a back of the rotation guy like Elizardo Ramirez?

Homer Bailey was a first-round selection like Howington and Gruler, but look at these minor league numbers.

Howington: 22-35 4.08 ERA, (2-10 4.69 ERA in AA)

Gruler: 2-4 5.36 ERA (never made it to AA)

Bailey: 15-10 3.63 ERA 10.1 K/9 (4-0 0.75 ERA in AA)

Homer Bailey after 1 1/2 seasons of professional baseball was invited to Spring Training. In ST, Bailey pitched 7 1/3 innings, allowed 2 runs and struck out 10. Nearly every Reds story has a note of Bailey's latest performance and Narron joking that Krivsky won't let him see it (because of how well Bailey is doing). Bailey has been dominating AA hitters and was selected in the Futures game.

Redsland
07-16-2006, 08:00 PM
At this point the difference is injuries. Ty and Chris spent less time wearing the "ace" label than they did wearing Ace bandages. Homer, by contrast, has been healthy.

Highlifeman21
07-16-2006, 10:36 PM
Homer Bailey was a first-round selection like Howington and Gruler, but look at these minor league numbers.

Howington: 22-35 4.08 ERA, (2-10 4.69 ERA in AA)

Gruler: 2-4 5.36 ERA (never made it to AA)

Bailey: 15-10 3.63 ERA 10.1 K/9 (4-0 0.75 ERA in AA)

Homer Bailey after 1 1/2 seasons of professional baseball was invited to Spring Training. In ST, Bailey pitched 7 1/3 innings, allowed 2 runs and struck out 10. Nearly every Reds story has a note of Bailey's latest performance and Narron joking that Krivsky won't let him see it (because of how well Bailey is doing). Bailey has been dominating AA hitters and was selected in the Futures game.

And right there, Reds Fans, is why I'm still not excited about Homer Bailey.

Being invited to ST means nothing to me as an A ball player, which IIRC was Bailey's level when invited to ST. Bailey's dominating AA hitters. Again, this is AA. Let him dominate AAA, and then maybe, just maybe I'll believe all the hype.

I can't be the only one that isn't buying into the Homer Bailey hype.

KronoRed
07-16-2006, 10:40 PM
I can't be the only one that isn't buying into the Homer Bailey hype.
:wave:

keeganbrick
07-16-2006, 10:46 PM
So I'm curious...

Why all the manlove for Homer Bailey?

I was schooled on Joey Votto (thanks to those of you opening my eyes to a potential future 1B for the Reds!), but I'm not sold on Homer Bailey at all. Maybe I need another prospect lesson to realize what I can't see about Homer Bailey, at this point in his development I don't understand why he's seemingly deemed untouchable.

What is it about Homer Bailey that some of you think makes him the answer to some of our future rotation questions? On his current time table, I'd be surprised if he made an impact for the Reds until the 2008 season at the earliest, most likely the 2009 season.

So, fellow Members of the Board, I ask you, what is so special about Homer Bailey, and why shouldn't we trade him for something that can help us in 2007, rather than him maybe helping us in 2009?

For the record, I still have him going the Howington/Gruler route.
If you mean as a #1 or #2 starter than yes. He could very well come up in the bullpen at the end of this year and make an impact.

uteroasis
07-17-2006, 01:03 AM
Homer Bailey always could turn out like a Brandon Larson--dominating in minors, embarrassing in majors. But I wouldn't want to trade him away like the Mets did with Scott Kazmir. Kazmir for Victor Zambrano. Kazmir never played AAA, but his jump from AA to the Majors wasn't the best (2-3 5.67 ERA). If Bailey can do anything like Kazmir has done this year at age 21 (10-9 3.77 ERA), I would hate to see him go.

I don't know if I'd do it, but good thing I'm not the one making the decisions. I fall in love with prospects too easily. I remember being mad when the Reds traded Noochie Varner.

Highlifeman21
07-17-2006, 08:51 AM
If you mean as a #1 or #2 starter than yes. He could very well come up in the bullpen at the end of this year and make an impact.

I can't imagine we'd see Homer Bailey before 2007 at the earliest. Even then, I don't know if a kid in AA with control problems and extreme love for his fastball are really better than what we have to offer in the rotation or the pen.

redsmetz
07-17-2006, 09:11 AM
I can't imagine we'd see Homer Bailey before 2007 at the earliest. Even then, I don't know if a kid in AA with control problems and extreme love for his fastball are really better than what we have to offer in the rotation or the pen.

I think Bailey needs more time in the minors to work on perfecting his repertoire. I noticed the comments about his appearance in the AA All Star game and how proud he was of blowing away the batters with his beloved fast ball. I'm told guys who can hit fast balls are a dime a dozen. Pitchers have to be smarter than that. He's 20 years old, right? There plenty of time for him to get to the majors. More seasoning will do him good.