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Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 02:43 PM
Tentative deal according to Buster Olney

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 02:49 PM
Tentative Deal.... rumor....

Oh, Yankees MAY get Abreu......

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 02:52 PM
Tentative Deal.... rumor....

Oh, Yankees MAY get Abreu......

It's on the "breaking news" box on ESPN News...I think this time it's real.

NJReds
07-30-2006, 02:54 PM
On the Yankees broadcast, they've yet to confirm but noted that Abreu was pulled from the Phillies lineup.

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 02:56 PM
It very well may happen. But it hasn't. And they are still talking about what players they get back. So the headline should say "tentative".

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 02:57 PM
It very well may happen. But it hasn't. And they are still talking about what players they get back. So the headline should say "tentative".

It does...

Strikes Out Looking
07-30-2006, 02:58 PM
Olney's tentative deal also says Lydle is going with him.

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 02:59 PM
The thread title should say "tentative" or something similar.

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 03:00 PM
Olney's tentative deal also says Lydle is going with him.

Good. Then he can't come back here :D

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 03:01 PM
The thread title should say "tentative" or something similar.

Changed! :D

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 03:03 PM
Thanks Matt

Assuming they are picking up his 18 million option for next year, the Yankees are paying a whole lot for a suddenly average outfielder and an average starter.

Gallen5862
07-30-2006, 03:13 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=2534459&type=story
Yankees have tentative deal for Abreu, Lidle

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com news services

The Philadelphia Phillies and New York Yankees have a tentative deal to send Phillies right fiedler Bobby Abreu and pitcher Cory Lidle to New York ESPN.com's Jayson Stark and ESPN The Magazine's Buster Olney reported Sunday.

Stark reported the Yankees will send 18-year-old minor-league shrotstop C.J. Henry -- their No. 1 pick in 2005 -- and 27-year-old left-handed reliever Matt Smith. The Phillies will also pick one other minor-leauge player from an agreed-upon list, while the Yankees will take on responsibility for Abreu and Lidle's contracts. Abreu is owed $15 million for 2007 alone.

Abreu is hitting .277 with 8 home runs and 65 RBI in 99 games. He has a career batting average of .301 with 198 home runs and 841 RBI over 10 seasons.

Lidle, a right-hander, is 8-7 with a 4.74 ERA in 21 starts in 2006. In eight seasons he has a career mark of 78-69 with a 4.54 ERA.

Abreu was in the Phillies' starting lineup Sunday but was pulled for Shane Victorino 10 minutes before their game with the Florida Marlins

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 03:15 PM
Oooh even worse. He's due 15 million in 2007 and the option was for 18 million in 2008. Rumor was he wanted it picked up to waive no-trade clause. I know they have a ton of money, but wow......

MWM
07-30-2006, 03:16 PM
That's not much return for Abreu and Lidle. C.J. Henry has not had a very good start to his professional career. I'd be interested to hear if he's better than his numbers from our more minor league savvy people.

Philly must have been content to get rid of Abreu's contract. I can't say I blame them.

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 03:19 PM
Well, the Phillies gain from this by dumping the bad contract. They just saved 24 million dollars.

cincinnati chili
07-30-2006, 03:23 PM
Make no mistake. This is a salary dump. Abreu is not worth $15 anymore, but he's still very valuable. .427 on base percentage = lots of runs created, even with his descreased power. He's a Hall of Famer, in my book.

CJ Henry looks like a draft bust, and Smith is already a bust.

This only makes sense for the Phillies if they use the money wisely. Time will tell. But in general, as Philly is IIRC the largest market in the country with only one team, I think it's sad that the franchise is in salary dump mode.

Edit: we also don't know who the player to be name is, but I can't imagine it's anyone that good if it's coming from the Yankee farm system.

Joseph
07-30-2006, 03:26 PM
Is it possible that the Yankees will do this year in and year out to the point that they have a roster full of 15 million dollar a year players who are barely league average?

I think it's not far off from happening.

flyer85
07-30-2006, 03:28 PM
That's not much return for Abreu and Lidle. C.J. with all the money Abreu is owed he has little to no trade value. The Phillies are simply getting out from under contracts.

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 03:42 PM
Word is, the Yankees would take on both salaries in their entirety...


Good lord!

Jpup
07-30-2006, 03:45 PM
I like the Yankees, but their payroll is outrageous. Something needs to be done to level the playing field.

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 03:47 PM
I like the Yankees, but their payroll is outrageous. Something needs to be done to level the playing field.

Bud Selig resigning would be a good start to improve baseball

Jpup
07-30-2006, 03:47 PM
Bud Selig resigning would be a good start to improve baseball

I agree.

cincyinco
07-30-2006, 03:52 PM
CJ Henry looks like a draft bust, and Smith is already a bust.

Edit: we also don't know who the player to be name is, but I can't imagine it's anyone that good if it's coming from the Yankee farm system.

CJ Henry is very raw, but scouts say he is an incredible athlete - possibly the best in the entire yankee system. He plays a premium position, and scouts project him to have good defense and a premium bat down the road. Of course, whether that translates still remains to be seen, but give him a lot of time. He's very young.

And the Yankee system isn't as bad as you think. In fact, with this years draft, its even better than before - one thing is for certain, most experts agree their minor league system is a lot stronger than ours right now.

vaticanplum
07-30-2006, 03:53 PM
George Steinbrenner makes me want to throw myself off a bridge. This is not a bad deal for either team...but let's take a moment to consider the fact that once the Yankees' outfield is healthy again, they've got to deal with Matsui, Sheffield, Damon and Abreu. That's a pretty well-paid, big-name logjam, one which will be expensive and virtually useless in the space of a few years.

I thought he was mellowing. But he's still George. he continues to destroy his team long-term and he's going to drive his good, logical people away.

cincyinco
07-30-2006, 03:53 PM
I like the Yankees, but their payroll is outrageous. Something needs to be done to level the playing field.

When was the last time the yankees won anything?

I take plenty enjoyment out of watching them spend hundreds of millions of dollars for nothing.

Jpup
07-30-2006, 03:55 PM
When was the last time the yankees won anything?

I take plenty enjoyment out of watching them spend hundreds of millions of dollars for nothing.

They make the playoffs every year and have won 26 World Championships.

cincyinco
07-30-2006, 03:55 PM
George Steinbrenner makes me want to throw myself off a bridge. This is not a bad deal for either team...but let's take a moment to consider the fact that once the Yankees' outfield is healthy again, they've got to deal with Matsui, Sheffield, Damon and Abreu. That's a pretty well-paid, big-name logjam, one which will be expensive and virtually useless in the space of a few years.

I thought he was mellowing. But he's still George. he continues to destroy his team long-term and he's going to drive his good, logical people away.

All the better for the rest of MLB... ;) But I know you're a Yank fan too, just givin you some grief :)

Truth be told, I tihnk Abreu would be a great addition to anyone's team.. he's overpriced, but if anyone can afford him, its the Yankees. Abreu is an on base machine. Better than Adam Dunn.

johngalt
07-30-2006, 03:56 PM
Will Carroll just made an update to his rumors that the Yankees offer was now Eric Duncan and Tyler Clippard, along with possibly someone else.

The reason? The Red Sox are sniffing around the Abreu tree. :)

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 03:57 PM
When was the last time the yankees won anything?



2000? 2001?

vaticanplum
07-30-2006, 03:58 PM
Well, they won a game less than 48 hours ago...:) and a division title less than a year ago.

But Steinbrenner doesn't consider anything but the WS "anything". Now there is part of me that agrees with him. But I hate the way he goes about it.

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 03:58 PM
"The Red Sox are sniffing around the Abreu tree. "

Didn't the Yankees mark their territory?

johngalt
07-30-2006, 03:59 PM
"The Red Sox are sniffing around the Abreu tree. " Didn't the Yankees mark their territory?

Of course they did. Why do you think the Red Sox are sniffing? ;)

Jpup
07-30-2006, 04:03 PM
wrong thread.

cincyinco
07-30-2006, 04:22 PM
They make the playoffs every year and have won 26 World Championships.

They make the playoffs, because they've played in an incredibly weak division. Outside of Boston, there's been little to no competition in the AL Least for the last several years. The Blue Jays finally geared up this year. The O's haven't been good since the mid 90's.. Boston has only been good since Theo...

I'll ask again, when was the last time they won a World Series? 200 million a year hasn't gotten them anything but an extended season and nothing to show for it.

KronoRed
07-30-2006, 04:24 PM
"The Red Sox are sniffing around the Abreu tree. "

Didn't the Yankees mark their territory?
Maybe even that is too old to work anymore :devil:

JaxRed
07-30-2006, 04:36 PM
Now ESPN is reporting that Philles would get 2 GCL guys catcher Jesus Sanchez and right-hander Carlos Monasterios.

But they also say that Phillies have to convince Abreu to waive his No-trade clause for 1-1.5 mill rather than picking up his option which is what Abreu's agent said had to happen.

Jpup
07-30-2006, 04:39 PM
Now ESPN is reporting that Philles would get 2 GCL guys catcher Jesus Sanchez and right-hander Carlos Monasterios.

But they also say that Phillies have to convince Abreu to waive his No-trade clause for 1-1.5 mill rather than picking up his option which is what Abreu's agent said had to happen.

very tentative, to say the least.

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 04:40 PM
I don't see Cory Lidle being able to handle the pressure of New York.

NJReds
07-30-2006, 04:43 PM
George Steinbrenner makes me want to throw myself off a bridge. This is not a bad deal for either team...but let's take a moment to consider the fact that once the Yankees' outfield is healthy again, they've got to deal with Matsui, Sheffield, Damon and Abreu. That's a pretty well-paid, big-name logjam, one which will be expensive and virtually useless in the space of a few years.

Sheffield might be back in Sept., and then he's a free agent. Abreu covers the Yanks for the rest of this season, and assuming they pick up his option, he'll man RF for them next year and they'll let Sheff walk.

vaticanplum
07-30-2006, 04:45 PM
Sheffield might be back in Sept., and then he's a free agent. Abreu covers the Yanks for the rest of this season, and assuming they pick up his option, he'll man RF for them next year and they'll let Sheff walk.

Yeah, I thought about that later...still a knee-jerk move, in my opinion, but not quite so bad. I still would have preferred that they nurtured Cabrera and spend the extra money on their real need, which is good young pitching. But whatever, George.

Crosby's days have got to be numbered, I would think.

Matt700wlw
07-30-2006, 04:55 PM
The deal is done.

Reds4Life
07-30-2006, 04:56 PM
It's official now. Yankees paying all of Abreu's salary. Lidle going to NY as well.

4 minor leagers going to the Phils.

NJReds
07-30-2006, 04:56 PM
Yeah, I thought about that later...still a knee-jerk move, in my opinion, but not quite so bad. I still would have preferred that they nurtured Cabrera and spend the extra money on their real need, which is good young pitching. But whatever, George.

Crosby's days have got to be numbered, I would think.

I'm not sure that there's any real good pitching to be had. Not w/out trading Hughes (their Bailey), Cabrera, Wang or Cano. So they added to the offense.

BTW, the deal is official. Abreu and Lidle to the Yankees for 4 minor leaguers. The Yanks will pick up all of Abreu's salary. He should do quite well in Yankee Stadium.

UKFlounder
07-30-2006, 05:08 PM
Yeah, I thought about that later...still a knee-jerk move, in my opinion, but not quite so bad. I still would have preferred that they nurtured Cabrera and spend the extra money on their real need, which is good young pitching. But whatever, George.

Crosby's days have got to be numbered, I would think.


But even with Cabrera, Abreu, Damon & Matsui, one of the can DH fairly often, with Giambi playing some 1b, so they still have room.

All the Yankees are doing is playing by the same rules everybody else has - they didn't make the rules, but they just follow them.

And though they haven't won a World Series since 2000, of the 30 teams in baseball only the Angels, D-backs, Marlins, Red Sox & White Sox have won one more recently, so about 24 teams probably would be happy to trade records with the Yanks in the past 6 years.

vaticanplum
07-30-2006, 05:28 PM
But even with Cabrera, Abreu, Damon & Matsui, one of the can DH fairly often, with Giambi playing some 1b, so they still have room.

All the Yankees are doing is playing by the same rules everybody else has - they didn't make the rules, but they just follow them.

And though they haven't won a World Series since 2000, of the 30 teams in baseball only the Angels, D-backs, Marlins, Red Sox & White Sox have won one more recently, so about 24 teams probably would be happy to trade records with the Yanks in the past 6 years.

I agree with ALL of that...I am a huge Yankees fan. I think the money argument against them is the laziest, shallowest argument there is. I just don't think it's a smart decision baseball-wise.

I like both Cabrera and Crosby, and I think the former in particular has great potential and I think it's a shame to see that cheap potential being developed on the bench. The Yankees have been pulling off their offense just fine with two-thirds of their outfield hurt this year. I simply think that Cabrera and Crosby were very serviceable, cheap replacements and that the money could have been put toward pitching in the off-season.

Abreu was the biggest name on the market right now, so Steinbrenner and co. jumped at it. But neither the outfield nor the offense is the team's biggest problem right now. If Lidle works out I'll be happy, but that's a pretty big if.

UKFlounder
07-30-2006, 05:40 PM
Yeah - they definitely need pitching, but given their pitching decisions in recent years - big money to Jarret Wright & Carl Pavano (injury risks, especially Wright) & Johnson (40+ years old), perhaps it's best for them that no big-name pitchers are really available.

edabbs44
07-30-2006, 05:41 PM
There are 2 ridiculous components to this deal:

1) The amt of money the Yankees took on to get Philly to agree
2) The 4 "prospects" the Phillies received.

Gone are the days where you actually have to give up a big-name minor leaguer to get a perennial all-star. It doesn't really matter if Abreu has 9 or 90 homers, that had nothing to do with this deal. It's all about the Benjamins, baby.

The one aspect of baseball which really kills me is the whole "international" signing thing. The 2 lower level guys the Yankees dealt were both international signings. No draft picks needed, just $$$. The Yankees use this loophole for their benefit to the max. They can sign however many guys from the DR every year and just have an unlimited pot of prospects to deal at the deadline. Makes me sick.

Outshined_One
07-30-2006, 06:19 PM
I'm curious as to what Soriano will eventually fetch given what Lee and Abreu have been traded so far.

Granted, Soriano's in the last year of his deal and will be nowhere near as crazily expensive as Abreu + Lidle are, but the point remains.

Mutaman
07-30-2006, 06:20 PM
George Steinbrenner makes me want to throw myself off a bridge. This is not a bad deal for either team...but let's take a moment to consider the fact that once the Yankees' outfield is healthy again, they've got to deal with Matsui, Sheffield, Damon and Abreu. That's a pretty well-paid, big-name logjam, one which will be expensive and virtually useless in the space of a few years.

I thought he was mellowing. But he's still George. he continues to destroy his team long-term and he's going to drive his good, logical people away.

George is now a senile old man. I seriously doubt he calls the shots anymore.

vaticanplum
07-30-2006, 06:31 PM
George is now a senile old man. I seriously doubt he calls the shots anymore.

This deal has Steinbrenner written all over it. Cashman is not exactly cash-conservative, but he has come to blows with Steinbrenner over this constant way of working.

Rojo
07-31-2006, 12:03 AM
The one aspect of baseball which really kills me is the whole "international" signing thing. The 2 lower level guys the Yankees dealt were both international signings. No draft picks needed, just $$$. The Yankees use this loophole for their benefit to the max. They can sign however many guys from the DR every year and just have an unlimited pot of prospects to deal at the deadline. Makes me sick.

You and me both. Its time for an international draft.

MWM
07-31-2006, 12:09 AM
Yeah, an international draft is the one item where MLB dropped the ball with the last CBA. It seemed like a rather obvious fix and one that I don't think the MLBPA would object to. I was really surprised when it didn't change.

Cedric
07-31-2006, 12:18 AM
Yeah, an international draft is the one item where MLB dropped the ball with the last CBA. It seemed like a rather obvious fix and one that I don't think the MLBPA would object to. I was really surprised when it didn't change.

Gotta disagree with the MLBPA part. These players would lose a TON of money if they had to be put in the draft pool.

Now it becomes major bidding wars.

MWM
07-31-2006, 12:28 AM
Gotta disagree with the MLBPA part. These players would lose a TON of money if they had to be put in the draft pool.

Now it becomes major bidding wars.

You're right in that it becomes a major bidding war which means these players get a lot more money. But you're talking about players who aren't members of the MLBPA yet. I would think making the international players go through the same drafting process would lower the amount paid to these guys leaving more money for the ML rosters. I could be wrong here, but I don't think the MLBPA represents international players prior to them being signed.

Mutaman
07-31-2006, 01:13 AM
This deal has Steinbrenner written all over it. Cashman is not exactly cash-conservative, but he has come to blows with Steinbrenner over this constant way of working.

The last time Steinbrenner spoke publicly was about one year ago when he was interviewed by Michael Kay. It was obvious that he was losing it. Daily News columnist Bob Raiseman wrote the following:

"During his lengthy chat with Michael Kay, Steinbrenner too was a shell of himself. The steely stare has given way to hollow eyes. Arrogance and bluster replaced by the tinny-toned voice of a grandfather suddenly awakened from a nap.

No energy.

No animation.

Steinbrenner was not registering. He seemed incapable of getting in-depth or offering details. This was a session of stock answers and repetition.

It did not matter what Steinbrenner was asked. Just hearing him answer the questions and seeing how he looked while answering made this interview eerie and, in a bizarre sense, compelling. This is a man who clearly has lost his fastball.
The interview was revealing, all right.
A revelation in sadness.
On Sunday, Steinbrenner's demeanor and performace did not fit that description. There, on the big screen, sitting in a large leather chair fiddling with his glasses, trying to remember moments and answer questions, Steinbrenner just looked small.

And sad. "

Steinbrenner has not been heard from since, except for brief appearances during spring training and at games where he will not talk to reporters. On several occassions I have read in the New York tabloids that there is a quiet understanding among reporters that they will no longer quote any off the cuff remarks by George so as not to embarass him.

Anybody who thinks the Boss is still in comand is not paying attention.

Jpup
07-31-2006, 02:00 AM
The last time Steinbrenner spoke publicly was about one year ago when he was interviewed by Michael Kay. It was obvious that he was losing it. Daily News columnist Bob Raiseman wrote the following:

"During his lengthy chat with Michael Kay, Steinbrenner too was a shell of himself. The steely stare has given way to hollow eyes. Arrogance and bluster replaced by the tinny-toned voice of a grandfather suddenly awakened from a nap.

No energy.

No animation.

Steinbrenner was not registering. He seemed incapable of getting in-depth or offering details. This was a session of stock answers and repetition.

It did not matter what Steinbrenner was asked. Just hearing him answer the questions and seeing how he looked while answering made this interview eerie and, in a bizarre sense, compelling. This is a man who clearly has lost his fastball.
The interview was revealing, all right.
A revelation in sadness.
On Sunday, Steinbrenner's demeanor and performace did not fit that description. There, on the big screen, sitting in a large leather chair fiddling with his glasses, trying to remember moments and answer questions, Steinbrenner just looked small.

And sad. "

Steinbrenner has not been heard from since, except for brief appearances during spring training and at games where he will not talk to reporters. On several occassions I have read in the New York tabloids that there is a quiet understanding among reporters that they will no longer quote any off the cuff remarks by George so as not to embarass him.

Anybody who thinks the Boss is still in comand is not paying attention.


He was quoted in several NY rags last week that he liked Bobby Abreu. He has also said several times that the roster and transactions are on the shoulders of Brian Cashman.

WMR
07-31-2006, 03:20 AM
The Yankees are the devil and George Steinbrenner is the Anti-Christ.

Caveat Emperor
07-31-2006, 03:28 AM
The Yankees are the devil and George Steinbrenner is the Anti-Christ.

Hard to fault the devil when he plays by the rules. The Yankees are a product of a broken system, not the cause.

WMR
07-31-2006, 04:02 AM
Hard to fault the devil when he plays by the rules. The Yankees are a product of a broken system, not the cause.

Please, Caveat, don't try to inject a sense of reason into my Yankee hatred! :laugh:

KronoRed
07-31-2006, 05:12 AM
Contract the yanks and red sox :D

Rojo
08-01-2006, 04:24 PM
You're right in that it becomes a major bidding war which means these players get a lot more money. But you're talking about players who aren't members of the MLBPA yet. I would think making the international players go through the same drafting process would lower the amount paid to these guys leaving more money for the ML rosters. I could be wrong here, but I don't think the MLBPA represents international players prior to them being signed.

Yeah, I don't think the MLBPA has a problem with an international draft or bonus caps. The Red Sox and Yankees however are different story.