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View Full Version : Merged: Anyone who doesn't believe in "clutch..." / Big Papi says...



Edskin
07-31-2006, 11:27 PM
Has NEVER seen David Ortiz play baseball. Honestly, how in the world do you explain this? It's absurd. ANOTHER walk-off win-- a three run homer to be exact. It's just ridiculous.

RFS62
07-31-2006, 11:27 PM
.... "I got your clutch right here."


Wow.

MrCinatit
07-31-2006, 11:29 PM
Yeah. I was watching that. Simply amazing - the guy literally lives for that type of situation.

TOBTTReds
07-31-2006, 11:30 PM
That guy is unreal. Every time it seems. He is "clutch"

captainmorgan07
07-31-2006, 11:31 PM
what did he do?

CTA513
07-31-2006, 11:32 PM
what did he do?

Hit a walk off 3-run homerun.

TOBTTReds
07-31-2006, 11:33 PM
Hit a walk off 3-run homerun.

Down by 2 off a 100 mph pitch

VR
07-31-2006, 11:33 PM
105 ribbies by the end of July. :scared:

Cedric
07-31-2006, 11:33 PM
I got your HGH right here. Bam.

edabbs44
07-31-2006, 11:35 PM
What's the excuse gonna be this time? Should be unanimous. And if clutch doesn't exist, Ortiz may have invented it.

RedsManRick
07-31-2006, 11:58 PM
Show me a bad player that's clutch. Funny how it's always the best players in the game who regularly perform in "clutch" situations. Wonder why that is...?

VR
08-01-2006, 01:06 AM
Show me a bad player that's clutch. Funny how it's always the best players in the game who regularly perform in "clutch" situations. Wonder why that is...?

Jimmy Leyritz

TOBTTReds
08-01-2006, 01:28 AM
Show me a bad player that's clutch. Funny how it's always the best players in the game who regularly perform in "clutch" situations. Wonder why that is...?

I don't see A-Rod doing it too often. Is he the anti-clutch?

I def. understand what you are saying, and I agree, but for some reason, Big Papi does it EVERY time (so it seems). I'm just saying no one else in the game seems to come up with huge hits like him. Again, it is the EVERY time aspect to me that makes him clutch.

redsrule2500
08-01-2006, 02:40 AM
David Ortiz does not deserve MVP. He doesn't even use a glove.

Big Klu
08-01-2006, 03:49 AM
Ortiz is an ex-Twin.... :D

KronoRed
08-01-2006, 03:56 AM
Jimmy Leyritz
Are greenies clutch?

jmcclain19
08-01-2006, 04:12 AM
David Ortiz in "Close and Late" situations in 2006


64PA, 17H, .293AVG/.359OBP/.741SLG/1.101OPS

Adam Dunn in "Close and Late" situations in 2006


60PA, 15H, .319AVG/.484OBP/.660SLG/1.143OPS

KronoRed
08-01-2006, 04:26 AM
Dunn is clutch this year..no doubt.

Ron Madden
08-01-2006, 04:30 AM
David Ortiz in "Close and Late" situations in 2006



Adam Dunn in "Close and Late" situations in 2006

WOW! Great stat Jmcclain. :thumbup:

buckeyenut
08-01-2006, 06:42 AM
Ortiz is "clutch" because he plays for the Red Sox. Any other team and he wouldn't leading Sportscenter for the hits.

Don't get me wrong, he is very good. But ESPN overblows it IMO

Johnny Footstool
08-01-2006, 11:01 AM
I don't see A-Rod doing it too often. Is he the anti-clutch?

ESPN doesn't like to present A-Rod as a clutch hitter.

And he's not -- this season. But his 2003-2005 Close and Late OPS is .945 - very similar to his overall .972 OPS during that time span.

David Ortiz is simply an amazing hitter, and he actually does become more amazing in Close and Late situations. It helps he's got another amazing hitter following him, too.

RedsManRick
08-01-2006, 04:07 PM
I don't see A-Rod doing it too often. Is he the anti-clutch?

I def. understand what you are saying, and I agree, but for some reason, Big Papi does it EVERY time (so it seems). I'm just saying no one else in the game seems to come up with huge hits like him. Again, it is the EVERY time aspect to me that makes him clutch.

Unfortunately Baseball Tonight does make Ortiz' failures the lead story. He succeeds at the end of games at roughly the same rate he succeeds in the beginning of games. That said, he does both better than nearly everybody else. Perception, largely driven by media coverage makes all the difference.

When ARod has a clutch hit, it's passed off as the exception, and then we're show the 2 of 3 times he fails. We're told "Arod fails more often than not in clutch situations"

When Big Papi has a clutch hit, it's hailed as further proof of his excellence and the 2 of 3 times he fails are brushed aside (nobody's perfect after all). Besides, if it were REALLY important, he would've come through.... We're told "Papi comes through every time his team really needs him".

The fact of the matter is that in the small single season sample sizes of clutch situations, random variation in performance around a player's normal ability makes it impossible to say anything other than "my, Ortiz sure is doing well in close & late situations this year..." Even then though, it's funny how his "clutch" numbers look an awful lot like his normal ones.

osuceltic
08-01-2006, 04:26 PM
Unfortunately Baseball Tonight does make Ortiz' failures the lead story. He succeeds at the end of games at roughly the same rate he succeeds in the beginning of games. That said, he does both better than nearly everybody else. Perception, largely driven by media coverage makes all the difference.

When ARod has a clutch hit, it's passed off as the exception, and then we're show the 2 of 3 times he fails. We're told "Arod fails more often than not in clutch situations"

When Big Papi has a clutch hit, it's hailed as further proof of his excellence and the 2 of 3 times he fails are brushed aside (nobody's perfect after all). Besides, if it were REALLY important, he would've come through.... We're told "Papi comes through every time his team really needs him".

The fact of the matter is that in the small single season sample sizes of clutch situations, random variation in performance around a player's normal ability makes it impossible to say anything other than "my, Ortiz sure is doing well in close & late situations this year..." Even then though, it's funny how his "clutch" numbers look an awful lot like his normal ones.

I'll tell you this, though: Red Sox fans watch a game hoping Ortiz has a chance to swing the bat at the end of the game. Yankees fans now expect A-Rod to fail at the end of the game. It's not SportsCenter creating that collective feeling, it's the entirety of experiences these fans have with these players. They've seen Ortiz come through time and time again in the clutch in big games and they've seen A-Rod fail time and time again in the clutch in big games. This isn't some media-driven collective hypnosis controlling the emotions of these fans.

Crash Davis
08-01-2006, 06:59 PM
Has anyone ever seen or heard a professional athlete or a former professional athlete say that there's no such thing as "clutch"?

I've seen many claims & studies purporting the myth of clutch, the impossibility of clutch, the misdiagnosis of clutch, etc. But I've never seen or heard somebody who has actually had an athletic career make that proclamation.

Peculiar.