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Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 05:17 PM
Lohse will start Saturday

Well, it's official. Kyle Lohse will get the ball Saturday afternoon against the Braves. There's nothing wrong with Brandon Claussen physically, it's strictly a "baseball decision," according to Narron.

Claussen's rehab clock runs out next week, and he says he feels fine, so it'll be interesting to see what they do with him. He said no one has approached him about the possibility of sliding into a long-relief role.


-Marc's blog

Reds Fanatic
08-02-2006, 05:20 PM
I don't get why they used him for 21 pitches in a blowout last night if they were thinking of starting him Saturday.

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 05:20 PM
Saturday's game is on Fox TV also....

Reds4Life
08-02-2006, 05:27 PM
Saturday's loss is on Fox TV also....

Fixed.

BRM
08-02-2006, 05:32 PM
Who's starting for the Braves on Saturday?

Reds Fanatic
08-02-2006, 05:34 PM
Who's starting for the Braves on Saturday?
They still have not announced Saturday. James is starting Friday and Smoltz on Sunday for the Braves.

CTA513
08-02-2006, 05:34 PM
I don't get why they used him for 21 pitches in a blowout last night if they were thinking of starting him Saturday.

My guess is they wanted to see what he had before giving him a start.
It probably would have been best to not let him pitch to Saturday since he hasnt started for a while.

flyer85
08-02-2006, 05:35 PM
I will get a close view on Saturday. At least Chipper Jones is out.

Reds Fanatic
08-02-2006, 05:36 PM
ESPN site says Jason Shiell is starting for the Braves Saturday. He has an ERA over 6. This looks like a 10-9 game on Saturday.

redsmetz
08-02-2006, 05:45 PM
ESPN site says Jason Shiell is starting for the Braves Saturday. He has an ERA over 6. This looks like a 10-9 game on Saturday.

As long as we're the 10, I'm fine with that.

registerthis
08-02-2006, 05:47 PM
Lohse will start Saturday

I knew it.

Too much use of the phrase "roster flexibility" to believe that Lohse would strictly be a reliever.

flyer85
08-02-2006, 05:49 PM
I knew it.

Too much use of the phrase "roster flexibility" to believe that Lohse would strictly be a reliever.they didn't trade for him just for that. Although if Claussen had pitched well on Monday night he likely would have gotten the Saturday start. When he got shelled it made their decision easy.

RedLegSuperStar
08-02-2006, 05:53 PM
I don't get why they used him for 21 pitches in a blowout last night if they were thinking of starting him Saturday.

Probably because they had an idea he was going to pitch Saturday. So getting him some work in a NL game. Also that gives him 3 days rest so that may be the reason for just an inning worth of work out of him. When the deal happened it was insurance incase Claussen didn't pitch well on Monday. Also either way it bolsters the bullpen. With Claussen never ever pitching in relief his whole career.. that may move him back into the rotation and bump Lohse. However.. I wonder if Elizardo struggles, if they might plug Lohse in and have Elizardo come out of the pen.

Puffy
08-02-2006, 06:32 PM
great. Just wonderful.

marcshoe
08-02-2006, 06:42 PM
It was bound to happen sooner or later. Might as well get it out of the way now. Besides, the Braves can't be too familiar with him. I don't expect too much, but lightning can strike in such situations.

Too bad Belisle's hurt. I like him better than any of the other options we're seeing.

Falls City Beer
08-02-2006, 06:43 PM
How much of this move was an effort to shut Lohse and his agent up? :)

Caveat Emperor
08-02-2006, 06:55 PM
There's nothing wrong with Brandon Claussen physically

I guess "Lack of Talent" doesn't really qualify as a physical ailment.

Six Kyle Lohse, half a dozen Joe Mays. I've really got no problem with pitching him because he's the best of any options the Reds have (which is in no way a compliment to Lohse). I'm not going to cry about the loss of Justin Germano, as I think he would've gotten litten like a fuse once hitters had a chance to look at him and see what he was all about.

This is what happens when you blow every discernable trading chip you have on bullpen pitching and leave the back of your rotation to rot away. The Reds failed to address their need for starting pitching, and they're reaping what they've sown.

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 07:39 PM
Can we at least let the guy pitch before we crucify him?

He may deserve it...but not yet.

KronoRed
08-02-2006, 07:42 PM
We let Joe Mays pitch first and look how that turned out :evil:

PuffyPig
08-02-2006, 08:08 PM
We let Joe Mays pitch first and look how that turned out :evil:
Yes, but Ramirez was crucified by many, as was Arroyo and especially Harang.

M2
08-02-2006, 08:15 PM
Can we at least let the guy pitch before we crucify him?

He may deserve it...but not yet.

You know, he has pitched before.

As a reliever he's potentially interesting, as a starter he's straight out of the Milton/Ortiz school of getting walloped. Doesn't help that the Braves have a quality offense. If it were the Cubs or Astros he'd at least have some favorable matchups.

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 08:16 PM
You know, he has pitched before.

As a reliever he's potentially interesting, as a starter he's straight out of the Milton/Ortiz school of getting walloped. Doesn't help that the Braves have a quality offense. If it were the Cubs or Astros he'd at least have some favorable matchups.

Maybe the change of league can help him. Maybe a new team can get his head on straight.

Maybe not.


I'm willing to at least give the guy a chance. If he stinks, I'll tell him :)

westofyou
08-02-2006, 08:19 PM
You know, he has pitched before.

Let us hope he channels the 4 starts he made in the ML this season, he had 2 CG and a sub 2 ERA in those games. Maybe the some of the Braves will be loopy after the night game? 5 Ways and and some Little Kings can hurt the uninitiated.

OnBaseMachine
08-02-2006, 08:21 PM
Can we at least let the guy pitch before we crucify him?

He may deserve it...but not yet.

He pitched last night, and we all know how that turned out.

He's awful.

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 08:22 PM
He pitched last night, and we all know how that turned out.

He's awful.

They all pitched last night.

They all sucked.


It's one game....one rather ugly game, but one game.

redsrule2500
08-02-2006, 08:31 PM
I'm not sure he's good....

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 08:32 PM
I'm not sure he's good....

None of us sure....but he's not Joe Mays :D

M2
08-02-2006, 08:37 PM
Maybe the change of league can help him. Maybe a new team can get his head on straight.

Maybe not.

Maybe, but Lohse has 900 IP under his belt and a 4.89 career ERA. He allows too many baserunners and he's got longball issues. Hopping a short flight from Minneapolis to Cincinnati isn't going to make all of that stuff go away. Kyle Lohse is still Kyle Lohse.

As has been noted elsewhere, the Twins could use another solid starter or two as well and they punted Lohse during a playoff chase. That club knows a thing or two about pitching.

I'll reiterate, trading for Lohse to be in the pen had some potential upside, trading for Lohse to be in the rotation has monstruous downside. He could play a big role in torpedoing the team's season.

LexingtonRedsFan
08-02-2006, 08:41 PM
Call me crazy (you wouldnt be the first...), but he kind of reminds me of jose acevedo....in that, he has "decent stuff" and will some times dominate the opposition and others will make you wonder why he isnt selling insurance. I give him a pass for last night as I hope it was due alot to jitters, but I cant say that I am surprised that he is starting. I have to assume that with claussens performance and his side session today, they want to keep him in louisville as long as they can.

M2
08-02-2006, 08:47 PM
Acevedo's a pretty solid comparison.

OnBaseMachine
08-02-2006, 08:49 PM
They all pitched last night.

They all sucked.


It's one game....one rather ugly game, but one game.

Check out his stats with the Twins. His whole career has been subpar to say the least.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6751

Matt700wlw
08-02-2006, 08:51 PM
Check out his stats with the Twins. His whole career has been subpar to say the least.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6751

I know..it worries me, but I'll wait and see...

Sea Ray
08-02-2006, 08:55 PM
Lohse will start Saturday

Well, it's official. Kyle Lohse will get the ball Saturday afternoon against the Braves. There's nothing wrong with Brandon Claussen physically, it's strictly a "baseball decision," according to Narron.

Claussen's rehab clock runs out next week, and he says he feels fine, so it'll be interesting to see what they do with him. He said no one has approached him about the possibility of sliding into a long-relief role.


-Marc's blog

Can anybody look up what the rehab rules are. I was under the impression that pitchers could stay out on rehab longer than hitters. I found this from the Baltimore Sun:


There are two disabled lists, 15-day and 60-day. Players may be disabled retroactively, up to a maximum of 10 days, beginning with the day after the last day they played. A player on the 15-day DL may be shifted to the 60-day DL at any time. Players may be assigned to a minor-league club for injury rehabilitation for a maximum of 20 days (30 days for pitchers).

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-baseballterms,0,2989710.story?coll=bal-baseball-storyutil

The guys on radio seem to think his 21 day rehab is up on Tuesday. Doesn't he have more than 21 days?

Redsland
08-02-2006, 09:05 PM
It's 30 days for pitchers, as your article mentions.

:beerme:

deltachi8
08-02-2006, 09:09 PM
None of us sure....but he's not Joe Mays :D

six of one....

Sea Ray
08-02-2006, 09:11 PM
It's 30 days for pitchers, as your article mentions.

:beerme:

Thanks. Someone ought to let Marc know. He's sounding pretty silly

Ron Madden
08-03-2006, 05:58 AM
Ahhh Yes, Pitching and Defense.

What more can we ask for?

BRM
08-03-2006, 10:27 AM
Ahhh Yes, Pitching and Defense.

What more can we ask for?

Well, it would be nice to actually have pitching and defense...

registerthis
08-03-2006, 10:39 AM
I guess "Lack of Talent" doesn't really qualify as a physical ailment.

In that case, I've been on the DL my entire life. :D

TRF
08-03-2006, 10:52 AM
I know..it worries me, but I'll wait and see...

You do that. But most here KNEW Milton would be a disaster. And he is.

Most here KNEW Ortiz would be a disaster. And he was.

Most here KNEW Joe Freaking Mays would be a disaster of Krakatoa proportions. And he was.

Yan

White

Burns

Most here KNEW Majewski had bee ridden too hard for two seasons now.

Conversely...

Most here see Elizardo as a solid upcoming #3 pitcher. Most saw Arroyo as a guy that would benefit from a change in leagues, but that he could be the 2004 Arroyo, or he could be the 2005 Arroyo. Harang had yet to pitch a full season in the Major Leagues when aquired, and while nobody saw him as a guy that might lead the league in K's I don't think trading Guillen for him was trashed all that much. Now the Williamson and Boone trades, that's another story.

Rose colored glasses are fine, but i prefer reality. Are you for some reason expecting Lohse to be something he's never been? Maybe his AAA numbers are indicative of a change in him. But then Mike burns is dominating AAA too.

M2
08-03-2006, 11:04 AM
I know..it worries me, but I'll wait and see...

I'm going to wait and see if the sun rises in the east and sets in the west on Saturday. I'm told it's a lock, a sure thing, but there's no reason the earth couldn't spin in the opposite direction.

TRF
08-03-2006, 11:19 AM
Oh, sure the sun will probably come up in the east, but lately I've been hearing reports that west, even north might be a possibility.

Heard it from the moon.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 11:23 AM
But then Mike burns is dominating AAA too.As are all those Chattanooga relievers... what's the difference?

Sometimes you can get surprised by a turn around.

Josh Hancock says hi.

osuceltic
08-03-2006, 11:33 AM
Rose colored glasses are fine, but i prefer reality. Are you for some reason expecting Lohse to be something he's never been?

Let's give him a chance to be something he has been up until a terrible start this season. If he is just the league average pitcher he has been up until this season, do you know how much of an improvement that would be? Do you know how far Claussen has to go to have the track record Lohse has? Who else do you suggest get the start?

No one is expecting him to morph into Cy Young. He's being pushed into the fifth starter's spot because we don't have any other good options. Look around -- precious few teams have good options in that spot. If Lohse can give give them five or six innings and keep them in the game, that's all anyone can ask. And looking at this guy's track record, that's not asking for the sun to rise in the west.

For crying out loud, just slit your wrists and get it over with.

Sea Ray
08-03-2006, 11:53 AM
The truth is a lot of teams have a vacuum at #5 starter. The Red Sox are struggling with 3-11 Jason Johnson. The Yankees have used castoffs like Sydney Ponson and in our own division the Cardinals #5 guy, Jeff Weaver, just got rocked again last night. A lot of teams would like a decent #5. There just isn't enough good starting pitching to fill 5 spots on 30 teams. The reality is when our #5 guy goes we'd better bring our hitting shoes and hope the bullpen is ready.

deltachi8
08-03-2006, 12:01 PM
Its not just the 5th starter on this club though. The 4ths starter is a train wreck in progress most nights and the third is a work in progress.

If #'s 3 and 4 were more solid, I wouldnt mind much what the Reds did with the 5 spot.

flyer85
08-03-2006, 12:05 PM
something to ponder


Dan (NY): When we look back on this trade deadline two years from now, which lower-profile deal is most likely to be considered highway robbery?

SportsNation Jim Callis: I'll throw out a couple . . . Zach Ward for washed-up Kyle Lohse . . . Ryan Shealy for a couple of guys with big arms and no command . . . Hector Luna may turn out to be just as good as Ronnie Belliard . . . Tyler Lumsden for Mike MacDougal . . . Shairon Martis for Mike Stanton. I also think Craig Wilson will help the Yankees a lot more than Shawn Chacon will help the Pirates, but you knew that already. I think my golden retrievers knew that already.

TRF
08-03-2006, 12:17 PM
As are all those Chattanooga relievers... what's the difference?

Sometimes you can get surprised by a turn around.

Josh Hancock says hi.

Hancock was a guy that posted far better number (small sample) as a reliever than as a starter. He did go something like 5-1 as a starter 2 years ago for the reds, but really, dude doesn't have much of a track record at all. his three year splits (2002-2005) show he is far better in relief than as a starter.

Lohse has a very difinitive record that clearly shows his DECLINE as a starter. His K numbers are far better as a reliever. He's a better pitcher as a reliever period.

So why start him? And BTW, the guys I advocated at both AA and AAA were always relievers, or to be used as relievers like Pelland.

IslandRed
08-03-2006, 12:24 PM
So why start him?

OK, so don't. Who are you giving the ball to Saturday, then?

For what it's worth, I don't expect Lohse to be good, exactly. Less disastrous than the dreck we've been running out in the #5 slot all year, and most everyone else has in their #5 slot? Maybe. Fingers crossed.

Ideally, we can swing a waiver deal for someone better soon, but it's too early for anyone to have cleared waivers yet, I think.

BRM
08-03-2006, 12:26 PM
OK, so don't. Who are you giving the ball to Saturday, then?


Claussen is the only other option right now. Maybe the Reds can just make it a bullpen night?

TRF
08-03-2006, 12:30 PM
Let's give him a chance to be something he has been up until a terrible start this season. If he is just the league average pitcher he has been up until this season, do you know how much of an improvement that would be? Do you know how far Claussen has to go to have the track record Lohse has? Who else do you suggest get the start?

No one is expecting him to morph into Cy Young. He's being pushed into the fifth starter's spot because we don't have any other good options. Look around -- precious few teams have good options in that spot. If Lohse can give give them five or six innings and keep them in the game, that's all anyone can ask. And looking at this guy's track record, that's not asking for the sun to rise in the west.

For crying out loud, just slit your wrists and get it over with.

wow. really can't get enough of you telling the rest of us how to think.

I gan be mad that the GM of the team I have followed for almost 30 years insists on signing Joe Mays, Yan and others of that ilk if I want to. The guy (Lohse) has been in a decline for three years. K's dropping. OPS rising. you think he'll not only be what he was when he first came up with the Twins, but that he'll actually progress from that point. OK. it won't happen, but ok.

Hey, I hope he goes 8, and K's 8. I hope the Reds win and he throws a shut out. But if he gives up less than 5 runs, I'll be stunned. But he might. Mays only gave up 4 in his first start. And where is he now?

And think about this: The Twins are in the middle of the WC race and they gave him up for a guy at Low A ball.

flyer85
08-03-2006, 12:30 PM
to this point in the season Lohse and Claussen have been about the same pictcher, both -12 RAA.

With the dealing of Germano, the options are limited if there is no chance they bring up Bailey.

flyer85
08-03-2006, 12:37 PM
BTW, Hudson has been pitching well for KC as a starter.

BRM
08-03-2006, 12:39 PM
BTW, Hudson has been pitching well for KC as a starter.

4.67 ERA with a 1.35 WHIP overall. The numbers are even better as a starter. That's not world-beater stuff but it's better than what Claussen has given us so far.

M2
08-03-2006, 12:43 PM
IMO, comparing Lohse to other dreck on the pitching market misses the larger point.

It didn't take a genius to figure out the Reds were getting boxed into this corner. They've already got starting pitching problems. Eric Milton's still in the rotation and getting kicked around. Elizardo Ramirez may very well be turning back into a pumpkin in front of our eyes. The Reds didn't/don't need a #5 starter. They really need another #3 starter.

The Reds needed to make a serious play for a starting pitcher in July and they came out of it with Kyle Lohse, a guy who probably should spend the rest of his career in the pen (at least if you want to entertain the notion of him actually pitching well on a consistent basis and helping your team).

Obviously the Reds lack appealing options -- that's the problem. They had to see this coming and the guy they acquired is likely to act as an anchor instead of a buoy. "Well, he shouldn't be as awful as Joe Mays and Dave Williams" in no way constitutes meaningful help to a team trying to get to October. Bad pitching always hurts.

This is just another obstacle the team is going to have to conquer if it wants to make the playoffs. The sad part of it is, it's an obstacle the management put in the team's way.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 12:44 PM
Lohse has a very difinitive record that clearly shows his DECLINE as a starter.True, but in AAA this year he has good numbers as a starter, you want promotion to the Reds for their AA relievers based on the same critera, then you should allow this "spot start" to occur rather then act as if it's some blight on the game. Plenty of losers have been getting spot starts and 5th start slots for 30 years now, it's a hard slot to fill.... otherwise we never would have heard of this.

Weaver's Seventh Law: It's easier to find four good starters than five

Fact is Jose Lima and Geremi Gonzalez have started 7 of the Mets games this year, it's a hard slot to fill.

flyer85
08-03-2006, 12:45 PM
4.67 ERA with a 1.35 WHIP overall. The numbers are even better as a starter. That's not world-beater stuff but it's better than what Claussen has given us so far.in 4 starts his ERA is 3.42

and those starts have been against Boston, LA, Texas and Chicago. Those are 4 excellent hitting teams. In those starts Hudson has become a GB machine 42/19 GB/FB ratio. 21K/7BB ratio. With those numbers the results are not a fluke. Very interesting.

Luke has always been a flyball pitcher until this year with a GB/FB ratio of 2.28.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 12:46 PM
IMO, comparing Lohse to other dreck on the pitching market misses the larger point.That he needs to be a reliever on this team.

One can only hope that Claussen rights his ship and pushes Lohse down the ladder. I'd like his stuff in the BP, not in the starting slot.... and he'll have all the Fox viewers Saturday afternoon to see him try and prove us all wrong.

TRF
08-03-2006, 12:48 PM
OK, so don't. Who are you giving the ball to Saturday, then?

For what it's worth, I don't expect Lohse to be good, exactly. Less disastrous than the dreck we've been running out in the #5 slot all year, and most everyone else has in their #5 slot? Maybe. Fingers crossed.

Ideally, we can swing a waiver deal for someone better soon, but it's too early for anyone to have cleared waivers yet, I think.

That's a good question, but leads to a larger look. 1st I wouldn't have traded Germano with questions about Claussen's health and effectiveness. And Germano pitched a better game than Lohse has as a starter all year. 2nd since that dumb move was made, I guess I'd look at Dumatrait or Chris Michalak. Not great options, though I think Dumatrait might hold his own as LH pitchers seem to do well never having been seen before. Seem being the key word.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 02:18 PM
Ahh.... more card shuffling in the subway stairwell.

http://frontier.cincinnati.com/blogs/spring/


The Reds are now saying Kyle Lohse will start Sunday (against Smoltz) and Bronson Arroyo will get the ball Saturday. That means Arroyo will be going on short rest after throwing 109 pitches Tuesday.

Guess we'll have to wait a couple more hours to find out the reasoning behind this one, but I am curious...

BRM
08-03-2006, 02:19 PM
This doesn't make much sense unless they are just buying some time to work a waiver trade.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 02:29 PM
This doesn't make much sense unless they are just buying some time to work a waiver trade.
Or they don't want the national audience to see Lohse pitch on Saturday, meanwhile all those nifty notes about Bronson, plus the rock star angle and you have your Reds marketing on the human side... voila... Televison!!

flyer85
08-03-2006, 02:32 PM
this one doesn't make any sense. I can't come up with any good reason for this "baseball decision". So maybe there is nothing more to it than the Reds being stupid.

Redsland
08-03-2006, 02:40 PM
I suspect the front office is trying to solve the Brandon Claussen problem by exposing him to revokable waivers and then trying to work a deal with whomever claims him. Moving Lohse to Sunday gives this process another day to play out, at which point we may have better options available to us.

flyer85
08-03-2006, 02:42 PM
I suspect the front office is trying to solve the Brandon Claussen problem by exposing him to revokable waivers and then trying to work a deal with whomever claims him. Moving Lohse to Sunday gives this process another day to play out, at which point we may have better options available to us.The Reds have little depth with Claussen and zero without him. That would be a very risky move.

M2
08-03-2006, 02:48 PM
Or they don't want the national audience to see Lohse pitch on Saturday, meanwhile all those nifty notes about Bronson, plus the rock star angle and you have your Reds marketing on the human side... voila... Televison!!

Until Bronson coughs up a kitten because he didn't get enough rest right in the middle of trying to get past the innings wall.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 02:52 PM
Until Bronson coughs up a kitten because he didn't get enough rest right in the middle of trying to get past the innings wall.
Yeah, he was wilting in the heat the other night and this one will plop in the middle of the day... he's been quoted as not being a heat guy (I feel for him and all you humidity pounded folks)

M2
08-03-2006, 03:00 PM
Yeah, he was wilting in the heat the other night and this one will plop in the middle of the day... he's been quoted as not being a heat guy (I feel for him and all you humidity pounded folks)

I'm from the mid-Atlantic, summer without humidity seems like a communist plot to me.

Matt700wlw
08-03-2006, 03:01 PM
I'm going to wait and see if the sun rises in the east and sets in the west on Saturday. I'm told it's a lock, a sure thing, but there's no reason the earth couldn't spin in the opposite direction.

If it's cloudy, you won't see it :D

westofyou
08-03-2006, 03:04 PM
I'm from the mid-Atlantic, summer without humidity seems like a communist plot to me.
I'm from the midwest, trust me you'd get over it.

Winter without hitting freezing more then once is a norm too..... and we get baseball at 9:30 in the morning on Thursdays all summer!!

Oh and as the guy from Georgia told me the other day, "Y'all know that your air smell wonderful out here? You really don't know how good it smells."

M2
08-03-2006, 03:12 PM
I'm from the midwest, trust me you'd get over it.

Winter without hitting freezing more then once is a norm too..... and we get baseball at 9:30 in the morning on Thursdays all summer!!

Oh and as the guy from Georgia told me the other day, "Y'all know that your air smell wonderful out here? You really don't know how good it smells."

No, I really like humidity. I've been in places without it and it feels like plastic weather to me.

I also like the cold. Wouldn't want to live in a place where it doesn't get cold.

pedro
08-03-2006, 03:13 PM
No, I really like humidity. I've been in places without it and it feels like plastic weather to me.

I also like the cold. Wouldn't want to live in a place where it doesn't get cold.

that's whack ;)

I bet you like pneumonia too.

Matt700wlw
08-03-2006, 03:33 PM
Kyle Loshe's career ERA is 4.72

If he "regresses to the mean," which seems to be a popular term around here lately, he improves.

We can hope.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 03:33 PM
No, I really like humidity. I've been in places without it and it feels like plastic weather to me.

That's funny, humidity makes me feel like I'm wearing plastic.

TRF
08-03-2006, 03:57 PM
Kyle Loshe's career ERA is 4.72

If he "regresses to the mean," which seems to be a popular term around here lately, he improves.

We can hope.

Except for him it wouldn't be a regression. It would be a wild improvement.

I'll say it again. Minnesota thought so much of him, they traded him for a pitcher in low A ball while in the middle of the wild card race.

That doesn't say a whole heckuvalot about the guy.

Matt700wlw
08-03-2006, 03:58 PM
Except for him it wouldn't be a regression. It would be a wild improvement.

I'll say it again. Minnesota thought so much of him, they traded him for a pitcher in low A ball while in the middle of the wild card race.

That doesn't say a whole heckuvalot about the guy.

I'm trying here....cut me some slack ;)

KronoRed
08-03-2006, 03:59 PM
No, I really like humidity. I've been in places without it and it feels like plastic weather to me.

I also like the cold. Wouldn't want to live in a place where it doesn't get cold.
With you on the cold..it rocks

Humidity however, is evil.

TRF
08-03-2006, 04:05 PM
Try combining the cold with the wind of the Texas panhandle.

ouch.

TRF
08-03-2006, 04:07 PM
I'm trying here....cut me some slack ;)

I know, and I wish i could see a positive in Lohse, but unless he's used properly, there isn't one. Don't believe me? Ask Edwin E.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 04:08 PM
Try combining the cold with the wind of the Texas panhandle.

ouch.
No trees equals sadness.

My friend lived in El Paso for 4 years and moved to Oregon, she experienced major weather shock.

TRF
08-03-2006, 04:11 PM
No trees equals sadness.

My friend lived in El Paso for 4 years and moved to Oregon, she experienced major weather shock.

22 years of no trees. I have a job interview at Texas Tech tomorrow.

Lubbock is even flatter than Amarillo.

Matt700wlw
08-03-2006, 04:11 PM
Trees are happy.

pedro
08-03-2006, 04:12 PM
Trees are happy.


unless they are Screaming.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 04:14 PM
22 years of no trees. I have a job interview at Texas Tech tomorrow.

Lubbock is even flatter than Amarillo.
Yep, there is a great line in a Billy Joe Shaver song when refering to Lubbuck, "They'd hang me if I ever went back...... if they could find a tree."

KronoRed
08-03-2006, 04:20 PM
unless they are Screaming.
Or not being fed

M2
08-03-2006, 04:24 PM
Try combining the cold with the wind of the Texas panhandle.

ouch.

Doubt I'd perceive it as being all that cold. We get roughly the same amount of wind in Boston that you get down in the panhandle.

Though if you really want wind and cold, head up to places like Winnipeg or Chicoutimi in Canada. Compared to those places, the New England, the Rockies and the upper midwest are tropical.

BRM
08-03-2006, 04:24 PM
22 years of no trees

13 years for me now. I am currently surrounded on three sides by nearly 1000 acres of open pasture. Oh, I have a few little trees on my property but nothing to get excited over.

TRF
08-03-2006, 04:40 PM
Doubt I'd perceive it as being all that cold. We get roughly the same amount of wind in Boston that you get down in the panhandle.


really? didn't know that. In February/March here it can be brutal. 30-40MPH winds and temps in the teens.

Falls City Beer
08-03-2006, 04:45 PM
really? didn't know that. In February/March here it can be brutal. 30-40MPH winds and temps in the teens.

I agree. Plains cold is WAY worse than Boston/NY cold. The winds are way worse and more consistently there--with nothing in the landscape to break their force.

And sure, there's nothing like the dry cold of Canada. It's in a league all by itself.

westofyou
08-03-2006, 04:48 PM
I agree. Plains cold is WAY worse than Boston/NY cold. The winds are way worse and more consistently there--with nothing in the landscape to break their force.

And sure, there's nothing like the dry cold of Canada. It's in a league all by itself.
Nebraska in the winter... brutal, just brutal.

Falls City Beer
08-03-2006, 04:49 PM
Nebraska in the winter... brutal, just brutal.

Hell, St. Louis in the winter can be an absolute nightmare.

A buddy mine lives in Wichita, and my wife and I spent one of our winter breaks there five years ago, and I genuinely thought I was dead on a few occasions--it was so cold, I think I hallucinated.

TRF
08-03-2006, 04:49 PM
Hey remember when this thread was about bashing Lohse as a starter?

good times.

Matt700wlw
08-03-2006, 06:11 PM
For the record, Bronson Arroyo requested to pitch Saturday, so that he could also then pitch against the Cardinals twice. He feels bad about how he's pitched as of late, and wants a chance to redeem himself against, not only the Braves, who kicked him around, but also the division leaders.

I love his attitude! I hope this is what kicks him back into gear

M2
08-03-2006, 07:11 PM
really? didn't know that. In February/March here it can be brutal. 30-40MPH winds and temps in the teens.

Obviously we've got stuff to break it up like trees and buildings. Yet if you go up to Blue Hills (it's a small rise just South of Boston) it's pretty unrelenting. In the city you get wind corridors where all the wind is funneled into one spot and actually accelerated. On a stiff day you can see people get blown over.

Out by the waterfront is where you get most of it though. In the winter it packs a triple threat because it's blowing like crazy, it's cold and it's wet.

Though if you want wind, the top of Mt. Washington in New Hampshire is the place to be. The MEAN wind speed is 35.5 MPH. They get hurricane-force winds 104 days a year and three out of every four days in the winter. Wind speeds usually top 100 MPH every third day in the winter. It also holds the world record with a recorded wind speed of 231 MPH back in 1934.

To commisserate with FCB, I hear Wichita can be a bear. And I imagine NYMoose has plenty of upstate NY stories. I remember reading once that the U.S. military transferred its extreme cold weather training facility from Alaska to upstate NY because Alaska wasn't brutal enough.

Chip R
08-03-2006, 08:46 PM
Wichita is not so bad in the winter. I spent a winter there once and the worst part about it was the ice storms. They would not get a lot of snow but they would get ice storms. I swear almost every weekend in January there was an ice storm. Got in a car wreck because of it too.

cincinnati chili
08-03-2006, 11:10 PM
As for the initial topic, I predict the Reds will lohse on Sunday.

As for weather, the front range of Colorado from Col Springs to Boulder has everybody beat. 300 days of sunshine per year, all four seasons, but relatively few brutally hot or brutally cold days. And no humidity.

You don't REALLY like humidity, M2, do you? I mean if you could take all the amenities of Boston and just cap the temperature at 80F with no humidity, wouldn't that be an improvement?

As long as there's enough moisture for an occasional tree to grow, that's enough for me. I only like humidity if I can be in a pool or the ocean.

westofyou
08-04-2006, 12:43 AM
You don't REALLY like humidity, M2, do you?

If he has no AC then I'd say yes he does, if he has it then you know why he does.

BRM
08-04-2006, 10:19 AM
As for weather, the front range of Colorado from Col Springs to Boulder has everybody beat. 300 days of sunshine per year, all four seasons, but relatively few brutally hot or brutally cold days. And no humidity.


Couldn't agree more. :thumbup:

M2
08-04-2006, 11:20 AM
You don't REALLY like humidity, M2, do you? I mean if you could take all the amenities of Boston and just cap the temperature at 80F with no humidity, wouldn't that be an improvement?

Yeah, I really like it. When I'm out in the summer, I want it jungle hot (and bag that 80F cap too). I was digging the heatwave we had this week.

WOY, I've got A/C in my current digs because it came with the place. We're moving at the end of the month and the new place doesn't have A/C, we aren't planning on buying any window units and A/C wasn't on the wish list when we were looking around.

I've seen A/C blamed for the destruction of drive-ins, southern culture, downtown America and summer in general. I've also seen it blamed for chunky, non-athletic kids. I wonder if baseball in specific isn't a victim of A/C culture. Why go outside on a sweltering day and play baseball when you can stay inside your climate-controlled environs and play video games?

Used to be that you had to find ways to pass the time on hot summer days. You had to get outside because it was stifling hot inside.

I'm not going to tell you that it doesn't feel nice to step into an A/C-cooled room when you're wearing a sweat suit, but I'm relatively certain my overall quality of life was better without it.

westofyou
08-04-2006, 11:26 AM
I've seen A/C blamed for the destruction of drive-ins, southern culture, downtown America and summer in general. I've also seen it blamed for chunky, non-athletic kids. I wonder if baseball in specific isn't a victim of A/C culture. Why go outside on a sweltering day and play baseball when you can stay inside your climate-controlled environs and play video games?

Used to be that you had to find ways to pass the time on hot summer days. You had to get outside because it was stifling hot inside.

Without AC the south would still be barefoot and preggers, sitting on the porch drinking Dixie beer and cussing yankees.

You might not need it in Boston, but I wouldn't take Atlanta without it.

M2
08-04-2006, 11:36 AM
Without AC the south would still be barefoot and preggers, sitting on the porch drinking Dixie beer and cussing yankees.

You might not need it in Boston, but I wouldn't take Atlanta without it.

My future brother-in-law is from Macon. His take is that too much of the south has become antiseptic and cloistered (with Atlanta being the worst example). According to him, the south used to be a lot more social and that because people used to get out more often, it often wore its faults on its sleeve as a result.

His argument is that A/C culture has robbed the south of some of its best qualities while giving some of its less appealing pathologies safe harbor indoors.

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 11:37 AM
Without AC the south would still be barefoot and preggers, sitting on the porch drinking Dixie beer and cussing yankees.

You just summarized my family in 20 words. I challenge you to a duel!:duel:

By the way, Britney Spears says hi!:wave:

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 11:41 AM
My future brother-in-law is from Macon. His take is that too much of the south has become antiseptic and cloistered (with Atlanta being the worst example). According to him, the south used to be a lot more social and that because people used to get out more often, it often wore its faults on its sleeve as a result.

His argument is that A/C culture has robbed the south of some of its best qualities while giving some of its less appealing pathologies safe harbor indoors.
Agreed 100%... but I would add in the Midwest as well... and cable/satellite TV.

Falls City Beer
08-04-2006, 11:43 AM
Agreed 100%... but I would add in the Midwest as well... and cable/satellite TV.

One thing I've noticed is that over the last twenty years or so, the ethos of the Midwest and the South has become almost indistinguishable. I guess it's all those Yanks from the Midwest moving south to escape the winters.

westofyou
08-04-2006, 11:44 AM
Agreed 100%... but I would add in the Midwest as well... and cable/satellite TV.
Don't forget to add cars, highways and increased income. People used to wander around their neighborhoods... oh wait strike "used to" they still do that here in PDX, maybe it is having no AC?

Or maybe it's having no humidity and a living in a town that creates a culture that promotes foot traffic?

westofyou
08-04-2006, 11:46 AM
One thing I've noticed is that over the last twenty years or so, the ethos of the Midwest and the South has become almost indistinguishable. I guess it's all those Yanks from the Midwest moving south to escape the winters.
No doubt... I lived in SC in the mid 70's and spent a good part of the late 90's commuting back to Atlanta every month. The south changed because AC allowed folks to move there. (and baseball teams followed)

M2
08-04-2006, 11:52 AM
Or maybe it's having no humidity and a living in a town that creates a culture that promotes foot traffic?

I'd say it's the second more than the first. People managed to be social in humid outdoor settings for millennia. People are doing it in PDX despite all that cloud cover. Pre-flood New Orleans never lacked people on the streets. It is possible for people to deal with weather.

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 11:56 AM
One thing I've noticed is that over the last twenty years or so, the ethos of the Midwest and the South has become almost indistinguishable. I guess it's all those Yanks from the Midwest moving south to escape the winters.
Here in SWO, I've never been able to tell much difference due to the large numbers of Kentuckians, West Virginians, Tennesseans, etc. that moved here in the 30s, 40s.

Very few families are actually from here if you dig back more than 2 generations.

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 11:57 AM
Pre-flood New Orleans never lacked people on the streets. It is possible for people to deal with weather.
Ditto Savannah and Charleston... and not just tourists, even locals.

Falls City Beer
08-04-2006, 12:00 PM
Here in SWO, I've never been able to tell much difference due to the large numbers of Kentuckians, West Virginians, Tennesseans, etc. that moved here in the 30s, 40s.

Very few families are actually from here if you dig back more than 2 generations.

I know all about Briers. I spent my formative years listening to Sabbath and breaking into half-constructed houses to drink beer with them. Quite an education for this Yankee.

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 12:00 PM
The south changed because AC allowed folks to move there. (and baseball teams followed)
Interesting thing about that is the large number of minor league teams that flourished (before the Astros, Rangers, Braves, Marlins, Rays) in the Deep South/Texas and continue to do so with the Texas League, Southern League, Carolina League, Sally League, and even the Appy League (if you consider that the Deep South).

westofyou
08-04-2006, 12:30 PM
Interesting thing about that is the large number of minor league teams that flourished (before the Astros, Rangers, Braves, Marlins, Rays) in the Deep South/Texas and continue to do so with the Texas League, Southern League, Carolina League, Sally League, and even the Appy League (if you consider that the Deep South).
Well the west coast leagues also florished at that time, I put it down as how distinct and seperate those parts of the country were prior to air travel, that's also why regional college football is still the monster it is in those areas. Years of no pro teams and the need to tie yourself to a sports institution. Why else do grown men put silly little flags outside their car windows on game day all fall?

dabvu2498
08-04-2006, 01:13 PM
Why else do grown men put silly little flags outside their car windows on game day all fall?
It's also a more common sight here in Big 10 country than some might think. I was surprised to see almost as many around here as I did while living in Nashville, Jackson MS, Columbia and Charleston. I've never seen anything like the 200 mile "parade" from Nashville to Knoxville on Friday evenings and Saturday mornings in the fall. Quite disturbing.

RANDY IN INDY
08-04-2006, 01:21 PM
Without AC the south would still be barefoot and preggers, sitting on the porch drinking Dixie beer and cussing yankees.

You might not need it in Boston, but I wouldn't take Atlanta without it.

Can't imagine what it would be like here in south Charlotte without AC. The summers here can be pretty brutal.

westofyou
08-04-2006, 01:26 PM
Can't imagine what it would be like here in south Charlotte without AC. The summers here can be pretty brutal.
No doubt, I spent a summer living on Lake Wylie and I must have jumped in that puppy 2-3 times a day.

pedro
08-04-2006, 02:18 PM
Along with A/C, 3 car garages with automatic openers haven't helped foster a sense of community either.

no more standing by the fence drinking a beeer (or lemonade) and talking to the neighbors b/c the "parlor" was too hot to have a sit in.

nope, it's drive the a/c car straight into the three car garage and have a martini in the "media room"

screw those guys down in the marketing department. that's what I say. :)

REDREAD
08-04-2006, 06:36 PM
Without AC the south would still be barefoot and preggers, sitting on the porch drinking Dixie beer and cussing yankees.


Yeah, nothing but a bunch of hicks until A/C was invented, that civilized us :rolleyes:

oregonred
08-04-2006, 06:39 PM
Don't forget to add cars, highways and increased income. People used to wander around their neighborhoods... oh wait strike "used to" they still do that here in PDX, maybe it is having no AC?

Or maybe it's having no humidity and a living in a town that creates a culture that promotes foot traffic?

WOY -- Need to visit the NW part of town to find all the cool A/C. While walking around the West Hill neighborhoods (past all the construction equipment building new $500K+ homes on 3K sq foot lots), on a really hot day you can just feel the sound of all the newly installed A/Cs and neighborhood garage doors closing as the Lexus/BMWs are safely turned off for the night... ;)

pedro
08-04-2006, 06:49 PM
Yeah, nothing but a bunch of hicks until A/C was invented, that civilized us :rolleyes:

I don't think he was suggesting that y'all are civilized, just that you're now inside. ;)

westofyou
08-04-2006, 06:52 PM
Yeah, nothing but a bunch of hicks until A/C was invented, that civilized us :rolleyes:
My grandfather was born in Alabama. I was even born in Appalachia, If anyone's a hick by relation it's me.