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View Full Version : Why don't we keep Dunn batting second?



Stingray
08-05-2006, 12:08 AM
Our hot start after the AS break had Dunn batting second. He was hitting, we were winning, and getting good pitching. I haven't checked but I think all that changed the very day we moved Dunn out of #2.

I think having a consistent batting order provides an element of stability and generally helps players performance. An occasional change is Ok for specific reasons but should be temporary. Our constant lineup change(except for Jr - who's always third) is disruptive.

reds44
08-05-2006, 12:09 AM
It has nothing to do with him being in the 2 hole IMO.

Despite Griffey's bad year he is still a feared hitter around the league. Rich Aurilia even though he is having a better year then Griffey, is not.

Bat Dunn 4th and Griffey 5th and you see the same results.

HumnHilghtFreel
08-05-2006, 12:11 AM
Having a consistent batting order is nice, but sometimes it needs to be shaken up a bit. Dunn hitting well #2, like many have said before, is a product of him getting protection with Griffey hitting behind him. It also helps that he got more ABs there.

Stingray
08-05-2006, 12:13 AM
Having a consistent batting order is nice, but sometimes it needs to be shaken up a bit. Dunn hitting well #2, like many have said before, is a product of him getting protection with Griffey hitting behind him. It also helps that he got more ABs there.

So why not keep Dunn 2nd?

sometimes = daily?

fearofpopvol1
08-05-2006, 12:26 AM
I'd like to see Dunn in the 3 hole...even though that won't happen.

HumnHilghtFreel
08-05-2006, 12:28 AM
So why not keep Dunn 2nd?

sometimes = daily?
That's more of a question to direct at someone who has some sway on the matter, i.e. Jerry Narron.

I like Dunn in the 2 hole as long as he's producing and as long as he has some protection, he's got a good chance at doing so.

Stingray
08-05-2006, 12:35 AM
That's more of a question to direct at someone who has some sway on the matter, i.e. Jerry Narron.

I like Dunn in the 2 hole as long as he's producing and as long as he has some protection, he's got a good chance at doing so.

I have no way to direct the question to Narron. I'm interested in the opinions of people here.

RedsManRick
08-05-2006, 12:51 AM
At this point, Hatteberg should bat 2nd, Dunn 3rd, Griffey 4th (or lower). That Junior is still in the 3 spot is just plain stubborness.

2001MUgrad
08-05-2006, 05:22 AM
Though I think Narron does something good with the team he makes horrible decisions. His lineup and how he uses players is a perfect example of that. I'm beside myself trying to figure out why Griffey is the 1 player on this team that is untouchable. Maybe he has, but I cannot recall a single time this year that he has been in the lineup and hasn't hit 3rd. I just don't get it. No knock on jr., but he isn't 27 anymore. Even in his later years Johnny Bench was moved down. I just don't get why Jr. can't be touched. I won't even get into the fact he costs the Reds 4 outs this week on not running balls out or playing defense.

MaineRed
08-05-2006, 07:42 AM
If Junior ran out every ball the way some wish he would, he would be on the DL with a torn hammy or groin. Despite his struggles, I'd rather have him healthy and able to play.

The man has slowed down, no doubt but he has come thru big for the Reds at times this year. His knows he is not 27 anymore which is why you don't see him playing like Eric Davis out there. He is trying to protect his body. Who the heck can blame him?

We all want to see guys like Freel who hustle all the time but Junior can't do that. He needs to pick his spots. I for one can live without the 3 or 4 infield hits he has cost himself by not running hard if he can stay healthy. Him standing on first base a few times is not worth having him eventually go down for the season.

IMO if the Reds get to September and can still be in it, Junior will carry them.

Spring~Fields
08-05-2006, 09:02 AM
Our hot start after the AS break had Dunn batting second. He was hitting, we were winning, and getting good pitching.

I think that playing musical chairs gives the manager a sense of being part of the game, more than he would have otherwise. This manager has had lineups that successfully scored 7-9-11 runs and one would think that those would be considered successful hitting orders or having the right players in the lineup, but he will invariably change the next day regardless of production or the win column.

There is one guy in the Reds organization that has proof that he knows hitting, and that would be Griffey with his career numbers, and Griffey clearly believes in playing everyday and batting in the same spot in the order. So perhaps what Griffey believes should be applied to the other batters, Dunn, Encarcion, Ross etc.

Redhook
08-05-2006, 11:47 AM
I think that playing musical chairs gives the manager a sense of being part of the game, more than he would have otherwise. This manager has had lineups that successfully scored 7-9-11 runs and one would think that those would be considered successful hitting orders or having the right players in the lineup, but he will invariably change the next day regardless of production or the win column.

There is one guy in the Reds organization that has proof that he knows hitting, and that would be Griffey with his career numbers, and Griffey clearly believes in playing everyday and batting in the same spot in the order. So perhaps what Griffey believes should be applied to the other batters, Dunn, Encarcion, Ross etc.

I'm a firm believer that a consistent lineup would provide more consistent results. I think the goal of a lineup should be to provide the best chance to score as many runs per game every night. I just don't see how changing the lineup, dramatically, every game provides any sort of consistency. It just doesn't make any sense. Coming to the ballpark, besides Griffey, no one on the team knows where they'll be batting that day. How can that be a good thing? It can't. The last think a player needs is constant change because it could eventually lead to doubt on whether he's doing things correctly or not.

I would prefer that Griffey's name is cemented in either the 4th or 5th spot. But, since it's obvious Narron isn't going to go that rout, keeping Griffey in the 3-spot is fine if he would just leave the guys around him in the same spot. It is almost impossible to have an exact set lineup every night for this team, due to the fact that we have too many players for too few spots and left-handers vs. right-handers. But a consistent lineup with the core players needs to be enforced. Dunn needs to bat ahead of JR. no matter what. If JR. is 3rd, then Dunn bats 2nd. If JR. is 4th, then Dunn bats 3rd. It's as simple as that. The rest of the lineup should be based around these two players.

TDHND
08-05-2006, 11:51 AM
My problem with the lineups is Edwin not playing enough. He should be out there every night.

jmac
08-05-2006, 12:32 PM
At this point, Hatteberg should bat 2nd, Dunn 3rd, Griffey 4th (or lower). That Junior is still in the 3 spot is just plain stubborness.
i agree with hat, dunn , jr.
if the reds had made the switch of brandon to ss i would like:
freel
hat
dunn
jr
aurilia
ee
phillips
catcher

this would give our 4-6 hitters alittle more thump