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View Full Version : Somebody who makes alot of $$$ is going to have to be traded



reds44
10-20-2006, 08:56 PM
The Reds have 10 players under contract for next season, making a total of $48.925 million:
OF Ken Griffey Jr. $12.5 million
OF Adam Dunn $10.5 million
SP Eric Milton $9 million
C Jason LaRue $5.2 million
SP Bronson Arroyo $3.8 million
RP Rheal Cormier $2.25 million
OF/IF Ryan Freel $1.7 million
IF Scott Hatteberg $1.65 million
C Javier Valentin $1.325 million
IF Juan Castro $1 million

The arbitration-eligible players:
pitchers Aaron Harang and Kyle Lohse and catcher David Ross...will get another $11 million or so. Even if everyone else on the roster made the big-league minimum, that would put the payroll at $65 million.
That would leave $10 million for shopping if the payroll went to $75 million. The Reds need a closer and a shortstop, and $10 million doesn't buy what it used to.

29 million dollars are tied up in Griffey, Milton, LaRue and Cormier.

FlyingPig
10-20-2006, 09:29 PM
I choose Milton..

:evil:

Highlifeman21
10-20-2006, 09:45 PM
The Reds have 10 players under contract for next season, making a total of $48.925 million:
OF Ken Griffey Jr. $12.5 million
OF Adam Dunn $10.5 million
SP Eric Milton $9 million
C Jason LaRue $5.2 million
SP Bronson Arroyo $3.8 million
RP Rheal Cormier $2.25 million
OF/IF Ryan Freel $1.7 million
IF Scott Hatteberg $1.65 million
C Javier Valentin $1.325 million
IF Juan Castro $1 million

The arbitration-eligible players:
pitchers Aaron Harang and Kyle Lohse and catcher David Ross...will get another $11 million or so. Even if everyone else on the roster made the big-league minimum, that would put the payroll at $65 million.
That would leave $10 million for shopping if the payroll went to $75 million. The Reds need a closer and a shortstop, and $10 million doesn't buy what it used to.

29 million dollars are tied up in Griffey, Milton, LaRue and Cormier.

That's my list of contracts that need a solution.

Unfortunately, Griffey is 10/5 and would have to be the perfect deal for Griffey, which may not be a deal benefitting the Reds.

As for Milton and LaRue, I think they are our most tradeable/expendible players on the list. Milton makes far too much money and has singlehandedly cornered the market on being often injured while putting up remarkably forgettable numbers. As for LaRue, he had a career 2005, and at the age of 32 will most likely never sniff that kind of production again.

Paying Juan Castro $1 Mil is a crime. Needs no explanation.

So, free up Milton and or LaRue, and we might have something.

schroomytunes
10-20-2006, 10:14 PM
Of that list I would choose to trade all of them, but the only one that has any trade value is Dunn and its at a low right now. But heres a thought, what about this deal, with the Nationals(Bowden).

Reds trade: Adam Dunn and Todd Coffey

Nationals trade: Brad Wilkerson(of) and Chad Cordero(cl)

Cordero becomes our closer, while Wilkerson plays left, and allows us to sign some Fa's to play SP,Bench, and CF.

IslandRed
10-20-2006, 11:08 PM
I think the present-day value of Griffey's contract is a couple of million dollars less because of the way the deferrals are believed to be funded. JaxRed worked up some numbers on that once but I don't remember the exact figure.

KronoRed
10-20-2006, 11:08 PM
I wouldn't throw Coffey in to that deal, we should be able to get both those guys for Dunn.

But it won't help the most glaring problem, starting pitching.

mth123
10-20-2006, 11:48 PM
Of that list I would choose to trade all of them, but the only one that has any trade value is Dunn and its at a low right now. But heres a thought, what about this deal, with the Nationals(Bowden).

Reds trade: Adam Dunn and Todd Coffey

Nationals trade: Brad Wilkerson(of) and Chad Cordero(cl)

Cordero becomes our closer, while Wilkerson plays left, and allows us to sign some Fa's to play SP,Bench, and CF.

The Nationals traded Wilkerson last winter for Soriano. He disappointed in Texas BTW. 222/306/422/728 in one of the best hitters parks in baseball.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 12:19 AM
Good thread. These contracts almost assure failure or at best mediocrity. I'd like to blame them all on DanO and Bowden, but I can't.

Cedric
10-21-2006, 02:12 AM
Good thread. These contracts almost assure failure or at best mediocrity. I'd like to blame them all on DanO and Bowden, but I can't.

So we are supposed to blame Krivsky for 8 million tied up? Almost half of that tied up into one of the best pitchers in the National League?

That list has nothing to do with Krivsky. Unless we are really complaining about less than five million dollars.

Patrick Bateman
10-21-2006, 02:45 AM
Of that list I would choose to trade all of them, but the only one that has any trade value is Dunn and its at a low right now. But heres a thought, what about this deal, with the Nationals(Bowden).

Reds trade: Adam Dunn and Todd Coffey

Nationals trade: Brad Wilkerson(of) and Chad Cordero(cl)

Cordero becomes our closer, while Wilkerson plays left, and allows us to sign some Fa's to play SP,Bench, and CF.

Honestly, you should put more thought into your trade ideas. I mean that's twice in one day that you have the Reds trading for players on the wrong teams. It's hard to take these ideas seriously.

reds44
10-21-2006, 03:20 AM
Good thread. These contracts almost assure failure or at best mediocrity. I'd like to blame them all on DanO and Bowden, but I can't.
Arroyo, Cormier, and Castro are the only doing's of Krvisky.

puca
10-21-2006, 08:32 AM
Arroyo, Cormier, and Castro are the only doing's of Krvisky.

Hatteberg is Krivsky's and I'm pretty sure Valentin is also.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 09:30 AM
Not for nothing, but Dunn is Krivsky's doing as well. I love Dunn, but I think it can be argued that his current contract makes him a bit more difficult to move this offseason, at any rate.

GAC
10-21-2006, 09:42 AM
So we are supposed to blame Krivsky for 8 million tied up? Almost half of that tied up into one of the best pitchers in the National League?

That list has nothing to do with Krivsky. Unless we are really complaining about less than five million dollars.

yep. And that has been my stated position.... Krivsky has not saddled this team with bad contracts as the likes of Milton, Griffey, and LaRue. He has shown us this past season that if it's for the good of the team he'll dump/eat contracts.

One has to look WHERE the bulk of the money is being spent (wasted).

Contracts like Hatteberg and Dunn are very tradeable.

And the contracts of guys like Castro and Valentin may not have "likeablility", but they are not killers to this organization.

Milton, Griffey, and LaRue's are. And they are not going anywhere.

IslandRed
10-21-2006, 11:44 AM
Not for nothing, but Dunn is Krivsky's doing as well. I love Dunn, but I think it can be argued that his current contract makes him a bit more difficult to move this offseason, at any rate.

True, but the alternative was to sit around and see what happened this year and take our chances in arbitration. $10 million might be a bit much given how 2006 went, but trying to trade him as an arb-eligible would also be difficult. Teams generally prefer to know how much payroll they're taking on.

Wheelhouse
10-21-2006, 02:19 PM
The Reds have 10 players under contract for next season, making a total of $48.925 million:
OF Ken Griffey Jr. $12.5 million
OF Adam Dunn $10.5 million
SP Eric Milton $9 million
C Jason LaRue $5.2 million
SP Bronson Arroyo $3.8 million
RP Rheal Cormier $2.25 million
OF/IF Ryan Freel $1.7 million
IF Scott Hatteberg $1.65 million
C Javier Valentin $1.325 million
IF Juan Castro $1 million

The arbitration-eligible players:
pitchers Aaron Harang and Kyle Lohse and catcher David Ross...will get another $11 million or so. Even if everyone else on the roster made the big-league minimum, that would put the payroll at $65 million.
That would leave $10 million for shopping if the payroll went to $75 million. The Reds need a closer and a shortstop, and $10 million doesn't buy what it used to.

29 million dollars are tied up in Griffey, Milton, LaRue and Cormier.

39 If you include Dunn.

Caveat Emperor
10-21-2006, 02:55 PM
Not for nothing, but Dunn is Krivsky's doing as well. I love Dunn, but I think it can be argued that his current contract makes him a bit more difficult to move this offseason, at any rate.

I'd disagree with that. While having him not under a big dollar contract might make him seem more enticing, it might help him move this offseason because it gives teams looking for a bat some cost certainty when dealing for Dunn. But for that contract, they'd be acquiring a player that would represent an unknown variable in arbitration.

At the very worst, it's a wash in his trade value, IMO.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 03:51 PM
I'd disagree with that. While having him not under a big dollar contract might make him seem more enticing, it might help him move this offseason because it gives teams looking for a bat some cost certainty when dealing for Dunn. But for that contract, they'd be acquiring a player that would represent an unknown variable in arbitration.

At the very worst, it's a wash in his trade value, IMO.

Maybe it's not such a big deal, but the non-sabremetric GMs who might have gotten excited by his HR numbers are probably really, really cold on him right now that he costs 10 million dollars.

Yeah, his contract might be enticing to Beane (cf. Jason Kendall), Epstein, or maybe Bowden, but that's about it.

But whatever, I'd just as soon keep Dunn, anyway.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 03:53 PM
yep. And that has been my stated position.... Krivsky has not saddled this team with bad contracts as the likes of Milton, Griffey, and LaRue. He has shown us this past season that if it's for the good of the team he'll dump/eat contracts.

One has to look WHERE the bulk of the money is being spent (wasted).

Contracts like Hatteberg and Dunn are very tradeable.

And the contracts of guys like Castro and Valentin may not have "likeablility", but they are not killers to this organization.

Milton, Griffey, and LaRue's are. And they are not going anywhere.

Larue at 5 million is money way better spent than Valentin and Castro at 3 million.

WMR
10-21-2006, 04:44 PM
It's far from the biggest issue as far as contracts are concerned, but seeing Cormier's contract, and knowing that he was extended b/f he ever threw a pitch in Cincinnati, really burns me up.

GAC
10-21-2006, 04:48 PM
Larue at 5 million is money way better spent than Valentin and Castro at 3 million.

That's your opinion. But as a catcher, and at age 32, I see him on the downhill side. His asset was his arm/defense, and not his offense. His defensive skills have been eroding.

2006 - 72 games...... .194 BA .317 OB% .346 SLG% .663 OPS

51 Ks in 191 ABs. Not good.

Everything about this guy's game is on the downhill side.

Now I realize that guy struggled with injury earlier in the season, and that possibly could be a factor.

We'll find out in '07, because I doubt they find someone to trade him to.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 04:55 PM
That's your opinion. But I see LaRue on the downhill side. He sure contributed alot this year. :rolleyes:

Larue's contributed for years. Castro and Valentin (aside from his career year) have done exactly nothing in their careers. How quickly we forget.

GAC
10-21-2006, 05:22 PM
Larue's contributed for years.

The issue is not about what he DID. Whose arguing with that? But what his future contributions will be.

Again, and as we've been discussing on here as of late, it's about making (or minimizing) poor decisions.


Castro and Valentin (aside from his career year) have done exactly nothing in their careers. How quickly we forget.

Nothing? That is an exaggeration on your part IMO.

But I'm not basing my evaluation of LaRue against Castro and/or Valentin.

You can make anyone look good standing them up against those two. ;)

TheBigLebowski
10-21-2006, 05:35 PM
Depressing thread. Demonstrates how far away we are from being financially solvent enough to be able to afford good pitching.

It still burns me up that we weren't able to take advantage of the stars aligning in our favor this season. Methinks we'll not get that close to a playoff berth for at least 5 years.

GAC
10-21-2006, 08:13 PM
Depressing thread. Demonstrates how far away we are from being financially solvent enough to be able to afford good pitching.

We free up alot of money after next year.

reds44
10-21-2006, 09:22 PM
39 If you include Dunn.
We get more out of Dunn's 10 then we do out of the other 29 combined.

My point was those 29 million were crappy.

Falls City Beer
10-21-2006, 09:24 PM
We get more out of Dunn's 10 then we do out of the other 29 combined.

My point was those 29 million were crappy.

The ability to move contracts matters no matter what.

GAC
10-22-2006, 08:05 AM
You look at the longterm contracts the Reds have handed out over the last 6-7 years, and with the exception of Dunn's, everyone of those players after they signed those contracts, performance-wise and due to injuries, have not lived up to those contracts. And they proved to be yokes around this organization's neck.

Larkin, Griffey, Casey, Graves, Milton, LaRue

No luck at all. ;)

4256 Hits
10-22-2006, 05:54 PM
You look at the longterm contracts the Reds have handed out over the last 6-7 years, and with the exception of Dunn's, everyone of those players after they signed those contracts, performance-wise and due to injuries, have not lived up to those contracts. And they proved to be yokes around this organization's neck.

Larkin, Griffey, Casey, Graves, Milton, LaRue

No luck at all. ;)

Don't forget Wilson. Didn't last 2 years of Pete Harinish also not work out well. It all started w/ Jose big contract and then he got hurt.

Really other than Larkins 1st contract (mid 90's) and Scott Sullivens (sp) were there any other long contracts that worked out for the Reds?

Bret Boones was ok but the 1st couple(pre roids?) years were not good.