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fewfirstchoice
10-25-2006, 06:26 PM
The Reds could have a lineup that looks like below and the money can work.

C-Ross .5 mil.
1B-Hatteberg 1.5 mil.
2B-Phillips .5 mil.
3B-E.E. .5 mil.
SS-A.Gonzalez 3 mil. free agent signing
LF-C.Lee 13 mil. free agent signing
CF-J.Pierre 6 mil. free agent signing
RF-Jr. 7 mil.
total= 31.5 mil. for starting lineup

Sp-Harang 5 mil.
Sp-Arroyo 4 mil.
Sp-Loshe 4 mil.
Sp-Penny 7 mil. from Dunn trade
Sp-Padilla 6 mil. sign as a free agent
total= 25 mil. for rotation

IF-Castro 1 mil.
OF-Denorfia .5 mil
C- Valentin 1.5 mil.
IF/OF Freel 2 mil.
IF-Olmedo .5 mil.
total= 5.5 mil. for bench

RP/lefty- Cormier 2.5 mil.
RP/lefty- Bray .5 mil.
RP/lefty- Schonewise 2 mil.
Rp/righty- Majewski .5 mil.
RP/righty- Belisle .5 mil.
RP/righty- Coffey .5 mil.
Rp/righty- Broxton(closer) 1 mil. from Dunn trade
total= 7.5 mil. fro bullpen

Total cost of full roster with free agent singings,buyouts,raises and trades= 70.5 million

This payroll and roster is based on a couple moves being made and FA signings.First the trade that needs to happen, Dunn traded to the Dodgers for Penny and Broxton.This will give the Reds a young closer that throws the ball in the mid 90's and a solid #3 man in the rotation.Then the Reds also need to send Larue to a team for a low level prospect and pay about 2.5 mil. of his salary for 07.Also send Milton to a team for a mid level prospect and pay around 4.5 mil. of his salary of 07.Now if these things can get done the Reds can make this roster happen with there payroll.

Starting Lineup
1)Pierre-CF
2)Phillips-2B
3)E.E.-3B
4)C.Lee-LF
5)JR-RF
6)Gonzalez-SS
7)Hatteberg-1B
8)Ross-C

This gives the Reds a lineup with speed at the top,run producers and power in the middle,and solid contact hitters at the end of the order.It also makes the defense up the middle alot better and the outfield defense will be better with Pierre in CF and JR in RF.I know Lees defense isnt any better than Dunns but if we trade Dunn we will have to sign a power bat to take Dunns place and Lee would do just fine with that.

So heres my roster and I think its a pretty good one.The money works and it gives the Reds what they need.Players that play hard and try and want to win.So what do you guys think.

Redsfan08
10-25-2006, 06:54 PM
It would be cool

Highlifeman21
10-25-2006, 07:00 PM
As for the starting lineup, it's decent minus Pierre, Lee and Gonzalez. Pierre has a horrible OBP for a leadoff guy, Lee is worse than Adam Dunn offensively and isn't much of a defensive upgrade, and Gonzalez is a SS glove man. Hatteberg is a platoon guy at best. I think overall this projected lineup scores at least 50 runs less than what we had in 2006.

Penny is injury prone, and would be our #3 over Lohse, but I question his durability and overall talent.

I could be mistaken, but I thought Broxton was a SP prospect, so why would he close for us? I like that you're getting pitching back in a Dunn trade, but you need better pitching than Penny/Broxton.

As for Padilla, if he's our #5, then I'd consider, but he'd be an expensive #5, and most likely not effective. He's always had command/control issues, not to mention he's one of the bigger headcases in baseball. He's not quite Milton Bradley material, but he's not far from.

I think these suggestions only marginally strengthen our bullpen, but overall weaken our team.

Patrick Bateman
10-25-2006, 07:05 PM
I could be mistaken, but I thought Broxton was a SP prospect, so why would he close for us?


68 games
76 innings
11.8 Ks/9
4.0 BB/9
0.85 HR/9
2.59 ERA
2.97 FIP

Those were his numbers this season. He's already one of the best relievers in baseball. Imagine once he gains a couple years experience.

cincyinco
10-25-2006, 07:07 PM
I could be mistaken, but I thought Broxton was a SP prospect, so why would he close for us? I like that you're getting pitching back in a Dunn trade, but you need better pitching than Penny/Broxton.


Broxton was converted to relief a year or two ago by the Dodgers, and worked out of the pen at the ML level all last year. He was dominant. I'd love to give him a shot at SP again though, but his velocity soared in the pen - can reach upper 90's.

Slyder
10-25-2006, 07:14 PM
3 mil for Gonzalez? Why he has less of a bat than Castro or Clayton. You get him here for around Castro money or a little more then ya its worth it. Like others have said Pierre is a sorry OBP guy and has one of the weakest arms in baseball. Ive seen Middle Schoolers with better arms than him.

I'd rather take a risk on a former Red (at less cash) and bring back Guillen if you trade dunn. Guillen has the athletic ability and arm to play all 3 positions well. And arguably could be the biggest steal of Free Agency because he might fly under the radar while everyone rushes to pony up for Lee and others.

I like your thought on the bullpen but that rotation I think youd be better suited grabbing someone on the farm in LA over Penny. By the way wheres Milton? Reds havent been able to find a suitor for LaRue or Milton yet, and honestly I highly doubt they will.

reds44
10-25-2006, 07:30 PM
1)Pierre-CF
2)Phillips-2B
3)E.E.-3B
4)C.Lee-LF
5)JR-RF
6)Gonzalez-SS
7)Hatteberg-1B
8)Ross-C

Bad offensive players
Players who had career years, but can you expect the same production from.
Then add Griffey.

So you have 2 reliable offensive players in that lineup, and 9 millon dollars tied up in Gonzalez and Pierre.

I'll pass.

Natty Redlocks
10-25-2006, 07:55 PM
Yeah, I'd definitely take Freel/ Denorfia over Pierre. And Dunn over Lee.

This seems like a grass-is-greener type plan. Though we do need a closer.

Dracodave
10-25-2006, 08:08 PM
I'd keep Dunn and trade for some younger starters..

As previously mentioned Corriea.
I've even asked about Saarloos from Oakland.

fewfirstchoice
10-25-2006, 08:39 PM
Thanks guys for the feed back appreciated.
But what would you guys do to improve the Reds with the payroll the way it is.
Its almost a certainy Dunn will be traded.I say this because Wayne wants this to be his team and dealing Dunn will allow this to become closer and closer.
As for not finding a taker for Larue and Milton I dont agree that the Reds cant find suitors.I believe they are teams out there willing to take Larue and Milton.It may be spring training until Milton gets dealt because of surgery but I believe if Wayne wants to he can deal him and Larue,but he will have to take probably half of both of there contracts back to get someone to bite.

fourrunhomer
10-26-2006, 08:35 AM
If we eat the salaries of Milton and Larue like you mentioned that puts payroll up around 77.5 million.

SultanOfSwing
10-26-2006, 09:49 AM
Very nice job. I don't quite agree with everything, but I believe it is realistic and well thought out. Very, very nice job.

fewfirstchoice
10-26-2006, 10:51 AM
Never said eat the full contracts of Larue and Milton.I said eat about 2.5 mil. of Larues and 4 mil. of Miltons.And that puts the payroll at exactly were I had it.

pahster
10-26-2006, 01:36 PM
You not only want Juan Pierre, but you want to pay him $6 million? That's an awfully high dollar per out made (which Pierre does a lot of) ratio.

joshnky
10-26-2006, 04:12 PM
If Wayne could work miracles.... this wouldn't be one.

Degenerate39
10-28-2006, 07:34 AM
If Wayne could work miracle's he'd get us Soriano and Zito

Kc61
10-28-2006, 08:29 AM
You keep Belisle and don't sign Weathers.

Belisle over Weathers.

Based on performance in what league and when?

mth123
10-28-2006, 08:41 AM
You keep Belisle and don't sign Weathers.

Belisle over Weathers.

Based on performance in what league and when?

None, but Weathers had a BABIP of around .240 and he is another year older. Chances of him repeating are not good. If you can keep him for cheap, sure. I don't give him a raise and pay him for holding down the closer role for part of the year though. He'll probably want $3 Million +.

Hoosier Red
10-28-2006, 08:59 AM
Harang will cost more than $5 mill I imagine.

fewfirstchoice
10-28-2006, 11:39 AM
If the Reds sign Harang to say a 5 year deal they can get Harang at around 5-6 million for 07.

07 - 5 mil.
08 - 8 mil.
09 - 10 mil.
10 - 11 mil.
11 - 13 mil option or 3 mil buyout

Harang could be signed to this 5 year deal and be had pretty cheaply the first two years of the contract.