PDA

View Full Version : Will Carroll's Latest: Update on Randy Johnson, Three Team Trade Upcoming?



Outshined_One
12-25-2006, 10:29 PM
Link (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=118&PHPSESSID=4dfb412f0e8b94984558988c15480487)

Wonder who the three teams are?

Joseph
12-25-2006, 11:02 PM
Thats just hardly fair at all on Mr Carroll's part.

George Foster
12-25-2006, 11:05 PM
Link (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=118&PHPSESSID=4dfb412f0e8b94984558988c15480487)

Wonder who the three teams are?

Willis to the Reds, Dunn to the Dodgers, 3 good Dodger prospects to the Marlins.:beerme:

Outshined_One
12-25-2006, 11:26 PM
Willis to the Reds, Dunn to the Dodgers, 3 good Dodger prospects to the Marlins.:beerme:

Given the Dodgers' current rotation status, I wouldn't be surprised if they were involved.

Heath
12-25-2006, 11:26 PM
Willis to the Reds, Dunn to the Dodgers, 3 good Dodger prospects to the Marlins.:beerme:

Great - than Farney can have a drinking buddy.

George Foster
12-25-2006, 11:38 PM
Given the Dodgers' current rotation status, I wouldn't be surprised if they were involved.

I thought they were "starting pitching rich?" They are shopping Penny, and want a big bat to replace "what's his name" that signed with Boston.

Outshined_One
12-25-2006, 11:42 PM
I thought they were "starting pitching rich?" They are shopping Penny, and want a big bat to replace "what's his name" that signed with Boston.

Right, that's what I meant. They have a bunch of guys who could be effective starting pitchers next year and not enough slots to place them. I also have no faith whatsoever in Ned Colletti to make a competent move.

This might be a good time to try and swoop in for a trade involving a guy like Elbert or Billingsley.

BCubb2003
12-25-2006, 11:47 PM
Arizona, San Diego, possibly San Francisco?


http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/26/sports/baseball/26yankees.html?ref=sports

Outshined_One
12-25-2006, 11:54 PM
The thing about Carroll's article is that it sounds like this three team deal won't involve Randy Johnson.

Jpup
12-26-2006, 12:19 AM
I got 100-1 odds that the Reds aren't involved in any way.

dougdirt
12-26-2006, 01:19 AM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

johngalt
12-26-2006, 01:47 AM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

I don't care what the snag is - I just hope it stays hit.

*shiver*

corkedbat
12-26-2006, 01:53 AM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

Blech! Give me Hawpe and Penn! Does KrivO have some weird manlove for the name Majewski?

pedro
12-26-2006, 01:56 AM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

yuck.

corkedbat
12-26-2006, 02:08 AM
yuck.

Majewski has never even hit a major league HR and while I would rather have Hirsch in the rotation over Milton or Lohse - not at the price of AD. If I give up Dunn in a deal for a Baltimore OF it will be Markakis.

If that deal has any truth to it at all the OF name coming to the Reds better be Markakis, Hawpe or Holiday and the pitching name better be Francis, Cabrera, Penn or Bedard. Krivsky would not survive that deal, there would be a fan revolt.

Jpup
12-26-2006, 04:22 AM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

that can't be real. that would be horrible. If the Rocks or Orioles were throwing in something like one of their young arms, it might make a little sense, but that deal doesn't. Colorado would be robbing both the Reds and O's.

Mario-Rijo
12-26-2006, 09:13 AM
that can't be real. that would be horrible. If the Rocks or Orioles were throwing in something like one of their young arms, it might make a little sense, but that deal doesn't. Colorado would be robbing both the Reds and O's.


Hayden Penn (O's young arm), Jason Hirsh (Rox young arm).


However it doesn't make a lot of sense too me, Jason Hirsh and Majewski coming here for Dunn and Olmedo?! Plus Look at what the Rockies are giving up in that deal Barmes, Hawpe, Hirsh & Sullivan. Hayden Penn must be downright spectacular for that too happen. My guess is that it would be a little closer to this.

Rox Get: Penn, Chris Ray, Olmedo
O's Get: Adam Dunn & Barmes
Reds Get: Hirsh & Hawpe

And even that has it's drawbacks but I could it a little easier. Could be that the balance of the 1st deal is why it's snagged.

flyer85
12-26-2006, 10:20 AM
if the Reds are involved in anything big it scares the heck out of me.

RANDY IN INDY
12-26-2006, 10:28 AM
Involved in nothing/scary

Involved in something big/scary

Involved in something in-between/scary

:confused: :all_cohol

Outshined_One
12-26-2006, 04:16 PM
Carroll finally spills the beans: (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=120)


Oh, the tease. While I canít give specifics on the deal, there are still at least six teams involved in some discussions centering on Atlanta. The Braves are in full dump mode, trying to get something for Andruw Jones, trying to find Jonesí replacement on the cheap, and working more on the bullpen. Leo Mazzone isnít there to build a bullpen out of dreck anymore. So how does this all work together? Why trade a young player like Andy LaRoche if theyíre trying to control the payroll? Why deal Jones right now rather than at the deadline? The team is determined to find a solid bullpen and think they can do it with a series of deals that include LaRoche, Mike Gonzalez, Andruw Jones, and several CF candidates that Iím told include Rocco Baldelli, Curtis Granderson, and Nick Markakis. The deals appear to also have some other big names like Tim Hudson, Mark Teixeira, and Dontrelle Willis on the periphery. The three team deal that seemed close over the weekend doesnít seem so close now as the complexity has increased. Remember that John Schuerholz is normally a slow worker, so quiet on this front doesnít mean that nothing is happening.

RANDY IN INDY
12-26-2006, 04:23 PM
Adam Laroche change his name to "Andy?"

M2
12-26-2006, 04:23 PM
If the Braves are dumping Tim Hudson, Wayne Krivsky needs to be following John Schuerholz around with a trash bag.

dougdirt
12-26-2006, 04:24 PM
Andy and Adam Laroche are brothers. Andy plays in the minor leagues currently.

RANDY IN INDY
12-26-2006, 05:11 PM
Andy and Adam Laroche are brothers. Andy plays in the minor leagues currently.

How are the Braves going to trade him when he belongs to the Dodgers?

dougdirt
12-26-2006, 05:16 PM
Oh, I didnt read that part, I just saw where he asked if Adam changed his name to Andy.

Jpup
12-26-2006, 05:56 PM
If the Braves are dumping Tim Hudson, Wayne Krivsky needs to be following John Schuerholz around with a trash bag.

I was scolded for such nonsense. :)

Spitball
12-26-2006, 06:02 PM
Hudson is not the pitcher he used to be, and now he is entering the really expensive years of that heavily back loaded contract. I imagine the Braves would like to unload him before he becomes unmoveable.

That said, I hope the Reds somehow get him. ;)

westofyou
12-26-2006, 06:30 PM
Hudson is not the pitcher he used to be, and now he is entering the really expensive years of that heavily back loaded contract. I imagine the Braves would like to unload him before he becomes unmoveable.

That said, I hope the Reds somehow get him. ;)


Good point

07:$6M, 08:$13M, 09:$13M, 10:$12M mutual option
($1M buyout)


TIM HUDSON

GIVEN NAME: Timothy Adam Hudson
BORN: 7/14/1975 Columbus, Georgia
BAT: R THROW: R HEIGHT: 6'0" WEIGHT: 160 MLB DEBUT: 6/8/1999

YEAR TEAM AGE W L PCT G GS CG SV GF IP H R ER BB SO ERA RSAA
1999 A's 23 11 2 .846 21 21 1 0 0 136.1 121 56 49 62 132 3.23 22
2000 A's 24 20 6 .769 32 32 2 0 0 202.1 169 100 93 82 169 4.14 13
2001 A's 25 18 9 .667 35 35 3 0 0 235 216 100 88 71 181 3.37 24
2002 A's 26 15 9 .625 34 34 4 0 0 238.1 237 87 79 62 152 2.98 45
2003 A's 27 16 7 .696 34 34 3 0 0 240 197 84 72 61 162 2.70 41
2004 A's 28 12 6 .667 27 27 3 0 0 188.2 194 82 74 44 103 3.53 24
2005 Braves 29 14 9 .609 29 29 2 0 0 192 194 79 75 65 115 3.52 19
2006 Braves 30 13 12 .520 35 35 2 0 0 218.1 235 129 118 79 141 4.86 -12
TOTALS 119 60 .665 247 247 20 0 0 1651 1563 717 648 526 1155 3.53 176
LG AVERAGE 92 93 .498 11 0 1651 1712 910 837 618 1171 4.56 0

YEAR TEAM HR H/9 BR/9 SO/9 BB/9 SO/BB SHO WP IBB HBP BFP BK NW NL
1999 A's 8 7.99 12.34 8.71 4.09 2.13 0 6 2 4 580 0 9 4
2000 A's 24 7.52 11.48 7.52 3.65 2.06 2 7 5 7 847 0 15 11
2001 A's 20 8.27 11.22 6.93 2.72 2.55 0 9 5 6 980 1 16 11
2002 A's 19 8.95 11.59 5.74 2.34 2.45 2 7 9 8 983 1 17 7
2003 A's 15 7.39 10.05 6.08 2.29 2.66 2 6 9 10 967 0 16 7
2004 A's 8 9.25 11.93 4.91 2.10 2.34 2 4 3 12 793 1 11 7
2005 Braves 20 9.09 12.56 5.39 3.05 1.77 0 4 5 9 817 0 14 9
2006 Braves 25 9.69 13.31 5.81 3.26 1.78 1 7 10 9 959 0 11 14
TOTALS 139 8.52 11.74 6.30 2.87 2.20 9 50 48 65 6926 3 109 70
LG AVERAGE 205 9.33 13.09 6.38 3.37 1.89 3 58 45 70 7183 6

IslandRed
12-26-2006, 07:12 PM
Hudson is one of those guys whose backloaded "bad" contract looks a lot better to me than it did two months ago. The performance and health trends aren't encouraging, but if he's not injured somehow he might be due for a bounceback. With Gonzalez in between EE and Phillips, at least we have the rangy groundball-vacuuming infield he needs.

Highlifeman21
12-26-2006, 07:46 PM
Ive heard a rumor of Baltimore-Cincinnati-Colorado trade:

Reds get: Jason Hirsh and Val Majewski
Rockies get: Adam Dunn, Ray Olmedo and Hayden Penn
Orioles get: Clint Barmes, Brad Hawpe and Corey Sullivan

Again, just a rumor, but I heard it from two different sources. One guy says there is a snag, but doesnt know what it is yet.

But did you see Krivsky @ The Pricinct wining and dining either of those GMs?

MartyFan
12-26-2006, 07:47 PM
With the market as tapped as it is on FA and at the price they are, The Reds could be in a position to move Milton for some REAL VALUE at the AAA level. Maybe a CF and a young starting pitcher?

savafan
12-26-2006, 09:44 PM
I can't imagine why Detroit would be moving Granderson...but if they did, I'd love to have him patrolling centerfield at GABP.

Caveat Emperor
12-26-2006, 10:12 PM
With the market as tapped as it is on FA and at the price they are, The Reds could be in a position to move Milton for some REAL VALUE at the AAA level. Maybe a CF and a young starting pitcher?

There is value out there for Milton, but I'd imagine not a whole lot of it. If the Reds were willing to eat $4 million of his deal, I think they would be able to at least pry loose a couple prospects (nothing with any real talent above the high-A level).

My hope is that Bailey making the team out of spring training convinces the Reds to jettison Milton. However, that would probably require them signing or dealing for another SP between now and the start of the regular season.

pedro
12-26-2006, 11:26 PM
There is value out there for Milton, but I'd imagine not a whole lot of it. If the Reds were willing to eat $4 million of his deal, I think they would be able to at least pry loose a couple prospects (nothing with any real talent above the high-A level).

My hope is that Bailey making the team out of spring training convinces the Reds to jettison Milton. However, that would probably require them signing or dealing for another SP between now and the start of the regular season.

If he pitches well the first half then this could really be true. That is a pretty big IF but we can always dream I guess.

marcshoe
12-26-2006, 11:47 PM
I'm afraid that we're going to see an Eric Milton in '07 that will lead to him either being put on the DL until his time with the Reds ends or DFA'd. I hope I'm wrong.

Marc D
12-27-2006, 10:31 AM
If he pitches well the first half then this could really be true. That is a pretty big IF but we can always dream I guess.


This can happen. Milton's knees are the problem and the last few years he's pitched decently when coming off an extended period of rest. If he's ever going to have a decent half a season this is probably his best shot.

That being said, even if he does have a good 1st half, the Reds will be hovering around .500 and not out of contention for the WC at that point and we'll have more of the same from 2006. We're in a "pennant race" we can't be sellers we must be buyers. Just like 2006 they'll be watching the playoffs from home and the organization will still be years away from actual competitivness. probably a year or two further behind if Kriv makes another mid season blockbuster with what little talent we actually have left.

At this point I wouldn't be shocked if they resigned Milton at a reduced price. They should give away free bottles of migrain headache medicine with any ticket purchase as a way of saying "we understand and we're sorry but we lack the ability to do anything but medicate the pain."