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View Full Version : The Reds Already Have a Lights out Closer



Bigredfan#1
02-11-2007, 02:57 PM
but they won't use him and I would have to agree with that. Bailey would be Papelbon all over and probably better for that matter. Could you imagine facing this kid who can hit 98 and then come in with the curve. He would be great as a closer but I think he will do more in the future as a SP.

KoryMac5
02-11-2007, 03:30 PM
I have thought about that idea too but both players are very different in that Papelbon is older 26 and did attend college. That being said I found this piece of info off of ESPN's website. Boston's doctors want Papelbon to go back to being a starter because of the stress put on his shoulder from closing.

Papelbon has undergone extensive rehabilitation to strengthen the muscles around his shoulder, but the team's medical staff suggested the 26-year-old be made a starter in 2007, the Boston Herald reports. The staff believes being a starter, rather than a closer, will give Papelbon more rest and the opportunity for a strict regimen of preventative workouts.

With that said I think it would be a mistake to mess with Homer's development both physically and mentally by converting him from starter to closer at this point in his development.

Bigredfan#1
02-11-2007, 03:33 PM
I have thought about that idea too but both players are very different in that Papelbon is older 26 and did attend college. That being said I found this piece of info off of ESPN's website. Boston's doctors want Papelbon to go back to being a starter because of the stress put on his shoulder from closing.

Papelbon has undergone extensive rehabilitation to strengthen the muscles around his shoulder, but the team's medical staff suggested the 26-year-old be made a starter in 2007, the Boston Herald reports. The staff believes being a starter, rather than a closer, will give Papelbon more rest and the opportunity for a strict regimen of preventative workouts.

With that said I think it would be a mistake to mess with Homer's development both physically and mentally by converting him from starter to closer at this point in his development.

I agree, I think he will be much more valuable as a SP and hope the Reds don't consider this. Teams now generally do not bring SPs up as MRPs or closers like they used to. Gullet was in the bullpen his first year and maybe part of his second, worked for him. Pedro Martinez started out as a MRP who was supposed to be a Closer, wouldn't have that been a mistake.

TexasRed
02-11-2007, 03:51 PM
I agree with the above; let Bailey work on being a SP at whatever pace he dictates. If he is as advertised, he is much too valuable to rush, change roles on, or overwork........ On a different note: what about Lohse in the closers role? I know we need starters bad, but this guy can bring it, and he might be much more consistent for 1-2 innings.

Degenerate39
02-11-2007, 07:26 PM
I'd rather have him be a Starter

Superdude
02-11-2007, 08:18 PM
From what I can tell, he'll be going back to AAA to learn how to mix his stuff better and polish his changeup. If you put Bailey in the closer's role right out of the gate, he'll probably just blow fastballs by everybody and scrap the changeup. I'd rather him come up as a starter later in the year.

TOBTTReds
02-11-2007, 09:44 PM
I have thought about that idea too but both players are very different in that Papelbon is older 26 and did attend college. That being said I found this piece of info off of ESPN's website. Boston's doctors want Papelbon to go back to being a starter because of the stress put on his shoulder from closing.

Papelbon has undergone extensive rehabilitation to strengthen the muscles around his shoulder, but the team's medical staff suggested the 26-year-old be made a starter in 2007, the Boston Herald reports. The staff believes being a starter, rather than a closer, will give Papelbon more rest and the opportunity for a strict regimen of preventative workouts.

With that said I think it would be a mistake to mess with Homer's development both physically and mentally by converting him from starter to closer at this point in his development.


I know this is one scenario, but the Cubs are going to make Kerry Wood a closer to have less stress on his arm. So, what gives?

dunner13
02-11-2007, 10:26 PM
I think the difference between wood and papelbon is the injury to the arm. Bailey has spent his whole career as a starter, moving him to a reliever would be more of a risk. Keep him as a starter and bring him up when hes ready, hes only 20. Even if he doesnt come up at all this year hes still ahead of most young pitchers. Lets take it slow so that hes an ace in cincinnati for along time.

blumj
02-11-2007, 10:58 PM
I know this is one scenario, but the Cubs are going to make Kerry Wood a closer to have less stress on his arm. So, what gives?
My understanding is that they're not trying to put less stress on Papelbon's arm, they're trying to build up his shoulder strength through a conditioning program, one that would be impractical to work around a closer's schedule. If they tried to keep him as closer, he'd be unavailable to pitch too frequently, or he'd be unable to adequately keep up his conditioning program.

jmac
02-11-2007, 11:11 PM
I agree with the above; let Bailey work on being a SP at whatever pace he dictates. If he is as advertised, he is much too valuable to rush, change roles on, or overwork........ On a different note: what about Lohse in the closers role? I know we need starters bad, but this guy can bring it, and he might be much more consistent for 1-2 innings.

I have toyed with the idea of Loshe myself.
He should get a look IMO since he has not yet excelled as a starter but has alot of the "stuff" baseball people talk about.
Again I am sure Narron probably has his mind made up on Weathers and Stanton though.

KoryMac5
02-11-2007, 11:44 PM
I know this is one scenario, but the Cubs are going to make Kerry Wood a closer to have less stress on his arm. So, what gives?

Kerry Wood said Wednesday that he has decided against having surgery to repair his injured right shoulder and that he intends to return next season as a reliever.
Wood, who has a partially torn rotator cuff, kept having setbacks as he reached 60-70 pitches in his throwing sessions. Rehab and shorter outings may give him the best chance of contributing next season. Where he'll be trying his comeback is anyone's guess. The Cubs will buy out his option year, and they have enough well compensated relievers as is. He'll probably take an incentive-laden deal elsewhere.(www.rotoworld.com)
Like was stated earlier two different injuries for two different pitchers. Wood who is hurt and trying to contribute anyway possible. Papelbon who was hurt last year with a socket problem in his shoulder trying to figure out what will have the least amount of stress on him.

George Foster
02-12-2007, 12:15 AM
It would seem like to me being in the bull pen is more stress on your arm. Getting ready to go 3 out of 4 nights is hard on a arm that is use to warming up once every 5 days.

TOBTTReds
02-12-2007, 01:25 AM
It would seem like to me being in the bull pen is more stress on your arm. Getting ready to go 3 out of 4 nights is hard on a arm that is use to warming up once every 5 days.

I agree. Include all the BP pitches when you don't go in. Those are the worst, and the most uncounted for reason for relievers being unavailable.

Slyder
02-12-2007, 12:58 PM
What good is a lights out closer if youre rotation can't get the game to him with a lead? Leave Bailey alone as a starter. Thats where we can maximize his production and value. If we had Florida's rotation then ya I would consider starting him in the closer role at AAA but we dont. 3-5 are full of ???. I really think Saarloos and ERam could have nice seasons but they will be far from locks for a great year like Harang.

Plus look at Papelbon and youll see why you dont take a guy who was a starter in the minors and make him a closer.

blumj
02-12-2007, 02:19 PM
To be fair, Papelbon never started a game until he was older than Bailey is now and already a pro, he was converted to a closer from a position player in college, so he'd probably had as much or more experience as a reliever than as a starter. For a 26 year old, he has very little pitching experience in any role. Still, the Red Sox turned Papelbon into a starting pitcher in the minors because they believed he had the potential, and he showed it, and I don't think they ever intentionally decided to turn him back into a closer without first giving him the chance to fail as a starter. It just sort of happened out of need, and he performed so well that it took an injury scare to make the decision to convert him back. In hindsight, it was probably a mistake, and Papelbon's no Bailey.