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WMR
04-09-2007, 08:06 PM
He called the Rutgers women's basketball team a bunch of 'nappy headed ho's.'

Despite mea culpas to Reverend Jackson and Reverend Sharpton, NBC announced today that he has been suspended for two weeks.

Red in Chicago
04-09-2007, 08:08 PM
i think howard is the only one that still talks about imus:p:

Blimpie
04-09-2007, 08:09 PM
I heard his "apology" on the air this morning...It seemed like he spent more time talking about all the black people he put on the air over the last several years than he did actually saying he was sorry.

Blimpie
04-09-2007, 08:10 PM
i think howard is the only one that still talks about imus:p:Not this week he isn't...

WMR
04-09-2007, 08:12 PM
Yeah he's about is irrelevant as you can get... but that's why he said what he did, IMO. He never knew how to walk the line that Howard is/was the master of doing. Not to mention he looks like the cryptkeeper now!

http://cache.eonline.com/News/Photos/i/imus.don.071205.jpg

Imus, IMUSSS, dead or aliveeee (probably only RIC will get that) :laugh:

GAC
04-09-2007, 09:53 PM
I agree, and always have, that it's degrading and insulting to the character of black women. But it's OK for the African-American community, including black artists (comedians, rap/hip hop artists, etc.) to use such derogatory terms, even worse in some instances, to characterize black females?

It's wrong in all instances. The hypocrisy of the "leaders" of the black community is amazing in this situation IMHO. Jackson and Sharpton are as big a joke as Imus is.

WMR
04-09-2007, 10:41 PM
I always ask, but no one seems able to provide an answer: When was the election to appoint "Reverend's" (haha) Jackson and Sharpton as the spokesmen of the black community?

No matter how dumb any remark by the Imus' and Michael Richards' of the world might be, kissing the ass of these buffoons is the last thing they should be doing, IMO.

Caveat Emperor
04-10-2007, 02:08 AM
He never knew how to walk the line that Howard is/was the master of doing.

Don Imus was a pioneer in the brand of radio that guys like Stern and O&A make a living on today. He's mellowed significantly in his old age, but give the man his due.

As for his current comments -- he made a joke that bombed when he stepped over the line a little. It happens to comedians and would-be funnymen all the time when, especially in the free-form that a radio program offers. I know its a shocking concept to some, but just because you say something insensitive doesn't make you per-se a bad person.

WMR
04-10-2007, 02:15 AM
Until Howard arrived at NBC, Imus played records.

Jpup
04-10-2007, 07:00 AM
I don't know what the big deal about it right now is. He has been saying things like these and worse for years. He needs to go to XM and quit worrying about what everybody thinks. I can't believe he is crumbling to Jesse Jackson.

I have heard him say the exact same thing before. If it was racially motivated, it was wrong, but I'm not sure it was.

dabvu2498
04-10-2007, 09:00 AM
http://cache.eonline.com/News/Photos/i/imus.don.071205.jpg


Don Imus criticizing someone's appearance... that's rich.

Truth is, the worst part of that clip is what alot of people aren't hearing. One of Imus' underlings using a term that, in my mind, is on par with the n-word. (Starts with a "j.")

To me, the real shame is that the Rutgers ladies basketball team is coached by one of the classiest, no-nonsense women in the business, C. Vivian Stringer. Her squad may look "rough," but I can tell you this, if I had a daughter that could play ball, I'd want her to play for Coach Stringer.

Puffy
04-10-2007, 11:28 AM
Imus' apology was great. I've had black people in my house. My wife and I once drove an African american girl to the hospital.

What year was he apologizing to - 1958?

Puffy
04-10-2007, 11:30 AM
Until Howard arrived at NBC, Imus played records.

Yup, he was a typical DJ - his 4 hour show was 3 hours of records and 1 hour of talking.

However, giving the devil his due, his one hour of talking was more "edgy" than anyone else out there at the time and he was a pioneer. Just not as big a pioneer as he'd like everyone to believe

Sea Ray
04-10-2007, 12:10 PM
I don't know what the big deal about it right now is. He has been saying things like these and worse for years. He needs to go to XM and quit worrying about what everybody thinks. I can't believe he is crumbling to Jesse Jackson.

I have heard him say the exact same thing before. If it was racially motivated, it was wrong, but I'm not sure it was.

I agree. This is what Don Imus does. He's a shock jock. If folks like Sharpton get their way he'll end up on satellite and make twice what he is now. Is that what they want? What are they trying to accomplish?

Dom Heffner
04-10-2007, 01:01 PM
It's sad that Imus continues to say such awful things. He tried to compare himself to Michael Richards and distance himself from Mel Gibson, when the opposite is true.

When you look at Imus' track record, he either has a problem or he doesn't get it. In both cases, he shouldn't be allowed to use the public airwaves.

In the same broadcast he made the "nappy headed" comment, someone said that Venus and Serena Williams shouldn't appear in Playboy but in National Geographic.

If you think that's funny in any way shape or form, you don't deserve the honor that comes with having a show such as his.

When Imus did a 60 Minutes interview, he admitted that he told a producer off-air that he had hired one person simply to do "n-word" jokes. He called Patrick Ewing "the missing link," a "carjacker in shorts," and the entire Knicks team, "chest-bumping pimps."

I just question someone's internal mechanisms who would think this is something that would be funny for broadcast.

It does sound a bit ironic, though, hearing the outrage coming from people who demean their own women as they do and who are more likely to be anti-semitic than whites.

I really don't want to hear lessons on how to treat people coming from Jessie "H_ _ ie Town" Jackson.

Nevertheless, Imus deserves what he is getting, but so do many of the people calling him out, but they will never hear much of it because people are afraid that even if their criticism is legitimate, they will be ran off into the hills.

To say that we should let capitalism run its course here is being a bit naive. A man whose audience is mostly white should not be the judge and jury for what happens to Don Imus. If people could be left to their own devices, there would be no need for a Constitution or laws that protect minorities.

None of it is good. None.

TeamDunn
04-10-2007, 01:03 PM
The press conference by the women on the basketball team is online right now.

They are a classy bunch of wonderful women! Good for them for standing up for themselves! :thumbup:

TeamCasey
04-10-2007, 01:06 PM
http://cache.eonline.com/News/Photos/i/imus.don.071205.jpg

It's Keith Richard's dad!

RANDY IN INDY
04-10-2007, 02:16 PM
I agree, and always have, that it's degrading and insulting to the character of black women. But it's OK for the African-American community, including black artists (comedians, rap/hip hop artists, etc.) to use such derogatory terms, even worse in some instances, to characterize black females?

It's wrong in all instances. The hypocrisy of the "leaders" of the black community is amazing in this situation IMHO. Jackson and Sharpton are as big a joke as Imus is.

:beerme: Imus was wrong, but if they are going to call him out, they better start worrying about all the folks that GAC mentioned above. It is never right, regardless of your race.

Razor Shines
04-10-2007, 03:51 PM
I can't believe they had a press conference to talk about this guy. Why are the players and the school giving him that much significance? They're going to give him that much power? Their press conference should have lasted 30 seconds and they should have had one statement: "We really don't give a D### what Don Imus thinks or says, thank you."

Caveat Emperor
04-10-2007, 04:33 PM
If you think that's funny in any way shape or form, you don't deserve the honor that comes with having a show such as his.

If you don't like it, don't listen.

Its hard for me to get morally righteous or upset about any of this stuff when I can flip from Imus to KISS-FM and here a song by Ludacris that uses every word Imus did in the course of one refrain. I like Luda (even if "Release Therapy" was kinda crap). I like Imus too.

The speaker doesn't make the speech offensive -- the speech is either offensive or it isn't.

bucksfan2
04-10-2007, 04:48 PM
What Imus said was stupid and wrong. He never should have said it and has apoligized profusly for it.

But I wonder why Sharpton is attacking him and wants him fired when he failes to address rappers and their constant degrading of women. He doesn't say a word about BET and the racy music videos they show. Why is it that a guy like Dave Chapell can joke around about the crackers and the N word but if any white person ventures itno that territory they are chastized.

I just am irritated by the contradictary nature of these self proclaimed african american leaders.

Redsland
04-10-2007, 04:53 PM
Why are the players and the school giving him that much significance? They're press conference should have lasted 30 seconds and they should have had one statement: "We really don't give a D### what Dom Imus thinks or says, thank you."
Agreed.

Caveat Emperor
04-10-2007, 05:02 PM
I can't believe they had a press conference to talk about this guy. Why are the players and the school giving him that much significance? They're going to give him that much power? They're press conference should have lasted 30 seconds and they should have had one statement: "We really don't give a D### what Don Imus thinks or says, thank you."

It's amusing -- this is probably the most relevant Don Imus has been in 2 decades.

NJReds
04-10-2007, 06:54 PM
I'm not condoning what he said, but he's been saying stuff like this for 30 years...24 hour news channels and the internet have brought this incident to the surface. Stern, Imus and their ilk have always used racial terms in their humor. Just as some of the hip-hop DJs have made racially insensitive comments.

Dom Heffner
04-10-2007, 07:42 PM
If you don't like it, don't listen.

I really don't think this is an argument is it?

Using this logic I could say we should have a show about how obsessed Jewish people are with money and the people who don't like it shouldn't listen.

The fact that only people who like that sort of humor are listening or watching a program doesn't change the fact that it should not be on our airwaves.


Its hard for me to get morally righteous or upset about any of this stuff when I can flip from Imus to KISS-FM and here a song by Ludacris that uses every word Imus did in the course of one refrain. I like Luda (even if "Release Therapy" was kinda crap). I like Imus too.

Calling someone out for telling offensive jokes is not being morally righteous, and the fact that you like Imus or Ludacris doesn't excuse the behavior.

This isn't a question of being a fan. There are people who like Pete Rose so much that they'd let them in the hall of fame even though he did something he knew would get him banned and lied about it for fifteen plus years. Maybe they could tell people, "If you don't like it, don't go look at his plaque."

And I do agree that these rap artists and everybody else should be called out for what they do to, if nothing else to hold them accountable as Imus and others have been.

I don't believe the answer to the problem is to say, "Well Ludacris is doing it too."

Imus' argument here is a bit specious: He wants us to look at the comment in the context of a comedy show, yet he himself says the joke wasn't funny.

So, he's in a bind. He either thought it was funny at the time, which doesn't bode well for his mindset, or he tried to tell a joke he didn't think was funny.

Chip R
04-10-2007, 07:49 PM
Imus had a right to say what he did no matter how offensive it was. However, people also have the right to be offended by it. His employer also has the right to discipline him for saying what he did too if they feel it is going to be bad for their business.

Caveat Emperor
04-10-2007, 08:06 PM
I really don't think this is an argument is it?

Using this logic I could say we should have a show about how obsessed Jewish people are with money and the people who don't like it shouldn't listen.

The fact that only people who like that sort of humor are listening or watching a program doesn't change the fact that it should not be on our airwaves.

EDIT: My post was probably straying too far into the political realm.

I'll take it over to the peanut gallery, because this topic probably belongs there more than anything else.

Matt700wlw
04-10-2007, 08:10 PM
Still not sure what he got suspended for....pissing people off? Isn't that part of what he does?

I don't think he broke any FCC violations,at least not off the top of my head.....

We live in over-sensitive society...a society where all of a sudden people can't decifer for themselves what they want to listen to or not...I get it working at the radio station, people call in and yell me because of a talk show host they don't like but are "forced to listen to"...grow up people! You have a knob on your radio, or buttons on your radio for a reason, to change the channel. If somebody who doesn't know me wants to call me a white honky, go ahead....you just sound stupid.


Should he have said it? No. Probably not. Has this stuff been going for years and years and years on the airways? Yes. Why is it so evil now? Why is it so hypocritical now? If one group of people says it, it's ok...if another does it, they're the devil...


It's like what Colin Cowherd said about Cincinnati.....I really don't care. He's probably never been here, or if he has, he hasn't spent enough time here to get to know people, so he uses a select few who have gotten negative media attention to generalize about the entire population of the city. He just sounds ignorant.

All I know, is that if an african-american or hispanic host (for example) would say "racially insensitive" things about a white person, they wouldn't get suspended...because if they did, the NAACP would scream "racism"

"Equal" is a joke.

RBA
04-10-2007, 08:16 PM
Let's talk about something more current than Don Imus. What does everyone think about the chances of the 1975 Reds going back to back Word Championships?

Chip R
04-10-2007, 08:43 PM
Still not sure what he got suspended for....pissing people off? Isn't that part of what he does?


Matt, you should know better than anyone why. Especially after the whole Furman deal. If I run a radio station and one of my hosts says something that's going to give me bad publicity and cost me money, I'm not just going to sit there and do nothing. And if I own a radio station, I probably own a lot of other things as well so that's going to be affected too. Imus is lucky he was only suspended.

Dracodave
04-10-2007, 08:49 PM
"Equal" is a joke.


That statement right there says it all. There seems to be something thats forgotten when it comes down to it. Something spoken by Morgan Freeman, and really is the point. "If you want racism to stop, stop being a part of it. Its a two way street." Claiming everything is racist (Remember the fact that they banned The Dukes of Hazard car due to the rebel flag?) doesn't help either. Was the comment racist? Yes, but was it meant to shock and start a debate? Yes again.

I had zero complaints about The Civil Rights baseball game because I agree'd with the message, use something as a grounds to "unite" not seperate...

This is just getting ridicilous.

JaxRed
04-10-2007, 08:53 PM
I always laugh when these guys think going on tv and apologizing over and over makes the situation better.

You do something stupid like this: Issue an sincere apology and then shut up. Don't do talk shows, don't meet the people, don't do interviews.

GAC
04-10-2007, 09:14 PM
Did anyone happen to see the interview last night with a panel of commentators on this issue? They were all black. They had a radio talk show host, a college professor who holds a doctorate on political science/psychology, and a comedian.

The professor was advocating outlawing this type of speech, which is simply ridiculous. But the comedian, who was hilarious, made the most sense. He states "If you outlaw the use of such terms, then the only people you are gonna hurt and put on the unemployment line are guys like me! I guarantee you that when those women on that basketball team heard Imus' words, their response was 'What did that cracker just call me?" :lol:

And it was also brought up by the radio talk show host that when Katrina hit, Imus was one of the most vocal critics of how the situation was being handled, was outraged that race may be the reasoning behind it, and worked with numerous agencies to help coordinate efforts to bring relief to the city.

Jackson and Sharpton are nothing more then a couple of race baiters who thrive on stuff like this for their livelihood and financial support. These two can't address, or have answers, to fix the real problems within the black community, issues that are really important, so they make issues out of stuff like this to show their relevance.

I find it very hypocritical that some of those calling for Imus' head are on record as saying some of the most overt racist comments. Spike Lee is utraged, yet says he hates inter-racial marriages and "visualizes daggers" when he sees them. Ludacris uses the same terms Imus did in song.

Matt700wlw
04-10-2007, 09:25 PM
Matt, you should know better than anyone why. Especially after the whole Furman deal. If I run a radio station and one of my hosts says something that's going to give me bad publicity and cost me money, I'm not just going to sit there and do nothing. And if I own a radio station, I probably own a lot of other things as well so that's going to be affected too. Imus is lucky he was only suspended.

I can't get into the Furman ordeal....there's things that have to stay behind closed doors. I "know" why Imus got suspended in that respect.

GAC
04-10-2007, 10:16 PM
Imus had a right to say what he did no matter how offensive it was. However, people also have the right to be offended by it. His employer also has the right to discipline him for saying what he did too if they feel it is going to be bad for their business.

That's true Chip. Yet why just outrage over Imus then? We can all sight examples of people on TV and radio who daily say outrageous comments about various groups, cultures, individuals. Some in humor, some not.

We now live in a culture that loves being caustic, offensive, and confrontational. There is no "etiquette", even when done in humor. Look at some of today's popular TV shows, and what they say, and who they attack/mock.

It just seems there is different standards being applied depending on who you are. ;)

bucksfan
04-10-2007, 10:36 PM
It's amusing -- this is probably the most relevant Don Imus has been in 2 decades.

Obviously in my little world it is - I must honestly admit that I wondered "Who the heck is this Imus guy?" when all this came about. Somehow I must not have escaped the shadow of my rock I live under long enough to have learned who this guy is...

dabvu2498
04-11-2007, 09:00 AM
That's true Chip. Yet why just outrage over Imus then? We can all sight examples of people on TV and radio who daily say outrageous comments about various groups, cultures, individuals. Some in humor, some not.

We now live in a culture that loves being caustic, offensive, and confrontational. There is no "etiquette", even when done in humor. Look at some of today's popular TV shows, and what they say, and who they attack/mock.

It just seems there is different standards being applied depending on who you are. ;)

GAC -- How would you feel if your daughter played basketball at Rutgers?

Razor Shines
04-11-2007, 02:03 PM
GAC -- How would you feel if your daughter played basketball at Rutgers?

I don't think I am GAC, but I'll answer it like you asked me.

If it were my daughter who played on a NCAA team that just played in the National Championship. I'd ask her why she's letting some dude on the radio take some of her joy away? I think if you let someone's words offend you, then you give that person power over you and you value that person's opinion way too much. I'm sure it's not the first time some of these girls have been called names, and it probably won't be the last. I just think by making a big deal out of this they are giving Don Imus way to much significance and way to much attention. If someone like Don Imus is going to stoop to the level of making these comments than he's not someone who's opinion is worth valueing, just like anybody else who makes these sort of comments. And by having press conference to talk about him instead of talking about their National Championship appearance is giving him more significance than them winning. That's the way I see it, anyway.

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2007, 02:03 PM
GAC -- How would you feel if your daughter played basketball at Rutgers?

I don't know that I'd really care -- being called out by Don Imus is like having a sternly-worded "letter to the editor" directed towards you from a paper in Boise, Idaho.

kaldaniels
04-11-2007, 02:25 PM
With all due respect to the mods...I started a thread over the Hardaway "gay" remark and got immediately scolded and sent to the peanut gallery wearing a dunce cap. How is this thread different???

dabvu2498
04-11-2007, 02:25 PM
If it were my daughter who played on a NCAA team that just won the National Championship. I'd ask her why she's letting some dude on the radio take some of her joy away? I think if you let someone's words offend you, then you give that person power over you and you value that person's opinion way too much. I'm sure it's not the first time some of these girls have been called names, and it probably won't be the last. I just think by making a big deal out of this they are giving Don Imus way to much significance and way to much attention. If someone like Don Imus is going to stoop to the level of making these comments than he's not someone who's opinion is worth valueing, just like anybody else who makes these sort of comments. And by having press conference to talk about him instead of talking about their National Championship is giving him more significance than them winning. That's the way I see it, anyway.


Actually, Rutgers lost in the National Championship game.

Followup to both you and CE: How would you feel if you were walking down the street with your daughter (girlfriend, wife, sister, good friend would also apply) and someone called them a "nappy-headed ho" or "j_g_b_o" or any other relevant insensative term?

In my way of thinking, all that "sticks and stones" stuff is great until it's personal. Imus' comment wasn't a term used in a movie or TV show or rap video. It was personal. He called 12 hard-working college students that he knew nothing about other than how they looked on TV "nappy headed hos." That's what makes it different.

Razor Shines
04-11-2007, 02:27 PM
Actually, Rutgers lost in the National Championship game.

See if they were talking about that instead of Don Imus I would know that. Thanks for correcting me, but it really wasn't the point.

dabvu2498
04-11-2007, 02:32 PM
See if they were talking about that instead of Don Imus I would know that. Thanks for correcting me, but it really wasn't the point.

I know. My followup question is above.

Razor Shines
04-11-2007, 02:44 PM
Actually, Rutgers lost in the National Championship game.

Followup to both you and CE: How would you feel if you were walking down the street with your daughter (girlfriend, wife, sister, good friend would also apply) and someone called them a "nappy-headed ho" or "j_g_b_o" or any other relevant insensative term?

In my way of thinking, all that "sticks and stones" stuff is great until it's personal. Imus' comment wasn't a term used in a movie or TV show or rap video. It was personal. He called 12 hard-working college students that he knew nothing about other than how they looked on TV "nappy headed hos." That's what makes it different.

If I was walking down the street and it happened, then I really don't know what I would do. I don't think it's something that's worth fighting over, I do believe there are reasons to fight, but I don't think that a verbal attack is one of them. Honestly something like that happened a few weeks ago while I was in San Antonio and my wife and I just laughed and kept walking. My friend who was also with his girlfriend wanted to fight (he's always gotten fired up over small things), but I got him to just keep walking. Now if the person had attempted to make more of it than just words than I'd have obliged him.

I do believe in that "sticks and stones" stuff, especially when it's personal. That person will not hold any power over me. I'm not going to let someone make me angry by calling me names, I don't value that person's opinion that much.

This is something that undoubtedly I am going to have to deal with in the future, because my kids are going to be mixed race. So I am preparing for it now, because unfortunately it's something that's going to happen.

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2007, 03:38 PM
Followup to both you and CE: How would you feel if you were walking down the street with your daughter (girlfriend, wife, sister, good friend would also apply) and someone called them a "nappy-headed ho" or "j_g_b_o" or any other relevant insensative term?

I'd keep walking -- but thats because I'm not in any great hurry to get charged with assault or disorderly conduct over some moron's comments.


Imus' comment wasn't a term used in a movie or TV show or rap video. It was personal. He called 12 hard-working college students that he knew nothing about other than how they looked on TV "nappy headed hos." That's what makes it different.

I don't see how comments from someone who knows absolutely nothing about the team or the players can BE personal? Ignorant, Ill-informed, and Idiotic, yes. Personal? Hardly. Maybe if he'd singled out individual players, it might be a little more malicious, but that'd require he knew something about the team beyond the 20 seconds of footage the national title game got on SportsCenter.

dabvu2498
04-11-2007, 03:50 PM
I don't see how comments from someone who knows absolutely nothing about the team or the players can BE personal? Ignorant, Ill-informed, and Idiotic, yes. Personal? Hardly. Maybe if he'd singled out individual players, it might be a little more malicious, but that'd require he knew something about the team beyond the 20 seconds of footage the national title game got on SportsCenter.

I'd say comments about a woman's (or group of women) appearance and sexual habits is personal.

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2007, 04:12 PM
I'd say comments about a woman's (or group of women) appearance and sexual habits is personal.

The appearence part is bad because the claim is being made that "nappy headed" is a direct reference to their race as opposed to any real critique of their appearence. I don't put a lot of weight behind it unless the race tie is there, because Adam Morrison got trashed out for months about his 'stash and nobody came rushing to his defense because he was a hard-working student athlete. No double standards.

The sexual habits part -- well, that depends on whether or not you think being called "ho" by an old white guy that has never met you, doesn't know your name, and probably forgot what school you went to immediately after the joke is really an attack on your chastity. The term has two meanings -- the direct insult meaning (said person to person based on accusation of sexual promiscuity) and the generalized mildly degrading to women meaning that it takes in popular culture (listen to the radio for 20 minutes to pick that one up). Based on the context of Imus' quote, I'd tend to attribute more the latter meaning, IMO.

Basically what I come up with is this: I see being outraged as a minority and as a woman for insensitive comments and terminology to describe african americans and women. I don't see being personally outraged as one of the 12 people "insulted".

I hope that makes some sense.

RBA
04-11-2007, 04:17 PM
Imus is wrong. But he isn't overtly right wing radio. Where's the outrage when Rush, Beck, and Bennet use hate speech (and they are not joking)?

dabvu2498
04-11-2007, 04:18 PM
Basically what I come up with is this: I see being outraged as a minority and as a woman for insensitive comments and terminology to describe african americans and women. I don't see being personally outraged as one of the 12 people "insulted".

I hope that makes some sense.


That's fair. I can go for that.

But I can say this -- if one of my daughters played for Rutgers, I'd be ticked.

redsfan1966
04-11-2007, 05:38 PM
I apologize if this has been stated before--I havent read the whole thread...but isnt it weird/interesting that Imus' "suspension" starts Monday...and he is still on the air while the controversy swirls???? If you really wanted to punish him...wouldnt you pull him immediately???? This reminds me of the infamous WLW "suspensions" given to Cunningham and Furman while they went on vacation....

GAC
04-11-2007, 05:43 PM
GAC -- How would you feel if your daughter played basketball at Rutgers?

What Razor Shine stated so eloquently. Would I be upset over it? Not to the degree of taking it to the public level that other people have just because some idiot made a off-handed comment which, IMHO, was not made with a malicious intent - and that is what is important: what is the INTENT behind the person's words - but was a wrong-headed attempt at humor.

I listened to Imus' initial comments afterwards, his apology, and I believe he was sincere. He knows he screwed up. He should have dropped it right then and there. He should have never taken it further and given "stage" to characters as Sharpton in an attempt to further rationalize/explain his remarks. He made his apology. Now let the chips fall where they may.

But I wouldn't be calling for the guy's head or trying to ruin his career.

AS far as I'm concerned - the shame he will have to carry on his head for those comments is plenty of punishment. He will always be known for that.

What bothers me is that if these terms, as well as others, are so offensive to blacks, then why have they allowed them to become so ingrained, as far as usage goes, within their own culture? And I don't accept this "It's a black thing". Black comedians and hip-hop artists use them regularly. I have heard co-workers who, when having conversations with each other, and yes I know they are joking around, used this language, especially the "N" word and "ho" on each other.

Is it, or is it not, offensive?

A couple weeks ago, long before this Imus incident, I watched a home video on one of the cable news networks showing a group of black college students joking around in the dorm. They were using the exact same words Imus did, and a few other divisive ones in their back-and-forth conversations. And they were all males! One black girl enters the scene and asks them why they, being males, were calling each other "ho's"? They just kinda looked at her. :lol:

Caveat Emperor
04-11-2007, 05:47 PM
I apologize if this has been stated before--I havent read the whole thread...but isnt it weird/interesting that Imus' "suspension" starts Monday...and he is still on the air while the controversy swirls???? If you really wanted to punish him...wouldnt you pull him immediately???? This reminds me of the infamous WLW "suspensions" given to Cunningham and Furman while they went on vacation....

Apparently Imus is completing the week because he is helping to raise money for one of the charities he does work for -- something that has been planned for quite some time.

Hoosier Red
04-11-2007, 05:51 PM
Apparently Imus is completing the week because he is helping to raise money for one of the charities he does work for -- something that has been planned for quite some time.


I bet the charity is thrilled with him.

Ltlabner
04-11-2007, 05:55 PM
Not that it matters much, but I wonder if a single member of the Rutgers team even knew who the heck Don Imus was prior to this flap?

Frankly, I had mostly forgotten he existed.

Chip R
04-11-2007, 06:00 PM
Not that it matters much, but I wonder if a single member of the Rutgers team even knew who the heck Don Imus was prior to this flap?

Frankly, I had mostly forgotten he existed.


If a tree falls in the woods and no one is there to hear it, it still makes a sound.

Ltlabner
04-11-2007, 06:09 PM
If a tree falls in the woods and no one is there to hear it, it still makes a sound.

Them knowing or not knowing Imus doesn't change that his statements were ignorant and insensative, I agree.

I just can't imagine Imus being a big force in the "young 20's, collage student, athlete" demo. I would think those young ladies were thinking, "who the heck is this old creepy guy?" when they were told about it.

durl
04-11-2007, 06:26 PM
If a tree falls in the woods and no one is there to hear it, it still makes a sound.

Actually, it makes vibrations, but it's not a sound until a receptor converts it to sound. ;)

TRF
04-11-2007, 06:43 PM
Imus should not have been suspended for his remarks. And in my opinion he was not.

ok, hear me out on this.

NBC knows Imus. this wasn't a surprise. They have tolerated his bile racist remarks for years. And they never really cared.

But this time it cost them money. And well we can't have that.

Is he offensive? yes. Is his right to be offensive protected under the Bill of Rights? Yes. He didn't incite a riot. He didn't tell someone to harm another person. He's just a bigot. Colin Cowherd did more harm with his "Let's take down a random internet site" rant. Cowherd did something that caused actual damage. Imus just insulted a group of women.

He's a pig. And a bigot. And a sexist. And nothing he did was illegal. I hate the "we have to hold broadcasters to a higher standard" arguement. Imus is not a reporter. He's an on air personality. His speech is protected.

However, he cost his boss some money. Hence the suspension. Just that simple.

KittyDuran
04-11-2007, 06:47 PM
With all due respect to the mods...I started a thread over the Hardaway "gay" remark and got immediately scolded and sent to the peanut gallery wearing a dunce cap. How is this thread different???Just wait... it'll get there...;) :p:

bucksfan
04-11-2007, 06:51 PM
Them knowing or not knowing Imus doesn't change that his statements were ignorant and insensative, I agree.

I just can't imagine Imus being a big force in the "young 20's, collage student, athlete" demo. I would think those young ladies were thinking, "who the heck is this old creepy guy?" when they were told about it.

Heck, I am hardly in the demographic of the Rutgers basketball team and I was thinking that too! :laugh:

Chip R
04-11-2007, 07:05 PM
However, he cost his boss some money. Hence the suspension. Just that simple.


And you're right. But they have every right in the world to do that if they feel he's costing them money. Imus wasn't arrested or killed or sent to Siberia for what he said. He got suspended. That's it.

Sometimes we mistake the 1st Amendment's meaning and we think it gives anyone the right to say anything they want without consequences. But that's not what it says. All it says is that Congress shall make no law abridging freedom of speech. If I went up to my boss and told him he was a no-good, lying SOB I'd get fired from my job and I'd deserve it and he'd be within his rights to do so. But I couldn't be arrested for saying it. I'd just have to get another job. If Imus wants to sue his employer for suspending him, God bless him. He's got every right in the world to do so. He also has a right to quit his job and go elsewhere if he doesn't like it there.

His employer also has the right to take action against him if they feel he is hurting their business. The basic principle of a capitalistic society is to make as much money as you can within the bounds of the law. You don't have to lose money if you don't have to.

Jaycint
04-11-2007, 08:20 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,265441,00.html

What a joke.

Matt700wlw
04-11-2007, 08:31 PM
Now that major advertisers are pulling ads, I can justify a suspension....he's now costing his company money.

If he gets fired, I don't know if I can justify that.

vaticanplum
04-11-2007, 09:00 PM
And you're right. But they have every right in the world to do that if they feel he's costing them money. Imus wasn't arrested or killed or sent to Siberia for what he said. He got suspended. That's it.

Sometimes we mistake the 1st Amendment's meaning and we think it gives anyone the right to say anything they want without consequences. But that's not what it says. All it says is that Congress shall make no law abridging freedom of speech. If I went up to my boss and told him he was a no-good, lying SOB I'd get fired from my job and I'd deserve it and he'd be within his rights to do so. But I couldn't be arrested for saying it. I'd just have to get another job. If Imus wants to sue his employer for suspending him, God bless him. He's got every right in the world to do so. He also has a right to quit his job and go elsewhere if he doesn't like it there.

His employer also has the right to take action against him if they feel he is hurting their business. The basic principle of a capitalistic society is to make as much money as you can within the bounds of the law. You don't have to lose money if you don't have to.

I agree. Imus can be suspended by anybody who chooses if it's a private business, no? We're arguing criminal charges and legality, but I don't think that's the issue here.

My place of employment could certainly fire me for public remarks such as these. I could choose to take them to court to try to get my job back and then my first amendment rights might become the tricky issue. But it's right there in my employer's contract: they can release me at any time for reasons that they feel are justified.

We can make this into a political issue if we want to, and we can debate the intention and the effect of his words. But I don't really get the "they have no right to suspend him" thing. They can suspend whoever they want -- and if they're losing money, that's as a legitimate reason as any, since business exist to make money.

WMR
04-11-2007, 09:43 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v447/dickybendy/GrimReaper3.jpg

WMR
04-11-2007, 10:08 PM
Time for Jackson, Sharpton to Step Down
Pair See Potential for Profit, Attention in Imus Incident
By JASON WHITLOCK
Sports Commentary

I’m calling for Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, the president and vice president of Black America, to step down.

Their leadership is stale. Their ideas are outdated. And they don’t give a damn about us.

We need to take a cue from White America and re-elect our leadership every four years. White folks realize that power corrupts. That’s why they placed term limits on the presidency. They know if you leave a man in power too long he quits looking out for the interest of his constituency and starts looking out for his own best interest.

We’ve turned Jesse and Al into Supreme Court justices. They get to speak for us for a lifetime.

Why?

If judged by the results they’ve produced the last 20 years, you’d have to regard their administration as a total failure. Seriously, compared to Martin and Malcolm and the freedoms and progress their leadership produced, Jesse and Al are an embarrassment.

Their job the last two decades was to show black people how to take advantage of the opportunities Martin and Malcolm won.

Have we at the level we should have? No.

Rather than inspire us to seize hard-earned opportunities, Jesse and Al have specialized in blackmailing white folks for profit and attention. They were at it again last week, helping to turn radio shock jock Don Imus’ stupidity into a world-wide crisis that reached its crescendo Tuesday afternoon when Rutgers women’s basketball coach Vivian Stringer led a massive pity party/recruiting rally.


Imus’ words did no real damage. Let me tell you what damaged us this week: the sports cover of Tuesday’s USA Today. This country’s newspaper of record published a story about the NFL and crime and ran a picture of 41 NFL players who were arrested in 2006. By my count, 39 of those players were black.

You want to talk about a damaging, powerful image, an image that went out across the globe?

We’re holding news conferences about Imus when the behavior of NFL players is painting us as lawless and immoral. Come on. We can do better than that. Jesse and Al are smarter than that.

Had Imus’ predictably poor attempt at humor not been turned into an international incident by the deluge of media coverage, 97 percent of America would’ve never known what Imus said. His platform isn’t that large and it has zero penetration into the sports world.

Imus certainly doesn’t resonate in the world frequented by college women. The insistence by these young women that they have been emotionally scarred by an old white man with no currency in their world is laughably dishonest.

The Rutgers players are nothing more than pawns in a game being played by Jackson, Sharpton and Stringer.

Jesse and Al are flexing their muscle and setting up their next sting. Bringing down Imus, despite his sincere attempts at apologizing, would serve notice to their next potential victim that it is far better to pay up than stand up to Jesse and Al James.

Stringer just wanted her 15 minutes to make the case that she’s every bit as important as Pat Summitt and Geno Auriemma. By the time Stringer’s rambling, rapping and rhyming 30-minute speech was over, you’d forgotten that Tennessee won the national championship and just assumed a racist plot had been hatched to deny the Scarlet Knights credit for winning it all.

Maybe that’s the real crime. Imus’ ignorance has taken attention away from Candace Parker’s and Summitt’s incredible accomplishment. Or maybe it was Sharpton’s, Stringer’s and Jackson’s grandstanding that moved the spotlight from Tennessee to New Jersey?

None of this over-the-top grandstanding does Black America any good.


We can’t win the war over verbal disrespect and racism when we have so obviously and blatantly surrendered the moral high ground on the issue. Jesse and Al might win the battle with Imus and get him fired or severely neutered. But the war? We don’t stand a chance in the war. Not when everybody knows “nappy-headed ho’s” is a compliment compared to what we allow black rap artists to say about black women on a daily basis.

We look foolish and cruel for kicking a man who went on Sharpton’s radio show and apologized. Imus didn’t pull a Michael Richards and schedule an interview on Letterman. Imus went to the Black vice president’s house, acknowledged his mistake and asked for forgiveness.

Let it go and let God.

We have more important issues to deal with than Imus. If we are unwilling to clean up the filth and disrespect we heap on each other, nothing will change with our condition. You can fire every Don Imus in the country, and our incarceration rate, fatherless-child rate, illiteracy rate and murder rate will still continue to skyrocket.

A man who doesn’t respect himself wastes his breath demanding that others respect him.

We don’t respect ourselves right now. If we did, we wouldn’t call each other the N-word. If we did, we wouldn’t let people with prison values define who we are in music and videos. If we did, we wouldn’t call black women *****es and hos and abandon them when they have our babies.

If we had the proper level of self-respect, we wouldn’t act like it’s only a crime when a white man disrespects us. We hold Imus to a higher standard than we hold ourselves. That’s a (freaking) shame.

We need leadership that is interested in fixing the culture we’ve adopted. We need leadership that makes all of us take tremendous pride in educating ourselves. We need leadership that can reach professional athletes and entertainers and get them to understand that they’re ambassadors and play an important role in defining who we are and what values our culture will embrace.

It’s time for Jesse and Al to step down. They’ve had 25 years to lead us. Other than their accountants, I’d be hard pressed to find someone who has benefited from their administration.

RedsBaron
04-11-2007, 10:17 PM
It will be interesting to see who visits whatever show Imus has after this controversy runs its course. His time on TV may be ending, but I can recall various media personalities, including most of NBC's main news talent, being regular guests on his morning show, as well as numerous politicians from both parties, including John McCain and John Kerry. I somehow doubt those people will be frequenting whatever show Imus winds up having in the future.

WMR
04-11-2007, 10:18 PM
I think the NBC firing is just the first shoe. I predict he'll be fired by CBS as well.

Chip R
04-11-2007, 10:24 PM
I think the NBC firing is just the first shoe. I predict he'll be fired by CBS as well.


He could be like Olbermann and get fired by all 3 networks and Fox. ;)

WMR
04-11-2007, 10:25 PM
Whitlock really really gets it. I've thought some of his stuff really lame in the past but that is a just magnificent piece of writing right there. I hope a lot of people read that and think about what he is saying and take it to heart.

Matt700wlw
04-11-2007, 10:43 PM
For the first, and possibly the last time ever, Jason Whitlock is dead on.

Reds Fanatic
04-11-2007, 10:51 PM
I rarely ever agree with Whitlock but that article is dead on the money. MSNBC set a horrible precedent in letting Imus go. It was a bad offensive joke but that was all it was. The firing will just embolden people like Sharpton to find something else they don't like and then go after the next target. The hipocracy of people like Sharpton and Jackson who have said their own racist things in the past and gotten away with it to then turn around and demand someone else is fired is sickening.

Mutaman
04-12-2007, 12:10 AM
Do you think the day will ever come when we can discuss racial issues without dragging Sharpton and Jackson into the discussion?

Dom Heffner
04-12-2007, 01:18 AM
MSNBC set a horrible precedent in letting Imus go.

Yeah, sure would hate to see anybody lose their job over some silly racist jokes. The nerve of some people. I'm with you, Reds Fanatic. I think they should let Imus continue to make comparisons of black people and animals. It's pretty funny, isn't it? As long as you're joking, you can say anything you want.

The Rutgers girls look like they should be playing for the Memphis Grizzlies (knee slap).

Venus and Serena should be in National Geographic instead of Playboy (Har dee har har!)

What a hoot!

If I were MSNBC, I'd hire three more like Imus. How fun it is not harming anything with offensive jokes.


The hipocracy of people like Sharpton and Jackson who have said their own racist things in the past and gotten away with it to then turn around and demand someone else is fired is sickening.

Their hypocrisy is sickening, but the idea isn't to let Imus continue because they're idiots, too.

Mutaman
04-12-2007, 01:31 AM
I'm upset with MSNBC's decision. I really wanted to watch Don spend a few more days groveling and trying to save his job. I mean the guy's been spewing his racist nonsence for more than 30 years, i don't think making him spend a week or so humiliating himself is too much to ask.

WMR
04-12-2007, 01:35 AM
Howard Stern has talked about how Imus called Robin the N-word (confirmed by Robin and others) several times back when they were at WNBC. He also called several other of the black workers at WNBC, including one of his producers, the same word.

dsmith421
04-12-2007, 01:50 AM
For the first, and possibly the last time ever, Jason Whitlock is dead on.

Since leaving ESPN, Whitlock has been right a lot more than he's been wrong. His broadsides at Scoop Jackson and other sportswriters that marginalized the problems during All-Star Weekend in Vegas were a much-needed breath of fresh air.

dsmith421
04-12-2007, 02:04 AM
In my way of thinking, all that "sticks and stones" stuff is great until it's personal. Imus' comment wasn't a term used in a movie or TV show or rap video. It was personal. He called 12 hard-working college students that he knew nothing about other than how they looked on TV "nappy headed hos." That's what makes it different.

Well said. If CE or I went into court and decided to pepper our remarks with a few "hilarious" racist/misogynist bon mots, chances are we'd lose our livelihood in a hurry. To hell with Imus. You reap what you sow.

GAC
04-12-2007, 09:14 AM
Do you think the day will ever come when we can discuss racial issues without dragging Sharpton and Jackson into the discussion?

Not as long as they continue to want to be the focal point of the discussion. Whose leading the charge? They feed off of this stuff because it helps to show their own relevance. ;)

http://www.coxandforkum.com/archives/07.04.10.OffColor-X.gif

durl
04-12-2007, 10:29 AM
Awesome cartoon. There's more reality to that picture than people realize. Jackson and Sharpton have become the high priests of their race, handing out judgements and forgiveness at their whim. They have a title in front of their names but blatantly don't live up to it. It's a shame.

By the way, does anyone know where to find lyrics to popular rap songs that have been "interpreted" (for lack of a better word) for those of us who don't know all the lingo? I'd be curious to read what's said about black women in those songs. I hear it's no different than what Imus said so I wonder if Jackson/Sharpton/Obama will call for it to be removed from the airwaves as well. Don't get me wrong. I'm not defending Imus' words. I simply believe that if these words are truly wrong, then it should apply to everyone.

Also, I loved Whitlock's article. Too bad it will be ignored by most media outlets and few people will read it.

paintmered
04-12-2007, 11:09 AM
This thread has run its course on RZ and now needs to be taken to the peanut gallery before it turns even more political.