PDA

View Full Version : Trade Suggestion



HokieRed
04-25-2007, 09:34 AM
I know Ross got two hits last night and looked a bit better at the plate. I hope he keeps it up. Still, the Reds have to get some offense from the catching spot, and both the second half of last year and this year's start have us all wondering whether Ross can really produce at an acceptable level. I also think the Reds have very little to trade on the 25 man roster. Lohse is possibly the most interesting talent we could afford to trade without hurting the ballclub too much. Moving Belisle to the #3 spot and adding either Dumatrait or Livingston until Homer can join the team later in the summer will hurt the rotation but the acquisition of a top catcher would offset that. Who needs a starter badly, has a great prospect catcher, and also has a very fine major league catcher blocking the prospect? Atlanta. So I'm suggesting Lohse for Jarrod Saltalamacchia, current line at Mississippi, AA, .471/.776/1.246 and one of the top prospects in baseball. Why does Atlanta do this? Because with a solid third starter, they become a near lock for a playoff spot. Why we would do it seems clear. What's anybody think?

edabbs44
04-25-2007, 09:41 AM
I think you should have your cereal with milk, not Jack Daniels. ;)

NYDCYankee
04-25-2007, 09:51 AM
Reds won't trade Salty for a guy like Lohse. Salty is a guy you trade to FLA for Dontrelle.

Also Lohse isn't a solid third starter type.

Jpup
04-25-2007, 09:53 AM
Reds won't trade Salty for a guy like Lohse. Salty is a guy you trade to FLA for Dontrelle.

Also Lohse isn't a solid third starter type.

You are overestimating what the Braves will do for pitching in the post-Mazzone era. Salt doesn't have the trade value as you believe IMO. He has no place to play and has to be traded eventually with Brian McCann locked up for the future already. I think Lohse could easily get him and I'm not sure Belisle wouldn't get it done.

NYDCYankee
04-25-2007, 10:03 AM
You are overestimating what the Braves will do for pitching in the post-Mazzone era. Salt doesn't have the trade value as you believe IMO. He has no place to play and has to be traded eventually with Brian McCann locked up for the future already. I think Lohse could easily get him and I'm not sure Belisle wouldn't get it done.

I think we just may disagree on this. There really are not very many good catching prospects in the game. So he would be very much in demand if he were on the trade market. Not only that but if Atlanta package him with another player/players they could bring back a high ticket pitcher that may become available. You don't trade players like Salty for guys like Lohse you save up as many of them as you can to trade for a Willis or an Oswalt or a C Zambrano should they hit the market.

Also, I have heard the Braves have been working him out at other positions, so he isn't necessarily blocked.

hebroncougar
04-25-2007, 11:10 AM
Wow........some trades people come up with just befuddle me. Why in God's name would the Braves trade their best prospect for a guy that will be a free agent in 6 months, and has a 55-62 record, 4.8 career ERA, and a career whip of over 1.4?

Kc61
04-25-2007, 11:28 AM
After years and years and years the Reds finally seem to have 3 good starting pitchers. And now we are going to trade one of them?

Belisle as number 3? Let's see Belisle make it through Memorial Day as a starter before we move him up a spot.

The issue with Lohse is whether to sign him as the season wears on. But trade him now?

AmarilloRed
04-25-2007, 11:42 AM
I think we have 4. I believe Lohse and Belisle are both starters who will have breakout years.

membengal
04-25-2007, 12:38 PM
Just a thought, instead of immediately criticizing the suggestion, offer one in its place. As I read this thread, good Mr. Hokiered is wondering what it would take to get to Salty, the uber-C prospect in the Braves' organization. Considering that Salty is uber-blocked by Brian McCann, it's a worthwhile question.

I don't think his Lohse suggestion is all that far-fetched, frankly. It presupposes a number of things, but they are doable. It pre-supposes that Lohse continues to pitch lights out. Given he is in a contract year, not an insane thought. It pre-supposes the Braves stay in the NL East chase. They can do that. It pre-supposes that Lohse might be a commodity at the deadline for the right team. Also a possibility. If all that comes together, I would certainly hope WK would ask for Salty, since he ain't going anywhere in the Atlanta system anytime soon.

As near as I can tell, Salty is exactly the kind of player WK should be targeting this summer.

Nice thought, Hokiered...

Highlifeman21
04-25-2007, 01:35 PM
I know Ross got two hits last night and looked a bit better at the plate. I hope he keeps it up. Still, the Reds have to get some offense from the catching spot, and both the second half of last year and this year's start have us all wondering whether Ross can really produce at an acceptable level. I also think the Reds have very little to trade on the 25 man roster. Lohse is possibly the most interesting talent we could afford to trade without hurting the ballclub too much. Moving Belisle to the #3 spot and adding either Dumatrait or Livingston until Homer can join the team later in the summer will hurt the rotation but the acquisition of a top catcher would offset that. Who needs a starter badly, has a great prospect catcher, and also has a very fine major league catcher blocking the prospect? Atlanta. So I'm suggesting Lohse for Jarrod Saltalamacchia, current line at Mississippi, AA, .471/.776/1.246 and one of the top prospects in baseball. Why does Atlanta do this? Because with a solid third starter, they become a near lock for a playoff spot. Why we would do it seems clear. What's anybody think?

I would start off with Wood and Cueto and see where we're at for a deal.

I have a feeling it might take more than those two, but to address such a glaring weakness @ C is key for this team moving forward.

Shaggy Sanchez
04-25-2007, 01:58 PM
I would think that the Braves would want to start thei conversation with someone like Bruce or Homer. It doesn't matter that he is blocked by McCann, he is one of their top prospects and happens to be a catcher. Most teams don't give up either of those things for just anybody. I don't think Krivsky would trade Bruce for Lohse just because he is blocked by Dunn, Hamilton, Freel, and Griffey (ok well he might but you get where I am going here) so why would someone else trade a top prospect for Loshe. The Braves have a great problem to have right now 2 yong catchers that are both good and both cheap, I don't see them moving either without getting a large return.

membengal
04-25-2007, 02:18 PM
I understand they would want a large return, shaggy, the discussion herein is over what would constitute same. His being blocked does have SOME relevance, I suspect, because it makes him potentially available (McCann is very young, Griffey is not, I don't consider Bruce "blocked" like Salty is). That he might be available actually lowers what it might take to get him just a piece. If the Braves are obstinate and demand too much, and years pass without a deal, the bloom will come off his prospect rose, as it were. It will be a balancing act for that organization in moving him while he is at highest value. If it were clear sailing from where he is to Atlanta, it might take a mint to get at him. Since he doesn't have any place there, it might make it a bit less so. The question, in theory, is how much less so it might make it.

I think there will be a package that can be put together that will get Salty from them, and it won't need to include Bailey or Bruce. To that end, I think Highlifeman is headed in the right direction. The two he mentioned, and toss in Lohse (assuming Lohse pitches lights out this early summer) at the deadline? Might be enough. Certainly worth WK pursuing...

bucksfan2
04-25-2007, 02:45 PM
No one knows what one organizatoin will trade for a player. Who would have thougth that the mets would have parted with Kasmier for an average/less than average starter. I think Lohse tends to get undervalued on this board. Sure he has his short comings but so far this year he has looked very good. If he keeps pitching good he will demand more in a free agent market. Pitching at the deadline does demand quite a bit. I for one would like to see Krivsky try to resign him and if not then trade him.

As for the Braves Salt is blocked by McCann at the major league level who has shown he can produce. Salt is still an unknown even thought he is playing well in AA. Who knows what the Braves are willing to give up to get pitching. Maybe they think if they get to the playoffs they can generate the extra revenue to bring Jones back for next season. There is no knowing another GM's motivation for doing something.

HokieRed
04-25-2007, 02:45 PM
Glad to have started some interesting conversation. Obviously Lohse for Saltalamacchia is not equal value, but that's the idea of trades--to get more than you give because the other team is in a position where they need something you have more than you need it. Take a look at the stats of the Braves starters--Smoltz, Hudson, and then it's a pretty good drop to Chuck James. A solid third pitcher--and I agree it's not yet clear whether Lohse is really going to be that this year--could very well mean the difference between the playoffs and staying home for Atlanta. And there's a lot of money to be made just by making the playoffs, money that translates into a better rotation next year, a replacement for Andruw, maybe something else badly needed.

Dracodave
04-25-2007, 05:38 PM
I would think that the Braves would want to start thei conversation with someone like Bruce or Homer. It doesn't matter that he is blocked by McCann, he is one of their top prospects and happens to be a catcher. Most teams don't give up either of those things for just anybody. I don't think Krivsky would trade Bruce for Lohse just because he is blocked by Dunn, Hamilton, Freel, and Griffey (ok well he might but you get where I am going here) so why would someone else trade a top prospect for Loshe. The Braves have a great problem to have right now 2 yong catchers that are both good and both cheap, I don't see them moving either without getting a large return.

Salty isn't exactly blocked, and he's a C to Mid-B level prospect at this point, Right now, he's no more than a back-up mlb catcher with future number one.

Why woud the Braves trade Salty? Easy enough. With McCann signed long termed they don't need the tomorrow, they have it now. McCann can slightly decline and still be a bargain. You can find a suitable back up for McCann in Pena.

Salty is right now, unless his move to first translates big, an excess for Atlanta to get anything they need.

Further more if Loshe isn't all it takes, I'd gladly give them a reliever and one of our crappy outfielders for Salty and whatever else they decided to toss in.

The problem isn't the Reds making the trade or Atlanta making it, it's finding that middle ground where both teams feel sastifised but one comes out ahead. Clearly for the Reds, we'd come out ahead even giving up more than Loshe. His money gone, and a younger fixature at catcher...means Ross' money will be gone as well. For a small market team, that's a few million to go to other holes till Salty asks for a payday.

Patrick Bateman
04-25-2007, 06:12 PM
I have been thinking about a Saltamallacca trade since he is a logical trade candidtae for the Braves and would fit our needs perfectly.

One problem is that they don't have to trade him since they think he can play 1st base at the major league level.

If they aren't sold on Salty being a great 1st basemen/great hitter, then I may consider trading Votto for him (they are very similar in most ranking systems) and may work for both teams. It would be a good move for the Reds because it's always better to have a good catcher than a good 1st basemen. If Atlanta feels they are getting the better hitter (at least the more likely to be a major lrague hitter) then they may consider Votto an upgrade for him.

I admit, the Reds would probably have to sweeten the pot. I would be willing to go as high as Votto and Wood and maybe lesser players for him. I think in the long run, a trade where we get a potential long term catcher would be worth the price of trading two of the system's better prospects. It shouldn't be hard to find 1st basemen, and with the way the OF is setting up down the road, 1st base still may very well be Dunn's long term position.

jojo
04-25-2007, 07:53 PM
You are overestimating what the Braves will do for pitching in the post-Mazzone era. Salt doesn't have the trade value as you believe IMO. He has no place to play and has to be traded eventually with Brian McCann locked up for the future already. I think Lohse could easily get him and I'm not sure Belisle wouldn't get it done.

The thing about catchers who can hit is that they can also play firstbase....a position that isn't exactly a strength for the Braves...

Concerning one of the top prospects in baseball, Lohse or Belisle is not enought to get it done....not even if offered together...