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RedsMan3203
05-08-2007, 02:39 PM
I think not, but if Wayne K keeps sitting on his hands we'll all be singing this by Mid July...

The Reds are on fire
The Reds are on fire
The Reds are on fire
We don't need no water let the mother :evil: burn
Burn mother :evil: burn


Hopefully this isn't the way we sound.... :laugh:

Sea Ray
05-08-2007, 07:12 PM
I'd like to see them compete but a fire sale in July might not be such a bad thing. Jettison some of these veterans and try to obtain another Harang or two, then reload for next year. It might be fun to see eager, enthusiastic "kids" playing in Aug/Sept.

BucksandReds
05-08-2007, 07:44 PM
Dunn and/or Griffey must go if we fall apart. I just don't see both of these guys in our future. I am really interested into just how much Dunn thinks he's worth. i'd lock him up now at a reasonable rate ($12 million) otherwise trade him and play Freel, Hamilton and Griffey next year in the outfield and get Bruce to be ready by 09. freel is so important right now because of the flexibility he gives us. He can play many positions, he is relatively cheap and he's a very average MLB player (average means better than awful and that's what we are at some spots.) With the Deno trade we either, can't trade an outfielder or we can't trade EE. Conine I guess helps a little but how much longer will he play?

Yachtzee
05-08-2007, 08:34 PM
My magic 8-ball says:

"Outlook hazy. Please try again."

Joseph
05-08-2007, 08:44 PM
How we lookin'?

Not good.

Sea Ray
05-09-2007, 12:52 AM
IMO all future moves should concentrate on the bullpen. With everything that ails this team, the bullpen is by far and away the major reason this team is falling short.

AmarilloRed
05-09-2007, 02:35 AM
I would keep the rest of the team together(except for Milton), and restructure our bullpen. Let the young relievers get experience now, and lets see what they can do.I would release all the old relievers(except maybe Weathers )and have major activity in the off-season to try and fix the bullpen.

Eric_Davis
05-09-2007, 05:14 AM
I have to disagree. I believe Wayne has done anything but sit on his hands.

In 2006, there was a new G.M. and a new owner. "The Trade" was supposed to net us two quality relievers that we could count on and get things back to normal, where Bray or Majewski would have been a closer". Krivsky got screwed by Bowden. Then, Krivsky took a chance on an ineffective and injury-plagued Guardado for practically nothing. Guardado plugged the hole.....for 15 games...before being shutdown Aug 20th, and eventually having Tommy John surgery. So, they were left with Weathers, Coffey, Mercker, and Belisle for the 2nd year in a row with likewise results.....horrible.

In 2007, nobody's healthy (Majewski, Bray, Burton), so that leaves us with Weathers and Coffey again. Mercker and Belisle are replaced by Stanton and Santos. So, that's why Krivsky is trying hard to find replacements until he finds a couple of guys that will pitch well. He found one in Saarloos, but he's not a closer or setup man. He hoped to find a couple out of Stanton, Santos, Coutlangus, Mcbeth, and it may turn out that Salmon from the REDS' organization or Tyler Pelland who was just converted to reliever after 28 starts and a 3.99 ERA at Chattanooga last year. FWIW, Pelland struck out 6 in two innings of relief on Monday.

What I see is that Krivsky has been addressing this problem for a year now, and it has been extremely difficult. I can see he's determined to have a good bullpen.

I do think it will be fixed, and fixed before June comes to an end.

Screwball
05-09-2007, 06:13 AM
I seem to remember a post from last summer letting us all know that the Reds were doomed to finish below .500 because of their Pythagorean W-L record, i.e., they had given up more runs than they'd scored, and it was only a matter of time until the mirage that was a winning record would vanish.

Well, as it stands right now, the Reds have a Pythagorean W-L of 17-16, ~.524 win pct. As hard as it is to fathom, the Reds really should be doing much better right now record-wise. It seems like most have given up on the season already (I can't really say I blame them, with Milwaukee 9 up on us), but the Brewers are on an unbelievable hot streak. Let's all take a step back from the skyscraper rooftops and see how things play out a little more before saying the eulogy to the 2007 Reds season.

sonny
05-09-2007, 06:26 AM
We just need to catch a little fire and were right back into this thing. Baseball is a game of streaks, we're just in a funk right now.

redsfanmia
05-09-2007, 07:21 AM
I have a bet with a friend that the Reds will lose 90+ games, I think I am looking like a winner about now.

Sea Ray
05-09-2007, 11:21 AM
I do think it will be fixed, and fixed before June comes to an end.

Where does this optimism come from? Krivsky has shown no eye for bullpen talent. Sure, some of his acquisitions have gotten hurt but to be fair most of us weren't impressed with them at the time of the trade. Guardado had a shoulder issue. Majeski's shoulder issue should have been seen by WK. He didn't do proper checking prior to the trade.

Redsland
05-09-2007, 12:33 PM
I keep hearing about how Krivsky won the trade, thanks to the future greatness of Maj, Bray, and Thompson. So obviously the outlook is very, very good. Very.

pedro
05-09-2007, 12:41 PM
I keep hearing about how Krivsky won the trade, thanks to the future greatness of Maj, Bray, and Thompson. So obviously the outlook is very, very good. Very.

I keep hearing how Felipe Lopez is an all-star shortstop. What'dya gonna do? :)

I still think this team wins 84 games. No bullpen is as bad as this one has been so far and the division is really weak this year, recent skull-crushings by the Astro's notwithstanding.

Redsland
05-09-2007, 12:54 PM
No bullpen is as bad as this one has been so far…
Really? Because I remember one from about a year ago that was. ;)

…and the division is really weak this year, recent skull-crushings by the Astro's notwithstanding.
And the small matter of the Brewers' nine-game lead.

:help:

Falls City Beer
05-09-2007, 12:57 PM
I keep hearing how Felipe Lopez is an all-star shortstop. What'dya gonna do? :)

I still think this team wins 84 games. No bullpen is as bad as this one has been so far and the division is really weak this year, recent skull-crushings by the Astro's notwithstanding.

No way. NO WAY this team wins 84 games. Totally impossible at this point. There simply IS NO talent within the system to shore up the weaknesses this team has.

pedro
05-09-2007, 12:58 PM
Really? Because I remember one from about a year ago that was. ;)

And the small matter of the Brewers' nine-game lead.

:help:

I haven't looked at the stats to compare but it *seems* like this years BP is doing even worse, perhaps it's just expectations. Although I guess Hammond and White had washed out by about this time last year.

Ironically, the Astros are getting ready to activate Rick White.

The Brewers are good but I think they'll fall back some though. Their defense is atrocious.

Ltlabner
05-09-2007, 12:59 PM
When did the Brew Crew become this unstopable juggernaut?

When did it become a given that the team leading the division at the end of 1 month + was the defacto winner?

Don't get me wrong, this is a mediocre team with some serrious problems. I'm not suggesting that all is well and we should just be happy. But nothing is written in stone at this point either.

I know for darn sure that if Wayne makes a move that folks here don't like, they will beat him over the head for years to come for "panicking".

But I am shocked by the level of hystaria when the board spent months deciding that it was a medocre team with little chance of being better than 5th place. Well, here we are. Shouldn't be this much of a suprise.

Falls City Beer
05-09-2007, 01:01 PM
When did the Brew Crew become this unstopable juggernaut?

When did it become a given that the team leading the division at the end of 1 month + was the defacto winner?

Don't get me wrong, this is a mediocre team with some serrious problems. I'm not suggesting that all is well and we should just be happy. But nothing is written in stone at this point either.

I know for darn sure that if Wayne makes a move that folks here don't like, they will beat him over the head for years to come for "panicking".

But I am shocked by the level of hystaria when the board spent months deciding that it was a medocre team with little chance of being better than 5th place. Well, here we are. Shouldn't be this much of a suprise.

Hysteria?

Perhaps "smug arrogance of certainty" on my part...but what else is new? :devil:

(You love to hate me, but you hate to admit how often I'm right).

pedro
05-09-2007, 01:03 PM
No way. NO WAY this team wins 84 games. Totally impossible at this point. There simply IS NO talent within the system to shore up the weaknesses this team has.

Unlikely? perhaps. Impossible? Absolutely not. We'll see. I agree there aren't any "saviors" on the horizon but the I still think the BP is better than it's been and it does look at this point that the offense is doing the job even w/out Ross & EE making significant contributions.

Ltlabner
05-09-2007, 01:06 PM
Hysteria?

Perhaps "smug arrogance of certainty" on my part...but what else is new? :devil:

(You love to hate me, but you hate to admit how often I'm right).

Actually my post had nothing to do with you. We all know your position. Keep saying it sucks. When it does suck tell the world that you knew it all along. Frankly, with the track record the Reds have had in this century, I'm not real sure why you are so proud of being able to "fortell" that the Reds will struggle. Sorta like saying, "taxes will go up" or "we will all die someday".

But for all your doom and gloom, I admire that you are consistant and not swayed by a few good games, or few bad ones. You are not one to jump on the bandwagon at the last minute that's for sure.

But my post was more aimed at those saying, "Do something Wayne, anything, oh my god, it's over, we're all gonna die". Well, maybe not that last part. :)

pedro
05-09-2007, 01:10 PM
btw- the Reds expected record for their runs for/runs against would be 17-16 (.519) which comes to (drum roll please...)

84 wins.

Falls City Beer
05-09-2007, 01:29 PM
Actually my post had nothing to do with you. We all know your position. Keep saying it sucks. When it does suck tell the world that you knew it all along. Frankly, with the track record the Reds have had in this century, I'm not real sure why you are so proud of being able to "fortell" that the Reds will struggle. Sorta like saying, "taxes will go up" or "we will all die someday".

But for all your doom and gloom, I admire that you are consistant and not swayed by a few good games, or few bad ones. You are not one to jump on the bandwagon at the last minute that's for sure.

But my post was more aimed at those saying, "Do something Wayne, anything, oh my god, it's over, we're all gonna die". Well, maybe not that last part. :)


Really?

I spend offseason after offseason listening to people try to blow sunshine up each other's arses about how good the team will be, how Wayne has turned the ship around, how much better the defense will be....blah, blah, blah.

I may not be Kreskin, but I know a winner when I see one. And, for better or worse (depending on how much you like having sunshine blown up your arse), I know a loser.

I've also said that I'll be the first one in line to praise a move I like; I live up to that point too, despite characterizations to the contrary.

Ltlabner
05-09-2007, 05:32 PM
I've also said that I'll be the first one in line to praise a move I like; I live up to that point too, despite characterizations to the contrary.

Never said you didn't. Kirk Sarrloos comes to mind as one you've praised reciently.

But my original post was aimed more the people who are cyber-running-around-with-their-hands-waiving-in-the-air. Your position about the team has been clear for some time now. No doubt about that.

If anything, they are jumping on the bandwagon you've been driving for quite a while now. You should be as irritated with them as I am. :laugh:

nate
05-09-2007, 06:22 PM
Really?

I spend offseason after offseason listening to people try to blow sunshine up each other's arses about how good the team will be, how Wayne has turned the ship around, how much better the defense will be....blah, blah, blah.

I may not be Kreskin, but I know a winner when I see one. And, for better or worse (depending on how much you like having sunshine blown up your arse), I know a loser.

I've also said that I'll be the first one in line to praise a move I like; I live up to that point too, despite characterizations to the contrary.

Personally, I haven't seen many "solar enemas" given around here.

Falls City Beer
05-09-2007, 06:34 PM
Personally, I haven't seen many "solar enemas" given around here.

I have no way of knowing when you joined Redszone, but I've heard it all from the optimists' collective over the last 7 seasons. Every offseason.

Screwball
05-09-2007, 06:59 PM
I have no way of knowing when you joined Redszone


He joined in Sept of '05. The join date that's listed tipped me off.

Falls City Beer
05-09-2007, 07:02 PM
He joined in Sept of '05. The join date that's listed tipped me off.

There ya go. For some reason, I thought the "join date" had been eliminated on the last update.

Never hurts to look, though, eh?

nate
05-09-2007, 07:18 PM
I have no way of knowing when you joined Redszone, but I've heard it all from the optimists' collective over the last 7 seasons. Every offseason.

I've been reading RZ for about that same period of time. Didn't join until a couple of years ago.

Everyone's take is different but, to me at least, there are more threads about the team sucking/will suck/has sucked/isn't even good enough to suck than ones of optimism. Admittedly, I could've missed the "HIP HIP HOORAY WE SIGNED MIKE STANTON", "Joe Mays/Ryan Franklin/Royce Clayton...BE STILL MY HEART!" and "Where can I get an Eric Milton jersey?" posts but there are still a lot of negative posts.

And yeah, its not a great team right now but its good enough to be allowed to play all 162 games. So lets see what they're gonna do and chew the fat on what they could do to make the team better rather than revisit topics gloomier than a Cure concert.

PuffyPig
05-09-2007, 07:28 PM
I may not be Kreskin, but I know a winner when I see one.

Like the Cards?