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Wheelhouse
05-12-2007, 08:06 AM
I would love to see Frank Robinson here.

dougflynn23
05-12-2007, 08:14 AM
:eek: That's not an upgrade. He is a terrible manager who after the performance he put forward with the Olympic qualifying team (that didn't) in 2004 should never manage again. He bickers with both players and the front office. True story...MLB tried to get an MLB team to hire him this winter as an advisor or consultant, and not one team would touch him.

If I had a clean slate, I'd love to see Davey Lopes here. He was burdened with a bad team, but I liked him as a manager.

rotnoid
05-12-2007, 08:14 AM
From that list, I'll take Davey. Frank Robinson would be my second choice, but I'm worried that he's getting too old and too cranky.

Wheelhouse
05-12-2007, 08:21 AM
:eek: That's not an upgrade. He is a terrible manager who after the performance he put forward with the Olympic qualifying team (that didn't) in 2004 should never manage again. He bickers with both players and the front office. True story...MLB tried to get an MLB team to hire him this winter as an advisor or consultant, and not one team would touch him.

If I had a clean slate, I'd love to see Davey Lopes here. He was burdened with a bad team, but I liked him as a manager.

Robinson turned some lousy teams around in Baltimore and Montreal--the main thing is getting a guy who can cut through the clubhouse fat that the Reds have.

Always Red
05-12-2007, 08:48 AM
I think there's a reason why Davey Johnson hasn't managed in a long time. I don't know that reason, but I'm sure there is one.

When and if the time comes to fire Jerry Narron (and it will, when WK's job is in jeopardy, and he needs to make some changes or lose his own job), it will be someone from Krivsky's past, during his work with the Twins. Probably some obscure name, a former Twins bench coach whom Kriv worked well with in the past, and never got a shot to manage the Twinkies.

He'll bring in his own guy this time. Even though he claims to work well with Jerry, Jerry is not his guy. At any rate, I don't think it'll be a hire designed to please the fan base.

hebroncougar
05-12-2007, 08:49 AM
Robinson will kill Harang, Arroyo, and Bailey if he makes it up. I'll take McKeon.

Rotater Cuff
05-12-2007, 08:54 AM
I would love to see Frank Robinson here.

Between Robinson, Mckeon and maybe Johnson (He's the baby, only 64), the equipment guys would need to add walkers, oxygen tanks and prostate stimulators for the bench. Probably an elevator to walk the steps into the clubhouse.
Girardi is the man. Besides, the Yankees are giving him the cold shoulder, as their replacement for Torre has already been annointed.

Wheelhouse
05-12-2007, 08:57 AM
I think there's a reason why Davey Johnson hasn't managed in a long time. I don't know that reason, but I'm sure there is one.

When and if the time comes to fire Jerry Narron (and it will, when WK's job is in jeopardy, and he needs to make some changes or lose his own job), it will be someone from Krivsky's past, during his work with the Twins. Probably some obscure name, a former Twins bench coach whom Kriv worked well with in the past, and never got a shot to manage the Twinkies.

He'll bring in his own guy this time. Even though he claims to work well with Jerry, Jerry is not his guy. At any rate, I don't think it'll be a hire designed to please the fan base.

I don't argue with that--but that is EXACTLY the wrong approach for Krivsky. The main issue for the Reds is that they need a manager who runs the ballclub. Right now the clubhouse runs the ballclub. Some no-name Twins coach will get eaten alive by the kids-in-detention mentality of Griffey, Dunn, Freel, et al.

Always Red
05-12-2007, 09:15 AM
I don't argue with that--but that is EXACTLY the wrong approach for Krivsky. The main issue for the Reds is that they need a manager who runs the ballclub. Right now the clubhouse runs the ballclub. Some no-name Twins coach will get eaten alive by the kids-in-detention mentality of Griffey, Dunn, Freel, et al.

Personally, I'd like to see Robinson. I know he's a dinosaur, and I know it wouldn't be for long, but I'd love to see him in a Reds uniform again. But that's not the only reason- this team could use a little 'tude. It'd be good for them to develop a little more mental toughness.

But I think Kriv will do what I have outlined above.

And I think Narron will be here through ASB 2008, at least. I don't think he's going anywhere soon. I scratch my head sometimes trying to figure out some of his moves, but no one could win with the way this bullpen is pitching right now. I think Narron's an average manager.

Jefferson24
05-12-2007, 09:50 AM
So how many of his staff go with him when he's fired? Pitching coach and hitting coach both gone too? Do you think they'll clean house?

GSURedsfan
05-12-2007, 10:24 AM
So how many of his staff go with him when he's fired? Pitching coach and hitting coach both gone too? Do you think they'll clean house?

If they fire him soon, I think Pole and Jacoby will stick around.

Brent

George Anderson
05-12-2007, 11:33 AM
Girardi is the man. Besides, the Yankees are giving him the cold shoulder, as their replacement for Torre has already been annointed.

and the replacement is????

Highlifeman21
05-12-2007, 12:13 PM
Bobby Valentine.

UC_Ken
05-12-2007, 12:52 PM
I think there's a good chance that Girardi's Nazi approach to managing would not go over well with our two best players Griffey and Dunn. If your stars don't buy in you have no chance to succeed. I voted for Frank, he seems to have done a good job in some tough situations and he is certainly someone everybody would respect.

fourrunhomer
05-12-2007, 01:00 PM
mckeon is a proven winner. But I don't think Narron is going anywhere soon

reds44
05-12-2007, 01:12 PM
Girardi's an interesting name, but he had alot of issues with a very good GM in Larry Beinfest. He's a bit of a nazi too.

I just want some new bllod. Don't hire Bucky Dent or somebody. Miley was a AAA manager, and Narron was his bench coach. Go outside and bring somebody in.

nate
05-12-2007, 01:26 PM
This might be a potentially stupid question but, if he were available, would Barry Larkin be a good manager?

I would've liked Jim Leyland or Lou, myself. Out of that list, I choose Bobby Valentine, Davey Johnson or Trader Jack.

Wheelhouse
05-12-2007, 01:48 PM
Larkin is an interesting idea---

flyer85
05-12-2007, 01:55 PM
Bobby Valentine.must be looking for trouble around here. He has always been my pick as well. He is a top stragegist. I could care less if he is a bit of media hound.

After that I would take McKeon in an interim role.

RedsFanWC
05-12-2007, 01:59 PM
What do Lou Piniella, Davey Johnson and Jack McKeon have in common?

They are the only managers to have winning records with the Reds in the past 17 years and they are also the only managers who had a track record of winning before the Reds hired them.

George Anderson
05-12-2007, 02:01 PM
This might be a potentially stupid question but, if he were available, would Barry Larkin be a good manager?

I would've liked Jim Leyland or Lou, myself. Out of that list, I choose Bobby Valentine, Davey Johnson or Trader Jack.

I dont think John Allen and Barry together would work.

Marc D
05-12-2007, 02:02 PM
I think there's a good chance that Girardi's Nazi approach to managing would not go over well with our two best players Griffey and Dunn. If your stars don't buy in you have no chance to succeed. I voted for Frank, he seems to have done a good job in some tough situations and he is certainly someone everybody would respect.


Griffey has a year or two left, you don't make decisions around him. Dunn's long term status is up in the air as well. Other vets like Conine, Hatteberg, Weathers, Castro and Stanton need to relieve us of their presence anyway.

The future of this franchise is a bunch of very young players and from what I saw Girardi get out of a pretty blah Marlins team he would be my choice.

RBA
05-12-2007, 02:06 PM
What do Lou Piniella, Davey Johnson and Jack McKeon have in common?

They are the only managers to have winning records with the Reds in the past 17 years and they are also the only managers who had a track record of winning before the Reds hired them.

McKeon had a track record of winning? What did he win before the Reds?

nate
05-12-2007, 02:10 PM
McKeon had a track record of winning? What did he win before the Reds?

Keno...you've never heard of Jack "McKeno" MeKeon?

nate
05-12-2007, 02:11 PM
I dont think John Allen and Barry together would work.

Maybe, but they'd be in two totally unrelated jobs.

Just a thought...I dunno if Barry is interested and I know the Reds can't even ask him about it while he works Sponge Jim Leatherpants.

RBA
05-12-2007, 02:17 PM
McKeon had a track record of winning? What did he win before the Reds?


A .503 winning percentage before the Reds. I guess if you set your expectations low; that's good.

vic715
05-12-2007, 02:32 PM
I think there's a good chance that Girardi's Nazi approach to managing would not go over well with our two best players Griffey and Dunn. If your stars don't buy in you have no chance to succeed. I voted for Frank, he seems to have done a good job in some tough situations and he is certainly someone everybody would respect.

I tend to agree that Giradi and veteren players might not be a good fit.Davy Johnson or Bobby Valentine would be my first picks.

MartyFan
05-12-2007, 03:00 PM
A .503 winning percentage before the Reds. I guess if you set your expectations low; that's good.

I am not advocating McKeon but wasn't he put in many of the same situations that Frank Robinson has been...rebuild..improve and under performing team?

I'd say with that in mind a .503 winning percentage is a pretty good mark.

MartyFan
05-12-2007, 03:01 PM
I think Davey Johnson or Bobby Valentine would be good managers for this team.

savafan
05-12-2007, 05:04 PM
Wally Backman

jesusfan
05-12-2007, 05:31 PM
hands down... Joe Girardi...

peterose00
05-12-2007, 05:36 PM
I always liked Davey Johnson -- I always felt he was the right combination of player friendlyness and a stern take-no-BS kind of guy.

McKeon is a fossil -- and at some point fossils need to be placed in museums.

Frank Robinson has never had any success as a manager

Girardi is still a bit of an unknown given that no club in baseball has seen fit to give him a job.

The other don't do anything for me.

durl
05-12-2007, 06:03 PM
Where's the option for "I'm tired of the 'Fire Narron NOW!' talk."

RedsFanWC
05-12-2007, 08:10 PM
McKeon had a track record of winning? What did he win before the Reds?

He had a .512 winning percentage in 420 games with Kansas City and a .541 winning percentage in 357 games with San Diego (the job preceding the one with the Reds). 176 bad games with an Oakland team in the late 1970s that had just unloaded most of its talent (winning percentage of .403) is the only thing that brings his winning perecentage close to .500.

Compare that with Narron who had a .453 winning percentage in 296 games with Texas. One has a track record of winning and one doesnt.

Always Red
05-12-2007, 09:00 PM
Where's the option for "I'm tired of the 'Fire Narron NOW!' talk."

you could start one...

"Trader" Jack McKeon was a heck of a manager, a real character and a good GM, too.

The man knew baseball (I guess that means he was a "baseball guy", eh? ;) )

I don't have any idea, maybe others do here, if he was better as a manager or a GM?

But his time is past.

redsfan4445
05-13-2007, 01:20 AM
the more the Reds lose the more Narrons days are going from number of weeks, to days to hours!!

MartyFan
05-13-2007, 05:25 AM
Where's the option for "I'm tired of the 'Fire Narron NOW!' talk."

No manager will have the support of this board until that manager wins the world series...I honestly think this is overreacting by many people and that last season was a fluke...Special K started to make the moves to rebuild the team and sometimes to rebuild you need to take a step back to leap forward...I still believe that Narron is safe and I believe that Krivsky is safe as well.

Maybe I'm wrong but I get Mr. C to be a guy who is about building a winner over the longterm...the starting pitching is coming into place and the next to deal with is the RP...I think this season is still part of the unannounced rebuilding of the Cincinnati Reds...and that NEXT year is when we'll see the team that Special K and Mr. C are building on the field.

Not what we always want to hear but don't forget how bad of shape this organization has been in and for how long...it was run by a veteran SS who held the organization hostage based on his popularity with an owner and that GM and CEO's inability to keep talent coming into the organization.

I think the Brewers and the Twins are both great examples of what is happening here.

Screwball
05-13-2007, 05:44 AM
No manager will have the support of this board until that manager wins the world series...I honestly think this is overreacting by many people and that last season was a fluke...Special K started to make the moves to rebuild the team and sometimes to rebuild you need to take a step back to leap forward...I still believe that Narron is safe and I believe that Krivsky is safe as well.

Maybe I'm wrong but I get Mr. C to be a guy who is about building a winner over the longterm...the starting pitching is coming into place and the next to deal with is the RP...I think this season is still part of the unannounced rebuilding of the Cincinnati Reds...and that NEXT year is when we'll see the team that Special K and Mr. C are building on the field.

Not what we always want to hear but don't forget how bad of shape this organization has been in and for how long...it was run by a veteran SS who held the organization hostage based on his popularity with an owner and that GM and CEO's inability to keep talent coming into the organization.

I think the Brewers and the Twins are both great examples of what is happening here.

You mean to tell me Wayne Krivsky isn't an idiot? And neither is Narron??

In all seriousness, you make some very good points. Anytime your team's strength is starting pitching, you have a good foundation to work with. When Krivsky finds the right guys to plug into the bullpen (Burton, Coutlangus, Bray, McBeth, Salmon, Coffey?), coupled with some very talented position players (Griffey. Hamilton, Dunn, EE, Phillips, Votto, Bruce, Valaika?,) this team could actually look pretty good. But then again, I've been accused of needing to take off my rose-colored glasses before...

KoryMac5
05-13-2007, 11:53 AM
None of the above

Carin4Narron
05-13-2007, 12:28 PM
Tracy Jones after all he played the game and has all the answers.:)

Marc D
05-13-2007, 01:02 PM
No manager will have the support of this board until that manager wins the world series...I honestly think this is overreacting by many people and that last season was a fluke...Special K started to make the moves to rebuild the team and sometimes to rebuild you need to take a step back to leap forward...I still believe that Narron is safe and I believe that Krivsky is safe as well.

Maybe I'm wrong but I get Mr. C to be a guy who is about building a winner over the longterm...the starting pitching is coming into place and the next to deal with is the RP...I think this season is still part of the unannounced rebuilding of the Cincinnati Reds...and that NEXT year is when we'll see the team that Special K and Mr. C are building on the field.

Not what we always want to hear but don't forget how bad of shape this organization has been in and for how long...it was run by a veteran SS who held the organization hostage based on his popularity with an owner and that GM and CEO's inability to keep talent coming into the organization.

I think the Brewers and the Twins are both great examples of what is happening here.


WK has a chance to show us he has a plan coming up very soon.

If people like Stanton, Weathers, Lohse, Hatte, Conine, Santos and possibly JR and or Dunn(if no LTC) aren't released or traded for some kind of return then his vet fetish is real and will hinder the franchise as long as he's in charge.

If his placeholders are used to see if we could compete, then flipped for decent returns once it was clear we could not, I for one will be back in the corner of WK. Thats the type of slow but sure, hedged betting I can live with.

If he holds on to a lot of that drek (Jr and Dunn obviously not included in drek) it continues to indicate he thinks they are part of the answer. That will make it beyond clear to even the most optimistic that we once again have the wrong guy talking on the GM phone.

Based on what we have to go on right now, WK's complete body of work is questionable. I don't think its being overly pessamistic or over the top to say so.

mth123
05-13-2007, 01:19 PM
WK has a chance to show us he has a plan coming up very soon.

If people like Stanton, Weathers, Lohse, Hatte, Conine, Santos and possibly JR and or Dunn(if no LTC) aren't released or traded for some kind of return then his vet fetish is real and will hinder the franchise as long as he's in charge.

If his placeholders are used to see if we could compete, then flipped for decent returns once it was clear we could not, I for one will be back in the corner of WK. Thats the type of slow but sure, hedged betting I can live with.

If he holds on to a lot of that drek (Jr and Dunn obviously not included in drek) it continues to indicate he thinks they are part of the answer. That will make it beyond clear to even the most optimistic that we once again have the wrong guy talking on the GM phone.

Based on what we have to go on right now, WK's complete body of work is questionable. I don't think its being overly pessamistic or over the top to say so.

Good post. Especially the part about hedging bets and complete body of work. I share these opinions.

I didn't really expect to see much changing of the guard prior to Memorial Day, so I guess I should be happy that Cormier is already gone. I'm ready to see what Salmon, McBeth and Dumatrait can do. I think EdE needs to be up when his 10 day minimum is up and Votto is hitting now and I'm ready for him as well. I'm not real excited about Livingston and Bailey needs more time in AAA.

Not sure how to turn the roster over without eating a bunch of contracts. I think Stanton is an albatross into next year and Milton is on the DL in a last ditch effort to move him before eating his deal. Let the knee and arm rest into June, comeback and put up an outing or two and deal him as teams now start looking outside for help. I'm one of the few that said hold on him earlier, but if that fails its time to cut bait. Santos will probably have to go. Lohse can probably be dealt for a decent return. I'm still not convinced of Saarloos, but his K rate is much better than throughout his career so maybe I give him a longer look for now. Hatte and Conine should be shopped but they could actually fill bench roles in 2008. I'd prefer a younger player with more power over Conine as the RH counterpart to Votto though. Make Castro a coach or something. Maybe Castro is Narron's replacement.

RBA
05-18-2007, 11:49 PM
Ms. Milano

Chip R
05-18-2007, 11:50 PM
Sorry, but this ain't the same poll I posted. ;) Oh well, let's not have any fun at
RedsZone anymore. :(


Too bad for you.

pedro
05-18-2007, 11:53 PM
WK has a chance to show us he has a plan coming up very soon.

If people like Stanton, Weathers, Lohse, Hatte, Conine, Santos and possibly JR and or Dunn(if no LTC) aren't released or traded for some kind of return then his vet fetish is real and will hinder the franchise as long as he's in charge.

If his placeholders are used to see if we could compete, then flipped for decent returns once it was clear we could not, I for one will be back in the corner of WK. Thats the type of slow but sure, hedged betting I can live with.

If he holds on to a lot of that drek (Jr and Dunn obviously not included in drek) it continues to indicate he thinks they are part of the answer. That will make it beyond clear to even the most optimistic that we once again have the wrong guy talking on the GM phone.

Based on what we have to go on right now, WK's complete body of work is questionable. I don't think its being overly pessamistic or over the top to say so.

I think that's pretty fair.

donnelly_31
05-19-2007, 12:02 AM
Tony Perez!!!!!!!!!

redsfan1966
05-19-2007, 12:06 AM
I think Bucky Dent gets the gig when Narron is canned...

RBA
05-19-2007, 12:12 AM
Senior

Aronchis
05-19-2007, 12:15 AM
WK has a chance to show us he has a plan coming up very soon.

If people like Stanton, Weathers, Lohse, Hatte, Conine, Santos and possibly JR and or Dunn(if no LTC) aren't released or traded for some kind of return then his vet fetish is real and will hinder the franchise as long as he's in charge.

If his placeholders are used to see if we could compete, then flipped for decent returns once it was clear we could not, I for one will be back in the corner of WK. Thats the type of slow but sure, hedged betting I can live with.

If he holds on to a lot of that drek (Jr and Dunn obviously not included in drek) it continues to indicate he thinks they are part of the answer. That will make it beyond clear to even the most optimistic that we once again have the wrong guy talking on the GM phone.

Based on what we have to go on right now, WK's complete body of work is questionable. I don't think its being overly pessamistic or over the top to say so.


Yup, well stated.

ChatterRed
05-20-2007, 10:42 AM
Davey Johnson, McKeon, or Girardi. This team needs a kick in the butt.

savafan
05-20-2007, 07:16 PM
Senior

His name seems to come up every time the job comes available...I'm not sure he really wants it.

savafan
05-20-2007, 07:22 PM
Why not give the job to Marty Brennamen? I recall a time back in the 1990s when he was considered for the job.

pedro
05-20-2007, 07:35 PM
Why not give the job to Marty Brennamen? I recall a time back in the 1990s when he was considered for the job.


Why not smoke a bunch of crack and go speeding through a school zone?

They're equally good decisions IMO.

savafan
05-20-2007, 07:41 PM
Why not smoke a bunch of crack and go speeding through a school zone?

They're equally good decisions IMO.

C'mon now, Marty knows exactly what Narron's doing wrong every game. ;)

pedro
05-20-2007, 07:44 PM
C'mon now, Marty knows exactly what Narron's doing wrong every game. ;)

You're not really serious that Marty was considered for the job back in the 90's are you?

That just doesn't seem possible (unless it was fans doing the considering)

Always Red
05-20-2007, 07:53 PM
C'mon now, Marty knows exactly what Narron's doing wrong every game. ;)

Really? I'd have to say Thom Brennaman is the smartest man who ever lived. Just ask him. He'd tell you, I'm sure! ;) As much as I thought I'd like Thom, I don't, and as much as I thought I'd dislike Jeff Brantley, I do not- I really like him- both on the radio and on TV. The guys knows pitching, and I love hearing him talk about pitching. Heck, let's make him pitching coach!

I had no idea until he said so today, but Tommy Hume was his bullpen pitching coach- that's how long Tommy Hume has been around.

George Anderson
05-20-2007, 08:10 PM
the As much as I thought I'd like Thom, I don't, and as much as I thought I'd dislike Jeff Brantley, I do not- I really like him- both on the radio and on TV. The guys knows pitching, and I love hearing him talk about pitching. Heck, let's make him pitching coach!

.

My thoughts exactly. I was pumped when Thom was announced as the new announcer but after listening to him I am not overly fond of him. I wasn't to sure about Brantley when he was hired, but I really have grown to like the guy as an announcer .

I thought Brantley would make a great pitching coach to, but I would imagine it would be a salary cut to go from the booth to pitching coach.

mole44
05-20-2007, 08:26 PM
There seriously needs to be a 6th option. I could not vote in this poll because everyone on that list sounds so much better than Narron.

TC81190
05-20-2007, 08:29 PM
Barry Larkin. He helped FeLo, he helped Wily Mo. He's a leader, he speaks Spanish, he doesn't tolerate losing. He'd be amazing, IMO,

bucksfan2
05-21-2007, 09:09 AM
Barry Larkin. He helped FeLo, he helped Wily Mo. He's a leader, he speaks Spanish, he doesn't tolerate losing. He'd be amazing, IMO,

I just dont see Larkin doing it. He can basically do what he wants with the rest of his life. He is financially sound and doesn't need the daily grind and headache of managing the reds. I would love to see it but I just dont see Larkin doing it.

mole44
05-21-2007, 03:39 PM
Barry Larkin. He helped FeLo, he helped Wily Mo. He's a leader, he speaks Spanish, he doesn't tolerate losing. He'd be amazing, IMO,

And he'd fill the seats.