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Benihana
06-27-2007, 01:53 PM
FWIW, 760 AM The Score in Chicago is reporting that Buerhle has resigned with the Sox for 4 years, $50 MM. I wonder how some Redszoners feel that deal compares to the Harang/Arroyo deals this offseason. Buerhle might be a slightly better pitcher than Harang (and he is lefthanded), but the gap is definitely narrowing.

RedLegSuperStar
06-27-2007, 02:13 PM
FWIW, 760 AM The Score in Chicago is reporting that Buerhle has resigned with the Sox for 4 years, $50 MM. I wonder how some Redszoners feel that deal compares to the Harang/Arroyo deals this offseason. Buerhle might be a slightly better pitcher than Harang (and he is lefthanded), but the gap is definitely narrowing.

Sign and trade?

RedEye
06-27-2007, 02:15 PM
I'm not convinced that Buehrle is better than Harang. He has a longer track record, but I think Aaron misses more bats. Take Harang's stats out of GABP, and they probably look even better. That deal is looking better by the day. Arroyo's deal is still a bit more difficult to gauge. I think he looks a lot less durable than either of the other two, so it could end up being an dead weight on the Reds payroll for years to come. Then again, Bronson always manages to surprise me, so I'm hoping for him to continue doing so.

flyer85
06-27-2007, 02:22 PM
Until recently it looked as if the Sox had no interest in keeping him.

It seems to be a case where the FO realized that keeping the known is a better course than taking the money and going into the unknown.

RedsManRick
06-27-2007, 02:22 PM
I floored that Buerhle would sign rather than test FA. Wouldn't that money still be there in November? What about the Cardinals. Good move if you're the Sox. Stupid move for Buerhle, IMO.

jojo
06-27-2007, 03:50 PM
I'm of the opinion that Harang is a better pitcher than Buehrle. Harang has a much higher Krate and though Buehrle probably has better command, it's not much better. Basically, in my mind, MB is a glorified inning eating junkballer with Gb tendencies (decent fastball with a great change with complementing curve/slider). Harang has a good fastball and slider with neutral BIP tendencies but his stuff has more make 'em quality. Part of Buehrle's charm is his handedness.

flyer85
06-27-2007, 03:51 PM
I floored that Buerhle would sign rather than test FA. Wouldn't that money still be there in November? What about the Cardinals. Good move if you're the Sox. Stupid move for Buerhle, IMO.Maybe $50M is enough for Buerhle and he likes it in Chicago. It doesn't always have to be about getting every last dollar(although it often is).

RedLegSuperStar
06-27-2007, 04:21 PM
Buehrle Extension: Not Happening

UPDATE: Now Gonzales says the White Sox sent their assistant GM to St. Petersburg, where Mark Buehrle's agent is. So there could be some talks after all.

I don't know who to believe anymore. It's starting to sound like Joe Cowley of the Chicago Sun-Times has been fed some bad information. The Sun-Times had the Red Sox as frontrunners for Mark Buehrle, and then today broke the story of an impending contract extension instead.

The Chicago Tribune has been singing a different tune the whole time, and now Mark Gonzales reports that there are no extension talks. Gonzales spoke to Buehrle's agent.

Fun stuff, all this manipulation and deception. 4/50 sounded too good to be true; perhaps the same person has been feeding bad information to Joe Cowley and 670 The Score.

White Sox Baseball.. Put It On The Board.. BLAHHHH!

RedEye
06-27-2007, 06:21 PM
I'd just like to point out that this guy has one of the most difficult name-spellings to remember in MLB. That's why I called Mark "this guy" rather than referring to his last name. Kind of like Kyle Lohse, whose name I have mastered since he got traded to my favorite team.

That is all. Quite a post as I enter my second 1,000! Woo hoo!

PuffyPig
06-27-2007, 06:27 PM
Count me among the group that says that Harang is quite a bit better than Buehrle.

Harang's DIPS ERA over the last 3 years is 3.85,3.73 and 3.14.

Buehrle comes in at 3.60, 5.33 and 4.37.

Considering that Harang pitches half his games at GABP, and he's getting better, he's easily worth more than Buehrle.

Harang is the first Reds pitcher who's been consistently good for us while pitching at GABP. That should be worth alot for us.

Put Harang in SanDiego, and he'd have an ERA under 3 some years. He strikes out guys, walks few and allows (relatively) few HR's considering where he pitches. We won't get much better than that.

Spitball
06-27-2007, 06:37 PM
As the Nationals learned with Soriano last year, I believe the White Sox found that teams are reluctant to deal young, inexpensive, almost ready prospects for rental players. It makes sense in this era that sees the escalating free agent contracts signed by Alfonso Soriano, Juan Pierre, Jason Schmidt, Julio Lugo, Carlos Lee, Gary Matthews, Aiubrey Huff, Jason Marquis, Jeff Weaver and others. Young major league ready players are important to budget room.

As a result of this, I believe we will not see as many big names being traded unless it is a pure salary dump. Last season, the Brewers even had to send their top outfield prospect, Nelson Cruz, along with Carlos Lee to Texas. This is also the reason I'm betting Dunn stays in Cincy.

PuffyPig
06-27-2007, 06:48 PM
As a result of this, I believe we will not see as many big names being traded unless it is a pure salary dump. Last season, the Brewers even had to send their top outfield prospect, Nelson Cruz, along with Carlos Lee to Texas. This is also the reason I'm betting Dunn stays in Cincy.


I agree.

Thats' why last year's trade of carlos lee was also a trade of talent for talent deal, with less prospects changing hands. The Brewers got Cordero and Mench in the deal. Now, at the time, they stated that they wanted major league players because they weren't giving up the chase, but I expect it was other team's reluctance to give up primo prospects that drove the trade for major league players with existing (and to some degree, expensive), contracts.

Red in Chicago
06-27-2007, 06:48 PM
Count me among the group that says that Harang is quite a bit better than Buehrle.

Harang's DIPS ERA over the last 3 years is 3.85,3.73 and 3.14.

Buehrle comes in at 3.60, 5.33 and 4.37.

Considering that Harang pitches half his games at GABP, and he's getting better, he's easily worth more than Buehrle.

Harang is the first Reds pitcher who's been consistently good for us while pitching at GABP. That should be worth alot for us.

Put Harang in SanDiego, and he'd have an ERA under 3 some years. He strikes out guys, walks few and allows (relatively) few HR's considering where he pitches. We won't get much better than that.


By the same token, Buehrle pitches half his games at The Cell, which also favors the long ball. His BAA, WHIP and ERA are all better when he's away from home.

Falls City Beer
06-27-2007, 06:54 PM
Harang is probably better than Buehrle--while Aaron surrenders too many homers, Mark is bordering on Miltonic.

Though to be fair to Buehrle, he pitches in the second toughest division in baseball, while Harang pitches in the weakest.

wally post
06-27-2007, 07:04 PM
Yes Falls City. It seems the american league is far more difficult in general than National - so... Can we PLEASE trade for some more American League pitching talent?? Paleeeeeeze!!!