07-17-2007 Minor League Updates

[nate]

Just wanted to get this started.

I forget who gave the tip about $5 to get all the Bats' home games on MiLB.tv but thanks!

[Chi-Town Red]

actually its 6.95 a month..but worth it

[nate]

Homer, 1 IP / 0 H / 0 R / 1 BB / 1 K

Machado flies out to deep right
Dickerson singles to right
Votto flies out to deep left
Dickerson caught stealing

no score after 1

[nate]

actually its 6.95 a month..but worth it

They have a deal for $4.95 if you just get the Bats' home games.

[nate]

Top of 2nd

Two lineouts
Homer walks Owens (on 4 pitches, threw some really bad looking breaking stuff)
Owens steals 2nd
Hernandez GO

Bottom

Herr GO to pitcher
Bruce GO to 2nd
Belhorn fouls out to 3rd

After 2, no score.

[Aronchis]

Homer's breaking stuff is brutally bad for this level. He almost never locates it. Compared to pitchers like Peavy or Hughes at 21, he far behind them in ability to mix up pitches for strikes and aquire strikeouts. They can miss high with their fastballs but still be decent as they get k's through breaking and offspeed pitches. Not Bailey.

Amazingly and amazing raw talent. When he improves his 4 seamer into consistant strikes, he should dominate AAA. But he needs those secondary pitches to be a major league "ace" people want him to be. Makes you wonder about the Reds pitching coaches and Bailey's head. I can't believe he hasn't improved abit with his curveball. Either they aren't teaching or Bailey isn't listening.

[nate]

Top 3rd
Johnson with a bunt single
Zobrist pops one up in the infield
Johnson caught stealing
Pridie flies out

Bottom 3rd
Bannon Ks looking
Hannigan singles to right
Janish reaches on an error to short
Machado lines to first and into an unassited DP

NEWS
Bubba Crosby will have season-ending shoulder surgery

[nate]

Homer's breaking stuff is brutally bad for this level. He almost never locates it. Compared to pitchers like Peavy or Hughes at 21, he far behind them in ability to mix up pitches for strikes and aquire strikeouts. They can miss high with their fastballs but still be decent as they get k's through breaking and offspeed pitches. Not Bailey.

Amazingly and amazing raw talent. When he improves his 4 seamer into consistant strikes, he should dominate AAA. But he needs those secondary pitches to be a major league "ace" people want him to be. Makes you wonder about the Reds pitching coaches and Bailey's head. I can't believe he hasn't improved abit with his curveball. Either they aren't teaching or Bailey isn't listening.

One of 'em was a real knee-bender but it was too far inside. I mean, the pitch looked good, had a lot of break just poor location.

[Aronchis]

One of 'em was a real knee-bender but it was too far inside. I mean, the pitch looked good, had a lot of break just poor location.

Yup, so raw. The location simply isn't there. Maybe Bailey needs to start with the 4 seamer. Get it refined and throw it for consistant strikes. Then move to the breaking stuff. Maybe he is trying to do to much at the same time.

[OnBaseMachine]

Stubbs is 1-for-1 with his 16th double and his 20th stolen base.

[nate]

Top 4
Durham
Ruggiano Ks (the last pitch was a sweet curve by Homer)
Guzman grounds to 3rd
Butler flies out deep to Dickerson

Bottom 4
Bats
Dickerson GO to pitcher
Votto flies out to short
Herr Ks

After 4, Homer 2 BB, 2K, no runs.

no score

[Chi-Town Red]

Votto pops out to SS...0 for 2

[nate]

Dinner break!

[Chi-Town Red]

Bruce triples....

[Chi-Town Red]

A shot to deep center of the bottom of the CF wall..

[dougdirt]

Jay Bruce is good.

[Chi-Town Red]

Jay Bruce is good.
yea..oh by the way...:thumbup:

[BearcatShane]

That hit raises Bruce's avaerage to .263. If he gets a hit in his next AB he'll be in the .280's. I'll wait til he has 50 AAA at bats to judge one way or another but I would like to see him stay in AAA the rest of the year instead of being shipped back to AA when Wise returns.

[Prf15]

He should of been able to stretch it into a homerun. What a slacker.:mooner:

[Redman15]

Homer just gave up a 3-run bomb. Louisville trails 3-1.
Dayton Trails 3-0.

[Aronchis]

I have a feeling before the end of the year, Bailey will replace Stubbs as the most disappointing prospect.

Bailey's confidence is shot. Why do I have a feeling if he had never been called up in the first place, this would have never been happening? First sign of something going wrong, he implodes.

[Redman15]

Logan Parker ties the game with a 3 run bomb. Dayton 3 Cedar Rapids 3.

Encarnacion leaves Fifth Third field with a monster 2 run homer. 5-3 Dragons.

[nate]

The wife brought home Chili's...sorry dudes!

Homer leaves after giving up a double to Velandia.

Salmon on in relief.

[Redman15]

Salmon replaces Bailey with runners on 2nd and 3rd, 2 outs.

[nate]

Ugh, Salmon doesn't get it done. Allows all of Homer's and one of his own runs to score. 6-1 Durham with Bray warming up.

[reds44]

Homer better get used to sitting on a bus.

[mth123]

Dickerson caught stealing


Looks like he's ready for a promotion to the big club.

[Redman15]

Turner hits a 3 run homer for the 3rd bomb in the inning. The Dragons have their 8th hit in a row. Dragons lead 8-3.

[Kc61]

I have a feeling before the end of the year, Bailey will replace Stubbs as the most disappointing prospect.

Bailey's confidence is shot. Why do I have a feeling if he had never been called up in the first place, this would have never been happening? First sign of something going wrong, he implodes.

Actually, I think his problem now is that he fades after about five innings. I saw it with the Reds -- even in his good games, Bailey weakened later on in the games. He hasn't had a lot of longer outings in his brief career -- another sign that he needs more seasoning.

I doubt that his confidence is shot. He seems like a competitive, confident young pitcher. But he is too young to be a successful major league pitcher right now, needs some work, and should get it at AAA.

[nate]

Homer's final line:

5.2 IP / 4 H / 5 R / 2 ER / 3 BB / 4 SO / 1 HR

[nate]

Bray Ks the only guy he faces. 6-1 Durham, with the Louisville coming to bat in the bottom of the 6th.

[Aronchis]

Actually, I think his problem now is that he fades after about five innings. I saw it with the Reds -- even in his good games, Bailey weakened later on in the games. He hasn't had a lot of longer outings in his brief career -- another sign that he needs more seasoning.

I doubt that his confidence is shot. He seems like a competitive, confident young pitcher. But he is too young to be a successful major league pitcher right now, needs some work, and should get it at AAA.

I don't agree. Homer had a tendency to get stronger as the game goes on. He is melting when the oppo gets a break, like the error. The dude is shellshocked.

[OnBaseMachine]

Stubbs is 1-for-1 with a double and his organizational leading 53rd walk.

[Redman15]

Homer only gave up 2 earned runs. Machado's error didn't help.

[nate]

He didn't look dominating at all. He had a couple of brilliant pitches but seemed very erratic. He threw one away on a pickoff move and the defense muffed an easy play which kind of lead to his undoing in the 6th.

On the bright side, I think he improved on his last AAA start!

[Redman15]

Parker just hit his 2nd 3 run homer of the inning. Dragons 11-3. That is their 4th homer in the inning.

[OnBaseMachine]

Votto then turns around and walks for the 53rd time, tieing him with Stubbs.

[pedro]

If Bailey's confidence is shot b/c he hit a rough stretch in his first trip to the majors (which I don't think is true) then he was never going to be any good in the majors anyway. It's ridiculous IMO to assert that the Reds mishandling him ruined him mentally. It is, however, quite possible that his arm may have been hurt and if so I believe that would be fair to blame on the Reds.

[Aronchis]

If Bailey's confidence is shot b/c he hit a rough stretch in his first trip to the majors (which I don't think is true) then he was never going to be any good in the majors anyway. It's ridiculous IMO to assert that the Reds mishandling him ruined him mentally. It is, however, quite possible that his arm may have been hurt and if so I believe that would be fair to blame on the Reds.

It is more than that. He wasn't nearly ready. Yet, they still called him up. As been mentioned, I don't see a injury. Just a exposed green pitcher in AAA that needs confidence in his stuff. He didn't have nearly enough. If he did, he would be beating these guys up.

[BearcatShane]

So your saying because he had 3 out of 6 bad starts in the majors and he's had 2 less than stellar starts in AAA he's going to be a bigger dissapointment than Stubbs and his confidence is shot? He's 21, as soon as he can throw his curve and change for strikes he will be fine. He can't do that consistanly yet, most successful pitchers couldn't do that at age 21 either.

[Chi-Town Red]

Homer's final line:

5.2 IP / 4 H / 5 R / 2 ER / 3 BB / 4 SO / 1 HRwhat to make of that???:confused:

[nate]

what to make of that???:confused:

Well, I thought he looked inconsistent. It _did_ seem like he was working on a lot of breaking pitches and he had a few curveballs that were total knee-benders. He also had some nice-looking breaking pitches that had bad location. Then he had some that were in the dirt.

The only velocity reading I heard all night was 94.

[RedEye]

Well, I thought he looked inconsistent. It _did_ seem like he was working on a lot of breaking pitches and he had a few curveballs that were total knee-benders. He also had some nice-looking breaking pitches that had bad location. Then he had some that were in the dirt.

The only velocity reading I heard all night was 94.

So were the reports of 98 and 97 last year just exaggerations or has Homer lost 3-4 MPH on his fastball?

[Redmachine2003]

If Bailey's confidence is shot b/c he hit a rough stretch in his first trip to the majors (which I don't think is true) then he was never going to be any good in the majors anyway. It's ridiculous IMO to assert that the Reds mishandling him ruined him mentally. It is, however, quite possible that his arm may have been hurt and if so I believe that would be fair to blame on the Reds.
Thank you. People love to give prospect built in excuses. Homer needs to buck up and listen to his coaches instead of always having to do things his own way. He did it in Dayton and he tried to do it with the Reds when he had a bad outing and then later said "he" had found a small mechanical flaw. Homer has great talent but until he learns how to pitch he will be just a 5 inning pitcher and then runs out of gas because he had thrown to many pitches.

[Patrick Bateman]

Stubbs is 2-3, with 2 doubles, and a walk.

The hot streak continues. Nice to see some extra base hits coming in.

[nate]

So were the reports of 98 and 97 last year just exaggerations or has Homer lost 3-4 MPH on his fastball?

I don't know. I'm just saying that the only time I heard speed mentioned the announcers said 94. He did seem to be working on breaking pitches, in my opinion so that may've been why they didn't mention anything else.

[Mutaman]

I seem to recall everybody here complaining because the Reds were taking too long to bring Homer up. In fact there were plenty of people who stated that they should have brought him up last year. Now its just the opposite. Everyone is taking the position that he never should have been brought up in the first place. This is what we call "redboarding"

[nate]

Votto drives in a run on a broken bat Texas leaguer then gets caught in an FC. 10-2 Durham after 8.

[dougdirt]

Bailey was throwing 97 and 98 last year. Just not consistantly.

[BearcatShane]

Bruce reaches on error.

[nate]

Game over in Louisville. Bats lose 10-2

Homer's final line:

5.2 IP / 4 H / 5 R / 2 ER / 3 BB / 4 SO / 1 HR

Votto:

1 for 3 with an RBI

Bruce

1 for 4 with a triple. Hit the ball really hard tonight, one of those outs was feet away from being a HR.

Hanigan and Dickerson both 2 for 4

Santos, 1.1 IP, 2 H no Runs

[zipcurve]

Chattanooga leading 9-1 going into the 6th inning

[11larkin11]

Frazier 1-1 so far with an RBI single, wouldve been 2 RBI but runner got thrown out at the plate.

[CTA513]

DeJesus (Dayton): 3.1 Innings, 2 Hits, 0 Runs, 0 BB, 6 K

[OnBaseMachine]

Lecure: 6 IP, 4 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 8 K

Rosales is 2-for-3 with a double, single, and a walk.

[Benihana]

Lecure: 6 IP, 4 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 8 K

Rosales is 2-for-3 with a double, single, and a walk.

Aronchis- see, this is why people around here claim that you rub them the wrong way. I'm not suggesting everything needs to be viewed through rosy colored glasses, but here you have a pitcher who you've ragged on constantly in the past, who puts together a stellar outing tonight, and you ignore it. Yet at the same time, you focus all of your effort into chiding Homer Bailey for his poor outing, continuing your doom and gloom forecast.

I'm NOT suggesting that everything needs to always be peachy around here, but if you don't want to be viewed as just as biased of a poster as the "peachy posters," you should start doleing out respect when it is due.

Great outing for LeCure tonight.

[Blue]

I seem to recall everybody here complaining because the Reds were taking too long to bring Homer up. In fact there were plenty of people who stated that they should have brought him up last year. Now its just the opposite. Everyone is taking the position that he never should have been brought up in the first place. This is what we call "redboarding"

I want him back in the majors for his next start. He's able to get by in AAA, he doesn't have to improve to get those guys out. The majors are where he needs to make adjustments in order to become a good or great pitcher, and he has to take his lumps at some point.

[Aronchis]

Aronchis- see, this is why people around here claim that you rub them the wrong way. I'm not suggesting everything needs to be viewed through rosy colored glasses, but here you have a pitcher who you've ragged on constantly in the past, who puts together a stellar outing tonight, and you ignore it. Yet at the same time, you focus all of your effort into chiding Homer Bailey for his poor outing, continuing your doom and gloom forecast.

I'm NOT suggesting that everything needs to always be peachy around here, but if you don't want to be viewed as just as biased of a poster as the "peachy posters," you should start doleing out respect when it is due.

Great outing for LeCure tonight.

Oh, come on. Lecure got praise from me during his last good start.................a few weeks back. Lecure has been nothing but inconsistant. At least Fisher put up several weeks of consistancy before his arm went dead.

[zipcurve]

Lecure struck out 9 with 1 walk in 7 innings

[LoganBuck]

I seem to recall everybody here complaining because the Reds were taking too long to bring Homer up. In fact there were plenty of people who stated that they should have brought him up last year. Now its just the opposite. Everyone is taking the position that he never should have been brought up in the first place. This is what we call "redboarding"

Not on this board they weren't. There were plenty of people wanting the Reds to hold off.

I suspect that the real reason he was sent down to AAA was not to keep him on his rotation turn, but to get those extra days of service away from counting toward super two status. The fact that he is now having problems lets him take care of that down there away from the bright lights. Homer Bailey is not a unique and delicate snowflake. He is taking his lumps and as long as he is healthy he should emerge better for it.

[Matt700wlw]

Bailey was throwing 97 and 98 last year. Just not consistantly.

Publications can make you believe things....saying he "throws" 98 mph and saying he can "hit" 98 mph are not the same thing. They write "throws"

However, I do think he had more consistant velocity above 91mph...more along 94-95 consistantly...

Seems he "hits" that reading more this year when he "threw" it at that reading in the past...

Possible room for concern? Absolutely.

[dougdirt]

Publications can make you believe things....saying he "throws" 98 mph and saying he can "hit" 98 mph are not the same thing. They write "throws"

However, I do think he had more consistant velocity above 91mph...more along 94-95 consistantly...

Seems he "hits" that reading more this year when he "threw" it at that reading in the past...

Possible room for concern? Absolutely.

I have seen Bailey sit 93-95 for prolonged periods of time this year. Sure he dipped down around 91 once and a while, but he has had times where he has sat 93-95. All that takes is a fast gun and all of a sudden he is throwing 95-97 consistantly.

[BearcatShane]

I'm sure you guys know this but I'm going to say it anyway.

Bailey has two fastballs, a 4 seemer and a 2 seemer(cut fastball). When the velocity is 93-96 that's his 4 seemer and when the velocity is 88-91 thats his 2 seemer. He throws the 2 seemer alot because it has more movement.

[Screwball]

Stubbs is 2-3, with 2 doubles, and a walk.


Kid's got bust written all over him. ;)

[OesterPoster]

Kid's got bust written all over him. ;)

Stubbs also threw out a guy at the plate last night.

[11larkin11]

Stubbs value has never been higher;)