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Reds Freak
07-26-2007, 12:14 PM
From www.bengals.com

Odell denied reinstatement by the NFL today with a chance to apply next year. Maybe I am biased but I do not understand this one. He had a rough year last year but as far as I know he has done everything he has been asked to do. Doesn't make much sense to me. Goddell better stay consistent with this with guys like Vick and Tank Johnson...

bucksfan2
07-26-2007, 12:26 PM
I was trying to find out more from bengals message boards but you really get nothing of substance over there. I can't help but think that this whole Vick situation put Gogdell in a fowl mood about Odell. It just amazes me that Jason Allen can have 2 dui's, spend jail time and get 2 games. Tank had so many infractions last year yet Goddell permitted him to play in the super bowl. I would imagine we will hear a grievance filed on Odell's behalf if he complied with everything he was supposed to. If not then he did something bad.

Red Leader
07-26-2007, 12:27 PM
That really, really sucks. Odell kept his nose clean for the time he was suspended and met all of the requirements they asked of him. I think Mr. Goodell is going a little far with his "severe" penalties. I'm fine with making them stringent, but if someone does what you ask of them, there's no reason to deny them "just because."

Joseph
07-26-2007, 12:29 PM
He has to have failed another drug test or something if there is NOT a grievance filed, otherwise the collective bargaining situation has to be being violated....I think.

Red Leader
07-26-2007, 12:34 PM
He has to have failed another drug test or something if there is NOT a grievance filed, otherwise the collective bargaining situation has to be being violated....I think.

Agreed. If nothing else exists since last year this should be appealed, immediately.

Matt700wlw
07-26-2007, 01:21 PM
On the surface, it looks like Odell got screwed...if there's more to this, I would like to know what it is.

dougdirt
07-26-2007, 01:40 PM
If there is more to this, then we would have already known.

1. Its a Bengal. You think someone would havee kept it out of the news? Not a chance. He didn't fail a drug test or we would know.

2. Something is going to happen. He is going to file a grievance. There is something funny going on here. Mr 'Tough as Nails' commish is a joke as of now.

Roy Tucker
07-26-2007, 01:45 PM
Yeah, something seems odd here.

IIRC, Thurman failed a drug test last summer and then got a DUI in the fall. I think he got a 4 game suspension for the drug test and then a full season for adding on the DUI. He had some scrape with the law a couple months back but that amounted to a trumped-up charge.

From limited press reports, he supposedly has been complying with all the terms of his legal system and NFL issues.

Either he didn't comply as well, did something else, or Goodell is coming down hard on him to make an example of him. If Thurman has kept his nose clean, I'd like to hear the reasoning if Goodell is just making an example of him.

If Thurman gets a 2 yr. suspension for a failed drug test and a DUI, Goodell sure as heck better start handing out multi-year suspensions to Pacman, Tank, Vick, and the rest of the NFL rogues.

Matt700wlw
07-26-2007, 01:47 PM
Either he didn't comply as well, did something else, or Goodell is coming down hard on him to make an example of him. If Thurman has kept his nose clean, I'd like to hear the reasoning if Goodell is just making an example of him.

.

I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but if he were a Patriot, a Colt, or a Steeler, for example, I wonder if the outcome would be different?

CTA513
07-26-2007, 02:17 PM
I was trying to find out more from bengals message boards but you really get nothing of substance over there. I can't help but think that this whole Vick situation put Gogdell in a fowl mood about Odell. It just amazes me that Jason Allen can have 2 dui's, spend jail time and get 2 games. Tank had so many infractions last year yet Goddell permitted him to play in the super bowl. I would imagine we will hear a grievance filed on Odell's behalf if he complied with everything he was supposed to. If not then he did something bad.

Allen did have a 4 game suspension until the NFL reduced it to 2 games.

Reds Fanatic
07-26-2007, 02:24 PM
This decision does not seem to make any sense. About a month ago a couple of people in Thurman's hometown alleged that he hit and kicked them at a party only to later withdraw the charges. I wonder if this had anything to do with the decision.

HotCorner
07-26-2007, 02:30 PM
I wonder what Pacman Jones is thinking today?

CrackerJack
07-26-2007, 02:48 PM
I wonder what Pacman Jones is thinking today?

That getting people shot and paralyzed and having 10 run-ins with the law isn't as bad as failing a drug test a year ago and getting his first DUI?

bucksfan2
07-26-2007, 02:50 PM
Here is the thing. A 2 years suspension in the NFL could just as well be a career suspension. Goddell needs to be careful with the way he his handeling things. You can be tough as nails but you have to be fair. If it comes out that Odell complied with everything and you deined him for a money grab police file then you are going to lose a lot of faith from both your owners and also a lot of agreement from the union.

Reds Fanatic
07-26-2007, 02:54 PM
Here is the thing. A 2 years suspension in the NFL could just as well be a career suspension. Goddell needs to be careful with the way he his handeling things. You can be tough as nails but you have to be fair. If it comes out that Odell complied with everything and you deined him for a money grab police file then you are going to lose a lot of faith from both your owners and also a lot of agreement from the union.
That is why unless there is an absolutely solid reason this was extended I think the union will be involved in protesting this.

savafan
07-26-2007, 02:55 PM
Maybe Goodell could just start kicking guys out of the league that he doesn't personally care for. Say, he doesn't like their hair cut, they go play in Canada. It looks like that's the direction the NFL is heading.

CTA513
07-26-2007, 03:02 PM
Look at all the stuff Chris Henry did and look at what Thurman did.
Chris Henry is going to miss a total of 10 games (2 last season and 8 this season) and Thurman is going to miss 2 seasons.

Matt700wlw
07-26-2007, 03:04 PM
Look at all the stuff Chris Henry did and look at what Thurman did.
Chris Henry is going to miss a total of 10 games (2 last season and 8 this season) and Thurman is going to miss 2 seasons.

I think after Henry's suspension, he has to re-apply as well....Goodell may jerk that decision around for 6 weeks and then decide against letting him come back...

Who knows

Danny Serafini
07-26-2007, 03:22 PM
I really hope Thurman files suit against the NFL. Goodell is nothing but a grandstanding fraud.

bengalsown
07-26-2007, 05:26 PM
I think after Henry's suspension, he has to re-apply as well....Goodell may jerk that decision around for 6 weeks and then decide against letting him come back...

Who knows

No, he doesn't have to re-apply.

WMR
07-26-2007, 07:18 PM
This makes no sense...

Goodell could go from being applauded for his "tough stance" to being derided for blatantly unfair treatment of players very quickly.

Reds Freak
07-26-2007, 07:40 PM
Ok, so let's say Odell has done everything he has been asked to do and there isn't anything else out there that we don't know about. How does he go about filing a grievance? How does that whole thing work, is there any chance at all the decision would change?

RedFanAlways1966
07-26-2007, 09:48 PM
If Odell has stayed clean, it seems as though the NFL has a Kennesaw Mountain Landis running the show. Iron fist.

Not sure and I am a huge Bengals fan. However, I have a hard time feeling sorrow for Odell. I think my fav team needs him in the middle of the defense. But he (and only he) made the bed he now lies in. I believe in 2nd chances... but when you start asking for 3rd/4th chances, then you have taken it to a different level.

hebroncougar
07-26-2007, 10:46 PM
If Odell has stayed clean, it seems as though the NFL has a Kennesaw Mountain Landis running the show. Iron fist.

Not sure and I am a huge Bengals fan. However, I have a hard time feeling sorrow for Odell. I think my fav team needs him in the middle of the defense. But he (and only he) made the bed he now lies in. I believe in 2nd chances... but when you start asking for 3rd/4th chances, then you have taken it to a different level.

Exactly the way I feel. Didn't he get a DUI while under his last suspension? And people are crying about him not being reinstated, and blaming Goddell?? Please, if you have a gripe, call Odell, don't blame the commish. He's trying to clean up the sport.

Danny Serafini
07-26-2007, 11:05 PM
Odell has served his time, though, that's the point. He spent four months in an alcohol rehab center and cleaned himself up. What else is he supposed to do?

CTA513
07-27-2007, 12:34 AM
Odell has served his time, though, that's the point. He spent four months in an alcohol rehab center and cleaned himself up. What else is he supposed to do?

He should have got two DUIs like Jared Allen, then he would of had his suspension reduced.

:devil:

acredsfan
07-27-2007, 12:41 AM
Exactly the way I feel. Didn't he get a DUI while under his last suspension? And people are crying about him not being reinstated, and blaming Goddell?? Please, if you have a gripe, call Odell, don't blame the commish. He's trying to clean up the sport.He did everything that the NFL told him to do, and still wasn't reinstated, that is the gripe with Goddell. I think everybody understands what Odell did wrong, and a lot of us were very bitter about it, but enough is enough, give him a chance to prove he has turned his live around. I like what one of his teammates said on Bengals.com. He needs to be with the team where they view him as a son, brother, and friend... Compare his offenses to Pacman Jones and Tank Johnson and tell me why he deserves more punishment than they have gotten so far... Its like being told by your parents to do something then after you complete the task you are punished like you never completed the task in the first place. Its hypocritical actions like that we protest.

After all, what better publicity can the NFL get than showing that a program to clean up the NFL and helping players is a success. Instead it makes it look like the NFL doesn't even trust its on policies of rehabilitation.

improbus
07-27-2007, 01:55 AM
He should have got two DUIs like Jared Allen, then he would of had his suspension reduced.

:devil:

Or taken steroids

UKFlounder
07-27-2007, 08:03 AM
He did everything that the NFL told him to do,

I see people making that assumption, but does anybody really know if its true? Granted, we have not heard of any violations, but perhaps he failed/missed a test (or tests) the NFL tried to administer, but they kept it quiet for privacy reasons.

If the NFL told him what he had to do to be reinstated, and he failed to live up to it (which seems just as likely as the more popular belief that he did everything he needed to do), then he probably deserves this.

And I'm not convinced the NFL is obligated to release all details of what he did/did not do. As a fan, I'd like to know whe reinstatement was denied and what, if anything, Thurman failed to do, as that would make this decision easier to accept, but perhaps Odell wanted it kept secret.

hebroncougar
07-27-2007, 09:44 AM
He did everything that the NFL told him to do, and still wasn't reinstated, that is the gripe with Goddell. I think everybody understands what Odell did wrong, and a lot of us were very bitter about it, but enough is enough, give him a chance to prove he has turned his live around. I like what one of his teammates said on Bengals.com. He needs to be with the team where they view him as a son, brother, and friend... Compare his offenses to Pacman Jones and Tank Johnson and tell me why he deserves more punishment than they have gotten so far... Its like being told by your parents to do something then after you complete the task you are punished like you never completed the task in the first place. Its hypocritical actions like that we protest.

After all, what better publicity can the NFL get than showing that a program to clean up the NFL and helping players is a success. Instead it makes it look like the NFL doesn't even trust its on policies of rehabilitation.


Wasn't Odell with his teammates when he commited his past transgressions? Maybe Goodell feels he's doing Odell a favor. I recently read there was a problem this summer with an all night party, guns, and Odell threatening someone? And how do we all know Odell's done everything the commish asked him to do?

bucksfan2
07-27-2007, 10:56 AM
Wasn't Odell with his teammates when he commited his past transgressions? Maybe Goodell feels he's doing Odell a favor. I recently read there was a problem this summer with an all night party, guns, and Odell threatening someone? And how do we all know Odell's done everything the commish asked him to do?

Yea and Henry also beat up some kids over the summer as well. This is speculation and was never followed through. Here is the thing with Odell. The NFL is a 24 hour a day buisness right now. If Odell feels that he complied with everything laid out he can take this to the court of public opinion, mainly the media. I will say this Goodell is running the league with an iron fist. It is all good until he takes that too far. The second he starts taking things to the next level and becoming unfair is the second he loses support. With the support of the union Goodell can do basically what he wants. When he loses support he will have a very difficult time with the union.

acredsfan
07-27-2007, 12:41 PM
Wasn't Odell with his teammates when he commited his past transgressions? Maybe Goodell feels he's doing Odell a favor. I recently read there was a problem this summer with an all night party, guns, and Odell threatening someone? And how do we all know Odell's done everything the commish asked him to do?Not all Bengals players are bad role models, he just needs to make better choices about who he is around. It amazes me that in America you are innocent until proven guilty, but in the NFL you are guilty no matter what. Speculation is that the people making the accusations were just doing it to get money and publicity.. whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but formal charges were never filed and the complaint was reported the day after the alleged incident happened... shady at best.

hebroncougar
07-27-2007, 01:58 PM
Not all Bengals players are bad role models, he just needs to make better choices about who he is around. It amazes me that in America you are innocent until proven guilty, but in the NFL you are guilty no matter what. Speculation is that the people making the accusations were just doing it to get money and publicity.. whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but formal charges were never filed and the complaint was reported the day after the alleged incident happened... shady at best.

You know what's amazing to me?? I teach high school for about 1/20th of what Odell made, and if I get a DUI, or some of the other ignorant stuff these guys do, I lose my job and my teaching license for life. No ifs, or buts about it. I don't have to be convicted, it's called a moral and good conduct clause. and evidently the NFL Commish is enforcing it. Cry me a river for these morons that throw their careers away for something freaking stupid that could all have been avoided (in Thurman's case), by being smart enough to take a $50 cab ride.

Chip R
07-27-2007, 02:39 PM
You know what's amazing to me?? I teach high school for about 1/20th of what Odell made, and if I get a DUI, or some of the other ignorant stuff these guys do, I lose my job and my teaching license for life. No ifs, or buts about it. I don't have to be convicted, it's called a moral and good conduct clause. and evidently the NFL Commish is enforcing it. Cry me a river for these morons that throw their careers away for something freaking stupid that could all have been avoided (in Thurman's case), by being smart enough to take a $50 cab ride.


That's a great point. :thumbup:

However, I've been concerned that the NFL is becoming almost McCarthyistic (if that's even a word) in dealing with these players. It seems that now all you need are allegations and a player can be suspended. It can get to be a slipery slope. For example, Steeler Fan could bait Carson Palmer into an altercation and even if charges were dropped or there were no charges filed at all, the NFL would have to take disciplinary action against Palmer. Now I know Carson's as clean as they come so he probably wouldn't be suspended but that's beside the point.

hebroncougar
07-27-2007, 05:10 PM
That's a great point. :thumbup:

However, I've been concerned that the NFL is becoming almost McCarthyistic (if that's even a word) in dealing with these players. It seems that now all you need are allegations and a player can be suspended. It can get to be a slipery slope. For example, Steeler Fan could bait Carson Palmer into an altercation and even if charges were dropped or there were no charges filed at all, the NFL would have to take disciplinary action against Palmer. Now I know Carson's as clean as they come so he probably wouldn't be suspended but that's beside the point.

Here's a statment I found on another site regarding Thurman:

The basic reality is that Thurman had been previously banished under the league's substance abuse policy. Banishment is the final step after multiple positive urine tests and/or other activities that violate the policy.

In order to be reinstated after a minimum banishment of one-year, the player must be in full compliance with all aspects of his treatment plan, and he likewise must submit to and pass any and all random urine tests imposed upon him. Even if the player complies with the treatment plan and passes all tests, reinstatement is not automatic.

Thurman was banned from the league, with the ability to apply for reinstatement after one year. I think that reads a lot different that what 99.5% of Bengal fans, including myself thought. But IMO, Thurman made his bed, now he's got to sleep in it. He's at the mercy of the commish, and this commish is trying to make bold statements about a league whose players have been way, way out of control in the past, and he's not going to put up with any of this kind of garbage right now, and quite frankly, I don't blame him. Someone has finally woken up and has seen that athletes are role models that kids and others look up to, and is holding them to the standards that many of us "commonfolk" live our lives by. Thurman pushed the envelope of the league rules, and they are pushing him back, playing hardball with him.

Chip R
07-27-2007, 05:38 PM
Just remember, you can't spell Goodell without Odell. :)

UKFlounder
07-27-2007, 05:49 PM
That's a great point. :thumbup:

However, I've been concerned that the NFL is becoming almost McCarthyistic (if that's even a word) in dealing with these players. It seems that now all you need are allegations and a player can be suspended. It can get to be a slipery slope. For example, Steeler Fan could bait Carson Palmer into an altercation and even if charges were dropped or there were no charges filed at all, the NFL would have to take disciplinary action against Palmer. Now I know Carson's as clean as they come so he probably wouldn't be suspended but that's beside the point.

Or Steeler player (now former) could join with his posse to attack a Bengal player in a casino, steal his jewelry (which was anonymously returned) and only be fined a couple game checks, but allowed to play.

deltachi8
07-27-2007, 07:53 PM
Thurman was banned from the league, with the ability to apply for reinstatement after one year.

I think Reds fans can grasp that one well.

savafan
07-27-2007, 07:59 PM
You know what's amazing to me?? I teach high school for about 1/20th of what Odell made, and if I get a DUI, or some of the other ignorant stuff these guys do, I lose my job and my teaching license for life. No ifs, or buts about it. I don't have to be convicted, it's called a moral and good conduct clause. and evidently the NFL Commish is enforcing it. Cry me a river for these morons that throw their careers away for something freaking stupid that could all have been avoided (in Thurman's case), by being smart enough to take a $50 cab ride.

I'm in the same boat HC...I can't even get a speeding ticket, because I transport clients...

Reds Fanatic
08-01-2007, 05:11 PM
Odell never learns he is in trouble again for violating probation.

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070801/SPT02/308010038



Suspended Cincinnati Bengals linebacker Odell Thurman violated his Hamilton County probation and must show up in court to explain why.

Thurman, who was suspended all of last season and for all of the 2007 season by the NFL, was supposed to report to his Hamilton County probation officer July 24.

When he didn’t, Probation Officers Liz Albert and Bob Lutkenhoff filed a criminal complaint against him for not reporting.

They also said Thurman still owes $574 in fees, fines and costs due the probation department.


Thurman’s Cincinnati attorney, Ed Perry, didn’t return calls today.

The probation was set by Municipal Court Judge John Burlew after Thurman, 23, was arrested and charged with drunk driving.

Initially, Burlew sentenced the linebacker from the University of Georgia to 90 days in jail but reduced that to a six-day, in-treatment program after Thurman admitted he was an alcoholic and spent several months this year in rehab.

Burlew also suspended the player’s driver’s license and placed him on probation.

Court records note Thurman was on probation less than two months before he was accused of violating it.

Thurman, whose NFL career could be ended by this probation violation, must report Aug. 21 to Burlew to address the violation.

Danny Serafini
08-01-2007, 05:43 PM
I give up. I thought the guy was turning things around, but he just doesn't get it.

RedFanAlways1966
08-01-2007, 05:44 PM
Suspended Cincinnati Bengals linebacker Odell Thurman violated his Hamilton County probation and must show up in court to explain why.

Have to wonder if Goodell knew about this. Does violating probabtion follow the guidelines set up for him by the NFL? Not hard to wonder why this chump cannot get back on the field.... and I am a Bengals fan who thinks the team needs his football abilities.

Stupid is, stupid does. And Odell seems to be pretty stupid.

Chip R
08-01-2007, 05:47 PM
Have to wonder if Goodell knew about this. Does violating probabtion follow the guidelines set up for him by the NFL? Not hard to wonder why this chump cannot get back on the field.... and I am a Bengals fan who thinks the team needs his football abilities.

Stupid is, stupid does. And Odell seems to be pretty stupid.


Looks like it happened a couple of days before Goddell ruled on this. You can't say for sure that he knew but it's quite possible that this was the reason Odell was not reinstated.

camisadelgolf
08-02-2007, 01:17 AM
Shame on Thurman, his lawyer, etc. for trying to spin it like Thurman has been completely compliant and innocent over the past year.