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View Full Version : Justin Upton misses the cycle by a single..only 19years old?



redsfan4445
08-08-2007, 06:11 PM
per rotoworld:

Justin Upton missed hitting for the cycle by just a single against the Pirates on Tuesday.
Upton tripled in the second, hit a solo homer in the fourth, and then doubled in the seventh. He received just one more at-bat in the contest, grounding out to second against closer Matt Capps to end the game. The homer, which was a deep drive to left off starter Tom Gorzelanny, was his first in the major leagues. Upton is 19-years-old and has been in the majors less than a week yet has already almost hit for the cycle. He's got a decent little future ahead of himself. Aug. 8 - 1:22 am et

SO why not bring up Bruce?? lets see what his future holds... might as well, nothing but the JR 600 watch to look forward too!!

Eric_Davis
08-08-2007, 09:53 PM
per rotoworld:

Justin Upton missed hitting for the cycle by just a single against the Pirates on Tuesday.
Upton tripled in the second, hit a solo homer in the fourth, and then doubled in the seventh. He received just one more at-bat in the contest, grounding out to second against closer Matt Capps to end the game. The homer, which was a deep drive to left off starter Tom Gorzelanny, was his first in the major leagues. Upton is 19-years-old and has been in the majors less than a week yet has already almost hit for the cycle. He's got a decent little future ahead of himself. Aug. 8 - 1:22 am et

SO why not bring up Bruce?? lets see what his future holds... might as well, nothing but the JR 600 watch to look forward too!!

Because we're not in a pennant race and he's not going to be as good as Upton, though others differ. But, he hasn't hit as well as Upton has this year. But, the way Bruce is playing, he'd probably hit well whenever he is brought up.

dougdirt
08-08-2007, 10:00 PM
Umm, Jay Bruce has hit better than Upton has this year. I don't know what you have been looking at?

Eric_Davis
08-08-2007, 10:13 PM
I think he's in a class above Bruce. I still fell he'll be an All-Star next year and every year after that for the next 10 years.

11larkin11
08-08-2007, 11:15 PM
He may very well be better than Bruce, but if so, not by much, and DEFINITELY not a class above him. But really, this is like comparing Peyton Manning to Tom Brady, but not at that level.

dougdirt
08-09-2007, 12:54 AM
He may very well be better than Bruce, but if so, not by much, and DEFINITELY not a class above him. But really, this is like comparing Peyton Manning to Tom Brady, but not at that level.

Peyton is much better than Tom Brady. Tom Brady has always had a great team around him. Peyton hasnt. If all things were equal, Peyton Manning is a much better quarterback than Tom Brady is.

dougdirt
08-09-2007, 12:55 AM
I think he's in a class above Bruce. I still fell he'll be an All-Star next year and every year after that for the next 10 years.

Well thats fine and all, but you said that Jay hasnt hit as well as Justin this year, and that is clearly not the case, or even close to it. Justin played in the California League while Jay was in the FSL. Thats like playing in Cincinnati and playing in San Diego..... and Jay still had a higher OPS in A+.

Dan
08-09-2007, 09:58 AM
I think he's in a class above Bruce. I still fell he'll be an All-Star next year and every year after that for the next 10 years.

I have to somewhat agree here. The one thing that concerns me about Bruce, and that I think will limit him just a bit in the majors, is his K/BB ratio. It's not the fact he strikes out a lot (that's a different discussion and I tend to fall into the camp that Ks aren't different than any other out), but that he doesn't offset the Ks with BBs. To me, a great determining factor between a serviceable MLer and a super-star is the K/BB ratio. The closer it is to 1 or more, the more likely the player is to be in that super-star class.

To me, Bruce is going to be more like Geoff Jenkins than Larry Walker in his ML career. That's not a knock on Bruce, mind you, just an analysis of his minor-league #'s.

BRM
08-09-2007, 10:18 AM
Because we're not in a pennant race and he's not going to be as good as Upton, though others differ. But, he hasn't hit as well as Upton has this year. But, the way Bruce is playing, he'd probably hit well whenever he is brought up.

That's where you're wrong, my friend. The Reds think they are in a pennant race. No room for rookies like Bruce and Votto when the team is chasing down the Central leaders. ;)

Johnny Footstool
08-09-2007, 11:00 AM
Bruce will be called up in September.

That is, assuming Krivsky isn't still in "Win Now" mode. :(

dougdirt
08-09-2007, 12:42 PM
I have to somewhat agree here. The one thing that concerns me about Bruce, and that I think will limit him just a bit in the majors, is his K/BB ratio. It's not the fact he strikes out a lot (that's a different discussion and I tend to fall into the camp that Ks aren't different than any other out), but that he doesn't offset the Ks with BBs. To me, a great determining factor between a serviceable MLer and a super-star is the K/BB ratio. The closer it is to 1 or more, the more likely the player is to be in that super-star class.

To me, Bruce is going to be more like Geoff Jenkins than Larry Walker in his ML career. That's not a knock on Bruce, mind you, just an analysis of his minor-league #'s.

Geoff Jenkins? Really? Becuase he doesn't walk a ton? You do know that Jay Bruce is 20 and in AAA right? Geoff Jenkins didn't get to AAA until he was 23, and even then he posted a .717 OPS the first time around. I am not saying Geoff Jenkins is a bad player or anything, but I cant see any type of comparison between the two as hitters at all outside of a walk rate.

But if we are going to truly do an analysis of Bruce's minor league numbers, I suggest we actually look at them. Highest OPS for a 20 year old or younger in the FSL with 100 at bats over the last 6 seasons. David Wright, Joe Mauer, Hanley Ramirez, Miguel Cabrera and Matt Kemp all also qualified. He then went to AA and posted an OPS over 1.000 as a 20 year old. He is now in AAA as a 20 year old and is posting an OPS of .973. You aren't going to find guys his age doing what he is doing. So looking at it statistically, or really almost any other way, I don't see how Geoff Jenkins is someone you can possible come up with.

Eric_Davis
08-09-2007, 01:08 PM
Peyton is much better than Tom Brady. Tom Brady has always had a great team around him. Peyton hasnt. If all things were equal, Peyton Manning is a much better quarterback than Tom Brady is.

Manning is no where near as good as Brady.

Brady is in a class by himself, perhaps the greatest quarterback to ever play the game. Manning is just another Marino, not that there's anything wrong with that.

Danny Serafini
08-09-2007, 01:13 PM
Manning is no where near as good as Brady.

Brady is in a class by himself, perhaps the greatest quarterback to ever play the game. Manning is just another Marino, not that there's anything wrong with that.

Sorry to drag the thread off track, but you can't be serious! Brady is the most overrated player in football today. He's efficient and doesn't make mistakes, but he's not the guy who can put a team on his back and carry it. He rode a very good defense and a great coaching staff to three Super Bowls. Two minutes left, I'll take Manning over Brady any time.

Eric_Davis
08-09-2007, 01:16 PM
Peyton is much better than Tom Brady. Tom Brady has always had a great team around him. Peyton hasnt. If all things were equal, Peyton Manning is a much better quarterback than Tom Brady is.

You couldn't be more wrong about the statement that Brady has always had a better team around him.

Manning has had his entire career Marvin Harrison...and he's had Reggie Wayne for about 5 years now, and he had Brandon Stokely his whole career....oh, and some dude named Edgerin James, and Brady has had nothing but waiver-wire pickups and Kevin Faulk.

The offensive lines of both clubs have been a contrast in talent every year. Where the Pats changed players every time someone threatened to make any kind of money at all, the Colts kept the best players they could find and protected Manning at all costs. Brady constantly scrambled for his life, or because of his absolute genius, would call plays that would offset the weaknesses of his line and play to their strengths. Manning couldn't hit the broadside of a barn on a rollout, and he panics whenever he does roll out.

BRM
08-09-2007, 01:17 PM
Manning has had his entire career Marvin Harrison...and he's had Reggie Wayne for about 5 years now, and he had Brandon Stokely his whole career....oh, and some dude named Edgerin James, and Brady has had nothing but waiver-wire pickups and Kevin Faulk.

And no defense. Defense is pretty important in the NFL.

Eric_Davis
08-09-2007, 01:17 PM
Sorry to drag the thread off track, but you can't be serious! Brady is the most overrated player in football today. He's efficient and doesn't make mistakes, but he's not the guy who can put a team on his back and carry it. He rode a very good defense and a great coaching staff to three Super Bowls. Two minutes left, I'll take Manning over Brady any time.


All that does is show me that you know nothing at all about football.

RedsManRick
08-09-2007, 01:22 PM
All that does is show me that you know nothing at all about football.

Limiting it to just the things which are under their control, make the argument that Brady is better. It's not Manning OR Brady's fault that the Pats allow nearly 10 points/game fewer. With the Pats defense, Manning could have had 2-3 championships right now.

Brady is a great QB and a HoF. But he's Joe Montana to Peyton's Elway. You have to be very careful when comparing them to not give Brady credit he doesn't deserve. What some people call Brady's intangibles, I call defense and luck.

Danny Serafini
08-09-2007, 01:37 PM
All that does is show me that you know nothing at all about football.

Being as you didn't refute anything I wrote I'll assume you just couldn't and resorted to a weak one liner.

Chip R
08-09-2007, 01:41 PM
If you guys want to talk football, take it to non-baseball.

dougdirt
08-09-2007, 02:13 PM
If you guys want to talk football, take it to non-baseball.

http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=61386

Just for those who want to continue the discussion.