View Full Version : Should the trainers have pulled Dave Ross sooner?

08-13-2007, 03:12 PM
From today's Under the Knife column by Will Carroll at Baseball Prospectus (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6583):

"Watching the Reds (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/team_audit.php?team=CIN)-Padres (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/team_audit.php?team=SDN) game yesterday, I wasn't surprised when David Ross (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/pecota/rossda01.php) got plowed by Mike Cameron (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/pecota/camermi01.php) on a close play at the plate. It was not--as the Reds announcer implied--a dirty play. Cameron didn't explode into him; he just dropped a shoulder rather than sliding, an accepted but dangerous play. Ross got the worst of it when Cameron's shoulder caught him on the chin of his goalie mask. It was driven back into his jaw and popped up and off his head. As Ross dropped, it was clear on the replays that his eyes closed, but it was also clear on the original play that Ross did what many trainers call "locking out." The arms seize and go rigid, often directly in front of the body at chest level. When that occurs, the player has lost consciousness and by definition is now in Grade II on the concussion scale. So after several minutes passed with Ross on the ground, then slowly sitting up, and finally coming to his feet and making a couple wobbly steps, how did the trainers decide to let him stay in the game? Ross made it through the inning, but the risk he took--being in a situation where the ball was coming at him at 90mph and the concussion could easily have been exacerbated--makes me wonder what the trainers saw there."

Big Klu
08-13-2007, 03:26 PM
I would not be surprised to see David Ross go on the disabled list. Medical staffs don't mess around with concussions anymore.

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08-13-2007, 04:15 PM
He should've been pulled sooner, but if you saw the game, he really appeared to be okay after he got up. He took some catches and even singled the next inning. They pulled him very soon after. I don't think the time he was in after the concussion vastly affected him. Although I'm not a doctor so I guess I shouldn't assume.

Always Red
08-13-2007, 04:30 PM
It didn't look to me like he ever lost consciousness (having your eyes shut when getting hit by Mike Cameron does not count as losing consciousness), and as fopv1 noted, he did get right back up.

I think they took him out at the right time; Billy Hatcher realized he "wasn't quite right in the head." (Movie reference, anyone?)

I saw it "live" on TV, and at first blush, it didn't look like he got hit very hard. It wasn't until I saw WHERE he got hit that the wooziness made sense.

I hope this doesn't affect Ross in the future at plays at the plate. He struggled with those last year, and has done a very nice job with them this year.

I hope Ross comes back soon.

08-13-2007, 04:32 PM
I was wondering what Hatcher saw and was surprised the announcers didn't pursue it. Was he wobbly coming around first? Did he just shake his head as if he was still trying to clear cobwebs?

08-13-2007, 05:09 PM
I kept seeing (in my mind) the Rose collision in the AS game way back when and what it did to that catcher (can't remember his name).

Anyway, having been around a few concussions in my time, I was concerned immediately because of some of his reactions. Ross is tough, but he took one heckuva jolt. When they let him stay in the game I was shocked. On the single, he seemed disoriented (to me) and once Billy Hatcher took a look at him, he immediately was taken out (as he should have been).

A judgment call, no doubt.

08-13-2007, 05:17 PM
I kept seeing (in my mind) the Rose collision in the AS game way back when and what it did to that catcher (can't remember his name).

Ray Fosse

08-13-2007, 05:58 PM
Ray Fosse
Nice to see that at least some of your memories haven't been robbed by age... :)

08-13-2007, 06:00 PM
The way his head snapped back into the ground made me believe, like Will Carrol indicated, that he was knocked out. It looked like a boxer catching one clean on the chin to me. I couldn't believe they let him stay in the game to catch at that point.

08-13-2007, 06:02 PM
Ray Fosse

Thanks, RFS.

Old brain doesn't work well anymore.

08-13-2007, 06:14 PM
Thanks, RFS.

Old brain doesn't work well anymore.

Fosse is the A's announcer

wally post
08-13-2007, 06:46 PM
Great dancer too.

08-13-2007, 06:49 PM
Great dancer too.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Yeah, so was his cousin Bob.

Team Clark
08-14-2007, 12:58 AM
Maybe that hard hit from Cameron will keep him from swinging from his heels and return to early 2006 form. Just sayin'... Speedy recovery Dave!!