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Johnny Footstool
08-22-2007, 09:47 AM
http://www.nbcsports.com/portal/site/nbcsports/menuitem.6f806e473b4cb158fb00ec22493c2d04/?vgnextoid=f47d0bfb78b84110VgnVCM10000075c1d240RCR D


Willie Mays making that over-the-shoulder catch. Brooks Robinson barehanding a bunt. Roberto Clemente unleashing a rifle throw.

Think of the most spectacular fielding plays in baseball history and those spring to mind. They're also what helped put those greats on the all-time Rawlings Gold Glove team released Wednesday.

Big Red Machine teammates Johnny Bench and Joe Morgan, glove whiz Ozzie Smith and current stars Ken Griffey Jr. and Greg Maddux were picked in the fan voting.

Plus, on the 50th anniversary of the first Gold Glove awards, there was a surprise among the big names: Wes Parker, a defensive ace in the 1960s and early 1970s, beat out the likes of Don Mattingly and Keith Hernandez at first base.

"I'm thrilled to be recognized as one of those who worked hard at what is an under-appreciated skill," Parker said. "I'm particularly pleased to be the lone representative of the Dodgers and the only awardee who is not and will not be in the Hall of Fame. This is my Hall of Fame."

The nine winners have combined to earn 100 Gold Gloves, which are chosen annually by major league managers and coaches.

Nearly 1 million votes for the all-time team were received online, through the mail and in person at sporting goods stores.

Robinson drew the highest vote total of any player with 61 percent. He won a record-tying 16 Gold Gloves at third base for Baltimore and was the MVP of the 1970 World Series, largely because of his diving stops, backhanded plays and accurate throws.

The closest vote came for the third outfield spot, where Cincinnati's Griffey (9 percent) edged out Jim Edmonds of the St. Louis Cardinals.

Mays (23 percent) -- his great grab in the 1954 World Series came three years before the first Gold Gloves were awarded, but still shows up in the highlight reels -- and Clemente (21 percent) made it easily.

Andruw Jones, Ichiro Suzuki, Paul Blair and Curt Flood were among the other outfielders up for consideration. A panel of baseball experts chosen by Rawlings trimmed the list of more than 250 Gold Glove winners to a ballot of 50.

Morgan also won in a narrow election. Known for his quickness in the AstroTurf era, he got 27 percent at second base and finished ahead of Roberto Alomar (22 percent), Ryne Sandberg (21 percent) and Bill Mazeroski (19 percent).

Maddux, tied with Robinson and Jim Kaat with 16 Gold Gloves, got 50 percent of the 974,284 votes. The San Diego ace with the catlike reflexes on comebackers beat out Kaat and Bob Gibson among pitchers.

The acrobatic Smith (56 percent) outdistanced Derek Jeter and Omar Vizquel at shortstop. The popular Jeter certainly boosted his chances with that into-the-seats diving catch against Boston and his backhanded flip in the playoffs to nip Oakland.

"It truly is an honor to stand with the very best defensive players," said Smith, who won 13 Gold Gloves at shortstop. "With so many great players, it's almost impossible to pick the best at each position."

Bench, famed for rocket throws that cut down would-be basestealers, drew 59 percent to top Ivan Rodriguez and Bob Boone at catcher.

Parker got 53 percent at first base. He won six Gold Gloves in his nine-year career and finished ahead of Mattingly, who got nine Gloves, and Hernandez, whose 11 Gloves are a record at the position.

To recap the fan voting:

C - Johnny Bench
1B - Wes Parker
2B - Joe Morgan
3B - Brooks Robinson
SS - Ozzie Smith
OF - Willie Mays
OF - Roberto Clemente
OF - Ken Griffey Jr.
P - Gred Maddux

The fact that Jeter took second at SS exemplifies how a few memorable defensive plays can make someone overlook a lifetime of mediocrity with the glove. I'm surprised by Parker, though -- maybe Dodger fans stuffed the ballot box.

bucksfan2
08-22-2007, 10:14 AM
Could Ozzie Smith be the most over rated player? He stole several gold gloves from Larkin during Larkin's career. He began after Conception's prime, he wasn't that great of an offensive force. Is his HOF career based upon his flair rather than his actual ability?

cumberlandreds
08-22-2007, 10:22 AM
To recap the fan voting:

C - Johnny Bench
1B - Wes Parker
2B - Joe Morgan
3B - Brooks Robinson
SS - Ozzie Smith
OF - Willie Mays
OF - Roberto Clemente
OF - Ken Griffey Jr.
P - Gred Maddux

The fact that Jeter took second at SS exemplifies how a few memorable defensive plays can make someone overlook a lifetime of mediocrity with the glove. I'm surprised by Parker, though -- maybe Dodger fans stuffed the ballot box.[/QUOTE]

What? No Jim Edmonds! ;)

I generally agree with this list. Although I don't remember seeing Parker or have ever seen highlights of any defensive plays by him. I think I may have voted for Hernandez at 1st.

Johnny Footstool
08-22-2007, 11:10 AM
Could Ozzie Smith be the most over rated player? He stole several gold gloves from Larkin during Larkin's career. He began after Conception's prime, he wasn't that great of an offensive force. Is his HOF career based upon his flair rather than his actual ability?

No, he wasn't overrated. Ozzie's defense was legitimately great. He probably did steal the 1990 Gold Glove from Larkin, but Gold Gloves are a joke anyway.

Roy Tucker
08-22-2007, 11:31 AM
Trouble is with these lists is that Golden Gloves tend to favor the offensive player. I'd like to see more love for defensive players without the stellar offensive stats like Gary Pettis, Graig Nettles, and Jim Sundberg.

I'm glad to see Morgan on the list, but I'd put Frank White and Maz over Joe. White had phenomenal range and Maz turned two faster than anyone else around.

Keith Hernandez was the best first baseman I've ever seen bar none. When he was playing, the difference between him and the rest of the 1B players in MLB was light-years.

And yeah, Ozzie was really something. Barry was an excellent fielder and may have lost 2-3 GGs that he deserved while Ozzie was at the tail end of his career, but Ozzie in his prime was just amazing. And his prime lasted a long time.

dougdirt
08-22-2007, 11:53 AM
The simple fact that Derek Jeter was even on the ballot of shortstops to be voted on almost makes this entire list moot. Derek Jeter has been one of the worst defensive shortstops every year of his career, yet somehow makes it onto the ballot for best SS of all time.....

Caseyfan21
08-22-2007, 12:07 PM
No "Manos De Oro" on the list? Can't be legit...

RedsBaron
08-22-2007, 12:44 PM
Trouble is with these lists is that Golden Gloves tend to favor the offensive player. I'd like to see more love for defensive players without the stellar offensive stats like Gary Pettis, Graig Nettles, and Jim Sundberg.

I'm glad to see Morgan on the list, but I'd put Frank White and Maz over Joe. White had phenomenal range and Maz turned two faster than anyone else around.

Keith Hernandez was the best first baseman I've ever seen bar none. When he was playing, the difference between him and the rest of the 1B players in MLB was light-years.

And yeah, Ozzie was really something. Barry was an excellent fielder and may have lost 2-3 GGs that he deserved while Ozzie was at the tail end of his career, but Ozzie in his prime was just amazing. And his prime lasted a long time.

I would probably have gone with Maz at secondbase. I never liked Hernandez as a person, but he would have been my pick at firstbase. And, yes, Ozzie gets the nod at short.
I have no argument with Mays and Clemente, but I'm not as sure about the third outfield spot (other than it would not be Edmonds). Junior was great in his prime, but so was Richie Ashburn, Paul Blair and Andruw Jones.

Cyclone792
08-22-2007, 12:57 PM
I would probably have gone with Maz at secondbase. I never liked Hernandez as a person, but he would have been my pick at firstbase. And, yes, Ozzie gets the nod at short.
I have no argument with Mays and Clemente, but I'm not as sure about the third outfield spot (other than it would not be Edmonds). Junior was great in his prime, but so was Richie Ashburn, Paul Blair and Andruw Jones.

I've have gone with Ashburn and Speaker over Griffey and Clemente, and it would have been humorous to watch casual fans scratch their heads trying to figure out who Tris Speaker was.

Wes Parker actually isn't a bad choice at first base, IMO, and Hernandez should definitely be considered. John Olerud should be up there too, I think, and may be my choice. Jimmie Foxx, Bill Terry, and Frank McCormick were supposedly pretty decent with the leather back in their day too.

My team would probably look like this ...

C - Johnny Bench
1B - Eh, I'll take John Olerud
2B - Bill Mazeroski
3B - Brooks Robinson
SS - Ozzie Smith
OF - Richie Ashburn
OF - Andruw Jones
OF - Willie Mays
P - Greg Maddux

RedsBaron
08-22-2007, 01:04 PM
I've have gone with Ashburn and Speaker over Griffey and Clemente, and it would have been humorous to watch casual fans scratch their heads trying to figure out who Tris Speaker was.

Wes Parker actually isn't a bad choice at first base, IMO, and Hernandez should definitely be considered. John Olerud should be up there too, I think, and may be my choice. Jimmie Foxx, Bill Terry, and Frank McCormick were supposedly pretty decent with the leather back in their day too.

My team would probably look like this ...

C - Johnny Bench
1B - Eh, I'll take John Olerud
2B - Bill Mazeroski
3B - Brooks Robinson
SS - Ozzie Smith
OF - Richie Ashburn
OF - Tris Speaker
OF - Willie Mays
P - Greg Maddux

I understood the poll to be limited to the last fifty years, encompassing the era in which "Gold Gloves" were awarded, so I didn't consider someone such as Tris Speaker.
Richie Ashburn did play during the era of Gold Gloves that began in 1957. Maybe he was slightly past his prime by then, maybe not, but here is the total number of Gold Gloves he won: zero. Hard to believe.

Cyclone792
08-22-2007, 01:10 PM
I understood the poll to be limited to the last fifty years, encompassing the era in which "Gold Gloves" were awarded, so I didn't consider someone such as Tris Speaker.
Richie Ashburn did play during the era of Gold Gloves that began in 1957. Maybe he was slightly past his prime by then, maybe not, but here is the total number of Gold Gloves he won: zero. Hard to believe.

You're absolutely right on the last 50 years, and I had completely forgotten about that. In that case, I'll remove Speaker and install Andruw Jones in the outfield. Jones, especially during his peak, is probably the greatest defensive outfielder I've ever seen.

RedsBaron
08-22-2007, 01:11 PM
To anyone wondering why Cyclone and I have both mentioned Richie Ashburn, compare his putouts per season with those of Willie Mays. From 1954 through 1958, Mays had 448, 407, 413, 422 and 429 putouts a season-that's great. Ashburn in those same seasons had 483, 387, 503, 502 and 495-that's beyond great. The only season in which Willie had more putouts was 1955, when Ashburn missed a bunch of games.
Those weren't Ashburn's best season for putouts, either. Prior to 1954 he had seasons when he had 514 and 538 putouts.

VR
08-22-2007, 01:31 PM
Too bad ED couldn't have had a healthy career. He would have redefined the standard for OFers.

Matt700wlw
08-22-2007, 07:45 PM
No Adam Dunn consideration? :evil:

camisadelgolf
08-22-2007, 08:03 PM
Wow, four Reds. What a great franchise this has been. If only I were born a few decades earlier . . .

Matt700wlw
08-22-2007, 08:04 PM
Wow, four Reds. What a great franchise this has been. If only I were born a few decades earlier . . .

If I grew up with my parents, it would have been fun! Good music! Good baseball! Good drugs...oh wait, I didn't need to be around in the 70's for that :D