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Buckeye33
09-05-2007, 10:12 PM
I was just looking over some of the scores from tonight and saw Ryan Braun hit another homer.

I started to think about if there could possibly be a player in the past who has had a better first 365 ABs in the majors than this kid. I'm sure there's some website where you can look that kinda info up but I don't know it.

Currently: .334/.380/1.023 28 HR 76 RBI 21 2B 5 3B 70 R 14 SB

Projected at 600 ABs:

46 HR 126 RBI 35 2B 8 3B 116 R 23 SB

It's simply sickening what this kid is doing to major league pitching this quick.

Now to only hope that Bruce can do something similar whenever he comes up permanetly.

fearofpopvol1
09-05-2007, 10:14 PM
Bear in mind he was the 4th overall pick in the 2005 draft and played college ball at Miami. So, it's not like he's a 20th rounder or something.

I do agree though. His numbers are ridiculous. He has to be the unanimous rookie of the year.

oneupper
09-05-2007, 10:23 PM
Would he be the first Jewish ROY?

TOBTTReds
09-05-2007, 10:26 PM
Bear in mind he was the 4th overall pick in the 2005 draft and played college ball at Miami. So, it's not like he's a 20th rounder or something.

I do agree though. His numbers are ridiculous. He has to be the unanimous rookie of the year.

I don't think anyone, not even his mom, would have guessed he would do this. Doesn't matter if he was the undoubted #1 amateur of all time, you just don't come in and hit like that.

Cyclone792
09-05-2007, 10:33 PM
Well, with some small research here's some candidates ...

Albert Pujols, 2001: .323/.391/.594/.985 and in 359 1st half PAs (OWP was .717 for full season)
Ted Williams, 1939: .327/.436/.609/1.045 and .736 OWP his first 677 PAs (no splits for 1939, unfortunately)
Jimmie Foxx, 1925-1928: .331/.410/.538/.948 and .695 OWP his first 663 PAs (no splits for those seasons)
Joe Jackson, 1908-1911: .394/.452/.567/1.019 and .837 OWP his first 768 PAs (again, no splits)
Stan Musial, 1941-1942: .325/.402/.498/.900 and .757 OWP his first 585 PAs (no splits)
Rogers Hornsby, 1915-1916: .306/.360/.428/.787 and .687 OWP his first 611 PAs (no splits, and remember Hornsby's early seasons were in an immense pitcher's era)
Johnny Mize, 1936: .329/.402/.577/.979 and .770 OWP his first 469 PAs (no splits, but this is a very good comp)
Paul Waner, 1926: .336/.413/.528/.941 and .676 OWP his first 611 PAs (no splits)
Frank Robinson, 1956: .290/.379/.558/.936 and .658 OWP his first 668 PAs (Robinson heated up the latter part of the season though; .862 OPS first half and .952 OPS second half)
Willie McCovey, 1959-1960: .288/.382/.549/.931 with a .748 OWP his first 526 PAs

OWP is Offensive Winning Percentage, which is what a team's winning percentage would be with an entire offense of that one player, average pitching, and average defense.

That's just a quick search which turned up some similar comps to what Braun's been doing this season. I'm sure there's more, but I had to search by players individually so I tried to think of guys who I knew got off to great starts.

It'll probably be easier to find better comps at the end of the season. Braun will probably finish with around 500 plate appearances this season so guys like Pujols, Williams, Foxx, Musial, McCovey would all have a similar amount of plate appearances as Braun.

fearofpopvol1
09-05-2007, 10:43 PM
I don't think anyone, not even his mom, would have guessed he would do this. Doesn't matter if he was the undoubted #1 amateur of all time, you just don't come in and hit like that.

Right, but what I'm saying is that it's not like he came out of nowhere. He was a highly touted pick

BCubb2003
09-05-2007, 10:48 PM
Frank Robinson might be close, but I doubt he quite makes it.

dougdirt
09-05-2007, 10:52 PM
Lets keep in mind though that Braun is 23 years old. Some players had just as incredible years, if not better when they were 23. Pujols for example hit .359/.439/.667 as a 23 year old.

Braun's season has been incredible though, no doubt.

RedsManRick
09-05-2007, 10:55 PM
Think of all the great offensive players in the game. How many of them were pretty darn great from the very start? Braun has been extremely impressive, but the good ones always hit the ground running.

BCubb2003
09-05-2007, 10:56 PM
Lets keep in mind though that Braun is 23 years old. Some players had just as incredible years, if not better when they were 23. Pujols for example hit .359/.439/.667 as a 23 year old.

Braun's season has been incredible though, no doubt.

And Frank Robinson had 130 homers before he was 23.

Cyclone792
09-05-2007, 11:01 PM
Lets keep in mind though that Braun is 23 years old. Some players had just as incredible years, if not better when they were 23. Pujols for example hit .359/.439/.667 as a 23 year old.

Braun's season has been incredible though, no doubt.

Pujols had a 189 OPS+ in 2003 when he was 23-years-old. That's fantastic, but it wasn't unprecedented, nor the best age 23 seasons.

Those honors go to Ted Williams and Ty Cobb. Not bad company, eh?

Williams hit .356/.499/.648/1.147 with a 217 OPS+ at age 23 in 1942 (his ridiculous 1941 season came at age 22!). Cobb hit .383/.456/.551/1.007 with a 207 OPS+ at age 23 in 1910 (for comparison, the AL league OPS in 1910 was a whopping .621).

dougdirt
09-05-2007, 11:04 PM
And Frank Robinson had 130 homers before he was 23.

Unless my math is bad, Robinson turned 23 on August 31st, 1958.... which would have left him with 98 HR by the time he turned 23.

SteelSD
09-05-2007, 11:27 PM
The interesting thing is that had the Brewers not questioned Braun's fielding (and rightly so) after his ridiculous spring training this season Braun, rather than Prince Fielder, might have been the Brewers' leading MVP candidate.

Also interesting is that since being called up Braun has received the lion's share of time in the 3-slot, right in front of Prince Fielder. Methinks that explains the ONE Intentional Walk Braun has received while demolishing opposing pitchers. I'm not a big fan of a "protection" theory when applied to most players, but the Brewers have placed a young, powerful Braun in the best possible position to succeed because Fielder is a really really scary alternative.

BCubb2003
09-05-2007, 11:30 PM
Unless my math is bad, Robinson turned 23 on August 31st, 1958.... which would have left him with 98 HR by the time he turned 23.

Yes, you're right. I was probably off by a year.

mbgrayson
09-06-2007, 12:42 AM
Then there is the Kid, Ken Griffey Jr.

He had 132 HRs by the end of his 'age 23' season, and played 5 years in the majors.

Topcat
09-06-2007, 01:22 AM
Just Curious if anyone can show me the details of Fred Lynn's first year?

Cyclone792
09-06-2007, 01:35 AM
Just Curious if anyone can show me the details of Fred Lynn's first year?

Lynn's a great comparison to Braun. Excellent catch, Topcat.


FRED LYNN

1974-1975

YEAR TEAM AGE G AB R H 2B 3B HR HR% RBI BB SO SB CS AVG SLG OBA OPS
1974 Red Sox 22 15 43 5 18 2 2 2 4.65 10 6 6 0 0 .419 .698 .490 1.188
1975 Red Sox 23 145 528 103 175 47 7 21 3.98 105 62 90 10 5 .331 .566 .401 .967

TOTALS 160 571 108 193 49 9 23 4.03 115 68 96 10 5 .338 .576 .408 .984
LG AVERAGE 510 64 132 21 3 11 2.23 60 52 74 10 6 .258 .379 .328 .706
POS AVERAGE 510 70 134 22 5 9 1.82 54 48 75 20 9 .264 .380 .328 .708


YEAR TEAM RC RCAA RCAP OWP RC/G TB EBH ISO SEC BPA IBB HBP SAC SF GIDP OUTS PA POS
1974 Red Sox 15 11 10 .909 15.58 30 6 .279 .419 .725 2 1 0 1 0 26 51 LF
1975 Red Sox 119 53 53 .743 8.43 299 75 .235 .371 .598 10 3 6 6 11 381 605 CF

TOTALS 134 64 63 .763 8.89 329 81 .238 .375 .608 12 4 6 7 11 407 656
LG AVERAGE 64 0 0 .500 4.25 193 35 .121 .242 .422 4 3 6 4 12 407 575
POS AVERAGE 65 1 0 .499 4.28 194 36 .116 .249 .432 3 3 7 4 11 407 572

Jpup
09-06-2007, 07:04 AM
Which is more amazing? Josh Hamilton (.914 OPS) or Braun? Tough choice. :)

I just checked out some stats and Hanley Ramirez has an OPS of .952 at the age of 23. Miggy Cabrera is just 24 and we know what he has done. Hunter Pence has had an excellent year as well. Braun certainly is the ROY in the NL. Just wait until he learns to take a few walks.

Puffy
09-06-2007, 10:03 AM
Miguel Cabrera just became the third youngest ever to reach 500 RBI - - only Ted Williams and Mel Ott were quicker.

Nice company.

oneupper
09-06-2007, 10:06 AM
Miguel Cabrera just became the third youngest ever to reach 500 RBI - - only Ted Williams and Mel Ott were quicker.

Nice company.

Miguelito's only threat to his career is himself (dude likes to party and eat).

VR
09-06-2007, 12:07 PM
Braun has been fantastic.

Hamilton has been even more amazing, IMHO.

To put up #'s that aren't too far off Braun, and do it while;

*Being protected by Norris Hopper, Alex Gonzalez or Ryan Freel

*Not playing baseball for 4 years, let alone facing MLB quality pitching consistently.



Scary to think how good Hammy might become.

It's bizarre to me why they aren't giving him as many ab's against righties as humanly possible. Because when he turns that corner...it will be very very bad for the NL central.

fearofpopvol1
09-06-2007, 01:49 PM
Miguel Cabrera just became the third youngest ever to reach 500 RBI - - only Ted Williams and Mel Ott were quicker.

Nice company.

and the youngest right-hander ever to do it.

Eric_Davis
09-06-2007, 06:12 PM
I prefer the rookie year of Joe DiMaggio.

138 Games

132 Runs

206 Hits

44 Doubles

15 Triples

29 Homeruns

125 RBI's

24 Walks

39 Strikeouts

367 Total Bases (Through 9/5, exactly 138 games, also, AROD has 330 Total Bases)

.323/.352/.576

21 Years Old

22 Assists from the Outfield. 66 games in LF, 55 games in CF, 18 games in RF. (After this, never played another inning anywhere but CF.)

Batted .346 in World Series that year (1936).

Played on the winning team in the 1937, 1938, 1939, & 1941 World Series. Lost the 1942 World Series, then served in WWII for the next 3 years.

klw
09-06-2007, 06:16 PM
Well its only 265 at bats so far but don't forget about Corky Miller

Career 265 ab 51 hits 13 doubles 0 triples 6 hrs 28 rbi .192 .284 .309
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=4951

klw
09-06-2007, 06:22 PM
In a related note, Mr. Ankiel has 2 more hr's, a double a 7 rbi's so far today.

LINEDRIVER
09-06-2007, 10:29 PM
Here's some brilliant numbers racked up by Babe Ruth BEFORE he turned 24 yrs old.

As a lefty pitcher with the RedSox, he went 80-41 with a 1.09 WHIP and 2.09 ERA over 1057innings. Won 18 games at age 20, 23 games at age 21, 24 games at age 22.
Led the AL with a 1.75 ERA in 323.2 innings at the age of 21.
Threw a string of 29 2/3 consecutive scoreless innings in the 1916 & 1918 World Series.