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View Full Version : Phillies GM Gillick Calls it a Career



Unassisted
09-25-2007, 11:44 PM
http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10372256


Gillick won't remain Philly GM after next year


PHILADELPHIA -- Phillies general manager Pat Gillick doesn't plan to remain with the team after his three-year contract expires following next season.

"This is it for me," Gillick said in the Philadelphia Daily News. "I'll fulfill my contract. It's time to think about doing some other things in life."

The longtime baseball man will be 71 by the time his contract is up. He wasn't immediately available to reporters before the Phillies played Atlanta.

Gillick's situation could affect manager Charlie Manuel, who is in the final season of his contract. Manuel has done an outstanding job keeping an injury-depleted team in the playoff race.

The Phillies were tied with San Diego for the NL wild-card lead and trailed the East-leading Mets by two games.

Manuel insists he's not concerned about his job status, and he won't talk about a contract extension until after the season.

jmcclain19
09-26-2007, 12:46 AM
That doesn't bode well for the Phillies.

Gillick usually gets out the door right before the plane crashes into the mountain - Toronto, Seattle & Baltimore know this scenario quite well.

KronoRed
09-26-2007, 02:36 AM
People about to get expensive?

M2
09-26-2007, 11:35 AM
That doesn't bode well for the Phillies.

Gillick usually gets out the door right before the plane crashes into the mountain - Toronto, Seattle & Baltimore know this scenario quite well.

He's certainly been a master of timing. Putting together some semblance of a pitching staff will be a hard chore for his successor.

Joseph
09-26-2007, 11:49 AM
I was listening to XM this morning, and he said thats not completely true.

He said his contract is up and he doesn't foresee signing another, but that nothing is out of the realm of possibility or set in stone.

princeton
09-28-2007, 10:31 AM
Gillick usually gets out the door right before the plane crashes into the mountain.

note to owners: quit replacing pilot with stewardesses

lollipopcurve
09-28-2007, 11:36 AM
Gillick has had a great career. Many thought he was a poor hire in Philly because of his age (gotta have those younger numbers guys, you know), but look at them now. You can be sure Phillie owners are pleased.

M2
09-28-2007, 12:53 PM
Gillick has had a great career. Many thought he was a poor hire in Philly because of his age (gotta have those younger numbers guys, you know), but look at them now. You can be sure Phillie owners are pleased.

I'd think their level of satisfaction will be wholly tied to what happens over the next three or four days. This may be the best shot that franchise gets for a while.

I'd also say that Gillick doesn't deserve much credit for this team. He really hasn't added much to it outside of Aaron Rowand. It's success this season has come in spite of the pitching debacle he's engineered.

lollipopcurve
09-28-2007, 02:27 PM
I'd also say that Gillick doesn't deserve much credit for this team. He really hasn't added much to it outside of Aaron Rowand. It's success this season has come in spite of the pitching debacle he's engineered.

Didn't he quickly trade Thome, opening 1B for Howard? The LTC for Utley. The conversion of Myers to closer. Stabilizing the rotation (trade for Lohse, call-up of Kendrick) so that they could make a pennant push. Victorino -- I think he was a Gillick acquisition? I'd say he gets a ton of credit.

M2
09-28-2007, 03:29 PM
Didn't he quickly trade Thome, opening 1B for Howard? The LTC for Utley. The conversion of Myers to closer. Stabilizing the rotation (trade for Lohse, call-up of Kendrick) so that they could make a pennant push. Victorino -- I think he was a Gillick acquisition? I'd say he gets a ton of credit.

He gets credit for using guys he inherited? If you want to throw credit around for that, thank Ed Wade (he picked up Victorino too).

I'd say Gillick deserves credit for trading Thome for Rowand after Howard won the ROY. I give him no credit for trading Bob Abreu for nothing. Utley's LTC is nice in the future, but it wasn't like he was in any danger of leaving the team this decade.

On the pitching front, Lohse has been a poor pitcher for them. He's not a complete disaster and I guess that'll do the trick well enough when you're getting 6 runs a game in support. Yet he's only had 4 quality starts in 11 tries and he's only reached the 7 IP mark once, innings would be helpful for a team like the Phils with such a shaky bullpen. Freddy Garcia got injured. Adam Eaton's been a cosmic disaster. Moyer's pitched like a guy who's going to retire after the season. Durbin's been of little help. Kendrick was the best they had going on the farm so they called him up and, frankly, he's been lucky to a spectacular extent. I know for a fact Phillies fans aren't quibbling with luck at this juncture, but let's not pretend his callup was done out of anything but necessity or that it constitutes prescient general managing.

When you look at it, Gillick hasn't added much talent. He's basically been a caretaker and the franchise hasn't played any better than it did the three seasons before he got the job.

lollipopcurve
09-28-2007, 04:24 PM
On the pitching front, Lohse has been a poor pitcher for them. He's not a complete disaster and I guess that'll do the trick well enough when you're getting 6 runs a game in support. Yet he's only had 4 quality starts in 11 tries and he's only reached the 7 IP mark once, innings would be helpful for a team like the Phils with such a shaky bullpen.

I count 10 starts (his first was interrupted by a line drive on the arm) and using the quality start as a measure for the success or failure of those starts is a bit disingenuous.

For example, I have no problem with a 6.1 inning, 4 run start on 8/8, where he entered the 7th with a 6-3 lead, got another out, gave up a run, but still got the win over Dontrelle Willis.

Nor do I turn up my nose at his 6.2 inning, 4 run start on 8/19, when the 4th run he gave up, the tying run, was delivered when a reliever gave up a 2-out double.

You pitch into the 7th and keep your team in the game, you've done your job.

His 5-inning, 3 run start in early August was serviceable.

So, I count 7 out of 10 games wherein he gave his team a chance to win. And the biggest one was his last start when he shut down the Braves. To me, that's a nice deadline pickup for a B prospect.


Kendrick was the best they had going on the farm so they called him up and, frankly, he's been lucky to a spectacular extent.

Have you watched Kendrick? The kid may not overpower, but he is tremnedously composed for a rookie and he executes well. He was by no means the clear choice to be promoted, statwise or age-wise -- he came out of AA, and they could just as easily have selected Happ, Maloney or Carrasco. In my opinion, it was a prescient choice.

We'll disagree here. I think he's steered this club out of perennial disappointment, a nice little rehab project in the final stop of a distinguished career.

Highlifeman21
09-28-2007, 04:46 PM
I give him no credit for trading Bob Abreu for nothing.

This is my measuring stick for Gillick. He gave away Bobby Abreu and Cory Lidle for absolutely nothing. And by absolutely nothing, I mean a middle of the road SS prospect when they have Jimmy Rollins locked up to a franchise player type contract at the same position.

Matt Smith ,CJ Henry, Jesus Sanchez and Carlos Monastrios. That's the return on investment for Lidle and Abreu.

Matt Smith's seen a whopping 4 IP this year for the Phillies, while being the only player in that deal that's seen any playing time at the AAA level or above. Henry stunk up the joint in A ball this year while playing in the OF (not SS), Monastrios stunk up the same joint on the mound as a teammate with Henry and Sanchez spent the majority of his year in the GCL appearing in a massive 34 games.

So, they acquire a "future SS" who's now playing OF in A ball, a catching prospect who's playing Rookie Ball, an arm in A ball that looks to have little to no ceiling, and a lefty reliever that had some success in AAA but has done nothing of merit at the MLB level. Huge return while giving away Bobby Abreu and Cory Lidle.

lollipopcurve
09-28-2007, 05:02 PM
Bobby Abreu was a salary dump. The guy had a huge contract running through this year. I believe there was a market of about 2 teams for his services.

Highlifeman21
09-28-2007, 05:14 PM
Bobby Abreu was a salary dump. The guy had a huge contract running through this year. I believe there was a market of about 2 teams for his services.

They could have afforded Abreu. They chose not to.

lollipopcurve
09-28-2007, 05:18 PM
They could have afforded Abreu. They chose not to.

So what? There's no guarantee they'd be any better with Abreu. But they're definitely richer.

M2
09-28-2007, 05:25 PM
I count 10 starts (his first was interrupted by a line drive on the arm) and using the quality start as a measure for the success or failure of those starts is a bit disingenuous.

For example, I have no problem with a 6.1 inning, 4 run start on 8/8, where he entered the 7th with a 6-3 lead, got another out, gave up a run, but still got the win over Dontrelle Willis.

Nor do I turn up my nose at his 6.2 inning, 4 run start on 8/19, when the 4th run he gave up, the tying run, was delivered when a reliever gave up a 2-out double.

You pitch into the 7th and keep your team in the game, you've done your job.

His 5-inning, 3 run start in early August was serviceable.

So, I count 7 out of 10 games wherein he gave his team a chance to win. And the biggest one was his last start when he shut down the Braves. To me, that's a nice deadline pickup for a B prospect.

I only used quality starts to point out that he was hardly lighting the world on fire. I mean, quality start is a pretty low bar.

I'm not terribly impressed by any start when the starter can't get through the 7th and the game essentially gets decided by the offense and the pen. Five innings, three runs? Blah. I mean, it works when you get six rpg in support, but don't call it good pitching. He's been functional given the run support and that beats non-functional, I just don't give "a ton of credit" for that.


Have you watched Kendrick? The kid may not overpower, but he is tremnedously composed for a rookie and he executes well.

Yes, and rarely have I seen a pitcher benefit from more at-em balls. Maybe he'll get better in the future, but the guy who's pitching for the Phillies right now is in harm's way everytime he takes the mound. It just hasn't fully found him yet.

BTW, I think poise and composure are important because he's going to have a period in his career where the balls are going to start finding holes and he'll need to keep it together when that happens.


He was by no means the clear choice to be promoted, statwise or age-wise -- he came out of AA, and they could just as easily have selected Happ, Maloney or Carrasco. In my opinion, it was a prescient choice.

Carrasco was in A ball when Kendrick came up and he's struggled in AA. Happ's had miserable control all season (1.52 WHIP and a 5.02 ERA). Kendrick was having by far the best season of anyone starting for the Phils in the upper minors with the possible exception of journeyman John Ennis. So you're basically saying it was prescient to choose Kendrick over a kid in A ball, another guy who can't find the plate and a bunch of guys having bad seasons. Maloney would have been the second choice I imagine, but Kendrick was pitching better at the time. All they did was make the obvious choice.


We'll disagree here. I think he's steered this club out of perennial disappointment, a nice little rehab project in the final stop of a distinguished career.

Steered how? They were just as good before he got there, the only difference is that this season the Mets late swoon has made it possible to win the division with 80-something wins. You're acting like Gillick acquired key players and the club is playing better baseball. He didn't and they aren't.

Highlifeman21
09-28-2007, 05:26 PM
So what? There's no guarantee they'd be any better with Abreu. But they're definitely richer.

I have no respect for a GM who runs a good player out of town, and hides behind "finances".

And I definitely beg to differ, the Phillies would be much better with Abreu. Abreu vs. the platoon of Victorino and Werth?

M2
09-28-2007, 05:30 PM
So what? There's no guarantee they'd be any better with Abreu. But they're definitely richer.

So what? I don't go to the field to watch the balance sheet. Abreu's one of the best hitters of the past decade. Obviously the Phils have a big offense without him, but had they gotten something for him, like a serviceable arm, they might have been popping champagne corks by now.

dabvu2498
09-28-2007, 05:35 PM
I have no respect for a GM who runs a good player out of town, and hides behind "finances".

And I definitely beg to differ, the Phillies would be much better with Abreu. Abreu vs. the platoon of Victorino and Werth?

Abreu in 2007 -- .811 OPS
Phillies RFs in 2007 -- .795 OPS

Is it worth $15.6 million?