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View Full Version : Let's go after Eric Gagne



SMcGavin
11-05-2007, 08:02 PM
I think Eric Gagne would be a great target for the Reds. His value was likely decreased by the perceived troubles he had in Boston, but take a look at this:

Gagne on Rangers (33 IP): 8.5 K/9, 3.5 BB/9
Gagne on Red Sox (18 IP): 9.6 K/9, 3.9 BB/9

Oh and he gave up fewer HR/9 with Boston than he did with Texas. Basically he got really unlucky in a small sample size, but it happened in a huge baseball market so everyone saw it. I would love to sign Gagne as our closer. That would give us four guys that I trust (counting Weathers, Burton, Bray). For what it's worth Gagne made $6M last season. Something like 3 years, $15M would be a good signing in my mind. I'd rather spend $5M on somebody good than $2.5M each on two Mike Stantons.

*BaseClogger*
11-05-2007, 08:06 PM
Gagne's health has to be a concern for a 3 year deal, but other than that I completely agree with your assesment...

mroby85
11-05-2007, 08:08 PM
i'd give him a shot, but i would have an incentive laden contract.

SMcGavin
11-05-2007, 08:11 PM
Gagne's health has to be a concern for a 3 year deal, but other than that I completely agree with your assesment...

Good point, $10M for 2 years would be better if we could swing it.

Jay Bruce
11-05-2007, 08:25 PM
The only concern I have about Gagne's stats is his HR/FB% last year. His was 5.2% last year. Based on him pitching in Texas and Boston, that number should have been closer to 11% last year with average luck. That said, his HR/9 would only increase to about 1 per nine, which is a fine number. So, if the Reds could get him for 7-8 million a year, it would definitely be a move to consider.

Vada Pinson Fan
11-05-2007, 09:39 PM
i'd give him a shot, but i would have an incentive laden contract.


Agreed. I think he would be a great addition to the bullpen. Let Dr. Kremcheck give him a complete physical and if Doc Hoillywood signs off on Gagne....sign him.

GoReds33
11-05-2007, 09:43 PM
This is exactly the kind of risk a small market team has to take. He might not be willing to take an incentive laiden contract though. If that's the case we may need to make significant guarantees. I don't know about you guys, but I am willing to take a few risks to get this bullpen back into shape.

*BaseClogger*
11-05-2007, 11:26 PM
as long as the risk is 2 years and not 3...

David Cubbedge
11-06-2007, 01:15 AM
I have a strong feeling we will go after him, but miss to a higher bidder. And the story continues...

BTW, this is just a feeling and not a rumor or "inside info" of any kind.

ChatterRed
11-06-2007, 08:56 AM
I said weeks ago I'd like to go after him. I think he was word down at the end of his stint with the BoSox, coming off injury.

I think if he gets in shape and we don't overwork him, he would be a great addition to our bullpen.

Screwball
11-06-2007, 10:44 AM
Gagne would dominate NL hitting. With Milton's (and Lohse's, and Cormier's) money coming off the books, the Reds can afford him. I think this is a great idea, and one that Krivsky and co. should heavily pursue.

5DOLLAR-BLEACHERBUM
11-06-2007, 11:18 AM
i'd give him a shot, but i would have an incentive laden contract.
Is it just me or has the term "incentive laden contract" popped up alot this year. Is it too much to ask for the Reds to go after pitchers who don't have a recent injury red flag. I know that the front office has been cheap in the past, but if we keep accepting this type of thing it will never change. Gagne, Matt Morris, Prior, Wood. If you are going to take these kind of risks and they don't work out I guess you havn't lost much money with a "incentive laden contract" but you probably havn't won alot of games either. Lets take a step forward with the hiring of a new manager and get some guys who we know will perform, and not guys that could perform if they stay or become healthy.

SMcGavin
11-06-2007, 12:10 PM
Is it just me or has the term "incentive laden contract" popped up alot this year. Is it too much to ask for the Reds to go after pitchers who don't have a recent injury red flag. I know that the front office has been cheap in the past, but if we keep accepting this type of thing it will never change. Gagne, Matt Morris, Prior, Wood. If you are going to take these kind of risks and they don't work out I guess you havn't lost much money with a "incentive laden contract" but you probably havn't won alot of games either. Lets take a step forward with the hiring of a new manager and get some guys who we know will perform, and not guys that could perform if they stay or become healthy.

OK, well what bullpen guys are out there are sure things who are better than Gagne? I think "guys who we know will perform" are pretty much a myth. Every signing is a risk.

5DOLLAR-BLEACHERBUM
11-07-2007, 03:14 PM
OK, well what bullpen guys are out there are sure things who are better than Gagne? I think "guys who we know will perform" are pretty much a myth. Every signing is a risk.
What im trying to say here is that if we signed Gagne to a contract and he got hurt within a month, nobody would be suprised by it. Same with Prior, Morris, Wood ect. These guys are great high risk high reward type guys but they probably are not long term answers with their injury history. Money is money and injured or not these guys are not going to be cheap considering the risk envolved. I guess what im saying is that I view "guys who we know will perform"= guys that if they got hurt it would be a shock, compared to guys that if they got hurt we would all say"we should have seen that comming"

bounty37h
11-07-2007, 03:33 PM
I said weeks ago I'd like to go after him. I think he was word down at the end of his stint with the BoSox, coming off injury.

I think if he gets in shape and we don't overwork him, he would be a great addition to our bullpen.

Word up!

SMcGavin
11-07-2007, 03:45 PM
What im trying to say here is that if we signed Gagne to a contract and he got hurt within a month, nobody would be suprised by it. Same with Prior, Morris, Wood ect. These guys are great high risk high reward type guys but they probably are not long term answers with their injury history. Money is money and injured or not these guys are not going to be cheap considering the risk envolved. I guess what im saying is that I view "guys who we know will perform"= guys that if they got hurt it would be a shock, compared to guys that if they got hurt we would all say"we should have seen that comming"

Fair enough, I understand the concern over injury risks. My question is, what pitchers on the free agent market would you like the Reds to sign who are both good and not injury risks?

Stephenk29
11-07-2007, 07:41 PM
Fair enough, I understand the concern over injury risks. My question is, what pitchers on the free agent market would you like the Reds to sign who are both good and not injury risks?


uhhh A-Rod is the only one that comes to mind that's never had injuries. Realistically though, I think Silva is the only one who isn't either horrible, injured, or just plan old.

5DOLLAR-BLEACHERBUM
11-09-2007, 11:45 AM
Fair enough, I understand the concern over injury risks. My question is, what pitchers on the free agent market would you like the Reds to sign who are both good and not injury risks?
Silva, Cordero, Glavine, Jennings, L. Hernandez, Iwase, Riske, Linebrink are a few that come to mind. Hernandez is an innings eater that coupled with Harrang, Arroyo would fit nicely in the number 4 spot to keep the bullpen fresh. Tossing Bailey in the three spot and limit his innings a bit allows the bullpen to get regulat work and stay sharp.

hippie07
11-09-2007, 12:33 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/jon_heyman/11/08/scoop.thursday/index.html

Over on SI.com, Heyman guesses what Free Agents will sign for - they're predicting Gagne at 1 year $6mil .... sounds expensive to me, but it actually sounds like the kind of gamble WK might be willing to take... you know, veteran reliever and all...

Bip Roberts
11-09-2007, 01:27 PM
Guys i know for a fact that Gagne used HGH. I really dont want to touch him.

jmac
11-09-2007, 01:52 PM
This may have already been mentioned but I heard on espn 1000 out of chicago, that they (cubs) are moving Dempster to the rotation in 08 and let Wood, Marmol, and Howry ( I think), compete for the closer's job. Apparently they are going to make a serious run at Wood which I would kind of like to see Reds aquire as a one inning specialist.

mlbfan30
11-09-2007, 02:46 PM
I think a 2 Year / 11M contract would be a reasonable offer. Gagne at 5.5 Mil a season a pretty good value based on what he is capable of. He has high K rates, has low HR rates, and is a power closer that the Reds need. He has an injury history, but that's part of what makes him a bargain. Think about it... we just have Stanton and Cormier 6M combined last year to produce negative wins... At least if Gagne is playing he will actually help and not hurt. His BABIP indicates he was very unlucky with Boston last year, and his peripherals stayed the same as when he was with Texas. With Texas he had 2.16 ERA and 1.05 WHIP

mound_patrol
11-09-2007, 03:09 PM
I vote we stay away. I'm turned off by soft tossers in the bullpen. Especially soft tossers who ended the year so badly.

mlbfan30
11-09-2007, 03:24 PM
http://baseball.bornbybits.com/plots/Eric_Gagne.html

Gagne's Fastball averages 93.24 MPH (That's not a Soft tosser)
His Curveball is 70.12 MPH
Change is 84.13 MPH

This indicates he has very good stuff. He changes his speeds by over 20MPH.... That's a Power Pitcher

mound_patrol
11-09-2007, 04:21 PM
http://baseball.bornbybits.com/plots/Eric_Gagne.html

Gagne's Fastball averages 93.24 MPH (That's not a Soft tosser)
His Curveball is 70.12 MPH
Change is 84.13 MPH

This indicates he has very good stuff. He changes his speeds by over 20MPH.... That's a Power Pitcher

I'm pretty sure he hasn't gotten close to that avg since his injuries. Gagne is now a poor mans Trevor Hoffman.

kbrake
11-09-2007, 04:27 PM
I could handle a poor mans Trevor Hoffman. He's not exactly horrible.

mlbfan30
11-09-2007, 04:29 PM
That was his avg for each pitch LAST YEAR!

hippie07
11-09-2007, 04:35 PM
Say the Reds take a chance on him... if he doesn't end up being an effective closer - would he be a waste of money??... or would you be happy w/ him as a non-closer reliever... stuff-wise and money-wise?

Jay Bruce
11-09-2007, 04:35 PM
Even as a "soft tosser" as you call him, Gagne had 8.83 K/9, and a 2.43 K/BB ratio. I don't care how the pitcher does it, but if they can strike out a batter an inning with good control and low homerun totals, they are a good pitcher. In fact, I would venture to say that Hoffman is only as effective as he is because of Petco. While his HR/9 was only 0.31, his HR/FB% was only 2.3%. Even in Petco, that is a ridiculously low number, and his HR/9 could quadruple, and still be in line with a normal HR/FB%. In the future, Gagne would look like the better bet between the two.

mlbfan30
11-09-2007, 04:48 PM
Why wouldn't he be a closer? He at one point was the best closer in baseball and has a closer mentality. One could argue he suffered in Boston because he wasn't the closer. It would not be a waste of money to sign him.
When he pitches, he is very effective..... that's a lot better than being detrimental to the team and playing a lot. He is worth 6M a year easy even if he doesn't play the entire year/

GoReds33
11-09-2007, 06:20 PM
Say the Reds take a chance on him... if he doesn't end up being an effective closer - would he be a waste of money??... or would you be happy w/ him as a non-closer reliever... stuff-wise and money-wise?No it wouldn't be a waste of money. He is defenitly a better overall pitcher than Weathers. I think that if they want him closing he will be the closer. Even if he doesn't close though, he is still worth the money, because he gives this bullpen a face. Him along with Burton would set it up nicely for whoever would close. This could be the workings of a good bullpen.:)

hippie07
11-09-2007, 06:45 PM
Sounds good - I'm on board ... why is everyone so skeptical w/ him, then? Sounds like he did good last year until he was moved from the closer role (sounds familiar.... Guardado?) $6 mil a year would be a bargain for a lights out closer, IMO. If he can be that guy or has a good chance at being that guy, why not?

Vada Pinson Fan
11-11-2007, 12:00 AM
If the price is right.