PDA

View Full Version : Redszone Community Prospect Vote: #7



dougdirt
11-22-2007, 11:40 AM
Vote for the player who you think is the Reds #7 prospect (the best prospect who is not yet on the list). We will go with this as far as you guys want to take it.

I will post a new list every 2 days with 10-15 options to vote on.

If you feel like making an argument on why a guy should be voted here, feel free to vote and state why you voted for that player.

If there is someone that is not currently listed as an option to vote on, vote for 'other' then just state who you want to vote for in the thread.

If there is anyone you would like to see as an option on the next poll, just say so and if they garner enough support, they will be placed on the next poll. Guys with the lowest amount of votes will usually be removed for the next few guys who were talked about in the previous thread.


Prospect 1 - Jay Bruce
Prospect 2 - Homer Bailey
Prospect 3 - Johnny Cueto
Prospect 4 - Joey Votto
Prospect 5 - Todd Frazier
Prospect 6 - Drew Stubbs

Patrick Bateman
11-22-2007, 11:49 AM
Doug, I think we have now voted the same all the way through.

Degenerate39
11-22-2007, 11:49 AM
I voted for Maloney as the number 6 so I guess I'll vote for him as number 7.

dougdirt
11-22-2007, 11:55 AM
I am going with Travis Wood on this one.

He is young, is a lefty, throws hard (low 90s) and has a plus plus offspeed pitch in his change up that has been described as the best change up in the minor leagues by some scouts. His injuries this year were not as bad as some believed and he pitched well in instructional league after the season. He also was making some strides with a curveball before getting shut down. Not sure how that went in instructional league.

OnBaseMachine
11-22-2007, 11:59 AM
It come down to Roenicke or Wood, and I decided to go with Wood since his velocity is reportedly back to where it was last year.

camisadelgolf
11-22-2007, 12:22 PM
I know it's premature, but I've always been ahead of the curve, so I went with Kyle Lotzkar.

Will M
11-22-2007, 12:58 PM
I voted Maloney for #5 & #6 so I'll keep voting for him until people agree with me :D

AmarilloRed
11-22-2007, 01:42 PM
I also have been voting for Maloney on 5 and 6. He may actually win this time.

mth123
11-22-2007, 02:28 PM
I voted Roenicke. I know he's a reliever and that limits his ceiling and his potential to be an extremely high impact guy, but, IMO, we've reached the portion of the list where the perspective needs to change. There are basically two types of players left to consider now. There are higher ceiling guys that the scouts love but have yet to show it on the field and there are guys who are less touted but have a record of performance that bodes well for them. Guys who have both of those things are basically the top 5 guys on the list. In the case of those players, ceiling is a huge consideration and is what separates Jay Bruce from Joey Votto. But, once you get past those guys, a lot more attention needs to be paid to the floor. Guys like Roenicke, Rosales and Maloney don't project to be TOR pitchers or 5 tool uber hitters, but they also have shown that they are probably going to eventually have a role in the majors. I compare that to a guy like Stubbs or Mesoraco who have to hit to reach the majors and haven't shown the ability yet. There are lots of defenders with speed and catchers with fundamentals. Without the bat, that is what these guys are. Bubba Crosby and Dane Sardinha.

So, when looking at the floor, the reliever becomes a lot more valuable. If Roenicke doesn't turn into Mr. Automatic 9th inning guy, he could easily still become a guy who comes in and puts out the fire in the 7th or 8th and in case you haven't been paying attention to the major league team since the destruction of Willamson, Sullivan and Graves, its a pretty necessary role if you actually want to win games. The beauty of it, is that he doesn't need to do something that he hasn't done in the minors. He does need to translate his success to the majors and that isn't a given, but I give a lot more consideration to a guy who just needs to carry what he's doing to the higher levels than I do to a guy who hasn't even done anything to translate yet. Roenicke IMO is the player who is most likely able to fill in important if not primary role at the major league level than any other player on the list. As a result, he gets my vote here and will continue to until he comes off the list.

Mario-Rijo
11-22-2007, 02:36 PM
I went with "Other", as I think the next best guy is Pedro Viola. Although he isn't doing so well in AFL action, he seems to be moving quick and turning heads which tells me that alot of pro people have him another radar screen.

He throws more FB's than GB's but he has been stingy with contact quite often this season. His combined stats through 3 levels this season were as follows.

3-2 w/ a 1.42 ERA w/ 6 saves

82.1 IP, 55 Hits, 5 HR's, 30 BB's & 94 K's

Opposing batters are hitting .186 against him

His 2006 stats in the DSL are pretty similiar except he gave up no HR's.

Bottom line is he has basically went through or skipped over a total of 5 levels in 2 seasons. He very well could be the next impact arm that makes it up to the show and sticks.

Kc61
11-22-2007, 03:01 PM
I think Wood is more of a 10-12 guy, this is a bit high, although I certainly have appreciated his success at the lower levels and hope he gets on track for a great career.

Smaller frame, listed at 5'11" and 166. Injuries, not a fireballer. Has a good changeup, which may or may not translate at the higher levels. Was considered a reach by many RedsZoners as a second round pick. BA didn't include him in its top ten this year.

Might consider him at 10-12 because of success in lower levels, particuarly at his young age, but a lot of guys do well at low A ball. Sean Watson blew away low A ball this year, 1.88 ERA. Wood had a 3.66 at that level. They both struggled at high A but Watson is a big guy and a hard thrower so he may be more projectable.

At number 7, I prefer Roenicke and Maloney who have broken through the AA barrier and performed at the higher levels.

mth123
11-22-2007, 03:26 PM
I think Wood is more of a 10-12 guy, this is a bit high, although I certainly have appreciated his success at the lower levels and hope he gets on track for a great career.

Smaller frame, listed at 5'11" and 166. Injuries, not a fireballer. Has a good changeup, which may or may not translate at the higher levels. Was considered a reach by many RedsZoners as a second round pick. BA didn't include him in its top ten this year.

Might consider him at 10-12 because of success in lower levels, particuarly at his young age, but a lot of guys do well at low A ball. Sean Watson blew away low A ball this year, 1.88 ERA. Wood had a 3.66 at that level. They both struggled at high A but Watson is a big guy and a hard thrower so he may be more projectable.

At number 7, I prefer Roenicke and Maloney who have broken through the AA barrier and performed at the higher levels.

My thoughts as well.

dougdirt
11-22-2007, 03:47 PM
I think Wood is more of a 10-12 guy, this is a bit high, although I certainly have appreciated his success at the lower levels and hope he gets on track for a great career.

Smaller frame, listed at 5'11" and 166. Injuries, not a fireballer. Has a good changeup, which may or may not translate at the higher levels. Was considered a reach by many RedsZoners as a second round pick. BA didn't include him in its top ten this year.

Might consider him at 10-12 because of success in lower levels, particuarly at his young age, but a lot of guys do well at low A ball. Sean Watson blew away low A ball this year, 1.88 ERA. Wood had a 3.66 at that level. They both struggled at high A but Watson is a big guy and a hard thrower so he may be more projectable.

At number 7, I prefer Roenicke and Maloney who have broken through the AA barrier and performed at the higher levels.

Wood was also 19 years old when he was in Low A while Watson was 21. Big difference. Not that Watson isn't a good prospect or doesnt have good stuff which he does, just saying he definately has age on his side a whole lot more.

icehole3
11-22-2007, 03:52 PM
I think Maloney is a capable starter who will be our 7th or 8th starter waiting in Louisville. I felt he was right behind Johnny C in the pecking order.

Blue
11-22-2007, 04:16 PM
I voted for Maloney based on results because he is close to the major leagues. I think he'll start the season in the Reds rotation. He's 24, and the Reds didn't keep him in AA long. They chose, probably wrongly, to send Cueto back to AA, but Maloney stayed.

Stingray
11-22-2007, 04:24 PM
I also voted other and I'm sure most will disagree with my assessment but I'm high on Chris Dickerson. If his ankle injury isn't serious and the Reds can move some of their excess outfielders, I think he is ready to contribute as a 4th OF now with a ceiling as an effective starting CF.

RedsManRick
11-22-2007, 04:30 PM
Voted for Danny Dorn again.

*BaseClogger*
11-22-2007, 07:21 PM
I voted Maloney again... I don't think we should hold is fly ball tendencies against him until it adversly affects him... If he was a prospect in the Padre's system it wouldn't matter...

Doug- can you please add Fisher to the list for the next vote?

Gallen5862
11-22-2007, 07:40 PM
I voted Maloney. It was between him and Dorn for me.

dougdirt
11-22-2007, 08:26 PM
I voted Maloney again... I don't think we should hold is fly ball tendencies against him until it adversly affects him... If he was a prospect in the Padre's system it wouldn't matter...

Doug- can you please add Fisher to the list for the next vote?

Will do.

Blue
11-22-2007, 09:50 PM
Its about time for Devin Mesoraco to make the list. He was rated ahead of Frazier in June, and two months of baseball shouldn't make him valued at any lower than #8.

mlbfan30
11-22-2007, 11:13 PM
I know Maloney doesn't have the stuff to be a great pitcher. His fastball may top the high 80s, but there have been many successful lefties like that. If he can be a #4, #5 innings eater with an ERA around 4.5, then that's very very valuable. Those guys are making 8-10 mil on the open market. He averaged just over 6 IP last year in the minors per start, with a FIP around 3.30. He is close to the majors, and I think he can be very useful. His K and BB rates suggest that he has decent control with the ability to get strike outs, which means he knows how to pitch considering people say he has no "out" pitch.
Even though Wood has much better upside, with a better pitches, they have been about equally successful in the lower minors. I know he's younger, but injuries are a concern to some degree. Wood seems like he might eventually become a decent closer, if he makes the majors. Maloney seems like he'll be at least a #5, when he makes the majors.

BigRed07
11-23-2007, 01:50 AM
I voted for Dorn too. I would like to see Turner added to the list.

camisadelgolf
11-23-2007, 03:47 AM
I voted for Maloney based on results because he is close to the major leagues. I think he'll start the season in the Reds rotation. He's 24, and the Reds didn't keep him in AA long. They chose, probably wrongly, to send Cueto back to AA, but Maloney stayed.

Cueto was sent to AA in an effort to get the Lookouts to the playoffs; it wasn't a demotion.

Superdude
11-23-2007, 03:53 AM
Its about time for Devin Mesoraco to make the list. He was rated ahead of Frazier in June, and two months of baseball shouldn't make him valued at any lower than #8.

People spaz out when the 1st round pick doesn't instantly produce MVP numbers while injured in a pointless rookie league. Logan Parker rocks though. ;)

Highlifeman21
11-23-2007, 01:42 PM
Its about time for Devin Mesoraco to make the list. He was rated ahead of Frazier in June, and two months of baseball shouldn't make him valued at any lower than #8.

Just b/c he was our 1st Round Draft pick last year doesn't mean he's necessarily in our top 10.

I thought the same about Stubbs, I thought he was probably our #10.

GoReds33
11-23-2007, 02:10 PM
I voted for Roenicke last time, and I voted for him again.

Blue
11-23-2007, 02:24 PM
Just b/c he was our 1st Round Draft pick last year doesn't mean he's necessarily in our top 10.

I thought the same about Stubbs, I thought he was probably our #10.

Right, but I think if the guy we picked at #34 is on the list as the Reds 5th best prospect then the guy we picked at #15 in the same draft shouldn't be passed over based on just two months of pro ball.

gedred69
11-23-2007, 10:34 PM
I would put Dorn ahead of Stubbs, so I too voted Dorn. He is so under the radar I can't believe it. After Billings in '06, he skipped low A Dayton, going directly to High A Sarasota, being promoted to AA Chattanooga, where he tore it up. That's kind of a 3 level jump in one year. Isn't that what Bruce did, having spent a year at low A? He very likely ends up trade bait, unless one of the studs in front of him get traded.

Kc61
11-24-2007, 12:42 AM
By the way, if relievers (Roenicke) are so valueless, a certain ex-Brewer reliever got a pretty nice contract today.

dougdirt
11-24-2007, 01:25 AM
By the way, if relievers (Roenicke) are so valueless, a certain ex-Brewer reliever got a pretty nice contract today.

Not valueless, just not as valuable.

Mario-Rijo
11-24-2007, 02:27 AM
Hey DD, is it just me or wouldn't Pedro Viola make a better prospect for the next round than say Soto? The kid is shooting through the sytem, is quite talented and isn't far away (AA). His chance at an impact may very well be equal to Soto.

Don't get me wrong I love Soto but Viola missing from the list that we have compiled seems blatantly wrong IMO.

camisadelgolf
11-24-2007, 02:55 AM
Speaking of Danny Dorn, can some please explain to me how he slipped to the 32nd round? He was drafted by the Devil Rays in the 23rd round the year before, so it's not like he was a no-name player out of a no-name school (he went to CS Fullerton and won the College World Series). Then, the next year, he dropped another nine rounds to the Reds despite his numbers improving a great deal. Scouts must have seen something they really didn't like. Either that or he just wasn't showing interest in playing baseball professionally. He apparently doesn't have a problem hitting breaking balls or taking a walk. His defense isn't embarrassing. I just feel like there's something to the story that no one's explaining. Maybe he's a big pain in the ass in the clubhouse (he was originally drafted by the Devil Rays, after all). Maybe he's one of those guys who can dominate AA but will fail in AAA (i.e. Pete Rose, Jr.). I just can't understand what's behind Dorn's success. It can't be good coaching, can it? Performance-enhancing drugs? Sold his soul to the devil? A miracle?

BigRed07
11-24-2007, 03:49 AM
Danny hurt his shoulder playing QB in high school at Diamond Bar HS. He had his shoulder completely rebuilt. He was a really good athlete. CSUF signed him knowing this and gave him a chance. Dorn had a great career at Fullerton. Dorn decided to return to Fullerton his senior year and get back to Omaha along with another Reds draft pick Justin Turner. Danny hurt his shoulder in a series at Rice and missed some games. That is why he fell to the 32nd round. They did get back to Omaha and made the All-Tourney team. He would of been a top 3 round pick if he had not hurt his shoulder. The Reds took a chance on him in 32nd round and the rest is history. The Reds got a great player and a great kid when they drafted Danny. His stats speak for themselves.

icehole3
11-24-2007, 08:33 AM
I saw a few of the Cal State Fullerton games that year and he was hitting rocket after rocket at key times during the games, when he was drafted along with Turner I was as giddy as a 1st grader on the first day of school, because both of those kids are the type of kids you wanna go to war with, They play all out 100 mph. I hope that they turn Turner into a Ryan Freel type let him move all over he can handle it no problem.

dougdirt
11-24-2007, 09:49 AM
Hey DD, is it just me or wouldn't Pedro Viola make a better prospect for the next round than say Soto? The kid is shooting through the sytem, is quite talented and isn't far away (AA). His chance at an impact may very well be equal to Soto.

Don't get me wrong I love Soto but Viola missing from the list that we have compiled seems blatantly wrong IMO.

I will add him to the list next time around. I just put up names of guys and have just kept them on so long as no one asked that they be removed and people were only requesting one or two guys from the previous poll.

dougdirt
11-24-2007, 09:51 AM
I saw a few of the Cal State Fullerton games that year and he was hitting rocket after rocket at key times during the games, when he was drafted along with Turner I was as giddy as a 1st grader on the first day of school, because both of those kids are the type of kids you wanna go to war with, They play all out 100 mph. I hope that they turn Turner into a Ryan Freel type let him move all over he can handle it no problem.

From what I have heard about Turner, everyone (coaches and scouts) loves his game and how he goes about what he does.

Kc61
11-24-2007, 10:12 AM
Please include Waring in the next round, if possible.

I would also ask for Miguel Perez, but since he seems to be a free agent I'm not sure he should be listed. But I think he would have a chance to make the top twenty.

klw
11-25-2007, 01:01 AM
other: Daryl Thompson