PDA

View Full Version : The Ravens sound off after last night's loss



BRM
12-04-2007, 12:09 PM
Is it sour grapes or do they have a point? This is from ESPN.com's Mike Sando.



Just returned from the Ravens' locker room. Those guys are ticked off. They said the league wants the Patriots to win, to the point that officials make calls favoring New England with the game on the line. They said Tom Brady sells tickets for the league, so the league wants Brady and the Patriots to stay unbeaten. I'll start posting the direct quotes momentarily. Refresh the blog periodically and you'll see them as they post.

Ravens linebacker Terrell Suggs on officiating: "Everybody is kind of cheering for them to go undefeated and break all the records. They called them the greatest offense on earth. So who knows? ... They made one more play than us and they got a little help."

Suggs on the timeout attributed to the Ravens, which gave New England another chance on fourth down after Baltimore appeared to stop Tom Brady short on a sneak: "You only get a few times to really get the NFL's poster boy in that type of situation. I don't know. It looked like all 22 men on the field played as if no timeout was called. But if it was called, it was called. I don't get into that part of the game. I just do my job."

Suggs on officiating: "It's kind of the feeling of the 2001 tuck rule. It kind of feels like the tuck rule. That is the NFL for you, man. When they got a guy like that that is selling a lot of tickets, you want to keep him selling tickets."

Ravens linebacker Bart Scott on the timeout: "I didn't hear a timeout. That was very convenient."

Scott: "We outplayed them, plain and simple. We punched them in the mouth on both sides of the ball."

Ravens receiver Derrick Mason: "Allow the players to dictate how the game is going to go, especially the last couple of seconds. It's kind of like basketball. There's three seconds on the clock. Let the guys play. The best team is going to win. You don't let outside circumstances dictate how the game is going to go. It's hard to play against the best team in the NFL and beat them. You are out there and working hard. You are playing against them and then also you have the other guys and it seems you are playing against them, also."

More from Mason on officiating: "I'm going to take it back to last game. San Diego. Quinn Sypniewski runs down the field, runs into one of their DBs, we catch the ball and they call offensive pass interference. OK. Great. This game, same thing happens. Randy Moss runs right into Samari Rolle. They call defensive pass interference. I don't understand that. One game it's called one way, the next game it's called another way. At the end, you have a phantom call. That's why it's hard to play and win a game when you are playing against more than just the best team in the NFL."

More from Mason on how hard it is to beat the Patriots: "It's kind of like that old Bulls team when they were running the tables. You were playing against Jordan, Pippen and the bunch and it was hard to beat them because everyone was on their side. That's the way it is now. You've got Brady and the bunch. It's hard to beat them when you're playing against them and extra people."

Mason on whether the refs can get caught up in talk of an undefeated season: "I think everybody can get caught up. You should have heard some of the verbal blasts we were taking from the refs. It was just despicable. They don't want us to say anything to them, but they treat us like we're little kids out there, saying anything they want to say. As players, we can't say anything back. We can't report it to anybody because it's our word against theirs. But you have to give it up to New England. They did what they had to do. They scored at the end and that's all you can ask of a team."

Ravens cornerback Chris McAlister on whether the NFL wants the Patriots to win: "They get a lot of calls. I'll say that. We've been watching film on them all week and I mean, they do get a lot of calls. As far as the NFL wanting them to win, you can't totally not think about it in those terms."

Ravens running back Willis McGahee: "I felt like we played our hearts out tonight and got some bogus calls, but it is what it is."

McGahee on which calls bothered him the most: "Shhh. Pass interference, the holding on [Jamaine] Winborne. There was a lot. I can't even remember them all."

Ravens coach Brian Billick spoke with reporters for only about a minute after the game. Asked why the Ravens called timeout before stuffing Brady on fourth down, Billick said, "We didn't feel like we were in the right configuration, kind of knew what they were going to do and felt like we needed a better call, I guess." It wasn't clear what he meant. Asked which person called the timeout, Billick said, "We called the timeout." Asked if the calls just didn't seem to go the Ravens' way late in the game, Billick said, "Yeah, evidently not."

Asked about what he said to Scott about tossing an official's flag into the stands, Billick said, "You've gotta be smarter than that. Can't be a dumb football player."

I'll leave you with a comment overheard from a veteran player: "You might as well crown them the Super Bowl champs if it's going to be like that."

MaineRed
12-04-2007, 12:18 PM
Replays were quite clear, the Ravens were calling timeout from the sidelines.

And I guess the Ravens didn't watch film of the Colts/Pats game in which New England set a club record for penalties, many of which were bogus.

traderumor
12-04-2007, 01:01 PM
The conspiracy theory sounds like sour grapes to me. I did not see the controversial holding call, but complaining about close calls in a close game is as old as the sport.

bucksfan2
12-04-2007, 01:14 PM
Officiating a NFL game has to be a difficult thing. I do not take away from the job the officials do, however, there have been some awful officiating this year. The problem I have is that it seems to me that the officials would rather protect the co-officials in the crew rather than getting the call right. They also do not have to answer any questions about the calls that they made. Make them answer the questionable calls to the teams and even the fans and I wouldn't have a problem with blown calls. Until they take accountability for the calls then they deserve any and all criticism they get.

OldRightHander
12-04-2007, 01:25 PM
This year has been pretty bad. Even Michaels and Madden had a couple things to say the other night about some of the calls in that game. Then there was the call at the end of the Browns game that could have gone the other way. I've seen quite a few others this year that really have me shaking my head.

Here's another beef I have. I have seen on several occasions that the play clock seems to hit zero right before the ball is snapped and the delay isn't called. It's like it really has to be a rather blatant delay for it to get called. Is there some grace period on delay of game, where when the clock hits zero you have another second to get the play off without it getting called?

Roy Tucker
12-04-2007, 01:35 PM
I do think the Patriots benefited from some seriously borderline calls last night.

But what really baffled me was the 3-man rush the Ravens switched to. They had been manhandling Brady all night with blitzes making him rush his throws and laying some serious wood on his receivers. But that old bugaboo of prevent defense reared its head and they gave Brady all the time in the world on that last drive. Dumb.

Johnny Footstool
12-04-2007, 01:42 PM
The conspiracy theory sounds like sour grapes to me. I did not see the controversial holding call, but complaining about close calls in a close game is as old as the sport.

There was a clear hold. The defender grabbed Ben Watson's left arm and pulled hard enough to turn his body while the pass was in the air.

The timeout was clearly called prior to the snap, too. The Ravens' coach got the ref's attention, and the ref ran several steps onto the field waving his arms before the ball was snapped.

WMR
12-04-2007, 01:44 PM
As much as I dislike the Pats, I love hearing the Ravens whine even more.

About time for another Ray Lewis chest-thumping speech.

BRM
12-04-2007, 02:01 PM
I've read a few articles today that claimed only head coaches or players on the field can call timeout. Apparently that it isn't true if defensive coordinator Rex Ryan is the one who called it.

MaineRed
12-04-2007, 02:10 PM
I've read a few articles today that claimed only head coaches or players on the field can call timeout.

I think this is true. But I just saw the replay again. The Ravens D was on the field. Their defensive coordinator was screaming and motioning for timeout and it was granted by an official who had his back turned to their sideline, he was watching as a play was about to be run. The ref in that position cannot clarify WHO called the timeout. He hears a bunch of "time out, time out, time out!", then he sees a bunch of hands in his face motioning for a timeout. All he can do is blow the whistle. He can't then look around and make sure that it was actually the head coach who called it. Just one of those things. And clearly something that wasn't done just to help New England. The Baltimore sideline wanted a timeout and it was granted.

Imagine the talk this morning with the highlights of all the Raves trying to call timeout if the timeout wasn't granted and the Pats scored on the play.

":cry: we were trying to call a timeout but the biased refs wouldn't grant us one, boo, hoo."

klw
12-04-2007, 02:22 PM
I only skimmed the article. Does anyone complain about the Ravens receiver tackling Samuel on the last play of the game but not getting called for offensive pass interference? These things even out. For example, the calls in the Eagles-Pats seemed to be heavily for the Eagles. For example the Moss pass interference that wiped out the touchdown that would have put the Pats up 10.

CrackerJack
12-04-2007, 02:37 PM
Watson was held in the end zone, they need to quit crying. Even if it wasn't blatant or drawn out - you can't be stupid enough to wrap your arm around a guy in the end zone like that - refs call it every time.

If the Ravens wouldn't act like they just won the SB after every decent play they made, or went into a tizzy every time something didn't go their way, maybe they would've faired better and not racked up so many stupid penalties. Call it Chad Johnson/Ray Lewis syndrome.

One thing you'll notice about the Patriots is that they take everything in stride and stay level-headed, and play until the final whistle and approach each play with a determination to get what they need out of it - it's why people accuse them of pouring it on. They're a focused, prideful team with a QB who doesn't let anything faze him, along with his coach. It's pretty impressive to watch actually. They know how not to get too up or too down during the course of a game, and don't let up until the final whistle blows - they are coached well in that regard certainly.

MaineRed
12-04-2007, 03:08 PM
I'm surprised nobody has specifically brought up the TD catch at the end by Gaffney. He didn't have full control of that ball before going out of bounds.

That was the biggest questionable call of all, IMO. Even after reviewing it they still gave him the TD. If we were playing down at the local atheltic field, that is a catch. Using NFL terms and their rules, it isn't. That is one of those calls where if it was seen correctly you would have seen the official come in and act out the bobbling motion to say no catch.

WMR
12-04-2007, 03:10 PM
I'm surprised nobody has specifically brought up the TD catch at the end by Gaffney. He didn't have full control of that ball before going out of bounds.

That was the biggest questionable call of all, IMO. Even after reviewing it they still gave him the TD. If we were playing down at the local atheltic field, that is a catch. Using NFL terms and their rules, it isn't. That is one of those calls where if it was seen correctly you would have seen the official come in and act out the bobbling motion to say no catch.

Yeah good point. That was the most questionable call of the bunch. Much more so than the Watson business.

BRM
12-04-2007, 03:14 PM
Yeah good point. That was the most questionable call of the bunch. Much more so than the Watson business.

I agree. I thought he bobbled the ball but I knew the refs wouldn't overturn that call.

Johnny Footstool
12-04-2007, 03:25 PM
I'm surprised nobody has specifically brought up the TD catch at the end by Gaffney. He didn't have full control of that ball before going out of bounds.

That was the biggest questionable call of all, IMO. Even after reviewing it they still gave him the TD. If we were playing down at the local atheltic field, that is a catch. Using NFL terms and their rules, it isn't. That is one of those calls where if it was seen correctly you would have seen the official come in and act out the bobbling motion to say no catch.

It appeared that the ball was in his fingertip control and wasn't moving before his first foot came off the ground. If anything, the replay was inconclusive.

Last week, Dwayne Bowe "caught" a touchdown pass that he ended up bobbling between his knees, and the play was upheld after the replay.

SeeinRed
12-04-2007, 03:35 PM
It appeared that the ball was in his fingertip control and wasn't moving before his first foot came off the ground. If anything, the replay was inconclusive.

Last week, Dwayne Bowe "caught" a touchdown pass that he ended up bobbling between his knees, and the play was upheld after the replay.

Yeah, there was no question in my mind that he had control of the ball when his feet hit the ground. I really didn't see the ball moving at all other than him transfering it into his arm. The officiating wasn't as bad as the Ravens would like to think. The time out was their own fault and the penalties were just rediculous. Especially the two 15 yarders for unsportsman like conduct. What you saw wasn't a conspiracy, it was a collapse by the Ravens.

jmac
12-04-2007, 05:35 PM
Yeah, there was no question in my mind that he had control of the ball when his feet hit the ground. I really didn't see the ball moving at all other than him transfering it into his arm. The officiating wasn't as bad as the Ravens would like to think. The time out was their own fault and the penalties were just rediculous. Especially the two 15 yarders for unsportsman like conduct. What you saw wasn't a conspiracy, it was a collapse by the Ravens.
Well Said !

blumj
12-04-2007, 06:17 PM
Watson was held in the end zone, they need to quit crying. Even if it wasn't blatant or drawn out - you can't be stupid enough to wrap your arm around a guy in the end zone like that - refs call it every time.

If the Ravens wouldn't act like they just won the SB after every decent play they made, or went into a tizzy every time something didn't go their way, maybe they would've faired better and not racked up so many stupid penalties. Call it Chad Johnson/Ray Lewis syndrome.

One thing you'll notice about the Patriots is that they take everything in stride and stay level-headed, and play until the final whistle and approach each play with a determination to get what they need out of it - it's why people accuse them of pouring it on. They're a focused, prideful team with a QB who doesn't let anything faze him, along with his coach. It's pretty impressive to watch actually. They know how not to get too up or too down during the course of a game, and don't let up until the final whistle blows - they are coached well in that regard certainly.

Could you tell Junior Seau that he's not supposed to act like he just won the SB after every tackle now that he's a Patriot? And it was pretty dumb for Rodney Harrison to start in with Billick after the INT, although I guess it was taken in the spirit it was intended judging by Billick's respnse of blowing kisses at him. What other HC does that?

This does seem like a bad season for officiating in general, though. I don't think Pats games are any different or directed one way over the other. Just the same issues as all the other games. It just seems like no one knows anymore what a catch is, what PI is, what a fumble is, etc.

And just for fun, the best line from Boston sports radio today:"Okay, we get it, you can start running up the score again now."

M2
12-04-2007, 07:07 PM
I'm surprised nobody has specifically brought up the TD catch at the end by Gaffney. He didn't have full control of that ball before going out of bounds.

That was the biggest questionable call of all, IMO. Even after reviewing it they still gave him the TD. If we were playing down at the local atheltic field, that is a catch. Using NFL terms and their rules, it isn't. That is one of those calls where if it was seen correctly you would have seen the official come in and act out the bobbling motion to say no catch.

My guess is the Ravens didn't protest it because an extra play or two only would have drained more time off the clock.

I actually watched the end of the game last night (a rarity). Seems to me like the Ravens are complaining for no reason. All those calls looked legit.

Just as a point of information, haven't the Ravens taken over from the Raiders this decade as the league leaders in dumb penalties? I was under the impression I was watching a display of typical Ravens football.

Dom Heffner
12-04-2007, 08:47 PM
The defensive coordinator of the Ravens is the goat of the game, really. What a moron.

MWM
12-04-2007, 10:15 PM
I just hate the selective enforcement of certain penalties. Defensive holding occurs almost every play. Yet, this year at least, it's been called in several key points in a few games I've watched. The call against Leon Hall on the safety play against the Steelers is a great example.

George Foster
12-04-2007, 10:50 PM
It was not the Ref's fault that the Ravens did nothing with the ball the last 3 times they had it. That last horrible interception was not the ref's fault either. I was for the Ravens last night, I wanted them to win, but you have to control the ball. You can't give Brady the last chance.

Cyclone792
12-04-2007, 10:57 PM
I just hate the selective enforcement of certain penalties. Defensive holding occurs almost every play. Yet, this year at least, it's been called in several key points in a few games I've watched. The call against Leon Hall on the safety play against the Steelers is a great example.

The NFL seems to do what it can to promote offense, because I guess offense probably sells and generates more revenue for them. If that means ticky-tack defensive penalties that can be realistically be called on every play and actually get called a half dozen times a game, for one reason or another they're ok with that.

I'm probably one of the few people out there that would get excited about a 10-6 final score in a game played in sloppy, muddy, cold, snowy conditions.

RedFanAlways1966
12-04-2007, 11:13 PM
I'm probably one of the few people out there that would get excited about a 10-6 final score in a game played in sloppy, muddy, cold, snowy conditions.

You must have been elated with last week's MNF game... the Pittsburgh Muds vs. the Miami O-fers. :)

blumj
12-04-2007, 11:19 PM
I just hate the selective enforcement of certain penalties. Defensive holding occurs almost every play. Yet, this year at least, it's been called in several key points in a few games I've watched. The call against Leon Hall on the safety play against the Steelers is a great example.
Yeah, I guess I just don't believe it's really as selective as it appears. I just think they call the ones they see, and sometimes what they think they see, and can't call the ones they miss, which is probably a lot more than we realize. We just see more of them than they can because of the replays and different camera angles.

Cyclone792
12-04-2007, 11:23 PM
You must have been elated with last week's MNF game... the Pittsburgh Muds vs. the Miami O-fers. :)

Unfortunately I wasn't able to catch most of that game, but it was the type of game I'd love to watch.

If it was up to me, the Super Bowl would always be played in a neutral site in an outdoor, northern stadium. Think Lambeau Field, Soldier Field, etc. If it's 15 degrees and snowing, I like it.

That's football weather to me.

MWM
12-05-2007, 01:42 AM
Yeah, I guess I just don't believe it's really as selective as it appears. I just think they call the ones they see, and sometimes what they think they see, and can't call the ones they miss, which is probably a lot more than we realize. We just see more of them than they can because of the replays and different camera angles.

That might be the case, but that's still a big problem in my mind. If you can't consistently officiate a game, then they ought to find a better way to do it. Football more than any other sport the officials can make or break a game with entirely subjective calls. Pass Interference plays WAY too big a role in the NFL, and holding is almost as bad. These calls are so subjective and aren't consistently enforced. I definitely don't buy any kind of conspiracy theories about refs wanting a specific team to win, but I think they should be very congnizant of the game situation when they're being so subjective about certain things.

Playadlc
12-05-2007, 02:05 AM
The Ravens are a bunch of babies. I am sick and tired of fans and players blaming officials after losses. The officials didn't throw a ridiculous INT in the 4th and the officials weren't the ones that couldn't get a 1st down when it mattered. That was the Ravens. Their inability to put the game away late is their fault.

The most embarrassing thing in all this is a "professional" athlete taking a flag and throwing it in the stands.

Seriously, grow up.

Roy Tucker
12-05-2007, 09:48 AM
The most embarrassing thing in all this is a "professional" athlete taking a flag and throwing it in the stands.

Seriously, grow up.

I, myself, thought it was hilarious.

But I don't think the League Office will have the same reaction and I anticipate his checkbook will be a bit lighter.

Sorry.

Chip R
12-05-2007, 10:31 AM
The Ravens are a bunch of babies. I am sick and tired of fans and players blaming officials after losses. The officials didn't throw a ridiculous INT in the 4th and the officials weren't the ones that couldn't get a 1st down when it mattered. That was the Ravens. Their inability to put the game away late is their fault.

The most embarrassing thing in all this is a "professional" athlete taking a flag and throwing it in the stands.

Seriously, grow up.


I agree. If there is a more dysfunctional team out there than the Ravens, I'd like to see them. This was a team that lost to the Bengals - twice. They could have ran out that clock with a couple of 1st downs but they couldn't sack up and do up.

GoReds33
12-05-2007, 01:00 PM
The Ravens are a bunch of babies. I am sick and tired of fans and players blaming officials after losses. The officials didn't throw a ridiculous INT in the 4th and the officials weren't the ones that couldn't get a 1st down when it mattered. That was the Ravens. Their inability to put the game away late is their fault.

The most embarrassing thing in all this is a "professional" athlete taking a flag and throwing it in the stands.

Seriously, grow up.I think that you do have to look at the Raven's side of the story. From what a bunch of players in that locker room said, the officals were bad mouthing them as well. I saw this in more than a few quotes from Ravens players. I would be mad too if I knew the other team being handed the win.

camisadelgolf
12-05-2007, 02:36 PM
I think that you do have to look at the Raven's side of the story. From what a bunch of players in that locker room said, the officals were bad mouthing them as well. I saw this in more than a few quotes from Ravens players. I would be mad too if I knew the other team being handed the win.

Andrew Whitworth said at least one official bad-mouthed him, as well.

M2
12-05-2007, 10:25 PM
Unfortunately I wasn't able to catch most of that game, but it was the type of game I'd love to watch.

If it was up to me, the Super Bowl would always be played in a neutral site in an outdoor, northern stadium. Think Lambeau Field, Soldier Field, etc. If it's 15 degrees and snowing, I like it.

That's football weather to me.

Cyclone for commish.

Add in polar bears and it would be perfect.

"The Seahawks tonight had the perfect gameplan for the Patriots. They dominated both lines of scrimmage. Kept the ball out of Tom Brady's hands by effectively running the ball and they made a few big plays on special teams. Unfortunately it all was undone by poor bear management. You simply can't allow Shaun Alexander to be mauled in the red zone like that. Meanwhile the Patriots used bear baiting tactics to break down Seattle's cover-two defensive scheme."

Dom Heffner
12-06-2007, 06:50 PM
If it was up to me, the Super Bowl would always be played in a neutral site in an outdoor, northern stadium. Think Lambeau Field, Soldier Field, etc. If it's 15 degrees and snowing, I like it.


It was a great game to watch, but I"d never want the Super Bowl played in conditions like that. We'd have the two best teams competing in conditions that would downplay their abilities or give one team an advantage over the other.

As well, bad weather tends to take the better offense out of it. There's no way the Dolphins keep up with the Steelers in better conditions.

I like "football weather" games as much as anyone, but I wouldn't want a championship decided under those circumstances.

Handofdeath
12-06-2007, 07:25 PM
I think that you do have to look at the Raven's side of the story. From what a bunch of players in that locker room said, the officals were bad mouthing them as well. I saw this in more than a few quotes from Ravens players. I would be mad too if I knew the other team being handed the win.

The Ravens are 4-8 for a reason. The offense is as it has always been. The Ravens are 19th in points allowed. They need to quit woofing, shut their mouths, and stop living off the 2000 season.