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*BaseClogger*
01-28-2008, 08:53 PM
From the ORG: From Rotoworld:


The Chicago Sun-Times believes that Brian Anderson is on his way to a National League team in a trade.

It's for the best. Possible destinations for Anderson include the Pirates, Marlins, Cubs, Padres, Reds and Braves. We wouldn't rule out the Nationals, either, just because Jim Bowden can never have enough outfielders.

Like Brandon Phillips before him, acquiring Anderson would be a great buy-low move on a former top prospect... This is kinda like David Aardsma...

Bip Roberts
01-28-2008, 08:55 PM
Hes been jerked around by the White Sox since being called up a few seasons ago. I wonder if hes got options?

He never got to develop in the minors like he should have

Edd Roush
01-29-2008, 12:58 AM
While a Freel or Hopper and a fringe player for Anderson trade would be a good one in my opinion, I can't take this article to be anything more than speculation on Rotoworld's part. We all know that Wayne isn't one to leak stories to the press and his best deals seem to come from no where.

However, I were to speculate on this possible move, I would think it would make the 2009 Reds really strong and could really add something to the 2008 team. I think have two potentially strong defensive outfielders in 2009 would allow Dunn to have it easier in left and migrate our defense into the average category. IMO, this trade would be another notch in Wayne's belt.

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 01:20 AM
Freel and Hopper have both done worlds more in the majors than Anderson has.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 01:30 AM
Freel and Hopper have both done worlds more in the majors than Jay Bruce has...

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 01:33 AM
Freel and Hopper have both done worlds more in the majors than Jay Bruce has...

At least pick prospect that hasnt been dicked in a system around since 05.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 01:34 AM
Freel and Hopper have both done worlds more in the majors than Brandon Phillips had circa 2005...

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 01:36 AM
Better but we didnt have a 2nd baseman at the time and right now we have a flurry of OF.

I think it could be a solid pick up if we can get him and let him work on crap in the minors then im all for it. If we have to have him on the 25 man roster all year id rather not bother.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 01:41 AM
Better but we didnt have a 2nd baseman at the time and right now we have a flurry of OF.

I think it could be a solid pick up if we can get him and let him work on crap in the minors then im all for it. If we have to have him on the 25 man roster all year id rather not bother.

We are talking about trading Hopper or Freel for him. That opens him up a spot. Also, we did have second basemen in 2006- Tony Womack, Rich Aurilia and Ryan Freel... I remember going to a Reds game in April 2006 and thinking "wow, this phillips is talented but second base is Freel's postition"

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 01:45 AM
Its not about the spot on the 25 man. Its that he has been awful in the majors and needs time to develop in the minors, and dont want him to be sitting on our bench just rotting like he is pretty much doing in Chicago.

Ill concede the we didnt have 2nd baseman ideas but then again phillips was able to be given playing time unlike if we added Anderson.

Edd Roush
01-29-2008, 11:46 AM
Freel and Hopper have both done worlds more in the majors than Anderson has.

Yea, but who will be under 30 come 2009 when Griffey is gone? If Brian Anderson's defense is good enough to call above average in CF and he can hit with a decent stick for a centerfielder (.280/.340/.440) than I think we give Wayne another chance of making some magic.

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 11:48 AM
Yea, but who will be under 30 come 2009 when Griffey is gone? If Brian Anderson's defense is good enough to call above average in CF and he can hit with a decent stick for a centerfielder (.280/.340/.440) than I think we give Wayne another chance of making some magic.

Read more of the thread before you reply to the 1st post :o

If he can be demoted to AAA great, if he sits on our bench and doesnt get playing time then its not really worth the trouble.

dunner13
01-29-2008, 12:57 PM
I say pick him up and give him a shot at the centerfield job this spring. If bruce isnt ready then he could step in. I dont really see freel or hopper as long term solutions in the outfield. freel is a utility guy and I think hopper got hot last year and would have a tough time as pitchers adjusted to him. Plus griffey is fragile and although he held up well last year you dont know if he can do that again. Anderson would be a low risk high reward type that krivsky has been succesful at so far.

Newman4
01-29-2008, 01:28 PM
For what it's worth, here's an old scouting report on Anderson:

Rank: #2 prospect for White Sox (behind Bobby Jenks) and around #48 for top prospects overall


Info: Brian Anderson had a solid Triple-A season and spent the last month and a half in the majors. Brian Anderson is a well-rounded player. He can drive the ball to all fields and could develop into a 25-homer guy at U.S Cellular Field. Hes also a good outfielder with a strong arm and has been solid in center fielder since his college days in Arizona. On the other hand, Anderson has decent speed but isn't a basestealing threat. He also doesn't draw a lot of walks. Brian Anderson is ready to take another step which is why the White Sox were willing to include Aaron Rowand in the Thome Trade to make room for Anderson. Anderson should get the nod for CF for the White Sox this season. He could def. compete for the AL ROY as well.

Most comparable to: Kevin Mench

Stats when he reaches his peak: .297, 27 HRs, 97 RBIs, 4 SBs.

ETA: April 2006

Newman4
01-29-2008, 01:34 PM
I have to disagree on the power potential from the article. Looks like an outfield glove and not much else.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 02:08 PM
Heres my plan with Anderson so we are perfectly clear:

1. trade Freel + fodder to CWS for Brian Anderson
2. Anderson and Bruce share CF duties for first month of season
3. May 1: Griffey gets hurt day after hitting 600th home run
4. Bruce moves to right. Anderson is throwing up Edd Roush's line (.280/.340/.440) and playing great CF defense
5. Griffey never comes back to full strength, or when he does return, he justs shows health so that we can trade him to a contender
6. Anderson looks like Krivsky's newest scrap found off the heap
2009
6. Griffey is gone, Dunn is in LF, Anderson in CF, and Bruce in RF. We have found the great defenseive CFer we were looking for to fill out our 2009 OF...

Edd Roush
01-29-2008, 02:17 PM
Heres my plan with Anderson so we are perfectly clear:

1. trade Freel + fodder to CWS for Brian Anderson
2. Anderson and Bruce share CF duties for first month of season
3. May 1: Griffey gets hurt day after hitting 600th home run
4. Bruce moves to right. Anderson is throwing up Vada Pinson's line (.280/.340/.440) and playing great CF defense
5. Griffey never comes back to full strength, or when he does return, he justs shows health so that we can trade him to a contender
6. Anderson looks like Krivsky's newest scrap found off the heap
2009
6. Griffey is gone, Dunn is in LF, Anderson in CF, and Bruce in RF. We have found the great defenseive CFer we were looking for to fill out our 2009 OF...

Haha, thanks for verbalizing, what I was thinking BaseClogger

BEETTLEBUG
01-29-2008, 03:55 PM
Well It All Sounds Good But I Don't Wish Griffey To Get Hurt.

SMcGavin
01-29-2008, 04:25 PM
Heres my plan with Anderson so we are perfectly clear:

1. trade Freel + fodder to CWS for Brian Anderson
2. Anderson and Bruce share CF duties for first month of season
3. May 1: Griffey gets hurt day after hitting 600th home run
4. Bruce moves to right. Anderson is throwing up Edd Roush's line (.280/.340/.440) and playing great CF defense
5. Griffey never comes back to full strength, or when he does return, he justs shows health so that we can trade him to a contender
6. Anderson looks like Krivsky's newest scrap found off the heap
2009
6. Griffey is gone, Dunn is in LF, Anderson in CF, and Bruce in RF. We have found the great defenseive CFer we were looking for to fill out our 2009 OF...

Sounds super except Anderson went .255/.318/.435 last season in AAA. He's gone .216/.279/.353 over his MLB career (416 AB). Apparently he used to be highly touted, but the numbers aren't there. If you just want great CF defense, I'm not sure Anderson is a better bet to hit in the bigs than Chris Dickerson is. I am all for finding a average bat great D CF for 2009 (in fact that is one of my top priorities), I just don't think Anderson is the guy.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 05:25 PM
Sounds super except Anderson went .255/.318/.435 last season in AAA. He's gone .216/.279/.353 over his MLB career (416 AB). Apparently he used to be highly touted, but the numbers aren't there. If you just want great CF defense, I'm not sure Anderson is a better bet to hit in the bigs than Chris Dickerson is. I am all for finding a average bat great D CF for 2009 (in fact that is one of my top priorities), I just don't think Anderson is the guy.

I understand where you come from, but you can say the exact same thing about Brandon Phillips' stats from after he didn't stick in Cleveland. In 2005 he hit .256/.326/.409 in 465 AB's in Buffalo. Secondly, the difference between Dickerson and Anderson is that Dickerson was never a highly touted offensive prospect as well as defensive. This is not very risky, as all I advocate giving up is Freel's contract and a C+ prospect...

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 05:25 PM
Well It All Sounds Good But I Don't Wish Griffey To Get Hurt.

I Never Wished Griffey Would Get Hurt...

BigRedMachine2
01-29-2008, 08:08 PM
If we can get him cheap I say do it. He does have 5 tool potential.

Newman4
01-29-2008, 08:45 PM
If we can get him cheap I say do it. He does have 5 tool potential.

Doesn't hit for average or power.

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 08:55 PM
Would be the most epic waste ever if he was on the 25 man roster

Edd Roush
01-29-2008, 09:41 PM
Would be the most epic waste ever if he was on the 25 man roster

Wow, you must be a very new Reds' fan not to have seen Jason Ellison and Buck Coats roaming the outfield in 2007. Don't make me go back to the DanO days to gather up some more valued roster spots. Your hyperbole is really starting to wear on me. This is the kind of low-risk, high-reward move that makes Wayne his money.

Bip Roberts
01-29-2008, 09:44 PM
Wow, you must be a very new Reds' fan not to have seen Jason Ellison and Buck Coats roaming the outfield in 2007. Don't make me go back to the DanO days to gather up some more valued roster spots. Your hyperbole is really starting to wear on me. This is the kind of low-risk, high-reward move that makes Wayne his money.

I dont see a Jason Ellison on this roster. Nice response though.

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 10:51 PM
I dont see a Jason Ellison on this roster. Nice response though.

In my opinion, Norris Hopper is about two missed drag bunts from being the next Jason Ellison...

*BaseClogger*
01-29-2008, 10:53 PM
Doesn't hit for average or power.

Hey, Brandon Phillips couldn't do any of those things in 2005 and that didn't work out...

If teams just gave away good players, this would be a whole lot easier, wouldn't it?

Edd Roush
01-30-2008, 12:07 AM
I dont see a Jason Ellison on this roster. Nice response though.

But wouldn't "the most epic waste ever" include any player on any roster any year :rolleyes: ? Jason Ellison wasted a roster spot on many rosters for many years. Get a grip.

Newman4
01-30-2008, 01:02 AM
Hey, Brandon Phillips couldn't do any of those things in 2005 and that didn't work out...

If teams just gave away good players, this would be a whole lot easier, wouldn't it?

As mentioned earlier, I don't see the potential for Anderson to ever be much of a power threat. Phillips had some good seasons in the minors that would make him more promising. I'd pass on Mr. Anderson.

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 03:03 AM
In my opinion, Norris Hopper is about two missed drag bunts from being the next Jason Ellison...

I hope you are kidding.

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 03:04 AM
But wouldn't "the most epic waste ever" include any player on any roster any year :rolleyes: ? Jason Ellison wasted a roster spot on many rosters for many years. Get a grip.

Of course its exaggerated but just because he isnt actually the biggest waste doesn't mean its more acceptable

SMcGavin
01-30-2008, 02:26 PM
I understand where you come from, but you can say the exact same thing about Brandon Phillips' stats from after he didn't stick in Cleveland. In 2005 he hit .256/.326/.409 in 465 AB's in Buffalo. Secondly, the difference between Dickerson and Anderson is that Dickerson was never a highly touted offensive prospect as well as defensive. This is not very risky, as all I advocate giving up is Freel's contract and a C+ prospect...

That's true, but just cause we got lucky with Phillips doesn't mean it will usually happen that way. I see what you're saying though, and if we acquired Anderson for Freel or something small like that, I wouldn't really be upset. In the event of KGJ going down I wouldn't be opposed to giving Anderson playing time in center before Hopper if we are already out of the race.

AmarilloRed
01-30-2008, 02:33 PM
We really will not need a CF in 2008. We have Griffey in RF, Dunn in LF, and Freel/Hopper in CF for now, Bruce most likely later in the year. I would look to get a CF in 2009 if we really need one.

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 04:41 PM
We really will not need a CF in 2008. We have Griffey in RF, Dunn in LF, and Freel/Hopper in CF for now, Bruce most likely later in the year. I would look to get a CF in 2009 if we really need one.

Why can't we get Anderson now and then wait to use him more primarily in 2009?

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 04:44 PM
I hope you are kidding.

Re: Norris Hopper

What is Mr. Hopper good at? The only real value from him is a batting-average-driven-OBP based on his infield hits and drag bunts. Take those away and he is worth about as much as Ellison...

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 04:48 PM
As mentioned earlier, I don't see the potential for Anderson to ever be much of a power threat. Phillips had some good seasons in the minors that would make him more promising. I'd pass on Mr. Anderson.

Mr. Anderson had a very promising track record in the minors going into 2006. His career minor league line (which includes 200 horrific AAA at-bats last year) is: .293/.364/.474. In rookie and A+ ball he slugged well over .500. In 2005 at age 23 in AAA, Anderson hit .295/.360/.469 in 448 AB's. What makes Anderson any different than Phillips? Hunch? Intuition?

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Re: Norris Hopper

What is Mr. Hopper good at? The only real value from him is a batting-average-driven-OBP based on his infield hits and drag bunts. Take those away and he is worth about as much as Ellison...

Jason ellison had a line of .188/.278/.271

Thats a long way away from what ever Norris did even if you want to take away hits.

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 04:49 PM
That's true, but just cause we got lucky with Phillips doesn't mean it will usually happen that way. I see what you're saying though, and if we acquired Anderson for Freel or something small like that, I wouldn't really be upset. In the event of KGJ going down I wouldn't be opposed to giving Anderson playing time in center before Hopper if we are already out of the race.

Saying we got lucky with Phillips would be selling Krivsky short. Did DanO get unlucky with Eric Milton, or was it just stupidity?

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 04:52 PM
Jason ellison had a line of .188/.278/.271

Thats a long way away from what ever Norris did even if you want to take away hits.

Wow, 48 at-bats there for Ellison. Pretty big sample size :rolleyes:... In 46 AB's with Seattle last year he hit .283/.298/.283. I can certainly see Hopper doing that, but I wouldn't base anything off of that information because it is TOO SMALL OF A SAMPLE SIZE...

Back to my question: What is Hopper good at?

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 04:56 PM
Wow, 48 at-bats there for Ellison. Pretty big sample size :rolleyes:... In 46 AB's with Seattle last year he hit .283/.298/.283. I can certainly see Hopper doing that, but I wouldn't base anything off of that information because it is TOO SMALL OF A SAMPLE SIZE...

Ok how about his bigger sample size of almost 600 abs .251/.305/.351

Once again thats a lot of base hits you are going to take away from Hopper to make up for the .125ish change in OPS.

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 04:58 PM
Not to mention we could demote Norris instead of having to DFA him

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 05:00 PM
Norris Hopper had a career BA of .289 in the minors. Assuming his average will be a bit lower in the bigs than it was in the minors, I don't have to take very many hits away from his statsheet to get it down to a .250 average...

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 05:07 PM
Norris Hopper had a career BA of .289 in the minors. Assuming his average will be a bit lower in the bigs than it was in the minors, I don't have to take very many hits away from his statsheet to get it down to a .250 average...

His bunts could stop working but he also probably never used the bunt single in the minors. Im not saying you are wrong but we were comparing Jason ellisons awfulness while being a red and not his career numbers.

Fact is Ellison was as bad as anyone could have been and for Hopper to be as bad as him he would have to almost lose a leg.

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 05:09 PM
His bunts could stop working but he also probably never used the bunt single in the minors. Im not saying you are wrong but we were comparing Jason ellisons awfulness while being a red and not his career numbers.

Fact is Ellison was as bad as anyone could have been and for Hopper to be as bad as him he would have to almost lose a leg.

Turning this into a Hopper vs. Ellison arguement wasn't my point, but this is the way I see it:

Anderson>Hopper>Ellison

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 05:16 PM
Turning this into a Hopper vs. Ellison arguement wasn't my point, but this is the way I see it:

Anderson>Hopper>Ellison

If Anderson isnt on the major league roster Id love to trade for him. Him sitting on the bench isnt going to do him or us any good.

CarolinaRedleg
01-30-2008, 05:34 PM
Hey, Great American turns mediocre hitters into good hitters and good hitters into great hitters and Jason Ellison into......never mind :p:

My take is, if Anderson's available on the cheap, there are worse players Krivs has taken a flier on (Ellison, Coats, etc.)

BLEEDS
01-30-2008, 06:06 PM
In my opinion, Norris Hopper is about two missed drag bunts from being the next Jason Ellison...

WOW, that is hilarious.

Hilarious because IT'S TRUE!!!

Anderson would be an ideal person to take a flier on. Of course SOME PEOPLE only prefer to look and rate people based on their play with the REDS, instead of their career numbers.

That's why people LOVE Hopper and Keppinger. Surely they are going to be batting .350 for the rest of their careers because they did LAST YEAR with the Reds.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 06:15 PM
WOW, that is hilarious.

Hilarious because IT'S TRUE!!!

Anderson would be an ideal person to take a flier on. Of course SOME PEOPLE only prefer to look and rate people based on their play with the REDS, instead of their career numbers.

That's why people LOVE Hopper and Keppinger. Surely they are going to be batting .350 for the rest of their careers because they did LAST YEAR with the Reds.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Hey look its BLEEEEEEEDSOMGCAPSLOCK.

People compared Ellison last year to Hopper last year. Hopper would have to get aids to ever be as bad as Ellison was last year.

Hey but what else is new with BLEEDS! He thinks young pitchers cant pitch and that all vets are dominate #3s no matter how injured and how bad they have been.

BLEEDS
01-30-2008, 06:22 PM
Hey but what else is new with BLEEDS! He thinks young pitchers cant pitch and that all vets are dominate #3s no matter how injured and how bad they have been.

Can you quit acting like a 12 year old and bring up old conversations in every thread/subject. Seriously. Grow up.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 06:25 PM
Can you quit acting like a 12 year old and bring up old conversations in every thread/subject. Seriously. Grow up.

PEACE

-BLEEDS

Still not taking your own advice I see.

redsupport
01-30-2008, 06:27 PM
Ellison has the potential to be the next Cecil Hernandez or even Gary Varsho or Greg Tubbs

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 07:58 PM
from MLBTR mailbox:


Are there any truth to the rumors that the Chicago White Sox are shopping outfielder Brian Anderson? I have heard that the Cincinnati Reds are a possible destination for him. How would Anderson fit into the Reds plans and what type of package would net a player like Anderson? - Rob

Haven't heard the Reds rumor, Rob. I guess he could make sense for them just to add some depth. Given that Anderson is out of options and does not have a role on the White Sox, the price should be low. A minor league pitcher or two that I've never heard of.

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 08:04 PM
Id like to give the guy a chance but he really needs to get a lot of at bats and I just dont see where they are for him on this roster.

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 08:14 PM
Id like to give the guy a chance but he really needs to get a lot of at bats and I just dont see where they are for him on this roster.

how about CF until Griffey gets hurt? He's RH so there will be plenty of platoon situations and he can be a late defensive sub...

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 08:17 PM
how about CF until Griffey gets hurt? He's RH so there will be plenty of platoon situations and he can be a late defensive sub...

So you are all for taking at bats away from Bruce then?

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 08:24 PM
So you are all for taking at bats away from Bruce then?

Jay Bruce is LH. Anderson can platoon with each of the three LH outfielders until Griffey gets hurt...

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 08:26 PM
Jay Bruce is LH. Anderson can platoon with each of the three LH outfielders until Griffey gets hurt...

If he can hit ML pitching something he hasnt done yet

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 08:26 PM
If he can hit ML pitching something he hasnt done yet

are you talking about Jay Bruce now? ;)

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 08:27 PM
are you talking about Jay Bruce now? ;)

Quite possible he cant hit ML pitching either, but Anderson was rushed through a system never won a minor league player of the year award and is out of options also.

He also he also hits left handers worse than he does RH so the LH RH thing really doesnt matter.

Also how often do defensive subs get to bat? Pretty rare unless its extra innings

*BaseClogger*
01-30-2008, 09:21 PM
Even if he hits LH worse than RH, what really matters is if he hits LH better than Dunn, Bruce, and Griffey...

Bip Roberts
01-30-2008, 09:23 PM
Even if he hits LH worse than RH, what really matters is if he hits LH better than Dunn, Bruce, and Griffey...

He certainly hasnt done that in the majors yet.

We dont know about Bruce though. I think he needs to out hit Freel or Hopper and im not sure he can even do that with out given a lot of at bats and time to work out his problems.

SMcGavin
01-31-2008, 12:01 AM
Saying we got lucky with Phillips would be selling Krivsky short. Did DanO get unlucky with Eric Milton, or was it just stupidity?

Didn't mean to imply it was blind luck. They had good scouting, he took a chance, it worked out. My point, and I think you'd agree with me, is that sometimes failed former prospects are just that - failed. BP happened to turn it around, but most guys suddenly don't start hitting when they have no track record of doing it. BP is the exception, not the rule. So maybe Anderson turns it around, and I said I'd be OK with trying if we give them nothing of value. But the reality is the most likely scenario that involves us trading for Anderson is that we trade for him, give him some ABs, he still can't hit, and we part ways after the season.

*BaseClogger*
01-31-2008, 12:04 AM
Didn't mean to imply it was blind luck. They had good scouting, he took a chance, it worked out. My point, and I think you'd agree with me, is that sometimes failed former prospects are just that - failed. BP happened to turn it around, but most guys suddenly don't start hitting when they have no track record of doing it. BP is the exception, not the rule. So maybe Anderson turns it around, and I said I'd be OK with trying if we give them nothing of value. But the reality is the most likely scenario that involves us trading for Anderson is that we trade for him, give him some ABs, he still can't hit, and we part ways after the season.

I do agree. Sitting here at my computer I sometimes forget that a lot of Krivdawg's decisions are made based on scouting reports and not just stats. Hopefully Kirvdawg has heard good things about Anderson from a scout. Usually I'm not a fan of attributing stuff like this, but maybe Anderson struggled because he had to put up with Ozzie "crazy ball" Guillen...

mound_patrol
01-31-2008, 12:08 AM
Why not go after a kid who has skills and may just need a change of pace. I'm all for taking a flyer on him.

SMcGavin
01-31-2008, 12:11 AM
I do agree. Sitting here at my computer I sometimes forget that a lot of Krivdawg's decisions are made based on scouting reports and not just stats. Hopefully Kirvdawg has heard good things about Anderson from a scout. Usually I'm not a fan of attributing stuff like this, but maybe Anderson struggled because he had to put up with Ozzie "crazy ball" Guillen...

Yeah and it seems like he made it up to the majors at a pretty young age. I mean it wouldn't be unprecedented for someone like him to figure it out, just unlikely. With the current make up of our team, I don't think we are going to be contenders in 08, so giving Anderson some ABs wouldn't be the worst thing ever.

One thing is for sure, if WK trades for him, I'll give him a chance. You can't really argue with Krivsky's success getting contributers for nothing.