Yanks to start Joba in the pen to limit innings

[flyer85]

ESPN.com news services

There reportedly will be a whole new set of "Joba Rules" in 2008.

The New York Post reported Tuesday that New York Yankees phenom Joba Chamberlain will begin the season as Mariano Rivera's setup man, then be sent down to the minors in June to stretch out his arm so he can be part of New York's rotation for the second half.

According to the Post, the Yankees want to limit the 22-year-old Chamberlain to approximately 140 innings in 2008 and starting him out of the bullpen will help to keep his innings count down.

The Post report states that the Yankees will start Chamberlain in the bullpen, not only to protect his arm but to find his successor as setup man. The newspaper reported that the team will audition several young relievers from a group including Alan Horne, Jose Veras, Edwar Ramirez and Ross Ohlendorf in the sixth and seventh innings in the hope they can replace Chamberlain when he moves into the rotation.

A starter in the minors, Chamberlain became Rivera's primary setup man during the final two months of last season.

"We've approached it in a great way. We're going to go in the beginning and understand there's an innings limit, and I know that," Chamberlain said Monday. "I'm excited to have a new challenge this year."

Chamberlain enters spring training along with two other heralded young pitchers: Phil Hughes and Ian Kennedy. The Yankees are relying on youth more than in recent years as they try to dethrone the World Series champion Boston Red Sox.

Chamberlain will work with the starting pitchers during the early part of spring training, even if he begins the season in the bullpen. Last year, Chamberlain worked under strict pitch and innings limits, which came to be known as the Joba Rules.

"This game is definitely a marathon, not a sprint, and I understand that," Chamberlain said. "Last year, it was kind of frustrating, having the rules, but you understood what it was about. I understand the work load and what's going to go on, but this is going to be my first go around, so I've got to be patient and learn and understand that I've got to ask questions as I prepare myself for a full season in the big leagues."

Chamberlain has been throwing off a mound for the past month at the Yankees' minor league complex. The on-field success has changed his off-field life, which includes being recognized more in public and invitations to baseball events.

"I definitely got some frequent-flyer miles, I'll tell you that much," Chamberlain said with a smile. "It's just the opportunities that came, and the people that I got to meet was great. If you don't perform on the field, you don't get to do all that great stuff and enjoy yourself in the offseason. It was definitely an honor. Hard works pays off, but you've got to come back and work even harder so you can have that much fun next year."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

[M2]

They're also starting him in the bullpen because he's going to spend his career there.

[BoydsOfSummer]

They're also starting him in the bullpen because he's going to spend his career there.

Bingo!

[Puffy]

They're also starting him in the bullpen because he's going to spend his career there.

Mariano Rivera, Part Deux

[flyer85]

They're also starting him in the bullpen because he's going to spend his career there.then why move him to the rotation at mid-season. Doesn't seem like their plan for him is to relieve long term.

[princeton]

I like this approach for young pitchers, and look forward to the results.

I would even apply it to certain minor leaguers when attempting to move up a level or two.

[RedsManRick]

They're also starting him in the bullpen because he's going to spend his career there.

What makes you say that? Doesn't he have 2 plus pitches and decent breaking stuff? Fastball, Slider, and then a change for lefties and a curve for righties is a pretty standard starter repertoire. And he's built to carry the load. Reminds me a bit of a young Bartolo Colon with better control and less creativity with his fastball.

[M2]

then why move him to the rotation at mid-season. Doesn't seem like their plan for him is to relieve long term.

They won't move him to the rotation at midseason. He certainly won't be sent down to the minors to stretch out his arm if he's pitching well in the majors.

It's pure B.S.

[M2]

What makes you say that? Doesn't he have 2 plus pitches and decent breaking stuff? Fastball, Slider, and then a change for lefties and a curve for righties is a pretty standard starter repertoire. And he's built to carry the load. Reminds me a bit of a young Bartolo Colon with better control and less creativity with his fastball.

He doesn't have a change worth mentioning (the slider's more effective against RHBs and the curve is better for LHBs, traditionally speaking).

I don't disagree that he has the potential to be a big-time starter, but he's never thrown more than 119 IP in a season and his stuff gets evil when he relieves. I figure if he succeeds in the pen, no one's ever going to ask him to start.

The bullpen was supposedly only a way station for Mo Rivera too.

[flyer85]

He doesn't have a change worth mentioning (the slider's more effective against RHBs and the curve is better for LHBs, traditionally speaking)..A number of dominant starters have had their success throwing only 2 pitches. The fact that he doesn't have a quality third pitch doesn't at all preclude him from being a starter. When you have a 94-98 fastball and a nasty slider throwing a 3rd pitch is doing the batter a favor.

[dougdirt]

I am 100% with M2 on this one. I don't buy what the Yankees are selling even a tiny little bit.

[lollipopcurve]

Why would the Yankees lie about this? To keep Joba happy because he might prefer to start... until they "change their mind" and send him back to the pen?

I just do not see what they'd have to gain. Once Rivera is done, they can buy the next big closer to hit the market. Why not see if Chamberlain can eventually lay waste to 200 innings instead of 80-90?

[blumj]

You almost can't do what they're saying they're going to do. If Joba's pitching like he was last year out of the pen, they're going to suddenly take him out of that role, send him down to get stretched out, and hand his relief innings over to someone else who may or may not be able to do the job at all, never mind do it as well as he's been doing it? No, you'd do it the other way, start him in the rotation, or the AAA rotation, and move him into the pen later as he got closer to his innings limit.

[flyer85]

No, you'd do it the other way, start him in the rotation, or the AAA rotation, and move him into the pen later as he got closer to his innings limit.Not if you wanted to have a potentially dominant starter ready for the playoffs.

[fearofpopvol1]

I don't think the Yanks are lying. I think that is their plan. However, what I think will happen with Chamberlain is what happened with Pappelbon (although the route to get there will be different) rather than what happened with Wainwright.

[flyer85]

However, what I think will happen with Chamberlain is what happened with Pappelbon (although the route to get there will be different) rather than what happened with Wainwright.two things that are different about Papelbon/Joba situations. The Sox had no reliable closer, the Yanks have Rivera. Papelbon was a closer in college who was made a starter by the Sox whereas Joba had always been a starter until AAA and the majors last year.

Who is to say how it will work out but if the Yanks have rotation issues in June I could seem they pulling the trigger.

[vaticanplum]

two things that are different about Papelbon/Joba situations. The Sox had no reliable closer, the Yanks have Rivera. Papelbon was a closer in college who was made a starter by the Sox whereas Joba had always been a starter until AAA and the majors last year.

Who is to say how it will work out but if the Yanks have rotation issues in June I could seem they pulling the trigger.

I thought a major reason papelbon was made a closer was to protect his shoulder. Am I misremembering? If so, the two situations are even more incomparable.

I don't see the Yanks making chamberlain a starter unless they really run out of other options. And even then, I think they'll exhaust ALL of them before they switch chamberlain back. If Chamberlain is lights out in the pen, I believe they'll leave him there. The Yankees have really struggled with a setup man in recent years and it's a relief to have a potential lights-out one. Plus, Rivera is nearing the end of his career. If they can establish a good replacement now, my guess is they feel they need to do it.

[KoryMac5]

I know that the guys on WFAN have been speaking a lot about this lately. I can't see it happening especially when the Yankee's biggest problem was middle relief last year. Keep him in relief groom him to take over for Rivera.

[Roy Tucker]

The Yanks probably need to send Joba down to a tropical climate to learn to deal with midges. :)

[blumj]

I thought a major reason papelbon was made a closer was to protect his shoulder. Am I misremembering?
Yeah, actually, it was the other way around. They felt that he could keep up his conditioning better in between starts with recovery time from pitching and and shoulder exercises built into the regular schedule of a starter. But not only didn't they have anyone else to close, he didn't like being a starter.

[Strikes Out Looking]

Papelbom was going back to the rotation last year, but since they didn't have a closer, he said he'd stay in the bullpen. The rest is history.

As to Joba--the plan is sound except for one thing. The Yanks are counting on Mussina, Pettite, Kennedy and Hughes to be behind Wang in the rotation. That is, I believe, a big if. Asking Kennedy and Hughes to both pitch like vets is like asking, well, Baily and Cueto to pitch like vets.

[edabbs44]

Papelbom was going back to the rotation last year, but since they didn't have a closer, he said he'd stay in the bullpen. The rest is history.

As to Joba--the plan is sound except for one thing. The Yanks are counting on Mussina, Pettite, Kennedy and Hughes to be behind Wang in the rotation. That is, I believe, a big if. Asking Kennedy and Hughes to both pitch like vets is like asking, well, Baily and Cueto to pitch like vets.

Joba isn't exactly a grizzled vet either.

[vaticanplum]

As to Joba--the plan is sound except for one thing. The Yanks are counting on Mussina, Pettite, Kennedy and Hughes to be behind Wang in the rotation. That is, I believe, a big if. Asking Kennedy and Hughes to both pitch like vets is like asking, well, Baily and Cueto to pitch like vets.

If the Yankees run into problems with Kennedy or Hughes, I have little doubt they will look for a grizzled vet elsewhere. I love em, but I mean, this is the Yankees we're talking about. I seriously doubt they are "counting" on Mussina or Pettitte any more than they're counting on the kids, and will explore backup options if need be.

[Strikes Out Looking]

If the Yankees run into problems with Kennedy or Hughes, I have little doubt they will look for a grizzled vet elsewhere. I love em, but I mean, this is the Yankees we're talking about. I seriously doubt they are "counting" on Mussina or Pettitte any more than they're counting on the kids, and will explore backup options if need be.

Then here is the $64 million question: Can the new Yankee management under Girardi produce miracles from washed up vets like the Torre Administration did two years ago? Because they can't just go out and pick up Cy Young ready pitchers in mid-season.

[vaticanplum]

Then here is the $64 million question: Can the new Yankee management under Girardi produce miracles from washed up vets like the Torre Administration did two years ago? Because they can't just go out and pick up Cy Young ready pitchers in mid-season.

Honestly, I think the Yankees will be out of the playoffs for a couple of years. And I think that will be good for their young players.

It's a numbers game. At least a few of their young talented prospects are bound to pan out, but it's a question of how many and when it will happen. But I think they realize they'd be foolish to ruin them or to misplace them for the sake of the short-term, which is why I think they'll keep Joba in the pen.