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Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 01:43 PM
Former Reds trainer Larry Starr was featured on ESPN's Outside the Lines today (and in an ESPN.com story yesterday) about the "enablers" in MLB who looked the other way when it came to steroids. The piece talked about trainers and especially managers like Tony LaRussa (I've been banging that drum for years -- wouldn't be surprised if LaRussa has an HGH lab in his basement).

Anyway, Starr wouldn't name the player, but said his first encounter with steroids was with a "light-hitting Reds prospect in spring training in 1984 who added 25 pounds of all muscle in the offseason and was suddenly hitting the ball much better." The reporter called him a "AA prospect who hit .400 that spring including a few home runs."

I thought long and hard about it, but couldn't come up with the name. Maybe Nick Esasky? Doubtful. Esasky was pretty naturally big. Maybe Tracy Jones???

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=quinn_tj&id=3270983

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

MrCinatit
03-02-2008, 01:58 PM
The only ones who seem to fit under the "light hitting infielder" mold during that time are Esasky, Ron Oester, Dave Concepcion and Wayne Krenchicki.
Oester and Concepcion didn't really improve on their numbers suddenly during that period.
Esasky saw a lot of improvement - but that could also come from his maturing. I don't really remember his size when he came up - I would have to look at some of my older cards.
Krenchicki saw a pretty large improvement from '83 to '84 - but this was in a utility position and could simply be luck.
Frankly, kind of hard to tell.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 02:04 PM
The only ones who seem to fit under the "light hitting infielder" mold during that time are Esasky, Ron Oester, Dave Concepcion and Wayne Krenchicki.
Oester and Concepcion didn't really improve on their numbers suddenly during that period.
Esasky saw a lot of improvement - but that could also come from his maturing. I don't really remember his size when he came up - I would have to look at some of my older cards.
Krenchicki saw a pretty large improvement from '83 to '84 - but this was in a utility position and could simply be luck.
Frankly, kind of hard to tell.

I'm sorry, I went back and edited. I went back and listened to the piece (I have it DVR'd) and he only said "light-hitting Reds prospect" not necessarily an infielder. I thought for some reason he said infielder but he clearly says "light-hitting prospect."

Here is what we know: This player was in Double-A in 1983. He gained 25 pounds of muscle in the offseason and hit .400 in spring training 1984 and made the team. Could we be talking about the Tracer here?

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 02:12 PM
Wade Rowdon, anyone?

As someone pointed out to me in a private message, he made his Reds' debut in 1984.

I don't think it was Eric Davis. First of all, he wouldn't have been considered a "light-hitting prospect." Second of all, since he was skinnier than the Olson twins, I just don't see steroids with him. Starr said this guy went from about 169 pounds to 195 in the offseason. Davis didn't weigh 195 soaking wet in 1984.

But Wade Rowdon, very interesting. I still think Tracy might be a possibility. When did he first come up to the bigs?

marcshoe
03-02-2008, 02:14 PM
Starr's made a similar comment to this before, engendering much speculation on this board. There are a few specifics now, eliminating some of the previous suspects (such as Kal Daniels).

I normally don't like to speculate on such things, but if it's Tracy Jones, the speculation seems somehow fair.

BCubb2003
03-02-2008, 02:15 PM
Tracy Jones "played the game" beginning in 1986.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 02:16 PM
BTW, Rowdon was listed at 6-foot-2, 180 pounds his final season in MLB in 1988. He would fall between the 169-195 lbs that Starr talked about.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 02:17 PM
Tracy Jones "played the game" beginning in 1986.

The process of elimination is great. Wade Rowdon is your leader in the clubhouse.

marcshoe
03-02-2008, 02:19 PM
Tracy Jones "played the game" beginning in 1986.

Yeah, he was only in single A in 1984, but if there's some way to make this about him, say by suggesting Starr's memory was off a little, hey, I'm willing to adjust. :p:

ochre
03-02-2008, 02:24 PM
I'm sorry, I went back and edited. I went back and listened to the piece (I have it DVR'd) and he only said "light-hitting Reds prospect" not necessarily an infielder. I thought for some reason he said infielder but he clearly says "light-hitting prospect."

Here is what we know: This player was in Double-A in 1983. He gained 25 pounds of muscle in the offseason and hit .400 in spring training 1984 and made the team. Could we be talking about the Tracer here?
http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32504&highlight=larry+starr
Starr has gotten a lot of mileage out of this story. Back in aught 5 the year in question was 1988. As he gets older the year in question pushes further back. Twenty years from now Starr's story might be that it was a young middle infielder back int 1962 or 1963.

Not saying that he's making it up, just that it sounds like one of those scenarios where a guy is remembering different bits and different pieces and combining them into a grand tale.

marcshoe
03-02-2008, 02:27 PM
fwiw, it couldn't be Krenchiki. I watched him play in several AAA games for Rochester (at Charleston) in 1979. I have some very specific memories.

marcshoe
03-02-2008, 02:28 PM
:cool:
http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32504&highlight=larry+starr
Starr has gotten a lot of mileage out of this story. Back in aught 5 the year in question was 1988. As he gets older the year in question pushes further back. Twenty years from now Starr's story might be that it was a young middle infielder back int 1962 or 1963.

Not saying that he's making it up, just that it sounds like one of those scenarios where a guy is remembering different bits and different pieces and combining them into a grand tale.



Okay, that's good enough for me. It's Tracy Jones. :cool:

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 02:29 PM
http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32504&highlight=larry+starr
Starr has gotten a lot of mileage out of this story. Back in aught 5 the year in question was 1988. As he gets older the year in question pushes further back. Twenty years from now Starr's story might be that it was a young middle infielder back int 1962 or 1963.

Not saying that he's making it up, just that it sounds like one of those scenarios where a guy is remembering different bits and different pieces and combining them into a grand tale.

In fairness, there is not a quote from Starr in the 2005 story that says 1988 was the first time he had an encounter with steroids. The writer draws that conclusion, but I wonder if he was taking certain liberties with the story. Starr was quoted on ESPN today saying 1984 was the first time. And he's clearly talking about two different players because he says the player in 1988 (possibly Kal Daniels) was asking him about steroids. The player in 1984 didn't say a word and Starr was just saying that was the first time he suspected someone of juicing.

WMR
03-02-2008, 02:36 PM
Tracy Jones "played the game" beginning in 1986.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

ochre
03-02-2008, 02:40 PM
In fairness, there is not a quote from Starr in the 2005 story that says 1988 was the first time he had an encounter with steroids. The writer draws that conclusion, but I wonder if he was taking certain liberties with the story. Starr was quoted on ESPN today saying 1984 was the first time. And he's clearly talking about two different players because he says the player in 1988 (possibly Kal Daniels) was asking him about steroids. The player in 1984 didn't say a word and Starr was just saying that was the first time he suspected someone of juicing.
Valid points.

I guess I just think it is a bit untoward of Starr to continue to throw this stuff out there. It is at best irresponsible, since he gives just enough information for people to speculate on who it might be, ostensibly dragging innocent people along for the ride through the mud.

Unassisted
03-02-2008, 02:42 PM
http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32504&highlight=larry+starr
Starr has gotten a lot of mileage out of this story.
<snip>

Not saying that he's making it up, just that it sounds like one of those scenarios where a guy is remembering different bits and different pieces and combining them into a grand tale.

That's what I was thinking when I saw this thread. I also think that if Larry Starr had any useful information to offer the steroids investigations, he would have been subpoenaed to testify before Congress and asked to name names.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 03:09 PM
That's what I was thinking when I saw this thread. I also think that if Larry Starr had any useful information to offer the steroids investigations, he would have been subpoenaed to testify before Congress and asked to name names.

Name names about light-hitting Reds players from the 1980's? Very doubtful. They want current players or at least guys who have recently retired (late 90's at the earliest). Knoblach is about as far as they are going to go back. And who knew HGH caused you to be unable to throw the ball from second base to first?

Starr not getting interviewed was also a function of Senator Mitchell's investigation not being comprehensive enough. It's astonishing that he didn't mention any Red Sox players in his report (Ortiz is obvious). Then again, we all know why he didnt: he owns stock in the Red Sox.

savafan
03-02-2008, 03:10 PM
What about Kurt Stillwell?

RedFanAlways1966
03-02-2008, 03:10 PM
Here is what we know: This player was in Double-A in 1983.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-TCMA-Waterbury-Reds-Team-Set-(19)_W0QQitemZ140205880667QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0 802100831a12947

Someone buy this and tell us the entire roster of that Waterbury REDS team! Enquiring minds want to know.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 03:11 PM
Valid points.

I guess I just think it is a bit untoward of Starr to continue to throw this stuff out there. It is at best irresponsible, since he gives just enough information for people to speculate on who it might be, ostensibly dragging innocent people along for the ride through the mud.

I agree. Either come out and name the player, or don't give an exact year. If you do, you bring the entire roster into question. You can just say "I had a player..." without naming the year.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 03:15 PM
What about Kurt Stillwell?

Nope. Made his MLB debut in 1986.

savafan
03-02-2008, 03:17 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-TCMA-Waterbury-Reds-Team-Set-(19)_W0QQitemZ140205880667QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0 802100831a12947

Someone buy this and tell us the entire roster of that Waterbury REDS team! Enquiring minds want to know.


C Dave Miley 21 65 186 19 45 11 0 4 24 1 1 36 7 0 1 1 1 .242 .363 .366 729 --
1B Jeff Jones 25 91 298 52 70 7 0 17 50 7 3 57 108 5 2 2 0 .235 .367 .430 797 --
2B Carlos Porte - 112 385 40 95 11 5 5 42 10 4 31 38 0 2 3 0 .247 .303 .340 643 --
3B Wade Rowdon 22 135 480 62 112 29 1 21 76 6 3 47 119 3 0 2 3 .233 .304 .429 733 --
SS Hector Rincones - 135 494 50 113 14 2 2 34 17 3 20 52 2 0 4 2 .229 .261 .277 538 --
OF Leo Garcia 20 131 498 65 128 25 11 5 47 16 9 31 70 1 5 6 7 .257 .298 .382 680 --
OF Ron Little - 101 318 35 70 11 0 9 40 3 4 31 95 1 1 3 3 .220 .289 .340 629 --
OF Eric Davis 21 89 293 56 85 13 1 15 43 39 12 65 75 5 3 0 3 .290 .423 .495 918 --

Lloyd McClendon 24 123 434 58 114 19 2 15 57 4 6 42 64 5 2 3 1 .263 .334 .419 753 --
Ken Scarpace - 83 266 33 71 11 2 4 27 4 5 20 26 2 3 3 2 .267 .321 .368 689 --
Paul Kirsch - 51 155 11 41 6 1 1 16 4 0 9 11 2 1 1 1 .265 .311 .335 646 --
Ray Corbett - 35 96 11 19 2 1 1 6 0 1 17 31 1 0 4 0 .198 .325 .271 596 --
Dexter Day - 36 93 12 13 2 0 1 8 8 1 16 23 2 1 0 2 .140 .274 .194 468 --
Glenn Franklin - 26 79 10 22 3 0 0 4 5 0 6 4 1 0 0 0 .278 .337 .316 653 --
Ruben Guzman - 20 44 5 7 0 0 1 5 0 0 6 11 1 0 1 0 .159 .275 .227 502 --
Paul O'Neill 20 14 43 6 12 0 0 0 6 2 1 6 8 0 0 0 0 .279 .367 .279 646 --
Curt Heidenreich - 17 33 4 3 2 0 0 3 0 0 3 14 0 0 1 0 .091 .167 .152 319 --
Ron Robinson 21 20 30 2 6 1 0 0 2 0 0 2 11 0 0 6 0 .200 .250 .233 483 --
Brian Ryder - 23 22 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 13 0 0 0 0 .045 .045 .045 090 --
Adolfo Feliz - 10 20 5 4 0 0 0 1 1 0 7 6 1 0 0 0 .200 .429 .200 629 --
James Pettibone - 18 19 1 3 0 0 0 1 0 0 4 7 0 0 3 0 .158 .304 .158 462 --
Bill Boddy - 8 17 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 2 0 0 0 0 .059 .111 .059 170 --
Tom Browning 23 18 16 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0 0 0 0 .250 .250 .250 500 --
Keefe Cato 25 7 16 3 5 1 1 0 1 0 1 2 4 1 0 1 0 .313 .421 .500 921 --
Scot Ender - 14 8 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .111 .000 111 --
Bryan Funk - 43 8 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 2 0 0 0 0 .125 .300 .125 425 --
Ken Jones - 29 8 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 .125 .300 .125 425 --
Mike Smith 22 22 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Bill Landrum 24 17 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Mark Rothey - 43 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 .000 .333 .000 333 --
Les Straker 23 3 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 .000 .333 .000 333 --
Mike Dowless - 13 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --

Pitching Statistics
Player Name Age W L ERA G GS CG SH GF SV IP H R ER HR BB SO WP BK H9 HR9 BB9 K9 WHIP GB%
ST Brian Ryder - 7 10 4.81 23 23 6 1 0 0 136.2 143 84 73 12 79 49 3 9.42 0.79 5.20 3.23 1.62 --
ST Ron Robinson 21 7 9 3.60 20 20 6 0 0 0 142.2 132 66 57 15 60 82 3 8.33 0.95 3.79 5.17 1.35 --
ST Tom Browning 23 4 10 3.53 18 18 3 1 0 0 117.1 100 62 46 6 63 101 3 7.67 0.46 4.83 7.75 1.39 --
ST James Pettibone - 4 8 5.72 18 18 2 1 0 0 91.1 95 65 58 12 63 54 6 9.36 1.18 6.21 5.32 1.73 --
ST Curt Heidenreich - 11 4 1.73 17 17 8 4 0 0 119.1 84 29 23 4 56 98 4 6.34 0.30 4.22 7.39 1.17 --

RP Bryan Funk - 2 6 4.06 43 4 3 1 22 5 84.1 96 48 38 5 37 50 5 10.25 0.53 3.95 5.34 1.58 --
RP Mark Rothey - 2 7 4.57 41 1 0 0 20 1 67.0 76 45 34 7 50 45 4 10.21 0.94 6.72 6.04 1.88 --
RP Ken Jones - 4 5 5.32 28 7 1 0 7 0 91.1 89 70 54 9 67 55 5 8.77 0.89 6.60 5.42 1.71 --

Mike Smith 22 2 5 2.83 22 0 0 0 18 7 28.2 18 13 9 0 25 16 2 5.65 0.00 7.85 5.02 1.50 --
Bill Landrum 24 1 1 1.52 17 0 0 0 12 3 29.2 17 5 5 0 14 33 2 5.16 0.00 4.25 10.01 1.04 --
Bob Buchanan 22 0 1 6.50 14 0 0 0 11 2 18.0 19 13 13 2 9 12 1 9.50 1.00 4.50 6.00 1.56 --
Brett Wise - 2 3 3.75 14 0 0 0 11 3 24.0 26 16 10 1 15 11 2 9.75 0.38 5.63 4.13 1.71 --
Scot Ender - 6 4 4.38 14 10 4 2 0 0 74.0 66 39 36 2 46 58 3 8.03 0.24 5.59 7.05 1.51 --
Mike Dowless - 4 4 2.85 13 11 0 0 2 1 75.2 66 29 24 7 26 55 1 7.85 0.83 3.09 6.54 1.22 --
Keefe Cato 25 3 1 3.18 7 7 3 2 0 0 51.0 37 18 18 4 9 40 2 6.53 0.71 1.59 7.06 0.90 --
Les Straker 23 0 2 9.00 3 3 0 0 0 0 10.0 16 10 10 2 6 5 0 14.40 1.80 5.40 4.50 2.20 --

savafan
03-02-2008, 03:20 PM
For the record, here's the Reds' 1984 Vermont AA roster:


Batting Statistics
Pos Player Name Age G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO HBP IBB SH SF DP AVG OBP SLG OPS GB%
C Buddy Pryor - 100 288 30 56 13 0 5 29 2 3 49 84 1 0 1 5 .194 .309 .292 601 --
1B Terry Lee 22 134 422 56 102 10 2 11 47 2 4 44 94 3 1 2 4 .242 .315 .353 668 --
2B Tom Riley - 52 163 16 32 2 0 0 7 0 0 19 18 0 0 3 0 .196 .280 .209 489 --
3B Chris Sabo 22 125 441 44 94 19 1 5 38 10 5 44 62 4 1 2 4 .213 .288 .295 583 --
SS Tony Evans - 117 334 45 69 11 3 6 40 6 7 49 72 2 2 5 4 .207 .308 .311 619 --
OF Paul O'Neill 21 134 475 70 126 31 5 16 76 29 11 52 72 2 6 0 7 .265 .336 .453 789 --
OF Ron Little - 122 355 37 93 11 1 0 34 5 5 30 69 0 5 1 5 .262 .315 .299 614 --
OF Ruben Guzman - 120 410 53 108 13 5 10 56 34 10 41 80 3 3 1 3 .263 .333 .393 726 --

Kal Daniels 20 122 415 81 130 29 4 17 62 43 11 73 59 2 5 0 1 .313 .418 .525 943 --
Glenn Franklin - 102 324 49 98 9 5 5 43 17 2 42 26 1 3 1 5 .302 .379 .407 786 --
Lloyd McClendon 25 60 202 36 56 16 0 7 27 2 2 28 28 2 0 0 1 .277 .369 .460 829 --
Dan Lamar - 46 141 13 23 4 0 4 20 0 0 14 32 2 0 0 1 .163 .247 .277 524 --
Carlos Porte - 42 126 12 25 5 0 2 12 4 2 8 16 1 0 4 0 .198 .252 .286 538 --
Jeff Cox 28 38 118 19 31 2 0 0 15 1 0 18 17 1 0 2 3 .263 .357 .280 637 --
Crestwell Pratt - 39 99 13 17 3 0 3 11 0 1 7 39 0 0 0 3 .172 .220 .293 513 --
Michael Knox - 29 22 1 4 1 0 0 1 0 0 1 6 0 0 3 0 .182 .217 .227 444 --
Scott Terry 24 20 17 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 10 0 0 1 0 .059 .158 .059 217 --
Dave Lochner 24 27 16 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 2 0 0 0 0 .063 .118 .063 181 --
Peter Grimm - 27 10 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 3 5 0 0 2 0 .100 .308 .100 408 --
Joe Stalp - 24 10 2 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 1 5 0 0 3 0 .100 .182 .100 282 --
Rob Murphy 24 45 4 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 .500 .500 .500 1000 --
Matthews Bullinger - 21 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Louie Trujillo - 19 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Mike Smith 23 35 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Brett Wise - 20 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --

Pitching Statistics
Player Name Age W L ERA G GS CG SH GF SV IP H R ER HR BB SO WP BK H9 HR9 BB9 K9 WHIP GB%
ST Peter Grimm - 10 11 3.88 27 27 5 1 0 0 155.1 147 81 67 12 56 85 4 8.52 0.70 3.24 4.92 1.31 --
ST Michael Knox - 13 8 2.97 27 27 7 2 0 0 185.0 178 78 61 6 39 76 5 8.66 0.29 1.90 3.70 1.17 --
ST Joe Stalp - 10 8 2.69 23 23 3 2 0 0 133.2 124 66 40 3 54 50 11 8.35 0.20 3.64 3.37 1.33 --
ST Dave Lochner 24 10 7 3.29 23 22 3 1 0 0 139.2 125 61 51 9 55 78 6 8.05 0.58 3.54 5.03 1.29 --
ST Scott Terry 24 14 3 1.50 20 20 9 6 0 0 144.0 110 31 24 1 43 100 5 6.88 0.06 2.69 6.25 1.06 --

CL Rob Murphy 24 2 3 2.71 45 1 0 0 25 15 69.2 57 23 21 0 35 69 7 7.36 0.00 4.52 8.91 1.32 --
RP Mike Smith 23 3 3 3.35 35 0 0 0 23 6 51.0 51 28 19 2 20 49 4 9.00 0.35 3.53 8.65 1.39 --

Jeff Montgomery 22 2 0 2.13 22 0 0 0 11 4 25.1 14 7 6 0 24 20 1 4.97 0.00 8.53 7.11 1.50 --
Matthews Bullinger - 1 2 4.62 21 2 0 0 8 3 37.0 38 27 19 2 23 31 1 9.24 0.49 5.59 7.54 1.65 --
Brett Wise - 2 1 3.21 20 0 0 0 8 2 33.2 32 18 12 1 16 24 2 8.55 0.27 4.28 6.42 1.43 --
Louie Trujillo - 0 3 5.50 19 0 0 0 6 1 34.1 33 30 21 3 28 29 2 8.65 0.79 7.34 7.60 1.78 --
Mike Konderia - 1 1 4.87 15 0 0 0 4 1 20.1 19 12 11 2 19 19 3 8.41 0.89 8.41 8.41 1.87 --
Bob Buchanan 23 1 2 2.18 14 0 0 0 12 6 20.2 14 8 5 0 14 18 1 6.10 0.00 6.10 7.84 1.35 --
Jim Jefferson - 0 4 7.31 7 4 0 0 3 0 28.1 44 25 23 1 12 22 1 13.98 0.32 3.81 6.99 1.98 --
Buddy Pryor - 0 0 0.00 1 0 0 0 1 0 1.0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 18.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.00 --
Crestwell Pratt - 0 0 0.00 1 0 0 0 1 0 1.0 1 0 0 0 1 1 0 9.00 0.00 9.00 9.00 2.00 --
Jack Lind 38 0 1 2.25 1 1 0 0 0 0 4.0 8 8 1 0 3 2 0 18.00 0.00 6.75 4.50 2.75 --

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 03:21 PM
C Dave Miley 21 65 186 19 45 11 0 4 24 1 1 36 7 0 1 1 1 .242 .363 .366 729 --
1B Jeff Jones 25 91 298 52 70 7 0 17 50 7 3 57 108 5 2 2 0 .235 .367 .430 797 --
2B Carlos Porte - 112 385 40 95 11 5 5 42 10 4 31 38 0 2 3 0 .247 .303 .340 643 --
3B Wade Rowdon 22 135 480 62 112 29 1 21 76 6 3 47 119 3 0 2 3 .233 .304 .429 733 --
SS Hector Rincones - 135 494 50 113 14 2 2 34 17 3 20 52 2 0 4 2 .229 .261 .277 538 --
OF Leo Garcia 20 131 498 65 128 25 11 5 47 16 9 31 70 1 5 6 7 .257 .298 .382 680 --
OF Ron Little - 101 318 35 70 11 0 9 40 3 4 31 95 1 1 3 3 .220 .289 .340 629 --
OF Eric Davis 21 89 293 56 85 13 1 15 43 39 12 65 75 5 3 0 3 .290 .423 .495 918 --

Lloyd McClendon 24 123 434 58 114 19 2 15 57 4 6 42 64 5 2 3 1 .263 .334 .419 753 --
Ken Scarpace - 83 266 33 71 11 2 4 27 4 5 20 26 2 3 3 2 .267 .321 .368 689 --
Paul Kirsch - 51 155 11 41 6 1 1 16 4 0 9 11 2 1 1 1 .265 .311 .335 646 --
Ray Corbett - 35 96 11 19 2 1 1 6 0 1 17 31 1 0 4 0 .198 .325 .271 596 --
Dexter Day - 36 93 12 13 2 0 1 8 8 1 16 23 2 1 0 2 .140 .274 .194 468 --
Glenn Franklin - 26 79 10 22 3 0 0 4 5 0 6 4 1 0 0 0 .278 .337 .316 653 --
Ruben Guzman - 20 44 5 7 0 0 1 5 0 0 6 11 1 0 1 0 .159 .275 .227 502 --
Paul O'Neill 20 14 43 6 12 0 0 0 6 2 1 6 8 0 0 0 0 .279 .367 .279 646 --
Curt Heidenreich - 17 33 4 3 2 0 0 3 0 0 3 14 0 0 1 0 .091 .167 .152 319 --
Ron Robinson 21 20 30 2 6 1 0 0 2 0 0 2 11 0 0 6 0 .200 .250 .233 483 --
Brian Ryder - 23 22 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 13 0 0 0 0 .045 .045 .045 090 --
Adolfo Feliz - 10 20 5 4 0 0 0 1 1 0 7 6 1 0 0 0 .200 .429 .200 629 --
James Pettibone - 18 19 1 3 0 0 0 1 0 0 4 7 0 0 3 0 .158 .304 .158 462 --
Bill Boddy - 8 17 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 2 0 0 0 0 .059 .111 .059 170 --
Tom Browning 23 18 16 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 0 0 0 0 .250 .250 .250 500 --
Keefe Cato 25 7 16 3 5 1 1 0 1 0 1 2 4 1 0 1 0 .313 .421 .500 921 --
Scot Ender - 14 8 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .111 .000 111 --
Bryan Funk - 43 8 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 2 0 0 0 0 .125 .300 .125 425 --
Ken Jones - 29 8 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 .125 .300 .125 425 --
Mike Smith 22 22 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 3 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Bill Landrum 24 17 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --
Mark Rothey - 43 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 0 0 1 0 .000 .333 .000 333 --
Les Straker 23 3 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 .000 .333 .000 333 --
Mike Dowless - 13 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 0 .000 .000 .000 000 --

Pitching Statistics
Player Name Age W L ERA G GS CG SH GF SV IP H R ER HR BB SO WP BK H9 HR9 BB9 K9 WHIP GB%
ST Brian Ryder - 7 10 4.81 23 23 6 1 0 0 136.2 143 84 73 12 79 49 3 9.42 0.79 5.20 3.23 1.62 --
ST Ron Robinson 21 7 9 3.60 20 20 6 0 0 0 142.2 132 66 57 15 60 82 3 8.33 0.95 3.79 5.17 1.35 --
ST Tom Browning 23 4 10 3.53 18 18 3 1 0 0 117.1 100 62 46 6 63 101 3 7.67 0.46 4.83 7.75 1.39 --
ST James Pettibone - 4 8 5.72 18 18 2 1 0 0 91.1 95 65 58 12 63 54 6 9.36 1.18 6.21 5.32 1.73 --
ST Curt Heidenreich - 11 4 1.73 17 17 8 4 0 0 119.1 84 29 23 4 56 98 4 6.34 0.30 4.22 7.39 1.17 --

RP Bryan Funk - 2 6 4.06 43 4 3 1 22 5 84.1 96 48 38 5 37 50 5 10.25 0.53 3.95 5.34 1.58 --
RP Mark Rothey - 2 7 4.57 41 1 0 0 20 1 67.0 76 45 34 7 50 45 4 10.21 0.94 6.72 6.04 1.88 --
RP Ken Jones - 4 5 5.32 28 7 1 0 7 0 91.1 89 70 54 9 67 55 5 8.77 0.89 6.60 5.42 1.71 --

Mike Smith 22 2 5 2.83 22 0 0 0 18 7 28.2 18 13 9 0 25 16 2 5.65 0.00 7.85 5.02 1.50 --
Bill Landrum 24 1 1 1.52 17 0 0 0 12 3 29.2 17 5 5 0 14 33 2 5.16 0.00 4.25 10.01 1.04 --
Bob Buchanan 22 0 1 6.50 14 0 0 0 11 2 18.0 19 13 13 2 9 12 1 9.50 1.00 4.50 6.00 1.56 --
Brett Wise - 2 3 3.75 14 0 0 0 11 3 24.0 26 16 10 1 15 11 2 9.75 0.38 5.63 4.13 1.71 --
Scot Ender - 6 4 4.38 14 10 4 2 0 0 74.0 66 39 36 2 46 58 3 8.03 0.24 5.59 7.05 1.51 --
Mike Dowless - 4 4 2.85 13 11 0 0 2 1 75.2 66 29 24 7 26 55 1 7.85 0.83 3.09 6.54 1.22 --
Keefe Cato 25 3 1 3.18 7 7 3 2 0 0 51.0 37 18 18 4 9 40 2 6.53 0.71 1.59 7.06 0.90 --
Les Straker 23 0 2 9.00 3 3 0 0 0 0 10.0 16 10 10 2 6 5 0 14.40 1.80 5.40 4.50 2.20 --


Let's see here. Rowdon hit .233 in 1983 in AA ball and then makes his MLB debut in 1984? That has GOT to be who Starr was talking about. Fits everything to a T.

Blitz Dorsey
03-02-2008, 03:23 PM
Nah, I think it was Dave Miley ;-)

And looking again, maybe I shouldn't be so certain on Wade Rowdon. He did hit 21 HRs in 1983 in AA-ball. But that could still very well be who Starr is talking about since his BA and other numbers were so low.

4256 Hits
03-02-2008, 05:05 PM
Paul O'Neill, this is someone I always thought maybe a user. He certainly had moments that could be called "'roid rage".

icehole3
03-02-2008, 05:11 PM
:cool:



Okay, that's good enough for me. It's Tracy Jones. :cool:

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