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Rounding Third
03-31-2008, 07:55 PM
The biggest hate of my is that players will watch the ball instead of running every time. Today with Javier showed what happens when you do that. Glad to see Dusty address it


One small play, one big difference

Javy Valentin thought the ball he hit in the third might be out. He broke out of the box slowly. The ball hit the ball of fence in right. He ended up with 330-foot single.

Could it have been a double?

"Maybe," Valentin said. "If I run right away, I got an opportunity."

"It's been addressed," Dusty Baker said.

"I apologized," Valentin said. "It's not going to happen again."

The play might not have been the difference in the Reds' 4-2 loss to the Diamondbacks on Opening Day, but it was something Baker won't tolerate. When Brandon Webb was pitching like he was Monday, the margin for error is extremely slim. Valentin's mistake was one glaring mistake that wasn't physical. Edwin Encarnacion's error led to a run. Aaron Harang didn't get a bunt down immediately after Valentin's long single. But those mistakes have nothing to do with effort.

http://frontier.cincinnati.com/blogs/redsinsider/2008/03/one-small-play-one-big-difference.asp

LouisvilleCARDS
03-31-2008, 08:03 PM
Also I still don't get why Hatteberg just walked off after a strike 3 in the dirt. I think some of the fans booed and were confused why he didn't run and just walked off. I don't see how he missed the catcher scrambling around, so he has to see it - just shocking from a guy who is supposed to be the professional hitter here.

Rounding Third
03-31-2008, 08:05 PM
It really didn't look like he saw that it was dropped. Should he have looked to make sure it was caught? Yes. But he didn't and I don't think he saw it

goreds2
03-31-2008, 08:49 PM
The true test is if Dusty addresses issues to Jr and Dunner.

redlegsmustache
03-31-2008, 08:51 PM
The Reds weren't with it today. I've seen them all play better, and for some reason they were not in the game mentally today. Maybe it was the weather I don't know.

keeganbrick
03-31-2008, 08:55 PM
Yea, Hatteberg looked rough today. He has been a good clubhouse guy for years and got the nod over Votto today, I dont know what his deal was. He took some awful swings out there too. I wouldnt mind seeing Votto get the start Weds.

I didnt think they looked that bad today. You cant expect for them to be clicking offensively on opening day against Brandon Webb. Pitching looked decent for us as well.

redlegsmustache
03-31-2008, 09:20 PM
I didnt think they looked that bad today. You cant expect for them to be clicking offensively on opening day against Brandon Webb. Pitching looked decent for us as well.


Then what's spring training for?

IMO spring training is so you get back in the game, get your timing, wind etc back, and the chemistry of the team starts to build.

fielder's choice
03-31-2008, 09:29 PM
Did he apologize for the wild pitch that led to a run?

jmac
03-31-2008, 09:51 PM
I didnt think they looked that bad today. You cant expect for them to be clicking offensively on opening day against Brandon Webb. Pitching looked decent for us as well.
The reds looked like most teams will look when facing Webb.
He is one the NL's best and his ball moves like a whiffle ball. Still, Harang went toe to toe ( 6 ip 2 er 6 k's) and we came out on the short end. Let's get'em wednesday.

Mutaman
03-31-2008, 10:11 PM
I'm not as depressed as I should be. Harang looked good except for one bad inning, Patterson looks good in centerfield, I liked that Dusty took Harang out after 6 and it sure is nice having Cordero.

No excuse for giving up 3 HRs to Arizona and Burton has got to get us through the 7th. But its no disgrace losing to Webb and those relief pitchers either. Arizona proves it all comes down to pitching and defense.

smoke6
03-31-2008, 10:28 PM
I'm not as depressed as I should be. Harang looked good except for one bad inning, Patterson looks good in centerfield, I liked that Dusty took Harang out after 6 and it sure is nice having Cordero.

No excuse for giving up 3 HRs to Arizona and Burton has got to get us through the 7th. But its no disgrace losing to Webb and those relief pitchers either. Arizona proves it all comes down to pitching and defense.

Agreed. No tears when losing to Webb. His change and sinker were nasty today.

Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose and, sometimes it rains.

jmac
03-31-2008, 10:33 PM
Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose and, sometimes it rains.

and sometimes it's just " fogg-y" :D

TC81190
03-31-2008, 10:35 PM
Agreed. No tears when losing to Webb. His change and sinker were nasty today.

Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose and, sometimes it rains.

Yeah, Webb was on today, Qualls was nasty, and Pena pitched effectively. Harang was a bit rusty for an inning, same as every OD for him, and Burton pitched like a 2nd year pitcher.

No need to get worked up.

fugowitribe
03-31-2008, 10:59 PM
Anyone else kind of 2nd guessing Baker pinch hitting with Hopper instead of Votto. I mean what the hell is he doing on the club if he is not going to get a chance to get his swings.

jmac
03-31-2008, 11:19 PM
Anyone else kind of 2nd guessing Baker pinch hitting with Hopper instead of Votto. I mean what the hell is he doing on the club if he is not going to get a chance to get his swings.

If I am not mistaken we were 2 runs down and he was probably just wanting to get Hopper on to get tying run to plate.
Anyhow, I hope Votto plays wednesday though Haren is just a notch below Webb.
Course Votto couldnt do much worse than Hatt did today.

Stephenk29
04-01-2008, 12:13 AM
Anyone else kind of 2nd guessing Baker pinch hitting with Hopper instead of Votto. I mean what the hell is he doing on the club if he is not going to get a chance to get his swings.

It's been one game. 161 more to go. I'm sure he will get his chances.

Jones1
04-01-2008, 07:30 AM
Im more upset with the fact that Valentin didnt block that slider in the dirt that lead to Hudson getting in scorring position. If he blocks that pitch they don't score that run. His defense is atrocious!

smoke6
04-01-2008, 09:31 AM
I was thinking back at the 2 guys I can remember not hustling, Hatte, & Javy. These are 2 guys that don't have their jobs locked down. Which I think is funny. It's not like Griff was the one Cadallacin'. Quick fix if it continues...Votto & Ross (when healthy). Dusty needs to stop it NOW.

durl
04-01-2008, 10:05 AM
Webb was on his game. Take away Harang's bad inning and they duked it out quite well.

I don't blame Valentin for the loss. He began to run hard after a few steps but the outfielder still got to the ball quickly so a double wasn't guaranteed. Lack of hustle is NOT the reason the Reds lost.

Caveman Techie
04-01-2008, 11:28 AM
Im more upset with the fact that Valentin didnt block that slider in the dirt that lead to Hudson getting in scorring position. If he blocks that pitch they don't score that run. His defense is atrocious!

I was thinking the same thing. I don't really count that as a wild pitch, Javy should of blocked that it went right through his legs.

TheBigLebowski
04-01-2008, 12:06 PM
Personally, I think the season is over. I'm already looking ahead to 2009.

Rounding Third
04-01-2008, 03:16 PM
Personally, I think the season is over. I'm already looking ahead to 2009.

Sarcasm Reading = Strong

Oxblood
04-01-2008, 03:42 PM
Webb is tough, but it's not good to see so many k's. Contact fellas, put it in play.

keeganbrick
04-01-2008, 05:42 PM
Anyone else kind of 2nd guessing Baker pinch hitting with Hopper instead of Votto. I mean what the hell is he doing on the club if he is not going to get a chance to get his swings.

Hopper hit because there was no one on base and we were down 2 runs. He was probably saving Votto for later in the game with a runner on base to use his power.

Casey
04-01-2008, 08:56 PM
Yeah, Webb was on his game, but it's still no excuse for the lack of hustle on the part of a couple of players.

jlb1705
04-02-2008, 04:55 PM
If Nacho Libre had actually hustled on that long single, he probably would've been gunned at second by anybody with an arm stronger than Johnny Damon's.

I'm more upsest about the passed ball. Let's call it what it was. It was not a wild pitch, even though that's how it was scored because it was in the dirt. In that count, Harang put that ball exactly where he wanted it, and Javy opened up the 5-hole and let it go to the backstop. I don't think it was lazy as much as it was just bad.

Also, I'm not an expert on such things, but I think after Harang gave up the two HRs and started walking guys, I heard Chris Welsh observe that Valentin was not doing Harang any favors with the way he was calling the game. That scares me even more than either of the other two items above - especially when you consider the likelihood that he'll be the personal catcher for Cueto & Volquez because he speaks Spanish. Let's hope Ross is brushing up on his Spanish while he's on the mend.

keeganbrick
04-02-2008, 06:12 PM
Has there been info that said he will be their personal catcher?

fielder's choice
04-03-2008, 02:14 AM
I'm more upsest about the passed ball. Let's call it what it was. It was not a wild pitch, even though that's how it was scored because it was in the dirt. In that count, Harang put that ball exactly where he wanted it, and Javy opened up the 5-hole and let it go to the backstop. I don't think it was lazy as much as it was just bad.



I was also very upset. Javy didnt even go to his knees, he just kind of stuck his glove down and it went through his legs. Most high schoolers block that ball, let alone a major leaguer.