View Full Version : heres an idea how about cordero

04-03-2008, 03:14 PM
when the game can be wn bring in the closer, this is nonsense that the closer can only pitch one innng

04-03-2008, 03:24 PM
when the game can be wn bring in the closer, this is nonsense that the closer can only pitch one innng

Didn't you know? Weathers was the major league leader in saves of more than one inning last year........Why on earth would we actually use a guy we payed $44 million (not sure about that figure) for? David Weathers is our franchise! :lastyear:

04-03-2008, 03:40 PM
Not every closer is effective going 2 innings. Dusty is gonna have to find faith in someone in the 8th inning. I'm hoping Weathers finds his slider pretty quick.

04-03-2008, 03:56 PM
I always thought Weathers #'s were bloated last year, since they usually only brought him in to close if the Reds had a 2 run or more lead.
Almost blowing Cueto's outstanding debut today, he should be ashamed.
Cordero needs to be used even if the Reds don't have a lead in the 8th or so.

04-03-2008, 03:56 PM
Please don't wear Cordero out.

04-03-2008, 04:02 PM
There's no point in using Cordero for 2 innings. Maybe if there's a situation with 2 outs in the 8th with men on, but thats basically it. You don't want to overuse a pitcher in the 1st year of a contract, that's just stupid. I'm sure some reliable 8th inning guy will break out, but that will never happen if Cordero goes into the 8th as well. The best bullpens last year were the DBacks and Indians. Both of those teams had their best RP pitch in high leverage situations, and worst RP when the game didn't matter. This team needs to be used similarly.

Rounding Third
04-03-2008, 04:11 PM
You should use the best reliever you have when your in trouble. Closer or not.

04-03-2008, 04:28 PM
You should use the best reliever you have when your in trouble. Closer or not.

I'd be fine with Cordero coming in to get out of the jam.

I'd be against having him pitch the next inning depending on his pitch count.

Va Red Fan
04-03-2008, 04:36 PM
Again, Weathers didn't pitch well today, but he is a quality pitcher. It worked out. Don't over think things. We are 2-1.

04-03-2008, 05:29 PM
I've long thought that less "conventional" use of your closer might be beneficial... tight game (1 or 2 run lead) in the 8th inning, with the opponents' 3/4/5 hitters due up? Why not trot your closer out there an inning early to face the biggest threat(s) remaining to your team?

Then, depending on how the 8th goes (pitch count, basically; but also considering whether or not you padded your lead in the top of the 9th or if the other team has dangerous pinch hitters available) you can either leave the closer in to finish the 9th, or put in your set-up man to face the bottom of the order in a lower-leverage situation.

All that said, however, it's a stone cold fact that "closers" and "pitching out of a jam" don't always go together. For better or for worse, today's Closer is often psychologically attenuated to starting an inning: fresh, no runners on, nothing to worry about except the man at the plate. Obviously there have been and still are exceptions (as a Yankees' fan, I always felt really safe when Torre would trot Rivera out into an 8th inning jam during October), but I think the "rule" would be that you usually want your closer coming in at the start of an inning or with as close to a clean slate as possible.

For this reason, I MORE than understand why you don't insert Cordero into a bases-loaded, nobody out situation... it's not what he's used to; and it's not all about "stuff" in that case, if he's working outside of his comfort zone.

"Well, then what are we paying him $46 million for if he can't come in in the middle of an inning?" I hear you cry... well, we're paying him for what we got 15 minutes later in the top of the 9th: peace of mind when we have a 1 run lead. Something we didn't have last year, and which just may be worth every penny before all is said and done.

Like I said, I still think using a closer earlier in the game is a viable option, though, based on the game situation and the part of the order you'll be facing in the 8th. But for mid-inning jams? You need to develop a different skill set, a different specialist. Not so much a "closer," but maybe a new breed of cat known as a "cooler."

With relievers' salaries on the rise lately, it wouldn't surprise me to see this type of pitcher become a point of emphasis: maybe not with a sweet nickname like "the cooler," but with increased attention paid to stats like inherited-runners-scored and even the unsexily named "holds." Or even some kind of new fangled stat that's like a context-sensitive version of "holds" (which are currently so easy to accrue as to be meaningless; but make it dependent on the number of batters you face/outs you induce and the closeness of the game, and you might have a useful new metric). In fact, I'm sure Scott Boras is probably eight steps ahead of me in this particular marketing campaign as he seeks to represent the first ever $20 million middle reliever.....


Jr's Boy
04-03-2008, 05:31 PM
Weathers will be ok,one bad start isnt a reason to give up on him.