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View Full Version : Nice weather this week- who's golfing?



SunDeck
04-15-2008, 06:24 PM
Besides the resident pros and those fortunate enough to live at, like...Pinehurst, any working stiffs out there playin' a little hooky this week?

I am.

:p:

westofyou
04-15-2008, 06:55 PM
Not me... I'm getting the bike ready.

http://www.cascadehuts.com/images/Biking%20Mt.%20Hood%20Loop.jpg

SunDeck
04-15-2008, 06:56 PM
Man, that's one narrow fairway.

Screwball
04-15-2008, 07:03 PM
Actually just got done playin' 9 at Reeves. I got all kinds of kinks to work out, but ya just can't beat a gorgeous day at the golf course.

HumnHilghtFreel
04-15-2008, 07:03 PM
Not sure about the course, but I'm definitely gonna hit the range soon. I need to work the kinks(most likely just add new ones) out of my swing before I embarrass myself for real ;)

George Foster
04-15-2008, 10:26 PM
I will play on Thursday and Sat. I shot 80 last Thursday. It was my first 18 holes since November...I'll take that. I actually drove the ball great, I missed some greens and had some bad chips. The short game is the first to go and the last to come back. I normally shoot between 74-79ish, so 80 was not that bad. It's been a long,cold,wet winter. We need some heat!

Redhook
04-16-2008, 08:17 AM
Finally, some nice weather.

I am one of the resident pros and this weather has been killing us. We were something like $40,000 down in March and we're way down in April as well. Fortunately, for me, I've been giving quite a few lessons.

As far as golf, I get to play 18 each Monday in tournaments (36 at NCR next Monday....I can't wait for that). And I'll slip out for 9 holes here and there. I'm going to try to play 9 on Thursday and maybe a few more later this week.

dabvu2498
04-16-2008, 09:49 AM
Haven't golfed yet, but the fishing's been solid.

Heath
04-16-2008, 09:54 AM
My sticks are still out in the garage underneath the porch swing.

Tempting, but not going to happen. IMO.

SunDeck
04-16-2008, 11:43 AM
Played Monday and Tuesday. The local muni lets me go out on the back nine just before all the early players make the turn. It's pretty nice- I can hit 2-3 balls, practice chipping and putting, repeat holes if I want. The only downside is having to go to work afterwards.

BRM
04-16-2008, 11:45 AM
Haven't golfed yet, but the fishing's been solid.

I haven't had a chance to do any yet this year. Maybe that's why I have been so mean.

dabvu2498
04-16-2008, 11:53 AM
I haven't had a chance to do any yet this year. Maybe that's why I have been so mean.

What's there to fish for in Eastern Colorado? Landsharks?

BRM
04-16-2008, 11:55 AM
What's there to fish for in Eastern Colorado? Landsharks?

I have to drive a ways to get to any good fishing spots. That's part of the reason I haven't done much of it the last few years.

redsfan30
04-16-2008, 02:42 PM
I played last Tuesday afternoon and went to the range on that Wednesday. I'm planning on going Friday as long as the forecast holds up!

HumnHilghtFreel
04-16-2008, 04:56 PM
I just got home from hitting the range, inspired by this thread :)

I actually surprised myself a bit by not being completely awful! I need to find some more consistency in my swing, but I wasn't pulling the ball as much as I normally do. Actually hit a few great shots in there too!

A question for the golf pros... How common is it for someone to hit their irons much much better than their woods/driver? I find and have found myself hitting my irons longer and more often than not straighter than my big stick. The longer part is what I find to be odd.

George Foster
04-17-2008, 12:37 AM
I just got home from hitting the range, inspired by this thread :)

I actually surprised myself a bit by not being completely awful! I need to find some more consistency in my swing, but I wasn't pulling the ball as much as I normally do. Actually hit a few great shots in there too!

A question for the golf pros... How common is it for someone to hit their irons much much better than their woods/driver? I find and have found myself hitting my irons longer and more often than not straighter than my big stick. The longer part is what I find to be odd.

I'm far from a pro, but I'm a single handicapper. If you are hitting your irons good and your driver not so good, let me make some suggestions.

You need to have the ball further up in your stance when hitting the driver. If the ball is in the middle of your stance with the driver, the shaft is so long you are hitting the ball on the down swing instead of the up swing. The ball should be placed just inside your left heal if you are a right handed golfer.

Make a concious effort to keep your weight behind the ball when hitting your driver. If you are hitting a large head driver, you need to tee it up higher than when they made "regular size" drivers. If the ball is up in your stance, and tee'd up properly you will hit the ball on the up swing and kill it!:thumbup:

If you really want to get good, you also need to check your grip. Google the "ben hogan grip." If you don't have a good grip, you will never be consistent.

Screwball
04-17-2008, 12:58 AM
A question for the golf pros... How common is it for someone to hit their irons much much better than their woods/driver? I find and have found myself hitting my irons longer and more often than not straighter than my big stick. The longer part is what I find to be odd.

I'm no golf pro either, but I'll take a stab at this (and hopefully Redhook or HLman can correct me if I'm wrong).

Generally you want to have a slightly different swing when using your irons versus using your woods. An iron swing requires more of an up and down motion, leading to a descending blow when striking the ball. If you're hitting your irons better/longer than your driver (which irons, BTW?), then it sounds like this is your natural swing.

I've found that when I have a tendency to hit my irons better than my woods I'm too much up and down with my big stick rather than making a desired sweeping motion. When hitting the driver it's kind of like swinging a sledgehammer. Get it swinging like a penduluum in a more "U" shaped swing than a "V" shaped swing.

Also, for a little more power, try to maximize your clubhead speed right at impact. That sounds kind of obvious, but it never ceases to amaze me how often I catch myself exerting too much energy/force at the exchange from the backswing to the downswing rather that waiting for the split second before impact to kinda let the club go.

Anyway, I hope that wasn't too tedious or boring, and more importantly, I hope it helps your golf game. :thumbup:

Redhook
04-17-2008, 08:17 AM
Pretty good advice given so far. Let me clarify a couple of things.

First, the driver is the most difficult club to hit for a few reasons. One, it's the longest club. Two, it has the least amount of loft which produces more sidespin. And three, your swing will be the fastest with that club.

Your driver swing should be the same as your iron swing. Yes, I did say it. However, with the club being a foot longer than some of your irons AND your stance being wider, your swing will automatically be more rounded. We definitely want that U-shaped motion with the driver at impact. Setting-up correctly and a good backswing usually do that.

Here's a couple of tips to help with that:

1) Always position the ball about 2 inches off the inside of your left heel (under a Polo symbol on your shirt). With wedges, you'll have a narrow stance and the ball will appear to be in the middle of your stance. With a driver, your right foot will wider which makes the ball appear up in your stance even though the ball position hasn't changed.

2) To help ensure that you're not too steep coming into the ball with your driver I would prefer that you make a proper shoulder turn. What's a proper shoulder turn? Turn your left shoulder to your right (level, not down) without swaying off the ball. Feel that your right shoulder is getting much farther away from the ball on the backswing. What this does is give you a "deeper" shoulder turn which in turn shallows out your swing. It will give you more freedom to attack the ball aggressively from the inside.

3) Sorry to correct you Screwball, but I have to. And this will help you too. NEVER try to maximize your clubhead speed at impact. Never, ever, never. Always try to maximize your clubhead speed well after impact. This does two things. One, it increases clubhead speed by a lot and two, it makes you swing through the ball and not at it.

Hope those tips help. Feel free to ask me more if you'd like. Also, feel free to PM me if you want to keep your golf "issues" private.

HumnHilghtFreel
04-17-2008, 11:20 AM
Hey! Thanks a lot for all the replies guys!:thumbup:

I was hitting mid-irons yesterday, mainly my 5 that I was really getting ahold of, to answer Screwball.

After reading all these and thinking back on the way I usually set up on the ball, I can definitely see where changes need to be made. Hopefully I'll get some time this weekend to put this advice to work.

gonelong
04-17-2008, 12:11 PM
NEVER try to maximize your clubhead speed at impact. Never, ever, never. Always try to maximize your clubhead speed well after impact. This does two things. One, it increases clubhead speed by a lot and two, it makes you swing through the ball and not at it.

Will try that on the range tomorrow. After a million baseball & softball bat swings its darn near impossible for me not to swing "at" the ball instead of thru it. I do like this thought though.

Do you have any thoughts on how someone might find the right tempo for their swing?

I find that I am moving too fast more often than not. I'd kind of like to find a rythm that I can play in my head that matches the correct tempo. This would allow me to check my tempo occasionally, and fix it more quickly. I am thinking something sort of like the 3 notes that NBC plays (ding, ding, ding) one to initiate the backswing, one at the top, and one at impact (or slightly past impact as the advice would indicate). Maybe its a pipe dream to think I could find something both familiar, repeatable, and applicable to my swing. :confused:

GL

Screwball
04-17-2008, 12:32 PM
3) Sorry to correct you Screwball, but I have to. And this will help you too. NEVER try to maximize your clubhead speed at impact. Never, ever, never. Always try to maximize your clubhead speed well after impact. This does two things. One, it increases clubhead speed by a lot and two, it makes you swing through the ball and not at it.


Interesting. I can remember an article in Golf Digest with Hal Sutton talking about incresing the acceleration of his swing the moment before impact. I thought he meant to maximize it at impact. However, it would make more sense that he's trying to instill the thought of swinging through the ball to maximize the speed post-impact, as you've stated above.

Thanks for the clarification, buddy. :beerme:

Redhook
04-18-2008, 08:00 AM
Do you have any thoughts on how someone might find the right tempo for their swing?

I find that I am moving too fast more often than not. I'd kind of like to find a rythm that I can play in my head that matches the correct tempo. This would allow me to check my tempo occasionally, and fix it more quickly. I am thinking something sort of like the 3 notes that NBC plays (ding, ding, ding) one to initiate the backswing, one at the top, and one at impact (or slightly past impact as the advice would indicate). Maybe its a pipe dream to think I could find something both familiar, repeatable, and applicable to my swing. :confused:

GL

Everyone has an internal clock. Basically everyone beats to their own drum. Tiger Woods, Nick Price, and Greg Norman all have fast beats. Ernie Els, Vijay Singh, and Fred Couples all have slower beats. Both are perfectly normal. The key is to find yours.

If you're a slow-moving person you should have a slower, longer, smoother swing. If you're usually in a hurry or have a lot of energy you should probably have a quicker tempo swing.

Here's the kicker. No matter how fast your tempo is you need to have rhythm. Where does rhythm come from? It comes from a smooth transition in your swing - the first move down. This move is critical in the golf swing. It must be smooth to allow your weight to shift to your target-side leg allowing the arms to drop naturally into "the slot", which in turn allows the club to pick up extra speed at and through the ball. We want to "delay" the hit as long as possible to get more speed.

Here's what to practice:

1) At the top of your swing, feel like your arms and hands are floating in the clouds for a just a split second to allow yourself to get to your left-side (if your right-handed). Feel like 70-80% of your weight is on that leg prior to impact. If you rush your downswing, you will hang back, hit up on the the ball, and lose your balance.

2) To find your rhythm, I would simplify it to two beats, not 3. There is a metronome that helps with this. If you don't have one or don't want one practice starting your swing on '1' and hitting the ball on '2'. Keep doing this til your rhythm is good.

These two tips should smooth you out and give you more effortless distance. Which is nice. ;)

RFS62
04-18-2008, 08:18 AM
Golf is an interesting game. You spend all kinds of time studying the fundamentals, proper positions, stance, grip, alignment. I'm a big believer in working on your fundamentals.

But if you're not careful, swing thoughts can take over your concentration when you're on the course. The more you learn about golf, the more susceptible you become to overthinking.

When you let your mind run away with linear thinking, internal dialogue going on, you're very prone to the dreaded "paralysis by analysis". Which is another way of saying you destroy your natural rhythm.

Switching back and forth between analytical decision making to chose your shot and club and then turn off the internal dialogue and think in pictures and rhythm is maybe the most advanced skill of all.

Become aware of your thoughts and you'll be surprised at how much is going on when you're trying to concentrate. Think in pictures and rhythm when you get over the ball.

BuckWoody
04-18-2008, 09:08 AM
Clicky (http://www.czabe.com/mediaclips/index.shtml?a=showclip&id=959). :D

SunDeck
04-18-2008, 11:48 AM
I try to keep it simple, with this same routine for every shot:

See the shot I want to make from behind the ball.
Pick a secondary target (Thanks Redhook!)
Align myself parallel to that path.
Waggle a little and visualize my swing along that path.
Turn my back to the target.
Swing easy. Powerful, but not "hard".
Swing to my follow through with my hands behind my left ear and hold it. (I used to jerk the club back down like Mickelson and Wetterich, but holding it is a great reminder for me to finish the swing and stay balanced).

For me, hitting a longer club is a matter of letting the club do the work. My mental error is to stand on the tee box and try to hit the ball 250 yards. Instead, when I think about a target, a good turn/turn and and easy swing the ball jumps off the club. As the saying goes, there's a difference between powerless effort and effortless power.

POST EDIT:
I should add that when I have a blind drive where I cannot see the target, my drives tend to block. The course I play is old and follows the contours of the terrain. There are five shots like that, with a small hill concealing the landing area. It takes me out of the routine above and makes it difficult to hit the driver straight. I consider this to be a confirmation that my routine works...when the conditions are right.

Joseph
04-18-2008, 11:56 AM
Shot 73 my last outing. I love this weather.

Screwball
04-18-2008, 01:14 PM
Shot 73 my last outing. I love this weather.

Yeah I usually play in the 70s too. If it gets any colder than that I just stay home.

redhawkfish
04-18-2008, 05:42 PM
Haven't golfed yet, but the fishing's been solid.

:beerme:

Screwball
04-19-2008, 03:17 AM
Shot 73 my last outing. I love this weather.

Where'd u play at, Joe?

dabvu2498
04-19-2008, 03:24 PM
:beerme:

Are you OGF angler of the month for April?

Redlegs23
04-22-2008, 05:43 PM
Just got back from the range and I have a question for you guys who know your golf.

While hitting my irons today I started with the pitching wedge and moved up to the 8 and hit all 3 of these clubs great. Once I grabbed my 7 iron it was like I forgot how to swing. Everything was fading and some even looked like a slice. I put the 7 down and grabbed my wedge and knocked a few straight as can be (although I did have one that was fading pretty hard). Switched back to the 7 and everything was fading and slicing. I got the same slicing result from my 6 iron. I struggled a little with this towards the end of last golf season too, and never found a cure. Any ideas?

Highlifeman21
04-22-2008, 09:20 PM
Shot 73 my last outing. I love this weather.

What'd you shoot on the back 9?

Highlifeman21
04-22-2008, 09:26 PM
Just got back from the range and I have a question for you guys who know your golf.

While hitting my irons today I started with the pitching wedge and moved up to the 8 and hit all 3 of these clubs great. Once I grabbed my 7 iron it was like I forgot how to swing. Everything was fading and some even looked like a slice. I put the 7 down and grabbed my wedge and knocked a few straight as can be (although I did have one that was fading pretty hard). Switched back to the 7 and everything was fading and slicing. I got the same slicing result from my 6 iron. I struggled a little with this towards the end of last golf season too, and never found a cure. Any ideas?

My initial thoughts are spine angle, and width of stance (without having seen any of the swings).

A lot of times, players will stand more upright and too tall as they put longer clubs in their hands. I would also make sure that you maintain a consistent stance width while taking full swings. In my experience, it seems the longer the club, the wider players' stances get.

Try and get some uniformity in your stance and your spine angle, and you should have better success. Granted, you will have to stand slightly taller with longer clubs, but don't overexaggerate how tall you stand. Standing very straight up can be a very bad thing for the golf swing.

Highlifeman21
04-22-2008, 09:36 PM
I'm no golf pro either, but I'll take a stab at this (and hopefully Redhook or HLman can correct me if I'm wrong).

Generally you want to have a slightly different swing when using your irons versus using your woods. An iron swing requires more of an up and down motion, leading to a descending blow when striking the ball. If you're hitting your irons better/longer than your driver (which irons, BTW?), then it sounds like this is your natural swing.

I've found that when I have a tendency to hit my irons better than my woods I'm too much up and down with my big stick rather than making a desired sweeping motion. When hitting the driver it's kind of like swinging a sledgehammer. Get it swinging like a penduluum in a more "U" shaped swing than a "V" shaped swing.

Also, for a little more power, try to maximize your clubhead speed right at impact. That sounds kind of obvious, but it never ceases to amaze me how often I catch myself exerting too much energy/force at the exchange from the backswing to the downswing rather that waiting for the split second before impact to kinda let the club go.

Anyway, I hope that wasn't too tedious or boring, and more importantly, I hope it helps your golf game. :thumbup:

Sorry, I'm late to the party.

I just checked this thread, and I agree with Redhook that you shouldn't have an iron swing and a woods swing. 1 swing will lead to more consistency and better success. Hitting down and thru each shot is, IMO, the best way to approach each shot. Some people tend to hit their driver on the upswing (man am I guilty of this far too often), rather than hitting the ball with a descending blow. If you notice, all the better ballstrikers hit almost all their full swing shots with a descending blow. IMO, it leads to more consistent, and better ballstriking, which leads to more confidence. Players that lack confidence over their fullswings will continue to fight themselves, rather than enjoy their game.

As Redhook beautifully articulated, you want to attempt to swing the fastest right after impact. Think of it like punching. When you're punching someone, you don't want to punch the surface of your target, but rather you want to punch a couple inches into your target. I'm sure I messed up that visual/metaphor, but hopefully not. My swing thought for full swings is to accelerate thought impact, and strike the ball on a descending blow. I find that when I'm not accelerating through impact, my ball striking becomes inconsistent (which is never what I want).

Hoosier Red
04-23-2008, 11:24 AM
Okay, so help me with my pitch shots.

I played Sunday, and I pretty much skulled all my pitch shots.
Even my high irons like 7,8,9 were hit well, but were screaming line drives as opposed to nice high lofts.

What am I doing wrong?

Joseph
04-23-2008, 11:32 AM
Where'd u play at, Joe?

A place called Fox Hollow. I'm hoping to get out more this year than in years past.

Highlifeman21
04-23-2008, 05:00 PM
Okay, so help me with my pitch shots.

I played Sunday, and I pretty much skulled all my pitch shots.
Even my high irons like 7,8,9 were hit well, but were screaming line drives as opposed to nice high lofts.

What am I doing wrong?

What kind of pitch shots are you trying to play with a 7, 8, or 9?

Redhook
04-23-2008, 05:57 PM
Okay, so help me with my pitch shots.

I played Sunday, and I pretty much skulled all my pitch shots.
Even my high irons like 7,8,9 were hit well, but were screaming line drives as opposed to nice high lofts.

What am I doing wrong?

Probably scooping the ball. Basically, you're hitting up on the ball and catching the ball on the upswing.

Focus on hinging the club up a lot higher on the backswing. For pitch shots, think thumbs up (like you're hitching a ride). Your left arm will be parallel to the ground and the shaft will be verticle forming a 90 degree angle. This will allow you to hit down on the ball.

Also, it's imperative that you turn your torso so your weight transfers to your target leg.

Play well!

Hoosier Red
04-23-2008, 06:00 PM
What kind of pitch shots are you trying to play with a 7, 8, or 9?

Sorry, I asked that poorly.

All my regular shots from 7 iron up were line drives.

The pitches I was playing with a 52 degree wedge, and I was skulling those across the green.

HumnHilghtFreel
04-23-2008, 09:17 PM
Friday is an inservice say at school, so all my classes are canceled. I'm going to get in my first round of the year, weather permitting.

gonelong
04-24-2008, 09:29 AM
I "invented" a shot a few years ago around the green that has helped me tremendously. This one might make a few people on the board cringe. :D

I open my stance to about 45 degrees left of target and play the ball 4 inches behind my back foot. I then de-loft a PW or 9iron so that its just short of standing straight up and down (about 10-15 degree of loft. At this point my grip is over my left knee and the club head is 4" behind my back foot.

I then just clip the ball off the grass with a 10" backswing and a 10" follow thru, no wrists at all. The ball pops off the grass, flies 5-10 foot, and then settles nicely and rolls toward the pin. I have 4-5 of my buddies that play this shot all the time now. It only takes about 10 swings to get the feel of it. If the greens are a bit slower I just de-loft it a bit more, and vice-versa for faster greens.

Basically the only thing that makes any contact with the ground is the leading blade-edge of the club. Darn near impossible to mis-hit.

If your average round is a 75, then this might not be for you. If your average round is a 90+ and wedge play around the green is an issue for you, this is for you.

GL

Highlifeman21
04-24-2008, 12:38 PM
I "invented" a shot a few years ago around the green that has helped me tremendously. This one might make a few people on the board cringe. :D

I open my stance to about 45 degrees left of target and play the ball 4 inches behind my back foot. I then de-loft a PW or 9iron so that its just short of standing straight up and down (about 10-15 degree of loft. At this point my grip is over my left knee and the club head is 4" behind my back foot.

I then just clip the ball off the grass with a 10" backswing and a 10" follow thru, no wrists at all. The ball pops off the grass, flies 5-10 foot, and then settles nicely and rolls toward the pin. I have 4-5 of my buddies that play this shot all the time now. It only takes about 10 swings to get the feel of it. If the greens are a bit slower I just de-loft it a bit more, and vice-versa for faster greens.

Basically the only thing that makes any contact with the ground is the leading blade-edge of the club. Darn near impossible to mis-hit.

If your average round is a 75, then this might not be for you. If your average round is a 90+ and wedge play around the green is an issue for you, this is for you.

GL

Last time I checked, they only have small boxes for the numbers on scorecards. No room for paragraphs.

At the end of the day, most people don't care about how, they care about how many.

If it works for you, great!

RFS62
04-25-2008, 08:33 AM
I "invented" a shot a few years ago around the green that has helped me tremendously. This one might make a few people on the board cringe. :D

I open my stance to about 45 degrees left of target and play the ball 4 inches behind my back foot. I then de-loft a PW or 9iron so that its just short of standing straight up and down (about 10-15 degree of loft. At this point my grip is over my left knee and the club head is 4" behind my back foot.

I then just clip the ball off the grass with a 10" backswing and a 10" follow thru, no wrists at all. The ball pops off the grass, flies 5-10 foot, and then settles nicely and rolls toward the pin. I have 4-5 of my buddies that play this shot all the time now. It only takes about 10 swings to get the feel of it. If the greens are a bit slower I just de-loft it a bit more, and vice-versa for faster greens.

Basically the only thing that makes any contact with the ground is the leading blade-edge of the club. Darn near impossible to mis-hit.

If your average round is a 75, then this might not be for you. If your average round is a 90+ and wedge play around the green is an issue for you, this is for you.

GL


Wow, I had no idea you were Dave Pelz.

That's a variation of his method. Playing it back in the stance does a couple of things. It almost insures that you'll hit the ball before you hit the turf, eliminating the dreaded "chili dip".

It also de-lofts the club, turning a PW into an 8 iron or somewhere in that range. Which means the ball comes out lower and rolls more like a putt.

You didn't say anything about your stance width in your description, GL. I'd think you must have your feet pretty close together in your stance for the shot you described. That makes playing the ball behind your back foot less extreme.

gonelong
04-25-2008, 09:40 AM
Wow, I had no idea you were Dave Pelz.

That's a variation of his method. Playing it back in the stance does a couple of things. It almost insures that you'll hit the ball before you hit the turf, eliminating the dreaded "chili dip".

It also de-lofts the club, turning a PW into an 8 iron or somewhere in that range. Which means the ball comes out lower and rolls more like a putt.

This Dave guys seems to know what he is talking about. :D

I am pretty sure its impossible to "invent" a new shot. Somebody, somewhere, is teaching it or using it.

I am taking that method to the extreme then. I am de-lofting the club to a 3-wood or so by pushing my hands from the center of my body, belt-high to atop my left knee, just above the knee. When I hit this shot, both my elbows are locked, as are my wrists.

I have tried this shot with a 1-iron and just can't duplicate the results. The loft is similar but I don't get the consistent contact, distance control, or directional control that I can count on with this method.


You didn't say anything about your stance width in your description, GL. I'd think you must have your feet pretty close together in your stance for the shot you described. That makes playing the ball behind your back foot less extreme.

My feet are 5-6 inches apart in this stance. The ball is only about 4 " off my back heel, but about 12" from toe. If my toe, heel, and the ball were a triangle, each side would be 12" or so.

I think the most "extreme" part of the setup and stroke are the position of my hands (very low and very forward, hands rotated so that both thumbs are on the side of the shaft, and mechanics of the swing (locked elbows, locked wrists). Of course, I have never taken formal instruction so it may not be as extreme as I think it is. I just know I get some very perplexed looks when I play in with people outside of my normal group. Hardly a round goes by without someone commenting on it or asking me to show them what I am doing (and why).

This shot is really useful (in my mind) for those shots that are within about 5-8 ft of the green. I find myself there all the time due to my poor iron play and had to figure out how to get the ball to the pin from there it I want to score well. I don't use it much outside of that range.

GL

Highlifeman21
04-25-2008, 03:15 PM
Wow, I had no idea you were Dave Pelz.

That's a variation of his method. Playing it back in the stance does a couple of things. It almost insures that you'll hit the ball before you hit the turf, eliminating the dreaded "chili dip".

It also de-lofts the club, turning a PW into an 8 iron or somewhere in that range. Which means the ball comes out lower and rolls more like a putt.

You didn't say anything about your stance width in your description, GL. I'd think you must have your feet pretty close together in your stance for the shot you described. That makes playing the ball behind your back foot less extreme.

Dave Pelz is a hack.

He's nothing more than a band-aid for anyone's golf game.

RFS62
04-25-2008, 08:19 PM
Dave Pelz is a hack.

He's nothing more than a band-aid for anyone's golf game.



Yeah, he's not for everyone. Isn't he Phil Mickelson's short game coach, though?

SunDeck
04-25-2008, 10:03 PM
What'd you shoot on the back 9?

That's all you got?
I expected so much more from a pro. ;)

Redhook
04-25-2008, 10:05 PM
Yeah, he's not for everyone. Isn't he Phil Mickelson's short game coach, though?

He is, but Mickelson doesn't pitch, chip or putt anything like what Pelz teaches to the average golfer.

I've been to a Pelz one-day school. I thought it was decent at the time, but looking back it wasn't very good. The chipping was ok, the bunker play was awful, the pitching was ok, and the putting was horrible. His method is only good for people who will never break 100.

The one thing I will give Pelz huge props for is reading greens. He knows what he's talking about in that department.

SunDeck
04-25-2008, 10:19 PM
I've read some of Pelz's stuff in Golf Digest and half the time I can't figure out what he's telling me to do. Step on a sponge, cross your hands out in front of you without a club and take a full swing. I have no idea.

RFS62
04-25-2008, 10:58 PM
He is, but Mickelson doesn't pitch, chip or putt anything like what Pelz teaches to the average golfer.

I've been to a Pelz one-day school. I thought it was decent at the time, but looking back it wasn't very good. The chipping was ok, the bunker play was awful, the pitching was ok, and the putting was horrible. His method is only good for people who will never break 100.

The one thing I will give Pelz huge props for is reading greens. He knows what he's talking about in that department.


Yeah, but 90% of the golfers on earth need to understand the basic principals of the short game, and he's pretty good at laying out the basics.

I agree with you guys that most low handicappers aren't going to use his chipping technique, although Gonelong's description of his chipping stroke is almost exactly what Pelz teaches, sans the 4 inches behind the back foot stuff.

Highlifeman21
04-25-2008, 11:06 PM
That's all you got?
I expected so much more from a pro. ;)

Sorry, it was the first place where my mind went.

The 2nd place my mind went was a putt-putt joke, but those aren't very funny anyway.

Highlifeman21
04-25-2008, 11:07 PM
Yeah, he's not for everyone. Isn't he Phil Mickelson's short game coach, though?

Yeah, he is, but only by title.

I'm not sure why Mickelson left Rick Smith.

Rick Smith's an underrated teacher, IMO.

Redhook
04-26-2008, 07:26 AM
Yeah, but 90% of the golfers on earth need to understand the basic principals of the short game, and he's pretty good at laying out the basics.


I agree about the basics except for the pitching. It's really bad and doesn't teach the golfer to hit down on the ball. Hitting down on the ball is imperative to getting the ball up properly and consistently.

His chipping technique is good for most average golfers.

The putting technique is so basic that most golfers could pick up a Golf Digest and learn the same thing and save a few hundred dollars.

RFS62
04-26-2008, 07:37 AM
The main thing Pelz has done, IMO, is really get high handicappers interested in the importance of a short game. He takes a scientific approach to all his stuff, which is definitely different in traditional golf instruction. About the only thing I use of his philosophy is his idea of rolling every putt with enough speed to roll 17 inches by the hole should you miss. The concept of the "lumpy doughnut" around the hole is important stuff to know.

For a long time before I read Pelz, I putted for the ball to die at the hole, a la Harvey Pennick and Ben Crenshaw. I switched to the Pelz method and I think it's much more sound, theory wise.

As far as the short game goes, I'm a big fan of Tom Watson's book "Getting up and down". It's a classic, written by maybe the greatest short game player I've ever seen.

Watson in his prime was unbelievable around the greens.

HumnHilghtFreel
05-02-2008, 05:30 PM
Haha well I had a pretty terrible first round of the year. The wind was going a consistent 10-15mph which really threw me off. I went with a couple of my buddies and actually managed to hit one of them with a chip shot... I could hardly breathe from laughing... even more so when I found out he was okay.

Then finally it started pouring down rain so hard that it hurt by the time we made it to the back 9 and we called it a day.

SunDeck
05-24-2008, 07:59 AM
For a long time before I read Pelz, I putted for the ball to die at the hole, a la Harvey Pennick and Ben Crenshaw. I switched to the Pelz method and I think it's much more sound, theory wise.



The problem with trying to die the ball in the hole is that those of us who don't putt like Crenshaw end up short and below the hole. Every single time. ;)

I started playing golf seriously about three years ago. It's been fun, but I have struggled mightily at times.

Here's an idea I tried this spring, which I think is great for high handicappers like me- try to play an entire round swinging at less than fifty percent. It's sort of like trying to just take an easy practice swing on every full swing.

To do this, you have to NOT focus too much on the target. Instead, pick an intermediate target, align with that, focus on a particular spot on the ball, then just trust that your club selection will take care of the rest. You have to tell yourself that if you are aligned correctly and if you have the right club in your hands, the ball will end up where you want it to. Otherwise, the image of the target in your mind tricks you into swinging harder. Once you are within about 120 yards, you can focus on the target because your brain will let you swing easily on shorter distances.

Over the last two weeks, I have done this and my ball striking has improved vastly. The ball jumps off the club with that distinctive "crack" (and the distance does not suffer as a result). I have hit some unbelievable shots and stared slack jawed, watching a four iron shot actually go up and up and drop down 180 yards later rather than streaking along at twenty feet off the ground. I am still trying to convince myself that I can hit the ball that far with such an easy swing, but there it is, the evidence is clear. Swinging hard does not mean hitting long.

Honestly, if one can take my own experience of learning to play over the last three years as an example, swinging too hard has to be the biggest hurdle to overcome for high handicappers. And it's no secret either; just about every golf instruction book says the same thing. Putting it into practice, however, is another thing entirely and it is only possible for me when I release myself from the image of the target in my mind.

bucksfan2
05-24-2008, 08:16 AM
The problem with trying to die the ball in the hole is that those of us who don't putt like Crenshaw end up short and below the hole. Every single time.

I hate that idea of putting. There are times when you want to die the ball in the hole. On a downhill or side hill put you do want to die it in the hole. You don't really want to be aggressive in that situation. But if you have a flat or uphill put that is not a good idea. If you are a poor short putter it may be ok but nothing is more frustrating that leaving put after put short because you didn't want to go past the hole.

Redhook
05-24-2008, 09:58 PM
According to Pelz, you want to hit every putt 17 inches past the hole. I firmly agree with this. Due to footprints and other indentations, putts can bounce around a lot. Pelz did some studies and found out 17" past the hole optimizes your chances for making the putt.

Here's what I do and teach:

On uphill putts try to hit the back of the hole. For a drill, stick a tee in the back of the cup, just above the plastic cup. Try to hit the tee solid.

For downhill putts, I always try to die them in. For these putts, it's imperative to read the green correctly because all downhill putts will break much more than uphill putts.

From what I've found out, the best way to read greens is from the hole backwards. Determine where it needs to enter the hole (imagine a clock.....6 o'clock would be straight in. Most right-left putts will enter around 4:00 - 5:00, opposite for left-right putts) and read the putt backwards. This will allow you to see the true break, which is usally 2-3 times more than what you think it is. The average person only reads approximately 30% of the true break.

Happy putting!

Betterread
05-25-2008, 09:10 PM
Putting - usually 34 putts a round is what I can achieve - trying to reduce that number. How many putts a round do you use?
Memorial day weekend is a big golf weekend for this family. We have played rounds all-three days so far with another tee-time on Monday.

Redhook
05-26-2008, 09:35 AM
I average around 28-29 putts per round. Putting is consistently the best part of my game.

Generally, putting accounts for 43% of your total score. That's a lot, right? It's definitely a part of the game that should not be taken for granted. Put down the drivers and work on putting to improve your scores.

Highlifeman21
05-27-2008, 12:28 PM
I average around 28-29 putts per round. Putting is consistently the best part of my game.

Generally, putting accounts for 43% of your total score. That's a lot, right? It's definitely a part of the game that should not be taken for granted. Put down the drivers and work on putting to improve your scores.

I'm right around the same number.

I can't remember the last time I had more than 30 putts in a round.

Now if I could just hit greens in regulation consistently....

Or a fairway, for that matter...