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View Full Version : The "Adam Dunn will heat up once Edwin heats up" Thread



DTCromer
04-27-2008, 11:18 AM
Since April 10th when Edwin began his torrid streak, he's been hitting .360 with 5 HR's/ 9 RBI's. (4 of those HR's were solo).

Adam Dunn is hitting .212 with 2 HR a nd 3 RBI's.

Now, I realize Edwin wasn't hitting directly behind Dunn some of that time, but Edwin is one of the hottest hitters in the league and AD is 3/17 in the last 5 games.

Will the heating up of Adam take time? Or do some of you fools still want to pay Adam Dunn $15 million to hit for a month, then take a month off, hit for a month, take a month off?

captainmorgan07
04-27-2008, 11:43 AM
I sure don't wanna pay him 15 million to hit whenever he darn well feels like it. My biggest grip against Dunn over the years is his inconsitency. He can't hit for average and usualy refuses to cut down his swing and take the ball to the opposite field. Hitting for alil average won't kill him now will it.

Orodle
04-27-2008, 12:09 PM
one thing he does do consistently is get on base. I would propose the question what is better? hitting .290 with an OBP of .330 or hitting .200 and OBP right under .400? I just want to hear people's opinions.

TC81190
04-27-2008, 12:37 PM
one thing he does do consistently is get on base. I would propose the question what is better? hitting .290 with an OBP of .330 or hitting .200 and OBP right under .400? I just want to hear people's opinions.
Personally, I'd take the .290 with .330. Getting on base is nice, but as this team has shown, you do still need to move the runners.

thorn
04-27-2008, 01:18 PM
Take the .290 .330 all day long. If Dunn ain't driving in runs, he's nothing more than a guy that can get on base, he ain't worth the money if that's all he's going to do. He's paid to drive in runs, he ain't getting it done.

CWRed
04-27-2008, 02:53 PM
Personally, I'd take the .290 with .330. Getting on base is nice, but as this team has shown, you do still need to move the runners.

From the Enquirer...and yet we still gt the lineup that Dusty carts out today...

For all the talk about the Reds not being able to hit with runners in scoring position (RISP), they are hitting higher in that situation than the Chicago Cubs, who led the Reds by 6 1/2 games going into Saturday night's games?

It's true: The Reds are hitting .257 with RISP, and the Cubs are hitting .244 in the same circumstances. (The Reds are hitting four points higher than the National League average with RISP - .253.)

So, why have the Cubs outscored the Reds by 42 runs? Because the Cubs have 82 more plate appearances with RISP than do the Reds (220 plate appearances with RISP - 14th in the 16-team league).

Conclusion: You've got to get runners on base in order to score them.

Kingspoint
04-27-2008, 03:25 PM
Adam Dunn will begin heating up on Wednesday, April 30th in celebration of the 205th Anniversary of the Louisiana Purchase.

DTCromer
04-27-2008, 09:37 PM
Adam Dunn will begin heating up on Wednesday, April 30th in celebration of the 205th Anniversary of the Louisiana Purchase.

Are you serious? How can you say that when it'll be the 63rd anniversary of Adolf Hitler committing suicide? The nerve!:)

mlbfan30
04-27-2008, 10:36 PM
Just look at the guy in front of Dunn...

Phillips is the worst #4 hitter in baseball. He can't get on base, and he'll hit into 25 Double plays a year. Do you have to wonder why Dunn never gets up with the pitchers going after him? They don't need to since no one is on base

jhiller21
04-28-2008, 03:13 AM
Just look at the guy in front of Dunn...

Phillips is the worst #4 hitter in baseball. He can't get on base, and he'll hit into 25 Double plays a year. Do you have to wonder why Dunn never gets up with the pitchers going after him? They don't need to since no one is on base

It's been done to death on this board, but...

SS Keppinger
1B Votto
LF Dunn
RF Griffey
3B Encarnacion
2B Phillips
CF Patterson
C Bako
Pitcher

vs. LHP you could switch Griffey and EE to split up the lefties

You've got Kepp, Votto and Dunn getting on base for Griffey and EE, and Patterson hitting 7th gives you great defense in CF without an OBP liability at leadoff. Needs to happen. Speed at the top of the lineup is great, but OBP is more important.

jhiller21
04-28-2008, 05:45 AM
Of course we all know leading off with the SS is unheard of for Dusty. The centerfielder is fast, surely the fastest guy should bat first in the lineup... Right?

Watching the Giants, those two speedsters at the top of their lineup did hurt us, no doubt... but when you've got Cory Patterson on your team, it's best to limit the early outs to a minimum.

I'd bat him 7th and take the OBP guys at the top of the order.

DTCromer
04-28-2008, 12:22 PM
The point of this thread is that many posters claimed that Dunn hasn't been hitting because there's never anyone behind him that's hitting. Well, Encarnacion is one of the hottest hitters in the league and he still can't manage to hit the ball on a consistent basis.

thorn
04-28-2008, 12:28 PM
Dunn's hitting issues were EE's fault at first, now's its Brandon's? I'm sure Dunn would be the first to say his slow start is his fault, not anyone elses. Blaming everyone else, including the leadoff hitter for not getting on base is not the reason Dunn is so bad right now. Maybe it acutally is Dunn's fault.

Jack Burton
04-28-2008, 12:40 PM
If Dunn has to be in the lineup, bat him 7th.

DTCromer
04-28-2008, 08:36 PM
:beerme:

Like clockwork.

Kingspoint
04-28-2008, 08:58 PM
mlbfan30, Brandon Phillips had more Total Bases last year than any 2nd Baseman not named Utley.

That's great hitting.

His 315 Total Bases last year were one of the best if not the best ever by a REDS' 2nd Baseman. I don't know where he ranks there, but here are the Top-10 Total Base totals by REDS ever.

Total Bases Rank Player TB Year
1. George Foster 388 1977
2. Frank Robinson 380 1962
3. Ted Kluszewski 368 1954
4. Ted Kluszewski 358 1955
5. Johnny Bench 355 1970
6. Dave Parker 350 1985
7. Tony Perez 346 1970
8. Wally Post 345 1955
9. Vada Pinson 335 1963
10. Frank Robinson 333 1961



And Phillips is doing even better so far this season than he did last season.

DannyB
04-29-2008, 03:07 PM
Y'all are nuts!
What will you think when both get extended?:bowrofl:

44Magnum
04-30-2008, 02:45 PM
Wow! Dunn is really struggling right now. I would say Jr. as well, but he is what he is...a "has-been".

44Magnum
04-30-2008, 02:53 PM
Wow! Dunn is really struggling right now. I would say Jr. as well, but he is what he is...a "has-been".

Check that...Dunn just doubled. He is the man! ;)

44Magnum
04-30-2008, 03:02 PM
I can't take anymore from him. He and Jr. are simply killing the Reds! I can't wait to come to the forum and see where someone has posted that Dunn has finally been traded.

tommycash
04-30-2008, 03:14 PM
If that stat is correct, then it proves he is not a clutch player. I have argued that point before, but I know someone is gonna say that he is clutch because he will draw a walk. I am sorry, but you don't pay a baseball player to walk. And if he has this so called great trained eye, why can't he hit for better average. If his eye is good enough to catch those bad pitches, why are his eyes not able to help him hit better. I love that he gets walked, but why can't his average and RBI numbers be better. But I know I am wrong when I say that. I should love the fact that Dunn either hits a home run, strikes out, or walks because his OBP and OPS are high. So what. I want his AVG, RBIs, OBP, and OPS to be high. Not just 2 of the 4.

Fil3232
04-30-2008, 03:17 PM
Another thread bashing Dunn?

Yawn. :rolleyes:

At least point out he has a career OPS with RISP of .875.

For comparison:

Keppinger- .828
Phillips- .745

Nasty_Boy
04-30-2008, 03:22 PM
He's killing the Reds? Have you seen Mr. Phillips look like an idiot at the plate today? What about Kepp and his 1st pitch hitting? It's amazing that he ends up with more RBIs than anyone on the team with such a poor average. Get a clue!

44Magnum
04-30-2008, 03:33 PM
Another thread bashing Dunn?

Yawn. :rolleyes:

At least point out he has a career OPS with RISP of .875.

For comparison:

Keppinger- .828
Phillips- .745

OPS with RISP means nothing. He simply does not produce when it counts. He can barely get to the 100 rbi plateau in spite of 40 hr's. That's sad.

I will also agree that Phillips is really struggling. He has the same approach as Dunn. Swing as hard as you can in case you hit it.

Kingspoint
04-30-2008, 03:49 PM
Adam Dunn will begin heating up on Wednesday, April 30th in celebration of the 205th Anniversary of the Louisiana Purchase.


2 hits today...unfortunately, none of them when it mattered as he failed to get a hit when there was a runner in scoring position.

Now that his slump is over, the REDS will win 8 of 11 after the St. Louis series.

Degenerate39
04-30-2008, 03:52 PM
Another thread bashing Dunn?
Yawn. :rolleyes:

At least point out he has a career OPS with RISP of .875.

For comparison:

Keppinger- .828
Phillips- .745

Same thread didn't thread title.

Rounding Third
04-30-2008, 08:55 PM
I will also agree that Phillips is really struggling. He has the same approach as Dunn. Swing as hard as you can in case you hit it.

Hmmmm....that is interesting to say the least.

Dunn has swung at 13.6% of pitches out of the strike zone. Lowest of regular starters.

Phillips has swung at 34.5% of pitches out of the strike zone. Highest among regulars on the team.

Dunn swings at 23% of first pitches. Phillips at 49%.

And for what its worth Dunn gets the lowest percentage of pitches in the strike zone on the team with 43.9%.

tommycash
04-30-2008, 09:22 PM
I guess the only way we can see Dunn's true potential is to have Manny Ramirez hit in front of him and Ryan Howard behind him and then he will become the best hitter in baseball.

mlbfan30
04-30-2008, 09:28 PM
mlbfan30, Brandon Phillips had more Total Bases last year than any 2nd Baseman not named Utley.

That's great hitting.

His 315 Total Bases last year were one of the best if not the best ever by a REDS' 2nd Baseman. I don't know where he ranks there, but here are the Top-10 Total Base totals by REDS ever.

Total Bases Rank Player TB Year
1. George Foster 388 1977
2. Frank Robinson 380 1962
3. Ted Kluszewski 368 1954
4. Ted Kluszewski 358 1955
5. Johnny Bench 355 1970
6. Dave Parker 350 1985
7. Tony Perez 346 1970
8. Wally Post 345 1955
9. Vada Pinson 335 1963
10. Frank Robinson 333 1961



And Phillips is doing even better so far this season than he did last season.

Total Bases don't correlate at all with getting on base. All it means is that he gets enough at bats and didn't walk enough. TB/AB = SLG. And a .500 SLG for a #4 hitter isn't something to get excited about.

Last year in the #4 spot in MLB with more than 350 PA....Of 19 total...
BP was the 5th worst 19 in SLG
He was the 4th worst in OBP.
Tied for the 4th lowest HRs
4th worst in RC/27
4th worst in ISOP (isolated power)
5th worst in SECA

Get the point? He's not a good #4 hitter.

And Why are you looking at second baseman anyway? I know he's good for a 2B, I never said he wasn't. My point is that he can't get on base, and he grounds into way too many double plays with a guy like Dunn behind him.

He had only 7 more Walks than Double plays last year. He grounds into more double plays than Casey an a rate basis.

Looking at his hit chart, every groundball is pulled, and every single fly out is opposite field. I'm not sure exactly what that means, but it's sort of interesting.

Phillips is either a leadoff type in the Rollins/Soriano mold, or he is a #7, Maybe #6. He has no business being a middle of the order hitter

eastkyred
05-01-2008, 11:15 AM
Another thread bashing Dunn?

Yawn. :rolleyes:

At least point out he has a career OPS with RISP of .875.

For comparison:

Keppinger- .828
Phillips- .745

Don't compare him to Kep and Phillips, compare him to Berkman, Lee, and Pujols. Those are the guys on other teams in our division that are being paid the big bucks to produce. I don't think anyone is saying that Dunn is the worst player in the majors, he's just not worth the money that he is being paid. We are not going to win with Dunn, Griffey, and Phillips hitting 3,4, and 5. That "middle of the lineup" can't produce runs.

Rounding Third
05-01-2008, 11:18 AM
Don't compare him to Kep and Phillips, compare him to Berkman, Lee, and Pujols. Those are the guys on other teams in our division that are being paid the big bucks to produce. I don't think anyone is saying that Dunn is the worst player in the majors, he's just not worth the money that he is being paid. We are not going to win with Dunn, Griffey, and Phillips hitting 3,4, and 5. That "middle of the lineup" can't produce runs.

Blame Dusty for putting Griffey and Phillips in the middle of the lineup. The middle of the lineup right now should be people like Edwin and Votto.

Right now Dunn is getting on base but not swinging the bat well. Thats why you put him in front of a strong meat of the order.

eastkyred
05-01-2008, 11:35 AM
Blame Dusty for putting Griffey and Phillips in the middle of the lineup. The middle of the lineup right now should be people like Edwin and Votto.

Right now Dunn is getting on base but not swinging the bat well. Thats why you put him in front of a strong meat of the order.

I agree. The third member that should be in the middle of the lineup is Jay Bruce. Put two of Kep, Phillips, and Dunn in front of Bruce, EE, and Votto. Griffey should hit 7th(though it will probably never happen) I realize that is a very young heart of the order, but it can't be worse than Griff, Phillips, and Dunn have been. My lineup right now would probably be Phillips, Dunn, Bruce, EE, Votto, Kep, Griff, Bako, and P.

Rounding Third
05-01-2008, 02:24 PM
Phillips leading off? No thanks.

Kepp
Dunn
Votto
Edwin
Griffey
Philips
Patterson
Bako

I think that is plausible for Dusty. Maybe not. Its not my dream lineup, but I think it has a slight chance of happening.

Jack Burton
05-01-2008, 03:43 PM
There is no place for this guy on an NL squad. That is, an NL squad that wants to contend.

Rounding Third
05-01-2008, 03:47 PM
I don't want 40 home runs. I don't want 100 walks. I don't want 100 RBIs. I don't want 100 runs scored. I don't want a great clubhouse influence.

Yuck Adam Dunn.

eastkyred
05-01-2008, 04:56 PM
[QUOTE=Rounding Third;1619836]Phillips leading off? No thanks.

QUOTE]

why? his OBP was in the .330 last year and he is still young. I expect it to improve. He's not ideal, but noone on this team is. There is not that much difference in Phillips #'s and Jimmy Rollins. Would you take Jimmy Rollins for a leadoff hitter? His OBP is a little low, but he has good speed, and is very aggressive on bases. I also think his approach at the plate could change a little if he was in a spot where he is suppose to get on for others to drive him in, instead of swinging for the fences thinking he has to drive everyone in.

Rounding Third
05-01-2008, 05:11 PM
[QUOTE=Rounding Third;1619836]Phillips leading off? No thanks.

QUOTE]

why? his OBP was in the .330 last year and he is still young. I expect it to improve. He's not ideal, but noone on this team is. There is not that much difference in Phillips #'s and Jimmy Rollins. Would you take Jimmy Rollins for a leadoff hitter? His OBP is a little low, but he has good speed, and is very aggressive on bases. I also think his approach at the plate could change a little if he was in a spot where he is suppose to get on for others to drive him in, instead of swinging for the fences thinking he has to drive everyone in.

I would rather have Kepp leading off than Phillips. Phillips has a bit more pop than Kepp and would rather have him lower in the lineup. Phillips tends to swing early and often no matter whether or not its in the strikezone or not. I definitly agree that there is not a good leadoff hitter on the team. And out of everybody it would probably be between Phillips and Kepp.

Ideally I want Kepp to stay in the #2 spot. I think I just recently read that Kepp has only swung and missed on 10 balls all year! He gets on base no matter what and is a contact machine. Ideally I want a mix of Phillips and Kepp in the leadoff spot. Kepp's ability to make contact, get on base and work the count with Phillips speed.

Phillips certainly isn't the worst leadoff hitter we could run out there. We are already starting every single game with one of the worst possible candidates for leadoff hitters in the league.

Kingspoint
05-05-2008, 07:29 PM
Adam Dunn will begin heating up on Wednesday, April 30th in celebration of the 205th Anniversary of the Louisiana Purchase.


Adam Dunn is hitting .417 his last 3 games, although he just struck out with the bases loaded.

Kingspoint
05-05-2008, 08:10 PM
And with that 2-run homerun, Dunn is now batting .429 over his last 4 games counting today.

Dunn's slump is over.

goreds2
05-05-2008, 08:13 PM
And with that 2-run homerun, Dunn is now batting .429 over his last 4 games counting today.

Dunn's slump is over.
FINGERS ARE CROSSED.

Kingspoint
05-05-2008, 08:43 PM
Defense doesn't slump.

Dunn is what he is.

Degenerate39
05-05-2008, 10:02 PM
Dunn's home run was a difference maker today but I'm sure everyone will find a a way to disprove that here within a few minutes.

Kingspoint
05-05-2008, 10:28 PM
Dunn's home run was a difference maker today but I'm sure everyone will find a a way to disprove that here within a few minutes.

It just goes to show what a difference he can make for the team.

Nice to see him hitting again.

All is right in REDSDOM.